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News & ArtsThursday, October 18, 2012
2012 White People Voting for Romney
Posted by Charles Mudede on Thu, Oct 18, 2012 at 8:10 AM
WaPo...
Mitt Romney is performing very, very well among white voters. And in fact, most recent polls show him winning the white vote by more than any GOP presidential candidate since Ronald Reagan.There are two Americas: just white; white and others. And so the core of American politics in our moment, and it was not always this way, is the whites who want to be with one block (the past) or the other (the future).
1
And this is why the Republican party is dying: Whites were 80% of the US population in 1980, and are 65% of the population now.
2
I would argue that the Republican Party isn't dying. If they can leave an absolutely horrible mess for Obama to clean up and still have enough credibility to even run a candidate, they are not dying. They still threaten to do worse.
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@2 - if Obama was white he'd be coasting into his second term with over 60% of the vote and bipartisan support.
This country is fucking racist mess, and probably always will be.
This country is fucking racist mess, and probably always will be.
5
If the Obama campain put out a t-shirt that said "White males for Obama," I'd wear the heck out of it.
6
True enough, but do remember this isn't an American trait. It's a human trait. America is, on average, less racist than the rest of the world. Sometimes it is difficult to tell whether we are moving backwards though.
7
I would say the Republicans are very much alive to the extent that wealthy elites who tend to support republicans own most of the media infrastructure that disseminates information that convinces people to vote against their best interests, e.g., policies that redistribute wealth upward, and starve social programs that benefit working and middle class people.
8
Good Morning Charles and Greetings from Chicago,
I agree there are two Americas. Those that are human & American and DON'T use race as the deal breaker. They come in all races, shapes, sizes, colors, sexual orientations and classes. The "other" America DOES use race as the deal breaker. They too, come in all races, shapes, sizes, colors, sexual orientations and classes.
Among the latter group, racists are found.
Also, among the two groups some will emphasize race AND class. But, at the end of the day we do have a division. I don't think that's constructive.
Barack Obama is performing very, very well among black voters. Among black voters that will vote he will get 95% of the vote. That's no surprise.
I only disagree with your division "just white & just white & others". America's division is far more complicated that that.
I agree there are two Americas. Those that are human & American and DON'T use race as the deal breaker. They come in all races, shapes, sizes, colors, sexual orientations and classes. The "other" America DOES use race as the deal breaker. They too, come in all races, shapes, sizes, colors, sexual orientations and classes.
Among the latter group, racists are found.
Also, among the two groups some will emphasize race AND class. But, at the end of the day we do have a division. I don't think that's constructive.
Barack Obama is performing very, very well among black voters. Among black voters that will vote he will get 95% of the vote. That's no surprise.
I only disagree with your division "just white & just white & others". America's division is far more complicated that that.
9
Samuel L. Jackson is voting for Obama because he is black. It's a pretty sad irony history will probably look back on the term of our first black President as having worsened the racial divides.
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@ 9,
Yes, our KKKuntree's problem is that blacks and Latinos won't give up their racist ways. Thank you, Ann Rmoney.
Yes, our KKKuntree's problem is that blacks and Latinos won't give up their racist ways. Thank you, Ann Rmoney.
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@9: Samuel L. Jackson is voting for Obama because he has a 40-year track record of leftist political activism. Yeesh!
12
FSM help me, I'll be so glad when this humiliating, sham election is over.
Hopefully, an Obama victory will put a lid on the ignorant, sadistic, hate-crazed, right-wing, neo-fascist, braying submorons for a little while.
On the other hand, can you even imagine how psychotically cracked-out the RepubliKKKans and their voters are gonna be, win or lose? They'll put a shotgun to the head of the American people and laugh maniacally as they pull the trigger on the most explosive murder-suicide in world history.
Hopefully, an Obama victory will put a lid on the ignorant, sadistic, hate-crazed, right-wing, neo-fascist, braying submorons for a little while.
On the other hand, can you even imagine how psychotically cracked-out the RepubliKKKans and their voters are gonna be, win or lose? They'll put a shotgun to the head of the American people and laugh maniacally as they pull the trigger on the most explosive murder-suicide in world history.
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@11 - I'm just quoting the man about why he's voting for Obama. Obama will get 95% of the black vote.
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I thought Dr. King taught us to judge people on the content of their character, not the color of their skin.
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@8 & 9.. y'all it's way too early for y'all to be as high as you surely must be to suggest or believe that the president will get 95% of the vote because he's black or that samuel jackson is shouting because negroes are ...well because he's black. not that you've been paying any attention to the deep discussion going on among african americans ( or latinos or women or democrats even, ) about the kinds of misgivings and dissapointments we / they have about the the leadership we were expecting but received.
things is.. before romney received the nominations , white folks were saying all sorts of things about him, frankly i was surprised made the cut.hell, in the beginning i think romney was just as surprised. but people manage to bear and forgive all sorts of traits that, under other circumstances, might suggest that the man might benefit from a solid relationship with therapy. but continue with whatever bad faith or janky drugs that leads you to believe that the obama prsesidency deepened the racial divide because well.. he's black.
things is.. before romney received the nominations , white folks were saying all sorts of things about him, frankly i was surprised made the cut.hell, in the beginning i think romney was just as surprised. but people manage to bear and forgive all sorts of traits that, under other circumstances, might suggest that the man might benefit from a solid relationship with therapy. but continue with whatever bad faith or janky drugs that leads you to believe that the obama prsesidency deepened the racial divide because well.. he's black.
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@15 - I just happen to read that old Jackson news the other day and this post reminded me of it. ""I voted for Barack because he was black. Cause that’s why other folks vote for other people — because they look like them,"
There is probably more context and Jackson is certainly a Democrat but you can obviously attribute racism more heavily to blacks giving Obama 95% of their vote than whites giving Romney 60% of theirs.
There is probably more context and Jackson is certainly a Democrat but you can obviously attribute racism more heavily to blacks giving Obama 95% of their vote than whites giving Romney 60% of theirs.
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Get a grip people, democrats always carry about 80%-90% of the black vote.
Somehow this is only racist when they are also voting for a black democrat.
You know, that 80%-90% of black people were voting for white people all those other years.
Morons.
Somehow this is only racist when they are also voting for a black democrat.
You know, that 80%-90% of black people were voting for white people all those other years.
Morons.
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@14 ....which is precisely what Charles is saying.
To all you equivocators on this thread, what this article is saying is something pretty much everyone already knows: Not all bigots are voting for Romney. But all who are voting for Romney are bigots.
To all you equivocators on this thread, what this article is saying is something pretty much everyone already knows: Not all bigots are voting for Romney. But all who are voting for Romney are bigots.
21
Something like 88% of blacks voted for Clinton, and an equally large percentage for Kerry.
Blacks are overwhelmingly Democratic, not racist.
Whereas the Republicans cultivate racists, and feed them misleading simplified talking points.
Blacks are overwhelmingly Democratic, not racist.
Whereas the Republicans cultivate racists, and feed them misleading simplified talking points.
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@22 - Is it truly a statistically controversial statement to say that blacks are more likely to vote for Obama because he is black?! Obviously not a popular thing to say but if you can't even admit this plain fact how are you ever going to have your great racial dialog?
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@ cliche ( how apt ) no it's not statistically controversial to say that anyone will vote for some one because they look alike, but to proceed as if that would be the ONLY reason is why republicans failed with herman cain, why they failed with sarah palin, and why they'll continue to fail capture the constituents they really only half heartedly pursue. you 're not having a dialog because you're not engaging in a discussion that entertains complex thoughts. you've dismissed any other reason that blacks might have for voting for obama save the racial one. and then you want to call black people racist singling out all other factors than race
' .you can obviously attribute racism more heavily to blacks giving Obama 95% of their vote than whites giving Romney 60% of theirs. '.you say . 'what on earth could possibly be appealing to black voters other than skin color ? 'is not the the question you'd entertain. even when others point out those complexities, you'll run back to racial ones. there's no dialog, just sticking to your guns. your bottom line is 'blacks must be more racist because' . but that;s not a fact, that's a faith.and no you can't have much a dialog with bad faith.
' .you can obviously attribute racism more heavily to blacks giving Obama 95% of their vote than whites giving Romney 60% of theirs. '.you say . 'what on earth could possibly be appealing to black voters other than skin color ? 'is not the the question you'd entertain. even when others point out those complexities, you'll run back to racial ones. there's no dialog, just sticking to your guns. your bottom line is 'blacks must be more racist because' . but that;s not a fact, that's a faith.and no you can't have much a dialog with bad faith.
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@24 - You're reading a lot into my posts that I did not write or imply. I certainly did not say that race was the ONLY reason people vote for a candiate. I realize most blacks are Democrats and align more politically with Obama. I think you understand that. At this point I assume you are just making an assumption that I'm a white Republican and am not capable of serious discussion.
And to @20 and whoever else thinks this line of argument that black racism is a false equivocation, I do agree with that. I understand that racism combined with a minority status leads to different outcomes but that doesn't change the fact that individuals are biased to their own racial groups. It doesn't mean you can simply choose to ignore the Sam Jackson and Stacey Dash controversies because they don't serve your side of the story.
And to @20 and whoever else thinks this line of argument that black racism is a false equivocation, I do agree with that. I understand that racism combined with a minority status leads to different outcomes but that doesn't change the fact that individuals are biased to their own racial groups. It doesn't mean you can simply choose to ignore the Sam Jackson and Stacey Dash controversies because they don't serve your side of the story.
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If you can bring yourself to vote for Rmoney, then you can convince yourself of anything. Maybe it's like those stores where they have those $5 boxes wrapped up in nice wrapping paper, but you know whatever is inside isn't going to be worth more than $5 and could be worth much less.
I keep hearing how popular this douche is with white folk. Well, I'm white, and I know a lot but, granted, not all white folk. If any of my white friends are voting for Rmoney, they sure are keeping it quiet.
I'm hoping people will get in the voting booth and have a last minute reckoning...."I can't vote for a Mormon!"
I keep hearing how popular this douche is with white folk. Well, I'm white, and I know a lot but, granted, not all white folk. If any of my white friends are voting for Rmoney, they sure are keeping it quiet.
I'm hoping people will get in the voting booth and have a last minute reckoning...."I can't vote for a Mormon!"
27
@25..' At this point I assume you are just making an assumption that I'm a white Republican and am not capable of serious discussion.' sheesh project much ? i'm not assuming anything. you could be a green venusian for all i know, it doesn't matter to me.
you said and i repeat
' .you can obviously attribute racism more heavily to blacks giving Obama 95% of their vote than whites giving Romney 60% of theirs. '
again i ask why ? why do you think it's obvious particularly given other factors ? i DO think that even while you might recognize it's a false equivocation , you'll still argue along those lines. it's a bad argument so just stop it. it doesn't point to racism among blacks ( and i would never argue that blacks can't be racist..ok ? ) i will argue , given all sorts of things samuel jackson said or might say, considering that a controversy and pursuing it as such is thin particularly in contrast to the myopia that's governing the republican selection for this election.
you said and i repeat
' .you can obviously attribute racism more heavily to blacks giving Obama 95% of their vote than whites giving Romney 60% of theirs. '
again i ask why ? why do you think it's obvious particularly given other factors ? i DO think that even while you might recognize it's a false equivocation , you'll still argue along those lines. it's a bad argument so just stop it. it doesn't point to racism among blacks ( and i would never argue that blacks can't be racist..ok ? ) i will argue , given all sorts of things samuel jackson said or might say, considering that a controversy and pursuing it as such is thin particularly in contrast to the myopia that's governing the republican selection for this election.
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@27 - "again i ask why ? why do you think it's obvious particularly given other factors ?"
1) Obama hasn't improved black employment
2) Black incarceration has doubled under Obama
3) Black people are more likely to be anti-abortion
4) Black people are more likely to be against gay marriage
The better question is what "other factors" are YOU referring to?
1) Obama hasn't improved black employment
2) Black incarceration has doubled under Obama
3) Black people are more likely to be anti-abortion
4) Black people are more likely to be against gay marriage
The better question is what "other factors" are YOU referring to?
29
@28,
The other factors are that black Americans are well aware that Republicans want to throw all of them in prison and throw away the key.
Other factors like this:
Factors like the fact that the black middle class is largely employed in the government. Want to know why Obama hasn't decreased the black unemployment rate? Because Republicans have been laying off government workers en masse.
Factors like the fact that black people (poor and middle class alike) are all too aware of how tenuous their basic survival is, and the Republican plan to gut what's left of social services would devastate them.
The better question is why are you so fucking stupid to think that Republican policy is good for the black community? The better question is why are you so fucking racist that you assume black Americans are too stupid to decide what's in their own interest? The better question is why are you claiming that black Americans aren't as entitled to vote in their own interests as anyone else?
Just because you are too stupid to vote in your own interest doesn't mean that everyone else should be too.
The other factors are that black Americans are well aware that Republicans want to throw all of them in prison and throw away the key.
Other factors like this:
A Republican member of the Arkansas state senate’s self-published memoir claims that for black people in America, slavery was a “blessing in disguise"
Factors like the fact that the black middle class is largely employed in the government. Want to know why Obama hasn't decreased the black unemployment rate? Because Republicans have been laying off government workers en masse.
Factors like the fact that black people (poor and middle class alike) are all too aware of how tenuous their basic survival is, and the Republican plan to gut what's left of social services would devastate them.
The better question is why are you so fucking stupid to think that Republican policy is good for the black community? The better question is why are you so fucking racist that you assume black Americans are too stupid to decide what's in their own interest? The better question is why are you claiming that black Americans aren't as entitled to vote in their own interests as anyone else?
Just because you are too stupid to vote in your own interest doesn't mean that everyone else should be too.
30
This is going to be trolled, but I don't care. I'm so sick of the terms "white" "brown" and "black"
Those of us who are mixed but look like one or the other don't necessarily fit any one.
Those of us who are mixed but look like one or the other don't necessarily fit any one.
31
@29 - More putting words in my mouth. I'm not making a case for blacks voting Republican. I understand why many wouldn't. But there are more than 5% of blacks that are aligned more politically with Romney than with Obama so I'm asserting that the explanation of that 95% number is coming from blacks simply voting for the black guy. It's the counter point to the original argument of this post that whites are the only racists in the equation here. That's all I'm saying.
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@30 - Well your parents the ones who are helping the most to settle this all in the end. Once everybody is born looking alike there will be no racism.
33
!28 one .. romney.. the choice between a democrat..any democrat and republicans. any republican running in this election anywhere. and that includes black republicans like herman cain and condoleeza rice, who refuse to address most concerns that people who are most likely to be affected by republican policies, hell they're black why aren't black people out cheering , cain, and rice and alan keyes and clarence thomas ? how about the fact that republicans fail and fail and fail again to consider or address black people's concerns even when given the opportunity to do ever hear a republican mention, let alone, discuss the outrageous scourge of black incarceration, rampant black unemployment ? me neither
i'm not sure where you getting your examples and i could only guess why you cling to them. 'black people are more likely to be anti-abortion' ? then whom ? white people ? black people are more likely to be against gay marriage. than whom white republicans ? even while there is evidence of growing number of black clergy who are reconsidering their stance on the issue even as the republican plank is to plan oppose it.? i don't know the numbers of black unemployment today as opposed to 4 years ago, but why doubt that any black american can listen to romney and fail glean a smidgen of hope about their future, in terms of incarceration, in cases of gay civil rights, in the question of women's right's to control their bodies. given that we're still dealing with a 2 party system, why you or anyone would think that black people ought to entertain being governed or led by (or lied to for that matter ) what is inarguably the worst republican candidate we can recall in our lifetime. but you will cling to the idea that it's just because we're black.
i'm not sure where you getting your examples and i could only guess why you cling to them. 'black people are more likely to be anti-abortion' ? then whom ? white people ? black people are more likely to be against gay marriage. than whom white republicans ? even while there is evidence of growing number of black clergy who are reconsidering their stance on the issue even as the republican plank is to plan oppose it.? i don't know the numbers of black unemployment today as opposed to 4 years ago, but why doubt that any black american can listen to romney and fail glean a smidgen of hope about their future, in terms of incarceration, in cases of gay civil rights, in the question of women's right's to control their bodies. given that we're still dealing with a 2 party system, why you or anyone would think that black people ought to entertain being governed or led by (or lied to for that matter ) what is inarguably the worst republican candidate we can recall in our lifetime. but you will cling to the idea that it's just because we're black.
34
@33 - Well it's been fun to talk about. I'm sure Obama has this thing locked up. Please consider voting Gary Johnson.
35
Given past elections, maybe 15 percent of black voters would even consider voting Republican. Has nothing happened in the past 12 years that might have changed that? Nothing other than Obama being black? Such as the Republicans becoming even more unhinged and racist in the face of a black president? Or an economic collapse that has devastated the black middle class? How about the Republican candidate being the personification of the predatory capitalism that caused the collapse?
Romney's support among the black community stands at ZERO percent. He has less support from the black community than McCain. Why is Obama's race factoring in so much more in this election than the last for black voters?
But there are more than 5% of blacks that are aligned more politically with Romney than with Obama
Given past elections, maybe 15 percent of black voters would even consider voting Republican. Has nothing happened in the past 12 years that might have changed that? Nothing other than Obama being black? Such as the Republicans becoming even more unhinged and racist in the face of a black president? Or an economic collapse that has devastated the black middle class? How about the Republican candidate being the personification of the predatory capitalism that caused the collapse?
Romney's support among the black community stands at ZERO percent. He has less support from the black community than McCain. Why is Obama's race factoring in so much more in this election than the last for black voters?
37
@36 Given that being elected to a second term is usually considered one of the criteria of being considered a successful president, how is it specifically racist to consider that as a factor?
If JFK had been able to run for a second term, I imagine some would have made a similar calculation.
I imagine that our first woman to hold the office will get a re-election boost as well.
If JFK had been able to run for a second term, I imagine some would have made a similar calculation.
I imagine that our first woman to hold the office will get a re-election boost as well.
38
cliche, it makes no difference how many minorities who are voting for Obama are doing it out of racism. The overwhelming majority of the President's supporters are not bigots. Nearly every supporter of Romney is motivated by racism & bigotry. I could spend the next month citing examples. This doesn't mean you're a bigot for supporting Romney. It does mean that most people who think like you are also bigots.
If you don't like racism, then the first step is w/ yourself: change how you see the world.
If you don't like racism, then the first step is w/ yourself: change how you see the world.
39
@38 - I don't know if you read through the entire thread but I don't support Romney. It's pretty incredible how blindly partisan Democrat this blog is. If you don't tow the Democrat line you will literally be labeled a Republic bigot as if that were the only other alternative. Please consider voting Gary Johnson.
40
John Edwards was right in that there are two, and Whiteness is definitely factor. More than that, though, I think the the fundamental divide is between Platonists and Ironists. Platonists presume an essential America (white, Judeo-Christian, martial, rustic, isolated), and see variation as evidence of corruption. This is old hat in intellectual terms -- Rousseau, Thoreau, and Spengler would all be nodding their heads. In a world of capitalism unmoored by sentiment, a retreat into tribalism and a cargo cult of white faces surveying white picket fences seems very natural.
In contrast, the textured denizens of the metropolis (omni-ethnic, omni-sexual, wired, weird), accept contingency and embrace improvised structures. "Whatever works," is the expectation of the pragmatic America Obama represents. I think it's reductionist to suggest that unreconstructed racism drives Republican rage against Obama; if you study the kinds of things the radical right was writing about Bill and Hillary Clinton back in the nineties, you'll see a lot of the same suspicion, the same unease, the same sense of an alien and nefarious occupant in the White House. Obama does, however, embody the Ironist America. His governing style could be summed up as "whatever works." That doesn't make for a great narrative in an election year; I think Obama would be doing better with whites if he was assimilating more of the frightened victims of financialization into Ironist America, rather than trying to meet them on their own terms (which inevitably sounds insincere).
In contrast, the textured denizens of the metropolis (omni-ethnic, omni-sexual, wired, weird), accept contingency and embrace improvised structures. "Whatever works," is the expectation of the pragmatic America Obama represents. I think it's reductionist to suggest that unreconstructed racism drives Republican rage against Obama; if you study the kinds of things the radical right was writing about Bill and Hillary Clinton back in the nineties, you'll see a lot of the same suspicion, the same unease, the same sense of an alien and nefarious occupant in the White House. Obama does, however, embody the Ironist America. His governing style could be summed up as "whatever works." That doesn't make for a great narrative in an election year; I think Obama would be doing better with whites if he was assimilating more of the frightened victims of financialization into Ironist America, rather than trying to meet them on their own terms (which inevitably sounds insincere).
41
@39 - you've provided no reason to support Gary, other than implying that black people should vote for him instead because reasons. And if they don't, they're racists, because there couldn't possibly be any other deciding factors then that.
I have many reasons for not voting for Rmoney, and the behavior of the Republican fan club is one of them. Congrats, you've given me another reason to not vote for Gary.
I have many reasons for not voting for Rmoney, and the behavior of the Republican fan club is one of them. Congrats, you've given me another reason to not vote for Gary.
42
@14: I believe he did, yes. Are we to assume that you spout this axiom because you personally believe it to be true? If so, the logical follow-up question is, Then why the hell are you voting for Mitt Romney?
43
Dr. King gave his life in his efforts to enlighten this country to judge a man (or woman) by the content of character and not by skin color. And I've seen very little that wil convince me that Romney is the bigot that he's being portrayed to be here. Similarly, I don't see anything overtly racist that is inherent to the republican party. I have witnessed a shit ton of ignorance from the fuckwads that are by all indications inbred and self identified as Romney supporters, much of which has been articulated through grotesque racial slurs. But I don't know that these people are Republicans so much as they are sheep. And knuckle dragging mouthbreathers, but that's another debate.
I don't think that Romney or his party is (are?) bigot(s) because they are equal opportunity haters--they despise anyone who they perceive as less than them. Romney is not singling out black people or brown people or any other color of people for his disdain and disregard--he pretty much hates all of us.
I don't think that Romney or his party is (are?) bigot(s) because they are equal opportunity haters--they despise anyone who they perceive as less than them. Romney is not singling out black people or brown people or any other color of people for his disdain and disregard--he pretty much hates all of us.
44
@43 "I don't think that Romney or his party is (are?) bigot(s) because they are equal opportunity haters--they despise anyone who they perceive as less than them. Romney is not singling out black people or brown people or any other color of people for his disdain and disregard--he pretty much hates all of us."
Factually, they are in some ways, dog whistle and otherwise, singling out black people or brown people in their rhetoric and policies.
I don't know that you are wrong that they are not specifically bigoted and are rather equal opportunity haters, but I submit to you that they are functionally racist.
Factually, they are in some ways, dog whistle and otherwise, singling out black people or brown people in their rhetoric and policies.
I don't know that you are wrong that they are not specifically bigoted and are rather equal opportunity haters, but I submit to you that they are functionally racist.
45
@43 The GOP and the Romney campaign is using obvious racist dog whistles a lot, perhaps more than at anytime in the past 20 years. If you refuse to see that, then you are constitutionally or willfully unwilling to be honest with yourself, or, most likely, you yourself harbor the racist sentiments the dog whistles are targeting. Blacks on the other hand, have no trouble seeing that the GOP is overtly bigoted against them because they are actively trying to incite white people to blame their problems on black people. The more fascinating question is how there can be 5% of the black population who will vote for anyone in a party that is actively trying to scapegoat them for the nation's ills.
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