This is a gag, right?

This is one of those "we're The Stranger and we shit on things that people like...and like things that are really shit to prove how alternative we are" things, right?

Tyler Perry is awful.
Tyler Perry's movies are awful.
Madea...awful.
Just...just...AWFUL.

But, if that's the point...and I'm just missing the joke... Heh--got me again, Stranger...got me again.

...and doesn't that joke get tired? (As tired as Tyler Perry's sense of humor?)

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I know it's hard to believe, but it's not a joke. I enjoy Tyler Perry's films, even though (because?) the tone careens from banshee anger to earnest worship and back again in the blink of an eye. Admittedly, the production values (especially on the first two movies) are embarrassing. But they're even worse on the filmed plays (available at Scarecrow), and I think the plays are even better than the movies.

You can read my progressively less incredulous reviews here and here and here.

I had totally forgotten about Tyler Perry and Madea. Fucking Christ, thanks a lot Annie. Now I'm going to have to give myself a home lobotomy. Did Oprah Winfrey hypnotize you or something?

I'm fascinated by all kinds of awful stuff, and Perry's productions are pretty awful. I don't see what's so strange about that. That said, I get a kick out of David Mann, who appears in many of his plays (which I've also been required to review).

I have never seen a Tyler Perry film and I wouldn't. I don't find Black men dressing up as fat Black women funny. (ie Martin, Norbit, Madea) I find the fact that Black men are making money off the "joke" that Black women are fat and ugly to be pretty sick.

Yeah funny joke--Black women are fat, ugly and stupid or abnormally strong. Let's all laugh at the fat, ugly, stupid/strong Black woman! Hahahaha. She's so ugly, she could be a man! Hahaha. Wow, this is really fun!

But what does it say about the state of contemporary theatre, and this particular sub-genre, that most of the people attending these plays seem to be plus-sized black women?

Clearly, these writers and producers have tapped into an audience that is hungry to see their lives represented onstage, and who can fault people like Tyler Perry because they're catering to a need? We can criticize the level of quality or get all PC about whatever elements offend our liberal sensibilities, but I know plenty of young playwrights who would KILL to rake in $7.5 MM per year.

So, whatever these "urban theatrists" are doing, it's obvious there's an audience for it; and frankly in showBUSINESS, the only thing that counts is success.

More power to 'em.

The NYT merely followed a much better story in Fortune.

As a Black woman who is neither fat, ugly, stupid or abnormally strong, I am very offended. It is not my "liberal" sensibilties or some PC bullshit. And I would say that any Black person, woman, fat person and all humans should be offended when a genre plays into racist sterotypes.

Should we all just sit back and watch Birth of a Nation appreciating the money that it is making in mainstream theaters. Ah, the people want to see it, who are we to call it racist? Damn liberals trying to ruin all the racist fun.

Sure there might be big Black women who like Madea, Norbit and Martin. There are also women who think that other women deserve to raped if they wear skimpy clothes. But, so what? This should not be about the mighty dollar.

It is a modern day minstral show. Black men are wearing the black face. Black women are the joke.

Flabbergasted that you like this crap....but everyone is entitled to their guilty pleasures, and EVERYONE has them...some of mine would have to include, Ace of Base, the cheesy ballet movie Center Stage and Mama's Family...

Minstrel shows were very popular among black folk back in the day. That didn't mean they weren't racist.

Papayas, I certainly understand your concerns, but I don't think it serves the discussion to try to frame "Urban Theatre" as racist. For one thing, the type of performance we're talking about has existed for decades in the south and east coast, and is not now, nor ever has been the province of a bunch of good-ole-boy white crackers putting on blackface for the entertainment of other whites. Rather, as the NYT article points out, it has been exclusively an enclave of African American artists performing for African American audiences. But your comment does beg the question, "can making fun of stereotypes within ones own race be considered racist?"

Now, if these plays, written by blacks, and performed by blacks for primarily black audiences were portraying white racial stereotypes, you might have a case to call it racism. But while you may find their subject matter and depiction of women offensive, clearly it's something else entirely; sexist if you will, but let's at least be clear about the terms here, otherwise the discussion is meaningless.

So, is it offensive to depict black women as obese, when according to most studies, as many as 80% of that population is overweight? Is it offensive to depict them as "fat, ugly, stupid, or abnormally strong", while at the same time allowing other genres to depict elderly white men, for example, as lascivious, miserly, and gullible, as do most of the works of the Italian Commedia, or Shakespeare? Or how about depicting father figures as distant, alcoholic, and emotionally abusive, as occurs in the works of Eugene O'Neill? Does our recognition of these as being stereotypical by necessity invalidate the qualities being depicted? I for one would have to say, no.

Caricature is just a device, a convention, a form of dramatic shorthand that conveys to the audience the essence of a character, albeit in an exaggerated form, without needing to resort to long psychological exposition; it's an essential element of comedy, and has been since The Greeks depicted horny old men with enormous phalluses strapped to their bellies chasing young maidens across the stage. Which is not to say that one cannot or should not be offended by the stereotypes; that in fact, is the point; stereotypes ARE offensive, usually deliberately so, because they tend to standardize a set of behaviors or physical attributes across an entire class of individuals, and most of us take offense with them, because they don’t allow for any sense of individuality; “I’M not like that!” we say. But while exaggerated, stereotypes also incorporate some basis of truth and reality. As you say yourself, and as the article also points out, many people, and most significantly those who are being lampooned by these kinds of characters, are also generally the ones who seem to appreciate them the most. Why? Presumably, because they DO in fact recognize qualities in these characters they themselves possess, some of which admittedly may not be terribly flattering. But, for every time we dismiss a stereotype as not being a faithful representation, there are as many times when we also must acknowledge these same qualities as having at least some basis in actual reality. Not all old men chase young skirts, but if you know of at least one who does, then the stereotype of the Pantalone, however broad it might be otherwise, can’t be dismissed out of hand, regardless of whether it offends your personal sensibilities.

As to your point about whether or not we should allow offensive material to be seen and experienced, well, where exactly would you draw the line? Who decides what is or isn't sufficiently offensive to require banning it? We all have individual tastes in these matters; something you personally find offensive is clearly embraced by a large group of people, so at what point does your individual sense of indignation outweigh their larger sense of enjoyment?

Freedom of Expression has to be a two-way street if it is to have any meaning or relevance, and that means occasionally tolerating something we may find offensive, so that we can continue to be free to experience things we enjoy, of which others may not approve. I'm not a big fan of Nazi Skinheads or Christian Fundamental Anti-Abortionists, but I understand why it's important to allow them to have their little marches occasionally - if for no other reason than because it serves as a reminder that people like that still live amongst us.

I would like to believe we're still a free enough country to tolerate these forms of expression, because I shudder to think what kind of a country we'll be if we start censoring anything with which anyone takes umbrage; once that genie is out of the bottle, there's really no way to stuff it back in.

It's an interesting discussion, but if any character in the Tyler Perry universe represents a direct inheritance from minstrel performances, it's not Madea. It's the "no-neck" male neighbor (who's regularly called a monkey) in the plays. I did find him a little questionable, and it's significant that when Perry's work moved from the nearly 99% black theater audience to a necessarily integrated movie theater audience, that character disappeared.

For the most part, Perry is phasing Madea out of his work, so everyone who thinks she's insulting is getting their way. But in my opinion, she's almost outside the gender spectrum of the world depicted in the plays and films. Madea is closer to Dina Martina than a conventional drag queen, and even though she's obviously "related" to Eddie Murphy's characters in Norbit et al, there's absolutely no attempt to represent Madea as a "real woman." The drag is entirely unconvincing--even to the extent of winkingly showing off facial stubble. Madea's whole function is to throw characters off their usual understanding of what's okay, whether the subject is religion or raising children or domestic abuse.

And, yes, it is significant that--in contrast to Eddie Murphy or Martin Lawrence, whose fat lady jokes really are about looking ugly and acting stupid--Perry's audience is overwhelmingly female. It isn't men who are laughing at this "ugly" woman. It's women, laughing at a 6'+ mammoth being who inflicts all kinds of violence on "bad" men. It's just too simple to say she's a stereotype.

Well said, Annie. I can see why people are offended by Perry/Madea, but only up to a point. For some viewers, it's their entry into the theater. I may not like his work, but making fun of his audience seems condescending to me. If they find it inspiring, so be it. I can wish that they would look elsewhere for inspiration, but if wishes were horses... Instead, what I wish for his fans is that Perry's plays/movies encourage them to seek out other black playwrights, like August Wilson and Suzan Lori-Parks.

I mean Suzan-Lori Parks. (Thanks, IMDb!)