Slog

Slog Music

Music, Nightlife,
and Drunks

Wednesday, October 2, 2013

SLLOTD: Fully-Clothed Fantasy

Posted by on Wed, Oct 2, 2013 at 2:15 PM

Originally published July 10, 2008:

I'm a gay man who never experimented with girls when I was younger. I've been in a relationship for a little over a year now, and it's great. We have an "open-enough" relationship that allows for some exploration of our sexuality with other people and we talk openly about it. The only thing is, I don't know how to tell him about this fetish I've developed for CFNM. I don't want to have sex with a woman, but I really want to find one who wants to stay fully clothed while watching me masturbate. I also have a fantasy for a woman to watch me have sex with my BF or another man. Attempts to find a woman via various websites have so far been unfruitful. I want to blame the prudes in Minneapolis for this, but I'm starting to think women just aren't into watching a man get naked and jack off.

How do I ask my boyfriend to get involved in this kink? And how do I find a woman who is into watching?

Horny And Clothed In Minneapolis

My response after the jump...

Make some lesbian friends, HACIM.

Lots of dykes watch gay male porn, a phenomenon I would unpack in this space if, um, I had the faintest idea what was up with that. (Ladies? What is up with that?) And on more than one occasion, lesbian pals have asked me and my boyfriend to put on a live sex show for 'em. They apparently wanted to see what gay sex looked like without the bad lighting, the waxed eyebrows, and the faked chemistry. Equal parts modesty and performance anxiety have sadly prevented my boyfriend and me from obliging our lesbian pals. But you, clearly, could do better by your lesbian buddies.

And how do you ask the boyfriend to go there with you? Just like any smart kinkster asks a partner to indulge, or consider indulging, his kink, HACIM: with a smile and a sense of humor. Kinks should always be presented as perks, as something that makes you a more interesting and fun sex partner, not as something that makes you a defective or problematic sex partner. And if your boyfriend isn't willing to go there, HACIM, it doesn't sound like you'll have much trouble getting his permission to go there on your own.

 

Comments (46) RSS

Oldest First Unregistered On Registered On Add a comment
Urgutha Forka 1
Hire a prostitute?
Posted by Urgutha Forka on October 2, 2013 at 2:47 PM · Report this
2
When I found my way into performing, it wasn't exactly my choice: a married bi-guy I was fooling around with brought a mostly-lesbian girlfriend to my apartment unannounced. I was put off initially, but I'm a born performer, and some very interesting things came up unexpectedly.

Not specifically germane to the LW's situation, but why not throw that out there?
Posted by Absurdist1968 on October 2, 2013 at 2:57 PM · Report this
The Beatles 3
How about the next time you're having brunch/antiquing with your mother, whip out your willie and slap it silly. She'll be fully clothed in her lovely gingham dress and flower hat-- and you can add the string of pearls.
Posted by The Beatles on October 2, 2013 at 3:16 PM · Report this
lolorhone 4
@3: Thanks for thoroughly creeping up my afternoon .
Posted by lolorhone on October 2, 2013 at 3:28 PM · Report this
5
As a "lesbian" I can say that the letter writer is the man of my dreams.........
Posted by TheLurker on October 2, 2013 at 3:35 PM · Report this
Allyn 6
Heck, I'd love to watch that. If he and his boyfriend want to fly out here, I'll volunteer to watch. Could be fun.
Posted by Allyn on October 2, 2013 at 3:54 PM · Report this
7
'cause generally the women in straight porn aren't happy, and are definitely not enjoying themselves? And the women in most girl-girl porn are the same, as it's produced mostly for straight men. So if you want to see porn where everyone is having a good time, it's gay guy porn for you! And plenty of women watch gay porn who are straight if that's part of what he's looking for.
Posted by gnot on October 2, 2013 at 4:16 PM · Report this
8
@7

You haven't seen the gay porn I have, apparently.
Posted by Bloated Jesus is Bloated on October 2, 2013 at 4:35 PM · Report this
6 9
WHY, oh WHY DO I LIVE IN ANOTHER STATE AND WHERE,
oh WHERE IS MY TIME MACHINE? *le sigh*
Posted by 6 on October 2, 2013 at 4:36 PM · Report this
10
I am a straight (happily married) woman, and men masturbating is my porn of choice.
Posted by ilikebeansdoyou on October 2, 2013 at 4:49 PM · Report this
11
@ What is a "lesbian," and how is it different from a lesbian?
Posted by fallen angel on October 2, 2013 at 4:57 PM · Report this
More, I Say! 12
Come to Seattle, I'm happy to watch.
Posted by More, I Say! on October 2, 2013 at 4:58 PM · Report this
13
Hello! What intertubes did he post to? Where are these sites? If he is not too tall, decently athletic, gymnast body a plus, with attractively placed body hair, I'd love to watch him fuck the hell outta my lover. (Yes, I'm superficial that way.)
Posted by LaSargenta on October 2, 2013 at 5:42 PM · Report this
14
Haven't you seen The Kids Are All Right? Julianne Moore's character explains it to her son beautifully... or at least one reason.
Posted by portland scribe on October 2, 2013 at 5:49 PM · Report this
15
I'm a straight woman and this would be a huge turn-on for me... I can't imagine I'm the only one...
Posted by transient on October 2, 2013 at 5:50 PM · Report this
16
Jesus christ, wasn't "straight women who are interested in gay men having sex" the entire reason slash fanfic was created? Starting with Kirk/Spock?
Posted by Action Kate on October 2, 2013 at 6:43 PM · Report this
17
I'd be happy to watch a male or a female (or intersexed for that matter) masturbate or have sex while I was clothed and not expected to participate at all. It actually wouldn't be a turn-on for me, but I'm just generally curious about other people and how sex works for them (part of why I read this column), so I'd be interested just out of general intellectual curiosity. I'm not bi, so in some scenarios I'd be very sexually unengaged, but I'd still find it interesting. It also means I'd be okay regardless of whether I found the person attractive and open to a wider age range, although I think if it got too far from my own age, in either direction, I'd potentially be uncomfortable. I don't know how many people like me are out there, but I bet the group of people willing because they either find it hot or they find it interesting is larger than just the group of people who find it hot. And there might be a significant group of people who find it interesting enough that they'd consider accepting such an offer if it came up. I don't know if the viewer not being sexually into it would ruin the experience though or not.
Posted by uncreative on October 2, 2013 at 6:47 PM · Report this
18
@16: Yes.
Posted by Hanoumatoi on October 2, 2013 at 7:17 PM · Report this
19
While I commend the assembled mesdames on their taste, I hope it will remain this side of appropriation. Tip: you don't want to emulate straight men ogling lesbians.

With a smile and a sense of humour, sure, but a PERK? Anyone who asked nicely would be welcome to go try out such an encounter with my blessing. Anyone who requested my participation and presented it as a PERK would require a year and a half to thaw out from the ice in my voice as I declined the invitation.

Those who have read Putting on the Ritz may recall the confrontation in which Boyd Larkin twists Peter Champion's tail by pretending that he intends to publish in his magazine a tape of a little encounter in which Peter is being spanked by his sister-in-law Kitty Driscoll as they portray a Saucy Shepherd and Aphrodite. Claire Simmons then reveals to the assembled company that, as Boyd's magazine is of high quality, he can't possibly publish the details of a tawdry affair that would be just the sort of thing people read all the time in Peter's newer and more popular magazine. Boyd would be emulating Peter. As Boyd couldn't publish and Peter couldn't sue without disaster for both, Claire proposes a draw, which Peter (who will be spared a divorce and likely criminal charges following his wife's revelations) takes as a win. Hence the following Keenansplaining:

["Well," he said, "I just want you to know I think you're one bright young gal - just the sort I'd like to have working for me. I could offer you a very attractive position at my magazine."

Claire stared at him. "No, thank you," she said, and she couldn't have done a better job if she'd been packing a lorgnette.]

Now that I think of it, I really must acquire a lorgnette.
Posted by vennominon on October 2, 2013 at 8:10 PM · Report this
20
dang, i just noticed this was a reprint. well, LW, if you're still out there, check the casual encounters section on CL.
Posted by carrot on October 2, 2013 at 8:16 PM · Report this
21
@7 gnot has it.

I hate watching most porn with women in it.* They moan a lot but they never come, and it’s not surprising they don’t come because most of what’s being done to them isn’t very fun. Choking on dicks? Long stabby fingernails stabbing pussies? Eek! Not a turn-on!

Also they have no agency, in the sense that nothing they do makes sense except as something a guy who doesn’t care about women would like a woman to do.

Generally, identifying with them is no fun at all.

Gay porn on the other hand does not contain any women being abused or denied agency. It’s satisfying to see guys being fucked for a change. I can identify with whoever I want.

*Exception for DP.
Posted by Alison Cummins on October 2, 2013 at 8:24 PM · Report this
22
Two gay men having sex are both going to be obviously enjoying themselves. You can see it in their faces, their actions, their noises, etc. On the other hand, it is very, VERY obvious when the woman/women in the porn are not enjoying themselves. This makes gay male porn much more appealing, to me at least.
Posted by Trippetta on October 2, 2013 at 8:57 PM · Report this
Sandiai 23
@21 and 22, for the explanatory win. We get off on the enthusiasm and enjoyment of the people in the videos. I thought most people were like this.
Posted by Sandiai on October 2, 2013 at 11:57 PM · Report this
24
Oh my god, I very much want to watch two dudes getting it on. I'm bi, so I don't know if I'm more like a lesbian or more like a straight girl in this respect.
Posted by Valkyrie on October 3, 2013 at 12:42 AM · Report this
milemarker 25
QUOTE: We have an "open-enough" relationship that allows for some exploration of our sexuality with other people UNQUOTE

Why do they always call it "exploring...blah, blah, blah" when they mean having sex with someone - not their SO? It makes me want to nominate this shit for Andrew Sullivan's Poseur Award – awarded for passages of prose that stand out for pretension, vanity and really bad writing designed to look like profundity.

Gag.
Posted by milemarker on October 3, 2013 at 1:43 AM · Report this
sissoucat 26
Although watching porn is not high on my list of to-do things, I don't mind watching gay porn. It often seems like the enjoyment is shared. Perhaps because, as a female, I don't pick the male signals of faking it ?

Straight porn I can't watch for more than 5 seconds without wanting to turn away. Why watch slabs of meat bumping ? It's pretty obvious to me that the women there are bored out of their minds. There's nothing arousing in that.

In theory, I'd like to watch two guys having sex - and I'm straight. But in real life ? Voyeurism is not my thing, so I don't know if sex happening in front of me would feel like a lovely turn on or a creepy turn off.
Posted by sissoucat on October 3, 2013 at 4:34 AM · Report this
27
I think sissoucat has it @26 when she says "Perhaps because, as a female, I don't pick the male signals of faking it ? " vs those that think gay porn is much more enthusiastic and people are enjoying themselves more. Many of the men in gay porn are heterosexual, and take viagra to get/stay hard.
Posted by KateRose on October 3, 2013 at 6:21 AM · Report this
28
okay, I have to ask--when the writer says "fully-clothed" does he mean fully clothed in typical lesbian wear like jeans and flannel shirts, or is part of the fantasy that the fully-clothed woman is wearing ultra-femme clothes like heels, stockings and a pretty dress? If the latter, his kink might be a bit more complicated than he thinks.
Posted by Marrena on October 3, 2013 at 6:45 AM · Report this
RTam 29
@26 - some of my enjoyment of gay porn might be that I'm not picking up on the "faking," but the clips that my (mostly straight) girlfriends and I share amongst ourselves are the ones where there is real affection as well as enjoyment being shown. I have never, ever seen a straight porno where both participants were attractive AND seemed affectionate towards each other AND were enjoying themselves while fucking. I don't even thing I've seen one with 2 of the 3. Plus gay porn actors are exponentially better looking than the straight porn actors. Call me shallow, but hot guy(s) fucking and having a good time is awesome to watch no matter who is on the other end of the dick. (which, now that I think about it, may explain the pretty women and ugly guys in straight porn)
Posted by RTam on October 3, 2013 at 7:07 AM · Report this
30
What lesbians are into this? Is this a butch thing? - A Lesbian Who Would Literally Break Her Own Arm To Avoid Being In This Situation.

Posted by LRH21 on October 3, 2013 at 7:17 AM · Report this
31
I'm a straight chick and I like gay porn. Not so much the jacking off [boring], but two dudes going at it? Hell yeah!
Posted by blah on October 3, 2013 at 8:08 AM · Report this
pastanaut 32
I'm a straight woman and the only porn that has ever really done anything for me is gay porn. I wouldn't answer an ad like the writer's though, because I would just get super horny and go home unsatisfied. That's a bummer.
Posted by pastanaut on October 3, 2013 at 9:58 AM · Report this
33
@HCIM, midwestkittie does, in fact, live in the Midwest and is overdue for a trip to the Twin Cities. If your and your man are relatively attractive and nice midwestkittie is more than willing to help you out. Cuz Midwesterners just want to help.
Posted by midwestkittie on October 3, 2013 at 4:44 PM · Report this
lolorhone 34
sissoucat @26: Gay porn has its share of bored/stressed deadfucking and it is just as off-putting as the straight porn you've seen. Interestingly though, it does not cleanly delineate into gay-for-pay = awkward performance; some of the straight men in gay porn are among the most enthusiastic.
Posted by lolorhone on October 4, 2013 at 2:34 AM · Report this
sissoucat 35
lolorhone @34 I'll defer to your superior knowledge of porn. The existence of a gay-for-pay market is a strong indicator in favour of your observation.
Posted by sissoucat on October 4, 2013 at 10:10 AM · Report this
36
I am bi female who is totally turned on by male masturbation and gay/bi male sex, and have searched to participate in this exact scenario before. What I've found is very few to zero ads like yours', so I stopped looking long ago. I began to assume that if there were men like you, that they were hiding out or enmeshed in gay relationships, and probably too nervous to come out to their partners about what they want.
Posted by snoodle on October 4, 2013 at 10:55 AM · Report this
37
chaturbate or a similar open entry cam site might offer the chance to explore with yoru BF?
Posted by adm.fookbar on October 4, 2013 at 11:33 AM · Report this
38
Bi girl here...that sounds freakin hot.
Posted by magda on October 4, 2013 at 1:56 PM · Report this
John Horstman 39
Webcam.

@29: Try (actual, user-uploaded) amateur porn. Not everyone's going to be model-hot, but with some sorting, you can find basically what you describe. As for ugly (or not super-hot) dudes in straight porn, it's a combination of a couple things. First, straight dudes are (generally speaking) all about the dick (it's a deeply-ingrained cultural symbol of masculine identity and power), and as straight dudes are the main target audience for straight porn, big dicks tend to be the primary (and perhaps sole) selection criterion for male porn actors. The secondary reason is that straight guys who are fantasizing by projecting themselves into the position of the male actor may find that a more easily-accessible headspace when the actor isn't totally gorgeous. A super-hot man might prompt the viewer to (unfavorably) compare his body or kill the fantasy that he could actually get with the female actor, so at least some physical imperfection is going to be broadly preferable. I'm talking about general tends, of course - none of this necessarily holds up for ALL straight porn (and I've seen plenty with ripped and otherwise normatively-super-hot male actors), as there's probably more than one could ever consume with dozens of continuous lifetimes of viewing it at this point.
Posted by John Horstman on October 4, 2013 at 2:45 PM · Report this
40
Mr Rhone - Could someone please put "gay for pay" on the Kill It With Fire list? That phrase gives me a MAJOR LMB.
Posted by vennominon on October 4, 2013 at 6:47 PM · Report this
lolorhone 41
Well, shit, Mr. Ven, I didn't invent the term.
Posted by lolorhone on October 4, 2013 at 8:36 PM · Report this
42
DUDE. I'm a clothed female in Minneapolis and that sounds awesome! Message me?
Posted by laurelgardner http://www.etsy.com/shop.php?user_id=5877570 on October 5, 2013 at 2:20 PM · Report this
43
Oh crap, this is old. Damnit.
Posted by laurelgardner http://www.etsy.com/shop.php?user_id=5877570 on October 5, 2013 at 2:23 PM · Report this
44

Straight gal here. It's the world's oldest cliché that straight guys are into two women, right? In part because, being into women's lady bits, they get twice as many bits to ogle/watch rub together, etc.

Hence I never understood anyone's surprise that straight women might feel the same way about two guys. For me, this is fantasy numero uno.

Never heard of lesbians wanting to watch two guys, however, and unclear as to why that might be, BUT I have the feeling absolutely anybody of any persuasion would be open to watching Dan and Terry ...

Posted by Velvetbabe on October 6, 2013 at 12:59 PM · Report this
45
Mr Rhone - It's a good job you didn't.
Posted by vennominon on October 6, 2013 at 5:56 PM · Report this
46
Total agreement with 21, 22 and 29. The men in gay porn are beautiful. Also why do I need to se a woman who is younger and prettier than me have sex. And not enjoy herself.
Posted by Jen2 on October 8, 2013 at 7:52 PM · Report this

Add a comment

Advertisement
 

Want great deals and a chance to win tickets to the best shows in Seattle? Join The Stranger Presents email list!


All contents © Index Newspapers, LLC
1535 11th Ave (Third Floor), Seattle, WA 98122
Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Use | Takedown Policy