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News & ArtsThursday, July 12, 2012
Transportation Rating Seattle's Public Transportation Coverage
Posted by Charles Mudede on Thu, Jul 12, 2012 at 8:55 AM
It's a high rating...
Over three-quarters of all jobs in the 100 largest metropolitan areas are in neighborhoods with transit service. Western metro areas like Los Angeles and Seattle exhibit the highest coverage rates, while rates are lowest in Southern metro areas like Atlanta and Greenville. Regardless of region, city jobs across every metro area and industry category have better access to transit than their suburban counterparts.My wish is this: Seattle takes the position expressed by the former mayor of Bogota, Enrique Peñalosa, in the documentary Urbanized. For him, a city that privileges the bus on all major roads is a city that's really (and not superficially—meaning, one man/woman, one vote) democratic.
A bus w/100 passengers has the right to 100 times more road space than a car w/1. Democracy at work.Cars should be stuck in traffic, not buses.
1
Bogotá is an interesting case study, a city that abandoned its plans for a traditional Metro for a system of busways. They apparently work pretty well, but they'lll awfully limited in scope -- and they're aided by what honestly have to be the widest streets of any city in the world. I've been poking around on Bogotá streets quite a bit lately, virtually, and honestly the major streets there seem like they're a mile wide. Plenty of room for a dedicated busway.
We're putting them in, to some extent, with the new Rapid Ride lines on Aurora and a few other places, replacing the 358 among other things, but they're not really full-on busways. I've ridden the one down Insurgentes in Mexico City, and it works very well -- and is completely packed with people most of the time.
Interestingly, Bogotá is now struggling to start construction on a more traditional underground Metro. Buses aren't the be-all and end-all. The truth is they are very unpleasant to ride in most cases.
We're putting them in, to some extent, with the new Rapid Ride lines on Aurora and a few other places, replacing the 358 among other things, but they're not really full-on busways. I've ridden the one down Insurgentes in Mexico City, and it works very well -- and is completely packed with people most of the time.
Interestingly, Bogotá is now struggling to start construction on a more traditional underground Metro. Buses aren't the be-all and end-all. The truth is they are very unpleasant to ride in most cases.
2
I always was curious if it would it be possible (and reasonable) to modify the car pool lanes to only allow Buses during rush hour(s)?
It seems this would allow for a much better commute time from the 'burbs and possibly encourage more people to use transit instead of picking up a hooker to use the car pool lane (looking your way Larry David).
It seems this would allow for a much better commute time from the 'burbs and possibly encourage more people to use transit instead of picking up a hooker to use the car pool lane (looking your way Larry David).
3
Bogota Population = 7,100,000
Seattle Population = 650,000
Its easy for Bogota to justify this as they simply have far more people living in their city. Until Seattles population explodes (which current density plans are being fought by NIMBYs), you wont get people taking mass transit as serious as it is in larger cities.
I spent 3 1/2 hours on the commute yesterday, getting to the 520 bridge was just embarrassing. But once the project is completed, the HOV lane will be moved from the outside lane to the inside, giving carpools and buses a higher priority (they wont have to merge with traffic on the on/off ramps).
Seattle Population = 650,000
Its easy for Bogota to justify this as they simply have far more people living in their city. Until Seattles population explodes (which current density plans are being fought by NIMBYs), you wont get people taking mass transit as serious as it is in larger cities.
I spent 3 1/2 hours on the commute yesterday, getting to the 520 bridge was just embarrassing. But once the project is completed, the HOV lane will be moved from the outside lane to the inside, giving carpools and buses a higher priority (they wont have to merge with traffic on the on/off ramps).
6
@3, the correct figures are
Bogotá, 7,881,156
Seattle 3,500,026
Bogotá is a metropolitan region as well as a central city, just like Seattle. Bogotá is slightly denser than Seattle, about in line with LA.
Most importantly, while it is overall a very wealthy, well-developed modern city, it has very large pockets of absolute grinding poverty of a kind unknown here, the dollar-a-day shanty-town dwellers who don't even have streets, let alone transit running on them. If these people are to earn even the miserable sums they currently get, they NEED access to transit to richer parts of the city.
Bogotá, 7,881,156
Seattle 3,500,026
Bogotá is a metropolitan region as well as a central city, just like Seattle. Bogotá is slightly denser than Seattle, about in line with LA.
Most importantly, while it is overall a very wealthy, well-developed modern city, it has very large pockets of absolute grinding poverty of a kind unknown here, the dollar-a-day shanty-town dwellers who don't even have streets, let alone transit running on them. If these people are to earn even the miserable sums they currently get, they NEED access to transit to richer parts of the city.
7
@2 It's easier than that. Just shift it to 3+ people to reduce the number of cars. That's politically easier than having a lane that everyone sees as empty as the sit in their cars. Since buses aren't stuck, it will seem empty. Add 3+ carpools and it will seem less so.
8
Delhi disagrees with Maude. Buses, apparently, are supposed to be stuck in traffic just like everyone else.
This is why we need rail.
This is why we need rail.
9
Seattle and LA more transit coverage than NYC?????? When you consider the sprawl of jobs to the suburbs/exurbs that both cities have, this study is a little hard to take seriously. I could believe this study if we had the equivalents of the LIRR, New Jersey Transit, and PATH carrying passengers with the right of way to places like Snohomish County, the East Side, and Tacoma at all hours of the day.
10
@6 yes, but is it denser because it doesn't have large bodies of water in the Greater Bogata area whilst Greater Seattle does?
You can compare anything. Doesn't mean you should.
You can compare anything. Doesn't mean you should.
11
#9
I grew up in the furthest corner of Queens. The nearest bus stop was (and is) a good six block walk from my house (long blocks). The nearest subway stop was miles away. And during the day time you might wait 30 minutes or longer. There was an express to Manhattan that ran rush hours and cost $5.
Here in Kent, I am near 3 local bus lines, and 4 express lines and a paratransit bus stops practically at my apartment door. Sounder is just down the hill at Kent station.
When seen in the MTA map with thick color lines it appears like there is a subway station everywhere, but if think of the land area, many of them are quite widely spaced.
I grew up in the furthest corner of Queens. The nearest bus stop was (and is) a good six block walk from my house (long blocks). The nearest subway stop was miles away. And during the day time you might wait 30 minutes or longer. There was an express to Manhattan that ran rush hours and cost $5.
Here in Kent, I am near 3 local bus lines, and 4 express lines and a paratransit bus stops practically at my apartment door. Sounder is just down the hill at Kent station.
When seen in the MTA map with thick color lines it appears like there is a subway station everywhere, but if think of the land area, many of them are quite widely spaced.
12
Riding w/ the trash on route 7 or 358 will convince you to better your job situation and get a car.
13
A study that measures coverage strictly by the percentage of geographical area served is pretty limited. Around here are lot of areas technically are served by transit (buses) but have such limited frequency and hours that they're barely useful.
15
"absolute grinding poverty of a kind unknown here, the dollar-a-day shanty-town dwellers"
Or as Charles calls them, the future.
Or as Charles calls them, the future.
17
@16, but you missed my point, which is that "Seattle" in this comparison doesn't mean "City of Seattle", but "Seattle-Tacoma-Bremerton CMSA" in order to compare apples to apples here. Bogotá is roughly twice as populous as Seattle, not 12 times.
18
@ 16, you got this one wrong. In addition to Fnarf's observations, consider that Seattle doesn't run its own bus system, independent of the burbs, so just speaking of the city of Seattle all by itself doesn't make sense.
19
Which is what I pointed out in @10, @17, but you missed that you can't compare them directly. Many large bodies of water means restrictions, stuff like bridges, tunnels, ferries, all cramming together in a tight ... DENSER ... state.
But, hey, let's take your analysis for it.
But, hey, let's take your analysis for it.
20
hey, don't mind me, Fnarf is still shocked they'll be building 40 story tall buildings south of him.
22
@19, you stupid motherfucking piece of shit, you don't know what you're talking about, and you are AS ALWAYS wrong. The density of Seattle is considerably less than Bogotá even when the bodies of water is taken into consideration.
YOU HAVE NO CLUE. You never even heard of Bogotá until today, so why are you pretending to be knowledgeable when every single word you type belies that notion?
Stupid fucking sack of dog diarrhea.
YOU HAVE NO CLUE. You never even heard of Bogotá until today, so why are you pretending to be knowledgeable when every single word you type belies that notion?
Stupid fucking sack of dog diarrhea.
23
Fnarf, you're really taking your penchant for grating, sardonic comments to another level with #22.
24
@23, this isn't even in the top fifty when it comes to me taking Will in Seattle to pieces. He's a supernova of suckitude, a grotesque serial liar and blowhard, and he knows absofuckinglutely nothing about any of the subjects he comments on here but adopts a know-it-all tone that is impossibly galling, especially since he doesn't seem to care that his lies and bullshit are glaringly obvious to anyone with a clue. He just plows on ahead, spraying everyone on all sides with a thick coating of verbal sewage.
He deserves everything he gets. He deserves ten times worse. He deserves a beating with a ball peen hammer about face and neck.
He deserves everything he gets. He deserves ten times worse. He deserves a beating with a ball peen hammer about face and neck.
25
@24 This is why I learned to spit in the compulsive liar's face, and ask him to prove that he could whip Bruce Lee's ass. Once you call the bluff, you'll never see him again. Pity that approach doesn't work online.
26
Girls! Girls! Please don't fight! All of you will get a chance to suck up to the Stranger's own Renaissance Man, Chuckie Mudede.
Of course, you could join the cast of "Pawn Stars" and have producers feed you useless information instead of jockeying for top Renaissance Sycophant in the vast wasteland of Chuckie's posts.
Of course, you could join the cast of "Pawn Stars" and have producers feed you useless information instead of jockeying for top Renaissance Sycophant in the vast wasteland of Chuckie's posts.
27
I am sorta surprised Charles is promoting Bogota's bus system because it is the shining star in the giant neoliberal scheme to formalize the transit sector in developing countries.
Granted the existing transit systems are not working, but what is going on is that when Bus Rapid Transit systems are created they require large companies to operate them. The small owner/operators are pushed out of the business while large companies benefit from the public subsidization of the infrastructure. It really isn't about democracy.
Granted the existing transit systems are not working, but what is going on is that when Bus Rapid Transit systems are created they require large companies to operate them. The small owner/operators are pushed out of the business while large companies benefit from the public subsidization of the infrastructure. It really isn't about democracy.
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