Why are so many religions, and "religions", so devoted to finding new and unusual ways to make women in particular suffer? It seems perverse to me. Damaged.

And what the effing eff did L. Ron Hubbard know about childbirth, anyways?

never cross cienna. what she'd do with a steakknife i don't want to imagine.

Dear Cienna:

U R Dumb.

Sincerely, Shantelle.

Huh?

Fnarf,

I suspect that it's because seeing women suffer is somehow more hilarious than seeing men suffer.

But I'm no theist, so that may be my ovaries talking.

"I suspect that it's because seeing women suffer is somehow more hilarious than seeing men suffer." -- Cienna

Go catch Mr.Savage by surprise and kick him in the nuts, then tell me if that still holds true.

Also, try to catch said act on film so the rest of us can 'discuss' it. Yes... Discuss...

I hate to say it, but I completely forgot about testicles. (Sorry my little friends!)

Apologies all around.

Religion rarely celebrates hilarity, though. They seem to be more morbidly fascinated by suffering. Like a geek pulling the wings off a fly.

My testicles forgive you (frankly they're too stupid to know they were being insulted), as long as you promise not to kick them.

I edit Cienna. My balls have suffered enough.

Scientists say that the inside of a woman's womb is as loud as a vacuum cleaner. How they know that, I really can't guess. However, if it's true, what difference does a little noise in the delivery room make?

"Scientists say that the inside of a woman's womb is as loud as a vacuum cleaner".

Yes; but are they CHRISTIAN scientists?

Who is this person - midwife specialist now?

Madrid, dearie, you know less about childbirth than any woman I know, since they have all given birth.

There is a lot of support for no meds, slow and easy is best --- and the noise thing,well, they find that interesting.

You don't want to deliver in this fashion, don't.

I always thought the swimming pool delivery plan was interesting. Or the in the woods sanding up.

Sienna, get a beat in new music, get out of bad mouthing things you don't understand and have just encountered for the first time.

"Sanding up" sounds even worse than total silence to me.

In my experience, babies get freaked when moms get freaked. Adrenalin and cortisol do cross the placenta. So, quiet can be helpful for birth, esp. when caregivers are the ones being quiet. We're mammals, and most of us give birth best in dark, quiet, private places. HOWEVER, I know plenty of moms that are noisy, not just during birth but throughout their pregnancies (i.e. any mom having her second child while parenting a toddler "CRAYONS ARE FOR PAPER, NOT THE WALLS!"). The way to get an optimal birth for baby AND mom is to be sure that mom feels safe, supported and empowered to make her own choices during her labor, however she vocalizes (or not).

What's the midwifery POV on forbidding so much as a groan when giving birth? Or forbidding the spouse's presence?

can't speak for every midwife, but 'forbidding' something sounds like the opposite of empowering moms to make their own choices in labor to me. I haven't worked with a scientologist mom yet, but if she chose to believe in scientology and its tenets and wanted to birth in that prescribed fashion, I'd support her. The hard part of any midwife's work is determining (or helping a mom determine her own) true beliefs about birth v. the ones compelled upon her by her partner/family/friends/society or even her midwife, because that's where her power is. She's the one doing the work; I'm there holding the space in which she does it.

Cienna,

U R Still Dumb.

Love,

Shantelle

I agree with Cienna. I had an epidural during both births, but really like the steak knife idea. I just think it shouldn't be limited to the father/partner/spouse, but to anyone who aggrevates you during this painful, emotional experience.