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Monday, March 17, 2008

Kos on His (“Silly Little”) Strikers

posted by on March 17 at 11:15 AM

He’s not impressed:

Clinton and her shrinking band of paranoid holdouts wail and scream about all those evil people who have “turned” on Clinton and are no longer “honest power brokers” or “respectable voices” or whatnot, wearing blinders to reality, talking about silly little “strikes” when in reality, Clinton is planning a far more drastic, destructive and dehabilitating civil war.

People like me have two choices — look the other way while Clinton attempts to ignite her civil war, or fight back now, before we cross that dangerous line. Honestly, it wasn’t a difficult choice. And it’s clear, looking at where the super delegates, most bloggers, and people like Olbermann are lining up, that the mainstream of the progressive movement is making the same choice.

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So, around what time did any of you, Sloggers, finally get sick of all the endless little subplots around this primary campaign? Sometime around last week, I suddenly no longer found it possible to care about the debate over what this Obama supporter said about that Clinton supporter.

Posted by tsm | March 17, 2008 11:21 AM

Maybe they can get one of those giant inflatable rats and park it outside his basement.

Posted by NapoleonXIV | March 17, 2008 11:22 AM

@1, agreed. I don't really give a crap anymore. Just please get the W out of office.

Posted by arduous | March 17, 2008 11:28 AM

I live in Europe and "the endless little subplots" are fascinating to me. Keep them coming. I live to see the day that my nasty European co-workers who insist that America is too racist and reactionary to elect a Black President are proven wrong.

Posted by Scott Dow | March 17, 2008 11:30 AM

It seems like the "strike" isn't about whether people have "turned on Clinton", but rather, is about wanting DailyKos to be a place where people can have civilized discourse about the candidates. And not, say, vitriolic, personal attacks on the supporters of either candidate.

It is the internet, so this goal might be a little Pollyanna-ish, but the striker talked about how someone on the site was advocating digging up real life information on her. Which is, I think we can all agree, out of line.

Posted by Julie | March 17, 2008 11:30 AM

Hmmm ... where have we seen these troll-like attacts on Obama? Can't imagine where ...

Is Erica taking her toys and going home too?

Funny thing about their "strike." They've already broken it by posting in the comments. Well done!

Posted by Jeff | March 17, 2008 11:33 AM

I don't read Kos much, but that was a damn good post.

Posted by Mike of Renton | March 17, 2008 11:40 AM

too hip for a contest? poor babies

it is a close race, folks, and several lengths to go, KOS is an ass

if the economy tanks as it seems about to do, ANY democrat will win big

shades of the Great Depression, remember why FDR came to power?

and the first Clinton (Bill) campaigned on THE economy to beat the first Bush

this feel more and more much like a true believer crusade rather than a spirited political primary

too bad that orthodox viewpoint will become all at some blogs, cause at that vector it is called propaganda, even if politely evaluated

Posted by Adam Kelper | March 17, 2008 11:44 AM

I recomend following the link and reading the Kos post. It is especially worth understanding the critique of Clinton v. Obama which is not based on personalities but upon clear differences of key long term Democratic party philosophies represented by the two candidates , especially in the area of the 50 state strategy and the DLC.

Posted by cracked | March 17, 2008 11:47 AM

Heck, even Republican Senators say that Sen Clinton was key to them being able to invade Iraq.

Not that the news is here on The Stranger, of course.

Can't let the truth speak for itself ...

Posted by Will in Seattle | March 17, 2008 11:53 AM

Democrats have always been little pussy bitches.

Posted by Mr. Poe | March 17, 2008 11:57 AM

anyone read matt tabbi's rolling stone article about hillarys self-marterdom?
if you havent you should
you can find it on

as for the poletical scene I have some feelings
1.hillary probably wont win the nom
2. even so if obama loses I will blame hillary-and her supporters- for the sabatoging of the last democratic hope for the rest of my days. years from now on dates I will casual ask who they supported in 08...if they answer hillary, wine on there face, atab to pay and another failed date.
3. if hillary does steal the nomination...I will sit home and get wasted on every drug imaganable come election day...some people will get pissy and say "mwah, you dont want to see four years of john mccain do you"
The differance between john mccain and hillary is this
I dont like john mccain as a presidental canadate
I dont like hilary as a human being

Posted by linus | March 17, 2008 12:42 PM

This bears repeating

based on ... clear differences of key long term Democratic party philosophies represented by the two candidates , especially in the area of the 50 state strategy and the DLC.
It is too easy to devolve into personal attacks on threads, but the whole attraction of the internet for many is the narcissistic nature of the medium.

Fact is, though, (and AGAIN, i've not seen this addressed on Slog in any meaningful way), is that this primary is truly a vote on the future of the party.

the democratic party has been so inept and so impotent that in order for things to get better, there needs to be a dramatic paradigm shift in how the party is run, what it values, and how the electorate fits into it.

kos puts it best that his entire web operation has been built upon the unrest and dissatisfaction with the powers that be in the party.

you can't make any clearer distinction between the principles that daily kos is founded upon and the principles of politicians--as epitomized by HRC--that have proven to be so ineffective.

the whole idea of intra-party civil war that kos mentions is a real risk. if the supers overrule the electorate, if HRC wins, the democratic party will be crippled for at least another ten years.

i know I've made up my mind that i'll officially become an independent. and i'm sure there are others who feel the same way.

these kinds of statements usually draw fire from HRC fans about how obama supporters are selfish my-way-or-the-highway types or that we lack party loyalty.

in reality, this party has been testing my loyalty for over a decade. this party let me down when they didn't fight the authorization to war. this party let me down when they didn't do fuck all to fight--or even READ--the patriot act before voting to pass it. this party has let us all down. repeatedly. and the question is, is there going to be an accountability moment or not?

if not, then this isn't my party anymore. it's something else. and i'm not going to be complicit in supporting people who don't represent my beliefs or wishes.

so if people really want to talk about this issues, lets talk about that. lets talk about what we want our party to be.

Posted by some dude | March 17, 2008 12:46 PM

My favorite part:

"...the mainstream of the progressive movement is making the same choice."

Hilarious. So now there is the main Democratic party with a slightly off to the left branch that likes to call themselves "progressive" (whatever that means) and within that designation are the slightly more progressive and the slightly less progressive and apparently the MAINSTREAM progressive...not to be confused with mainstream Democrats who are more conservative (but not quite right wing democrats who are closer to Republican, but not quite Republican enough) nor should they be confused with the more progressive progressive democrats that are TOTALLY nuts and lefty and retarded but not as COMPLETELY insane as the outright left/liberal democrats who should just be dismissed because their idealism is not rooted in the reality of the MAINSTREAM progressive democrats who are not as mainstream as the mainstream democrats because they are more...uh...cutting edge in their progressive cred.

Good luck with that!

Posted by patrick | March 17, 2008 12:50 PM

oh and some dude - you make more sense than any obsessive Obamaphile or Clintonazi ever could.

they enjoy being distracted too much by empty battles to think critically about what ought to be determined.

You threaten to disrupt the endless 2-4 year election cycle by stomping in the middle of the rapids of stupidity that wash our democracy toward the storm drain.

Thank you!

Posted by patrick | March 17, 2008 1:01 PM

The Hillary supporter "strike" on dKos is worth nothing more than a giggle. The author who started it argues that she and her cohorts deserve worker union-style protection for the volunteer writing they do to support their candidate. I'm sure that real union workers who rely on collective bargaining for safe work places and fair wages feel much sympathy for the poor Hillary supporters on dKos.

Also, Hillary's followers would be in a much better position to flounce off if they and their candidate lived up to the standard of behavior that they are asking from the dKos community. They look pretty hypocritical when they defend Hillary's ad hominem attacks on Obama but whine when someone does the same thing to them.

Then there's the melodramatic pseudo-exits... "I'm leaving now. Don't try to stop me. Really, don't try, it won't work. I'm definitely leaving now. Hey, I'm just back to let you know that you won't be hearing from me. SOMEBODY PLEASE CARE THAT I'M LEAVING!!!"

Somewhere in all of the kerfuffle is a good point about dKos posters who have gone over the line. Digging up real-life info to punish people for disagreeing with you is not acceptable. That's been lost, however, in the torrent of "ME ME ME ME ME!!!"

Posted by Kerry | March 17, 2008 1:04 PM

I've been noticing for some time, though, that the tone of the Obama supporters has been seriously nasty toward the Clinton supporters and the STATES who have supported Clinton--and just for cred, I voted for Obama in the primaries (and actually 2x when I lived in Illinois--once in the primary, and once in the general election for Senate). I pointed out several times that if you want the inhabitants of a particular state to vote for your candidate in the general election (and let's face it, that's where it's going to count) you MIGHT want to stop referring to all the inhabitants of that state as "stupid" (which I saw more than once). I quit reading DKOS for that reason--well, that, and their habit of referring to cats as "pooties". Ugh. I'm not overly fond of cats anyway, but referring to them as "pooties" makes me gag.

ANYWAY, I think there've been worse primary fights in the Democratic party, but nobody seems to remember them. I don't think this is going to ruin us. I am, however, agreeing with the person upthread who says they're tuned out, more or less.

Posted by Nora | March 17, 2008 1:21 PM

oh please, Kos, a "drastic, destructive, and dehabilitating civil war"? Come off the whiny melodrama already, especially when that's essentially what you're accusing the strikers of. Not that the strikers aren't guilty as well.

Posted by ugh | March 17, 2008 1:25 PM

That "most bloggers" are the pulse of the "mainstream of the progressive movement" is repulsively disgusting.

I mourn Democracy.

Posted by Non | March 17, 2008 1:42 PM

Yes, let's follow "most bloggers" on this issue. They are, after all, our political and cultural vanguard.


Posted by johnnie | March 17, 2008 2:14 PM

@20, I forgot to add PURPORTED (That "most bloggers" are the *purported* pulse of the...)

Posted by Non | March 17, 2008 3:18 PM

So, how'd Kos' pogrom against Lieberman work out?

Posted by Donolectic | March 17, 2008 7:39 PM

Daily Kos is dangerous to the Democratic Party. It often rallies around ludicrous and creates absurd conundrums for the party that dooms the progressive cause to various defeats. It would be best for the world not to pay attention to what goes on there.

Posted by DCDemocrat | March 18, 2008 8:54 AM

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