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Monday, July 15, 2013

SL Letter of the Day: That Sucking Sound

Posted by on Mon, Jul 15, 2013 at 4:30 PM

I've been mostly happily married for fifteen years. I'm a straight man. I absolutely love my wife even though we have rather cliché sex problems. We used to have a great sex life before we were married and even after we got married. But after many years, children, stress with finances, and just day-to-day reality our sex life is now pretty unsatisfying—well, for me at least. While my wife was barely GGG at the beginning, now she will not go down on me ever and will seldom let me go down on her. We do have sex on average, maybe 4 to 10 times a month, but it is always plain vanilla.

I thought about cheating. I went on Craigslist to look at all the "casual encounter" ads and after months of just looking I replied to some. My only actual response admitted to being a man pretending to be a woman. Long story short, I let him blow me. I didn't touch him, hardly looked at him, just watched some straight porn on his laptop while I let him blow me. I have done this a few times with different guys now. First it was just guys pretending to be girls but now I'm looking at guys who are looking for straight married guys to blow. I am not turned on by these guys at all but I've enjoyed the enthusiastic BJs combined with straight porn. I can't tell my wife about this as it would end an otherwise good marriage.


1. Does this make me gay, bi or neither?

2. Do I have to stop?

I know keeping this from my wife is cheating, but I have been careful to keep it pretty safe and since I really am not attracted or interested in these guys, it just serves to satisfy a "disproportionate sex drive" situation without the risk of any emotional cheating. I'm pretty sure if I found a woman interested in an affair or FWB situation it would be a much riskier emotional tightrope. One more question, I guess.

3. What should I do?

Blow Job Secrets

My response after the jump....


1. You're clearly not gay, BJS, and I wouldn't call you bisexual either, seeing as you're concentrating on straight porn during those enthusiastic man-on-man blowjobs. What you describe sounds like a mild case of "situational homosexuality," although you're not in locked in prison or stuck on a pirate ship or sweltering in a shithole like Saudia Arabia, e.g. places where men have sex with other men "due to the prolonged absence of partners of the opposite sex." You're just another married and blowjob-deprived man with access to the Internet. But you probably don't want to describe yourself as "situationally homosexual," as that sounds pretty gay, so let's just go with "heteroflexible," okay?

2. Yes, BJS, I'm afraid you do have to stop. I would be inclined to give you a pass if you were only having sex with your wife once or twice a year—or not having sex with her at all—but you and the wife are having quite a lot of sex. If you were to contract, say, gonorrhea or syphilis from one of your male sex partners, BJS, the frequency with which you have sex with the wife means you would almost certainly pass the infection along to her before you became symptomatic and got treated. (Sorry, BJS, but unless you're using condoms during those blowjobs they're not "safe.") If telling your wife about these blowjobs now would result in the end your marriage, JBS, just imagine what telling your wife about these blowjobs after she's contracted a sexually transmitted infection as a result of these blowjobs would result in.

3. You should get your wife's permission—maybe she'd be down with outsourcing oral duties; maybe she'd like to have an adventure or two of her own—or you should knock it off.


Comments (55) RSS

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Chris in Vancouver WA 1
I've always thought "heteroflexible" implies that you're actually somewhat into getting blown by another guy, which doesn't sound like the case with BJS. The guys he's hooking up with might as well be fleshlights. Nothing wrong with that, of course, it's just where BJS seems to fall on the gay-straight continuum.
Posted by Chris in Vancouver WA on July 15, 2013 at 4:55 PM · Report this
LW was looking for a permission slip. When I read "4 to 10 times a month", I knew he wasn't going to get one.

One option Dan didn't discuss was an ultimatum by him: Domestic blow-jobs or he's outsourcing them. While not fully disclosing, that much IS true. And it will make for an interesting discussion between husband and wife!
Posted by DAVIDinKENAI on July 15, 2013 at 4:57 PM · Report this
MacCrocodile 3
For fuck's sake. For the last time: looking at m4m craigslist ads doesn't make you gay. You have to sacrifice a young goat and recite the incantation to make yourself gay.
Posted by MacCrocodile on July 15, 2013 at 5:00 PM · Report this
@3: Yeah, That word (heteroflexible) - I don't think it means what he thinks it means. "Situational Homosexuality" seems closer, but really, we need a new term for getting blow jobs from guys not because you like guys, but because you like blow jobs and there are guys available, for free, who do that. Akin to straight truck drivers getting free blow jobs from guys in truck stops but wanting no other interaction.

Searching Urban Dictionary uncovers "Lot lizard" existing as a trucker's term for females who charge and, less common, "Weenie Washer" for the free male version.

I found no terms for the non-paying john. "Glory Holer", perhaps?
Posted by DAVIDinKENAI on July 15, 2013 at 5:17 PM · Report this
Is emotional cheating really a thing? Cause doesn't seem to be cheating really.
Posted by Seattle14 on July 15, 2013 at 5:28 PM · Report this
nocutename 6
@5: Oh, I'm pretty sure his wife would consider this cheating.
All my sympathy is on behalf of the guys that are blowing him whose eyes he won't even meet.
Posted by nocutename on July 15, 2013 at 5:32 PM · Report this
Is emotional cheating really a thing? Cause doesn't seem to be cheating really.

Yes, at least for some people. When my husband and I decided to divorce he dropped the little nugget that he had been seeing another woman once a week, but he swore that they never had sex because she was a respectable woman and he wasn't a cheater. Now, I got myself tested for STDs and HIV just in case there had been a night of not so respectable or another woman he wasn't fessing up to. But all in all, I thought he was being honest about not cheating physically. What really hurt was knowing that he was going to another woman and telling her what a lousy wife I was and how misunderstood he was, while we were going to marriage counseling and I was trying to do what it took to save the marriage. Having him find emotional support in a woman he kept hidden from me was more important than whether or not he had sex with her.
Posted by percysowner on July 15, 2013 at 5:36 PM · Report this
@ 6 Oh this is for sure but this is physical, I was just wondering about emotional cheating. seems it is for some.
Posted by Seattle14 on July 15, 2013 at 5:40 PM · Report this
lolorhone 9
I love how "Am I gay or bi?" gets first billing, not "Am I about to fuck up my marriage and possibly my family by doing this dumb shit?" Getting laid at least once a week in a LTR is not deprivation. Finding your Kinsey placement should be the least of your concerns at this moment.

@3: Suckling goat sacrifice and the incantation will only get you four years at a small liberal-arts college. You want lifelong gay, it's adult ox bloodletting and recitation of the entirety of ABBA Gold.
Posted by lolorhone on July 15, 2013 at 5:43 PM · Report this
nocutename 10
@9: don't make me spit red wine all over my computer screen again.
Posted by nocutename on July 15, 2013 at 5:47 PM · Report this
OutInBumF 11
"is emotional cheating really a thing?"
In the gay, non-monogamous (read: non-existent for long) world, it is a HUGE thing. Many gay men are okay with their partners having sex with others, but ABSOLUTELY NO EMOTIONAL INVOLVEMENT allowed. Most of us could care less who our partners have sex with, as long as there's no falling in love or other emotional involvement. Or STD carting home.
Emotional infidelity causes split-ups, nearly guaranteed, but not physical infidelity. It's one reason I find Dan's advice for folks like this LW becoming more prudish with every passing year. OTOH, this guy is getting laid fairly regularly, considering he's in a straight, monogamous marriage....poor soul.
Posted by OutInBumF on July 15, 2013 at 6:00 PM · Report this
Michael of the Green 12
"I let him blow me" Ha, how kind of you.
Posted by Michael of the Green on July 15, 2013 at 6:09 PM · Report this
Tim Horton 13
What about getting handjobs from escorts? No real risk of diseases, having anyone call the wife, or catching the gay.
Posted by Tim Horton on July 15, 2013 at 6:09 PM · Report this
nocutename 14
@13: For one thing, BJS really, really wants the blowjobs, not just something on the side: ("she will not go down on me ever"), and for another, I strongly suspect he's either too cheap to pay for an escort, or would have no way to hide the money spent from his wife.
Posted by nocutename on July 15, 2013 at 6:14 PM · Report this
femwanderluster 15
She's gonna get herpes from this dipstick.
Posted by femwanderluster on July 15, 2013 at 6:18 PM · Report this
How about asking her why she isn't feeling the love. I would suspect that he has let himself slide physically or there is some source of resentment interfering with the intimacy.

I am not really sure what one would do about these problems though. Talking seems like a good idea, but on the other hand, why not just start over with someone else?
Posted by Lady of Eagle Lake on July 15, 2013 at 6:19 PM · Report this
seatackled 17

They make wine in white, too.
Posted by seatackled on July 15, 2013 at 6:41 PM · Report this
Four to TEN times a month? Ten times a month is once every three days. Five times in two weeks. Sunday, Wednesday, and Saturday, some weeks. Dude, that scarcely counts as low libido, let alone withholding.

And if these guys are advertising for guys like you, then no, these blow jobs are not "safe" at all, unless you are using condoms while getting blown, which I doubt.

Cut it out, and start communicating with your wife.
Posted by avast2006 on July 15, 2013 at 6:48 PM · Report this
secretagent 20
For all she knows, he's content with their sex life. They've been married 15 years, have a couple of kids, but still manage to screw 1-3 times a week. Maybe he's never been good at oral and she was humoring him, and now doesn't feel like it. He describes the sex as "plain vanilla" while also saying she was barely GGG to begin with.

This isn't about her - it's about him, getting bored, being lazy and failing to communicate. Getting some on the side is easier than negotiating with his wife, so that's what he does. When she finds out, he'll lose everything, including the respect of his kids. Hope it's worth it.

Oh, and dude might wanna consider exactly how many other dicks have been in the mouths of these anonymous craigslist bj providers. He might already have something and be asymptomatic, and she might already have it too. Chlamydia and Gonorrhea OFTEN don't show symptoms. Even IF he stops, he needs to get tested asap, and regularly after that if he continues (which he probably will).
Posted by secretagent on July 15, 2013 at 6:52 PM · Report this
secretagent 21
Let me also point out that unresolved STI's for women can be debilitating. If he cares about his wife at all, he'd better get tested.
Posted by secretagent on July 15, 2013 at 6:58 PM · Report this
sirkowski 22
I dunno, I feels like the wife's asking for it. Like she just put out to hook someone up and then closed the gates.
Posted by sirkowski on July 15, 2013 at 7:16 PM · Report this
undead ayn rand 23
"2. Do I have to stop?
I know keeping this from my wife is cheating, but"

But they're not real people in your eyes?
Posted by undead ayn rand on July 15, 2013 at 7:25 PM · Report this
Dude. I can't believe that this guy thinks not getting a blowie now and then but still getting sex one to three times a week equals the wife not being sex-positive. Or that oral is somehow out of vanilla land. Oral is stupidly common, far too common to be considered anything but Breyers level pure vanilla.

Have you asked her lately? Do you just expect her to journey down below without prompting? Some women really hate giving BJs and the lack of requests can be a godsend "perhaps he's equally not into them!" she thinks hopefully. Speak up!
Posted by weatherwax on July 15, 2013 at 8:27 PM · Report this
[BJ] - You wish you were bi, LW. The Entrance Exam is probably way too hard for you - much harder than that delivered by the Red Queen and the White Queen to Alice.

[non-BJ] Ms Cute - Hopping back to Wonderland, would you say that straight-chasers get what they deserve, or do they deserve what they get? I can feel conditional sympathy for his service providers if they really, really REALLY want same-sexer partners, can't get them, and are about as limited in their options as the LW himself thinks he is. (Granted, it takes a lot of effort for me to get to FTWL... for straight-chasers, but what really makes me want to give this an LMB is that many of his servicers probably think he's the Holy Grail, and that servicing anyone straight raises their status. Gee, thanks, internalized severe homophobia in those people, for that lovely image!)

Mr Rhone - You have reminded me of one of my favourite pieces of Agnethasplaining, which I ought to be able to find an opportunity to present in the near future. (Normally I prefer Fridasplaining, but there have already been at least two or three letters this month for which these particular eleven syllables would have been at least tolerably apt. I shall be on the watch.)
Posted by vennominon on July 15, 2013 at 8:51 PM · Report this
nocutename 27
Mr. Ven:
Not being a gay male straight chaser, I can't speak for any, but it seems to me that there's one of two things operating: either you are desperate and take what you can, or you get a thrill out of somehow having a man who would normally be "off limits" to you, perhaps showing him what he's missing. I don't know. Maybe these guys are so deeply closeted and full of self-loathing that they don't want to be with someone who sets an example of self-acceptance they can't follow, but I don't think this can possibly account for all the ads on CL.

If it's the former, it's just too depressing to contemplate, considering how shabbily people like this letter writer are using these straight chasers.

I don't think anyone deserves to be held in contempt by the people s/he services sexually, and there's a great deal of "what's in it for him?" is what I'm thinking.
Posted by nocutename on July 15, 2013 at 9:16 PM · Report this
debug 28
4 to 10 times a month seems like quite a bit for someone married 15 years with kids. It could be why the routine has gotten so "routine".

LW seems kind of fake to me but, if true, then the LW is just a cheating piece of shit. Talk to your wife, coward.
Posted by debug on July 15, 2013 at 10:01 PM · Report this
treefort 29
Yes, this guy strikes me as a pile of shit. Twice a week after kids is not bad, and considering the attention given to men who hand out blow jobs, he has probably already given her something. He's going to ruin his marriage over this. I have a feeling that when she finds out she has gonorrhea, he's going to make up a story about a one night stand with a woman to avoid communication with his wife. @20 has it.
Posted by treefort on July 15, 2013 at 10:24 PM · Report this
johnjacobjingleheimerschmidt 30
4 times a Month??? divorce your ass and what's her number?

Its the same thing I would tell my kids... if your bored it's your own fault.
Posted by johnjacobjingleheimerschmidt on July 15, 2013 at 10:28 PM · Report this
Most Peeps Are Assholes 31
Maybe your wife doesn't blow you because she recognizes what a douchetwat you are.

You are cheating on her with a slew of random partners that you know nothing about, placing her at tremendous risk. You also don't have any concern or care for these men that you let blow you and from the tone and wording of your letter you actually seem to have a great deal of disdain for gay men.

Perhaps women don't respond to your ad because they're smart enough to recognize an arrogant asshole when they see one. If you fixed your stunning level of bastardness, you might find your wife more willing to please you in the bedroom.

I suspect the problem is not that there's an unwillingness on her part to blow you but there's an unwillingness on her part to do much beyond the minimum because you're repulsive on so many levels.
Posted by Most Peeps Are Assholes on July 15, 2013 at 10:32 PM · Report this
milemarker 32
I just wish my neighbor two houses over and across the street were heteroflexible. I'd do him any time as long as *he* had no STDs. I am so in lust with that guy. My husband keeps telling me - BTMA - (blow the mf....) but I can't! I just can't. I like his wife.

This is his fault. He's an electrician and I had him install some lights on my patio. So he's climbing up the ladder and I'm holding the ladder and all of a sudden he's leaning his dick right into my hand where I'm holding the ladder due to my concern for his personal safety and he's acting like he doesn't even know he's pressing his hot dick against my hand. That was 2 years ago and I still have't washed that hand. I think he melted the ladder, too. He never even looked. Just want about his business and THEN, ah HA!. HE PUT THE BOWL SHAPED GLOBE ON UPSIDE DOWN! I *knew* it! He knew exactly what he was doing. He heteroflexed me on the hand.

You're welcome.
Posted by milemarker on July 15, 2013 at 10:59 PM · Report this
Overall good response except gonorrhea from bjs ate about as rare as Jewish Nazis. Trust me, I must have been blown about ten million times in the seediest of places in my youth and never suffered from any malady other than teeth abrasions. Do your research re possible vs probable.
Posted by jeffy on July 15, 2013 at 11:00 PM · Report this
lolorhone 34
Mr. Ven @26: Was that a BJ or non-BJ post (to me)? Regardless, you really do need to explain this whole Agnethasplaining/Fridasplaining thing.
Posted by lolorhone on July 15, 2013 at 11:05 PM · Report this
lolorhone 35
@32: Your post reads like chaste porn (not necessarily a bad thing). But go ahead and wash that hand.
Posted by lolorhone on July 15, 2013 at 11:10 PM · Report this
@11: so gay males tend to be cooler with physical straying than emotional? Then gay men and straight women have similar standards. While straight guys think "cheating" mean only penetrating orifices, not penetrating conversations. Where do lesbians come down on this - which is worse, your lover opening her heart or opening her legs?
Posted by DAVIDinKENAI on July 15, 2013 at 11:39 PM · Report this
Mr Rhone - Had it been [BJ], it would have appeared before the mention to Ms Cute. Perhaps I should have put a row of asterisks.

You might be recently enough arrived that you have not seen my much more common habit of Austensplaining - quoting a passage of Miss Austen's that touches on a letter or comment. A recent example, when a husband had done something to displease his wife, was a bit from Sense and Sensibility: "...Lady Middleton resigned herself to the idea of it with all the philosophy of a well-bred woman, contenting herself with merely giving her husband a gentle reprimand on the subject five or six times every day."

It occurred to me in the night, though, that I could make this into a Faltskog Award (similar to the Gertrude Award for people who protest too much or the Sartre Award for trios of people who would be well cast together for No Exit). I am now planning to do this at the next excellent opportunity.
Posted by vennominon on July 16, 2013 at 4:09 AM · Report this
Ms Cute - Well, I can generally pound myself into FTWL... status by trying as hard as possible to make it comparable to those who are overphotographed at Pride and presented to mainstream society as the monolithic face of LGBT. And it's not as if I'd want them to be prevented or discouraged from chasing straights - for those confirmed in the inclination, I'd likely want them never to stop. If anything, I'd make it a completely different orientation. It's not their fault that they feed and perpetuate the Type B Homophobia Mr Savage instances in the 7/16 podcast, or that, if they like the bad treatment the LW's service providers receive, for many straight people this is their main image of gay men and they base their treatment of us accordingly. (In theory, I suppose I could see "straights only" as a monogamish condition, but that's about it.)

But what gets me and sets them apart from other stereotype feeders (so that I'm not sure that increased assimilation will help the situation here) is that the straight-chaser mentality uses the F word in a way designed to hurt Gs. There are two manifestations - either that everyone with a G deserves to be treated the way straight men treat them (because we're all silly little Fs), or that they're superiour due to the status they think they acquire from bagging an S, which means that they aren't silly little Fs like those Gs who aren't good enough to get an S.

Now, it is possible that I just used up all my tolerance for this at a conference workshop half a lifetime ago when people took turns pairing off, telling each other things and affirming each other. When one has to say something supportive to half a dozen men running who confide with lofty disdain that they aren't attracted to queers... I'm just glad this is the sort of experience you've probably never had.
Posted by vennominon on July 16, 2013 at 5:02 AM · Report this

I think for straight-chasers the emphasis is on their sexual object choices and not on their sexual objectivity. I agree, straight chasing - finding men attractive specifically because they're straight - stems from internalized homophobia. But the manifestation is purely externalized. it's the idea that a schlep with a beer-gut, a Penthouse in one hand and the back of your head in the other is by definition hotter than an Adonis with the back of your head in both hands.

And there is probably some obsequious "pride" in giving such good head that you can lure straight men down to your level. If you feel being gay already debases yourself, then there must be erotic power in the idea that your filthy gay skills are so powerful they can draw straight men into permitting your disgusting gay acts, but only to the point that their natural heterosexual superiority remains beyond question.

Like all dom/sub games, the psychology is multifaceted and runs very deep.

But I don't doubt for a minute that the guys giving the letter-writer head are getting exactly what they want from him. There are websites out there that cater to this exact fetish. My impression is that they are mostly gay-on-gay roll playing, but the scenario is always a variation on some simpering faggot being bullied by "real men," either being grateful that he's not getting the physical beating he naturally deserves or maybe being slapped around a little before the bully either holds his nose and reluctantly allows himself to be serviced, or expresses his outrage through a fantasy rape.

The situation the letter writer describes is just a variation on that fantasy. The only difference is that it's real, and therefore less in need dramatic embellishments.
Posted by East Coast Douglas on July 16, 2013 at 7:19 AM · Report this
I'm calling fake on this one, or at least he's not telling the whole truth.

My feeling is that most guys who pose as girls online are actually straight and aren't really into meeting people, they just get their rocks off interacting with people online from the fantasy of it.

Also, even if he did find a guy posing as a girl that wanted to meet to blow him, I doubt he's lucky enough to find multiple guys doing the same like he says.

So the guy is either making the whole thing up and no bjs have been had, or he maybe he did talk to guy online he thought was a girl and is fantasizing and gaming out a scenario where he gets a bj from said guy, or he just went directly to the m4m section and is modifying the story to reinforce and rationalize his "straightness."
Posted by pb1230 on July 16, 2013 at 8:00 AM · Report this
This guy needs to communicate with his wife. I suggest couple's counseling if he can't manage this on his own.
Posted by wingedkat on July 16, 2013 at 8:07 AM · Report this
Helenka (also a Canuck) 42
BJS is a dick who's been thinking with his dick for many years now. Which means NOT addressing the issue of sexual incompability with his wife from basically DAY ONE of their marriage onward. Weren't the bells going ding-ding-ding in his head when his barely GGG wife became less so? And, despite his assurance that they are still having a sex life, 4-10 times a month of thrusting - I'm guessing - two to eight minutes each time into her body does not a good sex life make. Is there any foreplay? Does she have a joyful look on her face during; or is she merely fulfilling her wifely duty via the missionary position? But too few details supplied for us to really know.

So, instead of attending to the problem in their marriage, BJS has divorced the physical aspect of it so he can seek gratification elsewhere (with equally displaced emotional involvement), while still insisting he's happy in his marriage. As #41 stated, counseling is probably the only way out of his dilemma. And starting to have some honest conversations with his wife.
Posted by Helenka (also a Canuck) on July 16, 2013 at 8:56 AM · Report this
I'm calling fake on this one, or at least he's not telling the whole truth.
Oddly enough, I think that he's telling the complete truth. He's looking for validation and absolution and permission, not advice. He's a self-centred fuckface, that's all. Whether he is or isn't gay or bi or closeted is vastly irrelevant to the deeper reality that he's a complete and utter cunterific dick.
Posted by seeker6079 on July 16, 2013 at 11:06 AM · Report this
Ophian 44
@9, that's how I ended up bi. The rite of ox slaughter went off without a hitch, but then I flubbed the lyrics to Gimme! Gimme! Gimme!...the rest, as they say, is history.

Posted by Ophian on July 16, 2013 at 1:27 PM · Report this
Ophian 45
...and I feel sorry for LW's wife.
Posted by Ophian on July 16, 2013 at 1:28 PM · Report this
SRK83 46
Agree with 43. I am a straight woman,but asexual and I meet men like this all the time. A lot of them make politicians tame by comparison when it comes to the blame game. 'If she'd try anal, I won't have cheated'. 'She's always busy with the children and too tired to have sex'. I always want to send these idiots to the ER.

In my experience, the women are under the misconception that their home life is peachy: happy kids,clean house,happy husband while the fucktard is off in a corner whinging about getting blowjobs/anal sex/the wife refusing to open up the marriage. I can guarantee you that this letter writer may not hate gay men,but he doesn't consider it cheating because he is receiving and he's messing around with men,no matter what anyone says. He'll never talk to the wife because doing so might clue her in and he won't want to take away his security blanket no matter how small that blanket has gotten. There are men out there who are miserable, but won't get a divorce and are content to fuck around on the woman because the thought of rejection after years of their wives accepting their bullshit puts the fear of god in them.
Posted by SRK83 on July 16, 2013 at 1:36 PM · Report this
'She's always busy with the children and too tired to have sex'.
Oddly enough, SRK @46, that's one that I have some sympathy with. Not for being a CPOS, naturally, or for the lying bastards who exploit it, but for the reality of those who faced it. I've seen more than a few marriages break up because the women throw themselves utterly and completely (and, in those cases, always excessively) into the role of "mother", tossing the roles of wife and lover into the trashcan. I know that the stereotype is to trot out the dad that won't help with the kids, but I honestly didn't see much of that. Rather, that subset of women had a switch in their heads: "sexual being" was one setting and "motherhood" the other, and only one could be on at a time. It's the "busy" word that reminds me most strongly of that because that sort of wife would fill up all of their time with kid stuff, even where they didn't need to.

Bonus factoid: those were the sort of ex-wives who were the most irrational about dad's post-divorce girlfriends and would do everything in their power to either mess up the new relationship or mess up dad's relationship with his kids. Having made the decision for themselves that the role of "parent" was wholly incompatible with "sexual being" they were ferociously against the ex-husband and the new squeeze demonstrating the falsity of that dichotomy.

Why? Haven't the foggiest. Just Was. I saw more than a few cases where I suspected closeted asexuality in the wife -- those were the ones where the husbands noted that sex was one of those things that was their interest and the wife's duty, dropped the second they got pregnant -- but never enough to draw any generalizations from it. Your own experience seems to run counter to mine, and that's one of the weird realities of family law; contradictory data is par for the course. You, for example, note the "happy husband". In those of my cases that I refer to here, the wives defined "happy husband" as one who had stopped complaining of a dead sex life. He had given up, and so far as the wife was concerned he was now "happy" because if he was "unhappy" he would have still been asking or complaining.
Posted by seeker6079 on July 16, 2013 at 2:10 PM · Report this
Surprised no one has said it yet. Letter writer -- it depends entirely on how hot you are. You are married for 15 years so that makes you at least 33, probably late 30s or early 40s. If you are a typical "str8" male of this age, fuhgettaboutit. If, however, you are hella hot, special rules apply.*

*In real life I am a very politically correct person who would never dare say this in public. But on the internet, only the NSA knows what breed of dog you are.**

**Actually, I actually agree with Dan and @1-@47 -- LW is a CPOS who is risking STIs and wife has a right to know. Plus, Dan is underestimating risk from BJs with condoms, dude can get herpes even with condoms *and* be aysmptomatic yet still give wife. Admittedly, a small risk, but a risk nonetheless.
Posted by delta35 on July 16, 2013 at 3:31 PM · Report this
Can we hear more about the hot electrician?
Posted by milkshake on July 16, 2013 at 4:09 PM · Report this
@47, seeker: so a Madonna–whore complex but in her head instead of Freud's original description as being in his head?

For some, motherhood trumps all and then sex before marriage, marriage, and sex before pregnancy were all necessary steps to get to where she wanted (or felt expected) to be. There could be a self-closeted lesbian or closeted asexual aspect to it. And the female attraction to a new partner may have allowed her to kick things off and then momentum carried her through those early years.
Posted by DAVIDinKENAI on July 16, 2013 at 5:38 PM · Report this
nocutename 51
@44: Huh. I've been sacrificing goats to the Copier Gods at the Xerox machine for years, never realizing it's a sexual orientation thing. No wonder the machine still jams . . .
Posted by nocutename on July 16, 2013 at 7:31 PM · Report this
Still Thinking 52
Ophian @ 44 - LOL thanks!
Posted by Still Thinking on July 16, 2013 at 7:51 PM · Report this
@50 i don't know whether i'd accept the madonna/whore thing; it just feels like it did not fit those cases. Difficult to rationally explain it but that is the gut-take on it. Similarly their hatred of the new relationships often seemed equally driven by a weird paradox : her insistence on making the kids 100% of her own existence caused the problem ... But now that the husband was gone there was a huge martyr complex about "having to carry the entire burden" and a near-rage at him being happy when "he should be helping". The weirdest part of all was that some mothers who complained loudest about their burdens were the ones who fought like tigers to minimize the dad's efforts to spend time with the kids and take away some of that burden. I used to hate seeing that kind of position because sure as eggs was eggs you could anticipate 2 things: First, she'd enrol the kids in a plethora of things they like, often during time slotted for him, leaving the dad with the choice of being only a chauffeur or taking away the new treat. Second, there would be outrageous demands for stratospheric child support to pay for all this. I actually saw one such woman concede (off the record) that a related goal was to make sure that every penny he had went to support so that the new gf/wife would dump him because she didn't want to support him. Psycho city.
Posted by seeker6079 on July 16, 2013 at 8:49 PM · Report this
lolorhone 54
Ophian @44: It wasn't flubbing the lyrics, everyone does that. Think back- did your belt match your shoes?
Posted by lolorhone on July 16, 2013 at 8:50 PM · Report this
Ophian 55
@54, Nooooooooo!
Posted by Ophian on July 17, 2013 at 9:19 AM · Report this
DAVIDinKENAI @ 4: If they're truck drivers maybe they should be called Glory Haulers instead.
Posted by Anastasia Beaverhausen on July 17, 2013 at 9:13 PM · Report this
Sabotage 57
Don't really feel sorry for the dudes going down on him. I've gotten plenty of attention from dudes who WISH I'd treat them the way LW is treating them to know that it's a legitimate pursuit (if incredibly boring for guys like me who want to be involved).
Posted by Sabotage on July 18, 2013 at 7:05 AM · Report this

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