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News & ArtsTuesday, May 29, 2012
Politics / Books Adultery: It's Okay If You're a Republican (That Goes Double If You're a Republican and My Daddy!)
Posted by Dan Savage on Tue, May 29, 2012 at 12:42 PM
In her new book, Meghan McCain blasts Karl Rove as a “pathetic excuse for a human being” who spread vicious rumors about her father, finds Bill Clinton deplorable for having “cheated and lied” while then trying to play the victim... McCain, a Columbia University graduate, vows that she has “never cheated on a boyfriend,” having been raised by her parents to never lie, cheat or steal. “This is why, for me, it is a completely black-and-white situation: President Clinton cheated and lied. You can argue all you want, but he cheated on his marriage vows."
Bill Clinton cheated on his wife and that makes him utterly deplorable and Megan would never cheat on a boyfriend because her parents raised her never to lie, cheat or steal.
It appears that Meghan McCain's book research didn't include a visit to her father's Wikipedia page:
On July 3, 1965, McCain married Carol Shepp, a model originally from Philadelphia. McCain adopted her two young children Douglas and Andrew. He and Carol then had a daughter named Sidney.... In April 1979, McCain met Cindy Lou Hensley, a teacher from Phoenix, Arizona, whose father had founded a large beer distributorship. They began dating, and he urged his wife Carol to grant him a divorce, which she did in February 1980, with the uncontested divorce taking effect in April 1980.
Meghan McCain would not exist if her father—the one who taught her never to lie or cheat—didn't cheat on his first wife with the woman who would be one day be Meghan's mother. That makes Meghan McCain the byproduct of an adulterous affair—the somewhat dense and seemingly hypocritical byproduct of an adulterous affair. Now I haven't read Meghan's new book yet—I'll get to right it after finish Fifty Shades of Grey (which is to say never)—so it's possible that she explains what makes the lying and cheating her parents engaged in different and somehow less deplorable than the "black and white" lying and cheating that Bill Clinton engaged in. But I suspect that Meghan doesn't go there.
Because adultery, like all the deadly sins, IOIYAR.
5
Another case of selective morality. Yeah, if you're going to throw darts (and, metaphorically, I don't recommend throwing darts), make sure the target isn't on your back or on the back of someone you love.
PS: Save the darts for the bad guys.
PS: Save the darts for the bad guys.
6
@2 On Wikipedia, there are these little numbers every so often next to the text. You may have missed them, they're kinda small. They're called "footnotes." Those numbers correspond to the actual sources of the information in the article. Hence the name, they appear at the "foot" of the article. Wikipedia has made it easy for people like you, all you have to do is click on the number & it will take you to the bottom of the page. There, you'll find the source for what's in the article.
This is a standard way of writing academic papers. You learn stuff like this in school.
This is a standard way of writing academic papers. You learn stuff like this in school.
7
It is not "hypocritical" of Megan McCain to have such an inflexible stance on monogamy just because her father has been married twice.
8
@2 Were you around during the 2008 election cycle? This story was pretty widely reported, as I recall.
This isn't quite as dumb as Bristol Palin being a spokesperson for married, two-parent families and abstinence before marriage, but it's still dumb.
This isn't quite as dumb as Bristol Palin being a spokesperson for married, two-parent families and abstinence before marriage, but it's still dumb.
9
And George W. Bush wishes we would stop calling them "the Bush tax cuts" because everybody must take personal responsibility unless they're Republicans.
10
Megan McCain's not my favorite person. And John McCain has talked about being an imperfect person and a not great husband to his first wives. So maybe he learned his lesson and passed those lessons on to his children. That said, when we decide to stick it to the Republicans can we start with the ones who don't: 1) publicly challenge their high-ranking and influential parents 2) support (rather loudly) gay rights 3) challenge Republican stances on women's rights and who do: give credit to high-ranking Dems at times.
I mean really, was it a super-slow news day? You couldn't find a sound bite of some asshat elected official spouting "facts" about the dangers of gay marriage? Or trying to undermine abortion rights? Or giving massive tax-breaks to the rich? We're picking on someone for her moral stance re: cheating? I have some massive issues with cheating, in large part because my dad cheated and walked out on his family when I was a kid. And guess what? I still love the man. Cause, ya know, he's my dad. But I still think John Edwards is a dick. And Bill Clinton. I don't have to give them the same pass I gave my dad.
I mean really, was it a super-slow news day? You couldn't find a sound bite of some asshat elected official spouting "facts" about the dangers of gay marriage? Or trying to undermine abortion rights? Or giving massive tax-breaks to the rich? We're picking on someone for her moral stance re: cheating? I have some massive issues with cheating, in large part because my dad cheated and walked out on his family when I was a kid. And guess what? I still love the man. Cause, ya know, he's my dad. But I still think John Edwards is a dick. And Bill Clinton. I don't have to give them the same pass I gave my dad.
11
2, John McCain himself admits to the affair. Actually it was multiple affairs. He started cheating on his first wife long before he met Cindy.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0f53-j7QK…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0f53-j7QK…
12
You know how much I care about the marital infidelities of past presidents and presidential candidates? Not at all.
13
Also hypocritical:
Meghan specifically accuses Karl Rove of being the driving force behind the nasty rumors about her younger adopted sister being Daddy McCain´s secret "mixed-race" love-child during the 2000 Republican primary race.
But today she posted her new Daily-Beast-segment called "Start Raving Meghan" in which she whines that all the "cool" celebrities support Obama whereas the Republicans only have DONALD "The Birther" TRUMP as a "hip" celebrity supporter on their side:
http://www.thedailybeast.com/videos/2012…
LOL
Meghan specifically accuses Karl Rove of being the driving force behind the nasty rumors about her younger adopted sister being Daddy McCain´s secret "mixed-race" love-child during the 2000 Republican primary race.
But today she posted her new Daily-Beast-segment called "Start Raving Meghan" in which she whines that all the "cool" celebrities support Obama whereas the Republicans only have DONALD "The Birther" TRUMP as a "hip" celebrity supporter on their side:
http://www.thedailybeast.com/videos/2012…
LOL
14
@7 on the contrary, it's understandable. Now if she happened to carry on an adulterous affair, then yes I would agree, hypocrisy!
It is possible that McCain did some growing up between his first and second marriages. It's also possible he's a hypocritical, golddigging douchebag. And it's also possible that Megan McCain is avoiding the topic so as not to cause grief at the dining room table, something that happens in every family.
What is a bit tiresome is jumping on every last little family blemish to score political points. Last I heard, Megan's been pretty good about confronting the GOP on their homophobia. That's basically the kind of Republican we need to cultivate. I know Slog is a liberal bastion, but we don't have to be so dickish about it.
It is possible that McCain did some growing up between his first and second marriages. It's also possible he's a hypocritical, golddigging douchebag. And it's also possible that Megan McCain is avoiding the topic so as not to cause grief at the dining room table, something that happens in every family.
What is a bit tiresome is jumping on every last little family blemish to score political points. Last I heard, Megan's been pretty good about confronting the GOP on their homophobia. That's basically the kind of Republican we need to cultivate. I know Slog is a liberal bastion, but we don't have to be so dickish about it.
16
From everything I've read about the success rates of marriages of returning tortured POWs, my surprise that McCain's first marriage broke up is exactly nil. For those men, a round of 'I'm focused only on myself and what I want' for the next year or so it quite normal, and any spouse with that attitude is absolute crap to be married to during that. From MM's point of view, her parents modeled monogamy for her in their own marriage. I don't see much point in berating her. Plus 10, 12, etc.
18
Maybe it isn't cheating if you marry your co-cheater, eventually?
I don't know...it's tortured logic, to be sure. But she is right about Karl Rove.
I don't know...it's tortured logic, to be sure. But she is right about Karl Rove.
19
@14 and others: nobody would be criticizing either John or Megan's McCain if she hadn' t dumped on Clinton for the crime of cheating. In fact, the last time I looked, Bill and Hillary were still married, whereas John had dumped his first wife and married his mistress, just like Newt. Nows I am fine with Megan's preaching the virtues of monogamy. I am a fan of it myself. But if she is going to criticize somebody else for cheating while holding up her formerly adulterous parents as moral exemplars, she might want to consider adages about glass houses and stones.
20
@4: Yeah, but it's attached to that crazy bitch. I don't care how awesome her boobs are. I can't put up with that kind of lunacy. At all.
21
Yeah, of all the dickish republicans to get my panties in a bunch about, Megan McCain is relatively low on the list. I don't agree with most of what she stands for, but a pro gay rights republican who is against cheating but doesn't drag her own father through the mud really isn't going to get me all worked up.
I don't like that she is anti-choice, but I have to give her credit that she is very pro sex education and contraception, and doesn't hesitate to call out republicans who are anti choice but also want to restrict people's access to contraception and information that would keep them from getting pregnant in the first place. So again, she at least isn't a hypocrite on the subject.
I also like that she has admitted that the more she reads about economics the more confusing it is and so she doesn't make statements about economics. That kind of honesty is severely lacking on both sides of the isles where everyone pretends they are experts on every subject and fully capable of making informed decisions about the most obscure issues when they really have no clue what they are talking about or voting on half the time.
My father cheated too. I am also very much against cheating and never would. I don't see where that makes her a hypocrite just because she doesn't make comments on her father's foibles. In general I don't talk about my father's failings in public either.
I don't like that she is anti-choice, but I have to give her credit that she is very pro sex education and contraception, and doesn't hesitate to call out republicans who are anti choice but also want to restrict people's access to contraception and information that would keep them from getting pregnant in the first place. So again, she at least isn't a hypocrite on the subject.
I also like that she has admitted that the more she reads about economics the more confusing it is and so she doesn't make statements about economics. That kind of honesty is severely lacking on both sides of the isles where everyone pretends they are experts on every subject and fully capable of making informed decisions about the most obscure issues when they really have no clue what they are talking about or voting on half the time.
My father cheated too. I am also very much against cheating and never would. I don't see where that makes her a hypocrite just because she doesn't make comments on her father's foibles. In general I don't talk about my father's failings in public either.
22
@6 - im aware of the footnotes on wiki, but IMO the reader shouldn't have to track down the story to verify its truth. citing wikipedia as a source is akin to saying "this guy on 23rd street told me, so it must be true". its just kind of slack.
23
+10 for successfully reminding everyone what a douche her father was without saying a word about it. She's more Raving than her father ever was Maverick.
24
@7 It's not about his multiple marriages. It's about the fact that he's admitted to adultery in the past. Still, you're right, hypocritical is the wrong word. It would be hypocritical if SHE were the one cheating. It's pretty stupid to profess she learned about faithfulness from her adulterous parents though.
25
Well this is just a little Payton place,
And you're all Harper Valley hypocrits
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aOZPBUu7F…
26
@22 -
If the entire world were allowed to hear what the guy on 23rd told you, then correct him, then create a record of their correction, and in instances where people disagree, state their cases in a public forum.
Then yeah, you're right: the guy on 23rd is just as credible as Wikipedia.
Esp if you want a source of unquestionable fact without doing any extra reading yourself.
BTW: Hotmail would like you to conform your password. Go ahead and click this link and they'll guide you through the process: http://www.idiot.com/
If the entire world were allowed to hear what the guy on 23rd told you, then correct him, then create a record of their correction, and in instances where people disagree, state their cases in a public forum.
Then yeah, you're right: the guy on 23rd is just as credible as Wikipedia.
Esp if you want a source of unquestionable fact without doing any extra reading yourself.
BTW: Hotmail would like you to conform your password. Go ahead and click this link and they'll guide you through the process: http://www.idiot.com/
27
Okay, she says her father and mother taught her not to "lie, cheat or steal." But her father and mother DID do that so they are the hypocrites (and, as an adult, she's playing along rather than saying, "I'm going to do what they said to do, not what they did").
And again, the Clintons have a messy marriage but they are STILL together. A lot more Reps jump ship than Dems.
But don't get me started on Gingrich.
And again, the Clintons have a messy marriage but they are STILL together. A lot more Reps jump ship than Dems.
But don't get me started on Gingrich.
28
@26 - thats just it though, the entire world CAN hear the guy on 23rd st because of wikipedia. unless theyve changed their model, wiki is a community source that's created by joe shmoes around the world and anyone can put anything on there regardless of how untrue it may be. upon checking the footnotes it redirected me to the NY times article:
http://www.nytimes.com/2000/02/27/us/pow…
which is what the original blog post should have referenced as it IS a credible source. they teach the use of credible sources in writing classes in schools these days ya know.
http://www.nytimes.com/2000/02/27/us/pow…
which is what the original blog post should have referenced as it IS a credible source. they teach the use of credible sources in writing classes in schools these days ya know.
29
i would love to see some of you guys turn in a paper to one of your teachers with wikipedia listed in the footnotes.....any decent teacher would give you an immediate F
30
@16 Actually, it wasn't about him being a POW. She had been in an accident while he was away, and she was no longer "model pretty". When Little Johnnie got home, he got into the Pentagon's political liaison racket and needed a pretty wife for the cocktail parties. A rich and connected one would be even better. Enter Cindy Lou Hensley. Her money and his name got him elected.
It's every bit as much a character revealing story as Newt's marital history.
It's every bit as much a character revealing story as Newt's marital history.
31
@10 and 16,
McCain *currently* cheats on his wife and has been doing so for years. The two of them don't even live together. Meghan McCain is a liar, hypocrite, and idiot of the highest order.
McCain *currently* cheats on his wife and has been doing so for years. The two of them don't even live together. Meghan McCain is a liar, hypocrite, and idiot of the highest order.
32
Ms. McCain's self-righteousness and sanctimony grate on me just as much as her apparently clueless hypocrisy.
She should shove her "black-and-white" certitude where the sun doesn't shine.
And nice job, comment 6. Wikipedia gets a bad rap--if someone wants to see original source material, they can usually do far worse than checking out the references footnoted on most Wiki pages.
She should shove her "black-and-white" certitude where the sun doesn't shine.
And nice job, comment 6. Wikipedia gets a bad rap--if someone wants to see original source material, they can usually do far worse than checking out the references footnoted on most Wiki pages.
33
@29 -- Turn in a paper based on wiki as opposed to a paper based on what, the Compton's Encyclopaedia in One Volume, which, as far as anyone really knows could have been written entirely by a band of monkeys being paid in bananas and figs by Donald Trump? Wikipedia's the only encyclopaedic information source around that even uses footnotes as backup for the information it presents. Perhaps the teachers would give a failing grade, but the students are still going to be learning from a verifiable source. And, yes, before you go off on the verifiable source, I'm well aware that there are any number of people these days who can't figure out the difference between a reliable footnote and one leading to a crackpot theorist. But they're going to have the same trouble assimilating information from Compton's, too.
34
@29 now youre just being silly, wikipedia even ADMITS to containing false information and lists several notable instances that have made headlines.
im happy to use wikipedia as much as the next guy, it is a useful tool however i take much of the pop culture stuff with a grain of salt and you can be damn sure if i were making a statement that had to hold up in court (or to a letter grade) i would be using something that as a reputation for being reliable.
im happy to use wikipedia as much as the next guy, it is a useful tool however i take much of the pop culture stuff with a grain of salt and you can be damn sure if i were making a statement that had to hold up in court (or to a letter grade) i would be using something that as a reputation for being reliable.
35
Remember this exchange from 2008? (For the sticklers, this is a rough paraphrase, not the direct quotes.)
Hannity: Anyone who has cheated on his marriage vows can not be trusted to be president.
Colmes: Um, McCain cheated on his wife.
Hannity: That doesn't count. He was a POW.
Hannity: Anyone who has cheated on his marriage vows can not be trusted to be president.
Colmes: Um, McCain cheated on his wife.
Hannity: That doesn't count. He was a POW.
36
Remember this exchange from 2008? (For the sticklers, this is a rough paraphrase, not the direct quotes.)
Hannity: Anyone who has cheated on his marriage vows can not be trusted to be president.
Colmes: Um, McCain cheated on his wife.
Hannity: That doesn't count. He was a POW.
Hannity: Anyone who has cheated on his marriage vows can not be trusted to be president.
Colmes: Um, McCain cheated on his wife.
Hannity: That doesn't count. He was a POW.
37
I'm guessing he and is wife were separated and she just wouldn't go along with divorce.
Either way, taking bribes from Abramoff is a better example of the kind of scum sucking, bottom feeding prick that McCain is.
Too bad, too, because his pops was a pretty good guy.
Either way, taking bribes from Abramoff is a better example of the kind of scum sucking, bottom feeding prick that McCain is.
Too bad, too, because his pops was a pretty good guy.
39
@29. The trick is to use Wikipedia as one possible starting point. Do not list Wikipedia itself as a reference, dumbass--use Wiki's footnotes to help you find original sources that ARE valid references for your paper.
Wikipedia is just a tool--a possible place to start research, and a possible place to start finding original source material that you can safely cite in an academic paper. It is not the final word, and should not itself be cited, but it can be a good place to start (and remember that blogs--including this one--are mainly about opinion and commentary, and do not have to meet the rigorous standards of a Master's thesis).
Wikipedia is just a tool--a possible place to start research, and a possible place to start finding original source material that you can safely cite in an academic paper. It is not the final word, and should not itself be cited, but it can be a good place to start (and remember that blogs--including this one--are mainly about opinion and commentary, and do not have to meet the rigorous standards of a Master's thesis).
40
And who says Bill Clinton was cheating on his wife?
I can hardly imagine she didn't know that he ran around, and if they stayed together while he was running around and she knew he was running around they must have had some kind of agreement. Like "nobody I know and keep it out of the press," or some such. Which is not cheating, because it's honest.
I can hardly imagine she didn't know that he ran around, and if they stayed together while he was running around and she knew he was running around they must have had some kind of agreement. Like "nobody I know and keep it out of the press," or some such. Which is not cheating, because it's honest.
41
Meh, false equivalency
It seems clear by the way the wikipedia article is written that McCain's first relationship was over, regardless of if they had actually finished the last bit and divorced. So I would not consider that cheating.
The vows generally say something along the lines of 'as long as we both shall live'; so if you want to be uppity, getting divorced is against the vows. But otherwise, this is just a stupid blog post.
It seems clear by the way the wikipedia article is written that McCain's first relationship was over, regardless of if they had actually finished the last bit and divorced. So I would not consider that cheating.
The vows generally say something along the lines of 'as long as we both shall live'; so if you want to be uppity, getting divorced is against the vows. But otherwise, this is just a stupid blog post.
42
This isn't the first time Meghan McCain has deliberately ignored her parents' history while attacking someone else. She also went after Callista Gingrich for being "a mistress." http://www.examiner.com/article/meghan-m…
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