Slog
News & ArtsTuesday, January 24, 2012
The Ladies Santorum to Rape Victims: Pregnancy Is Just a Horrible Gift You Can Never Return
Posted by Cienna Madrid on Tue, Jan 24, 2012 at 12:30 PM
Here, watch Rick Santorum tell all the rape victims of the world that he feels really bad for them but they simply need to suck it up, "make the best out of a bad situation," and accept the "horribly created... gift" of an unwanted pregnancy.
As Think Progress points out, conservative Christians like Santorum bang on the drum of compassion for fetuses but curiously lack compassion for the victims of sexual assault, and seemingly justify their hypocrisy with the ol' "God works in mysterious ways!" argument: "God gave you the gift of life; he just decided to rape it into you for whatever reason! Maybe you deserved it—I don't know! Who am I to judge?* All I know is this isn't Bed, Bath, and Beyond. You can't return your gift. And if you do, you're a monster because that gift is life and life is sacred**."
It's a hard, confusing argument to parse out.
Curtsies to Slog tipper Joe Szilagyi.
*Unless you get an abortion and then I will judge you hard.
**Except for your life (and body and privacy), which is less sacred for some reason I can't explain. Hey, God works in mysterious ways!
1
If Rick Santorum and his wifey aren't using contraception, shouldn't they have a ton more kids? I find it hard to believe that they're having sex but that baby juice isn't making more babies.
2
One of many reasons why he'll never win the primaries, as moderate Republicans cant vote for someone that cruel.
3
I'd have a whole lot more sympathy for the Pregnancy Enforcement crowd if they spent one tenth of their Pregnancy-Enforcement energies on developing a safe alternative to abortion. One that doesn't, you know, force some poor girl to endure the risks and discomforts of the preg against her will. Lois McMaster Bujold calls this technology a uterine replicator. Aldous Huxley also writes about it. We're currently using this technology to gestate sharks. If we were to throw a whole lot more money into the project we could start human trials in a relative handful of years.
4
He needs to STOP FUCKING WEARING SWEATER VESTS!!! I LOVE sweater vests!! And now I can't wear mine because of this cumsucking, santorum bathing piece of shit.
5
This kind of rhetoric works great for the catholic priest subset of the population, but I'm guessing not so much with the under-70 crowd. Hopefully these idiots will keep preaching this garbage to disaffect people from ever voting Republican.
6
I've always wondered what the 'Beyond' in Bed, Bath and Beyond actually encompassed. Maybe it's our uterus's. I hope so!! They have TOWELS to MATCH!!
I wish I could rape myself up a baby just to see what the exchange policy is... they didn't have that when I pushed you forth.
I wish I could rape myself up a baby just to see what the exchange policy is... they didn't have that when I pushed you forth.
8
@6, and THANK GOD they didn't. You wouldn't think twice about trading me in for a dog bed and a slanket.
9
@Cienna - It's not true! I would have had more children, though ( or 'Returns') and better linen.... I'd have filled the FUCK out of my Beyond.
They should have a Rape Sale.
They should have a Rape Sale.
10
I think it is an intentionally false misstatement to say that conservative Christians have compassion for fetuses. I don't think that they particularly do. I don't think their position comes from a perspective of compassion or any emotion. I think their perspective - listen to what he said and you will hear it too - comes from a sort of technocratic chain of logical deductions and conclusions.
A. Human life begins at conception
B. Therefore fetuses are human beings
C. Therefore killing them is murder
Conclusion: Abortion is murder. That's the line that I see them follow. While rape is a capital crime, and potentially punishable by a death sentence, the child produced by it is not the perpetrator and therefore should not suffer that penalty.
So this opposition to abortion in all cases isn't an emotional, compassionate plea, it's a logical, cold-hearted conclusion that is inevitable once you accept the principle that life begins at conception.
I'm not offering an opinion about whether Mr. Santorum and his ilk are right - as it happens I don't think they are right. I'm just saying that their position should be honestly stated, even by those who disagree with them.
A. Human life begins at conception
B. Therefore fetuses are human beings
C. Therefore killing them is murder
Conclusion: Abortion is murder. That's the line that I see them follow. While rape is a capital crime, and potentially punishable by a death sentence, the child produced by it is not the perpetrator and therefore should not suffer that penalty.
So this opposition to abortion in all cases isn't an emotional, compassionate plea, it's a logical, cold-hearted conclusion that is inevitable once you accept the principle that life begins at conception.
I'm not offering an opinion about whether Mr. Santorum and his ilk are right - as it happens I don't think they are right. I'm just saying that their position should be honestly stated, even by those who disagree with them.
11
@3 Let's step outside the realm of future tech for a moment and focus on the now. If the anti-abortion crowd desired even a pretension toward the moral high ground they would defend the social safety net for poor mothers and their children. They would use their clout to reform and improve foster services. They would be outraged at America's infant mortality rate. They would demand government subsidized heath care for every child. Do they do any of this? No.
If you're preborn, you're fine; if you're preschool, you're fucked. -George Carlin
12
@3 & 11:
You're missing the point. People like Santorum believe sex has one and ONLY one purpose - to make babies. They don't care about things like family planning, contraception, social safety-nets, infant mortality rates, et al. They believe that if you're having sex for any other purpose than to make babies, you're violating God's Will (tm), and therefore, any negative consequence of your evil, non-baby-making sex (even if it results in a baby that you didn't want) is a just punishment brought down on you by God for disobeying him.
You're missing the point. People like Santorum believe sex has one and ONLY one purpose - to make babies. They don't care about things like family planning, contraception, social safety-nets, infant mortality rates, et al. They believe that if you're having sex for any other purpose than to make babies, you're violating God's Will (tm), and therefore, any negative consequence of your evil, non-baby-making sex (even if it results in a baby that you didn't want) is a just punishment brought down on you by God for disobeying him.
13
@11--If I perceived them to actually be working to see that every baby born would have the best available chance at a decent start and every pregnant girl got the care she needed to grow a healthy human being, rather than exactly the other way round I wouldn't have to think up such wild plausible technological solutions.
14
@10 You are right about offering up one's opinions for consideration, that is the crux of the 'marketplace of ideas.' But as the article points out, Santorum cannot help but fall back upon religious explanations for his public policy positions- a blatant violation of secular, pluralistic government predicated upon Public Reason.
However, I concede that the argument "life begins at conception" is in fact secular. Then, once we evaluate the argument on its own terms, we can see how flimsy it is: failed implantation, miscarriages, and simple genetic anomalies all become grounds for manslaughter charges. As has been tirelessly asked by those paying attention: how can we expect women to bear the results of rape and incest? To say nothing of the questions of privacy and involuntary servitude that others have raised.
The whole enterprise is bunk and smacks of ignorance: of biology, of sociology, and most importantly: reality.
However, I concede that the argument "life begins at conception" is in fact secular. Then, once we evaluate the argument on its own terms, we can see how flimsy it is: failed implantation, miscarriages, and simple genetic anomalies all become grounds for manslaughter charges. As has been tirelessly asked by those paying attention: how can we expect women to bear the results of rape and incest? To say nothing of the questions of privacy and involuntary servitude that others have raised.
The whole enterprise is bunk and smacks of ignorance: of biology, of sociology, and most importantly: reality.
15
So here's the secular, darwinist thinking on this: why the fuck would we as society want to allow the propagation of the genes of a rapist? We should fucking ecourage abortion via Plan B for all rape victims and pay for it as part of counseling (which would be free if we had proper health care).
16
Okay. Somebody stick a dildo up his ass and tell him he has to keep it there for nine months. Or you'll go to prison. I wouldn't consent to the sex, so I wouldn't have consented to the pregnancy. Not to mention that I have just as much right as my rapist in deciding what of my DNA is walking around out there. His rape doesn't constitute the right to force me to bear his child.
17
We are looking at this the wrong way. If you want to work towards ending the abortion debate, Pro-lifers like Santorum should be "praised" for their position on rape, because at least they're logistically consistent (before you jump down my throat, I'm pro-choice). Think about it this way: if life begins at conception, then why is it ok to kill a rape-baby, simply because the baby is the innocent "byproduct" of a crime?
Instead of attacking Santorum for his views on rape and abortion (there's so much else to attack him for); we should force the other asshole politicians who say they're pro-life, except in cases of rape to explain how that can be. If you're ok with murdering an innocent rape-baby, then you're sort of pro-choice. It's like saying you'll reduce the deficit by lowering taxes. It may sound great from the campaign trail, but it's just illogical and contradictory.
If every pro-lifer were forced to admit that being pro-life means forcing rape victims to carry a baby to term...well I frankly think we'd see a huge shift to the pro-choice side.
And another question for the pro-lifers, except for rape: how do you enforce that rule? Do women need to physically prove rape in order to get an abortion? Will there be a trial at the abortion clinic? Is it enough to simply claim you were raped without any proof? Are we going to end up putting innocent men in jail, just because some women want an abortion; or conversely, will women who were really raped be denied abortions if they don't have enough evidence to convict? What if the raper waives his right to a speedy trial, and it takes longer than 9 months to get to trial?
Ask the tough questions. Then maybe we'll see some progress.
Instead of attacking Santorum for his views on rape and abortion (there's so much else to attack him for); we should force the other asshole politicians who say they're pro-life, except in cases of rape to explain how that can be. If you're ok with murdering an innocent rape-baby, then you're sort of pro-choice. It's like saying you'll reduce the deficit by lowering taxes. It may sound great from the campaign trail, but it's just illogical and contradictory.
If every pro-lifer were forced to admit that being pro-life means forcing rape victims to carry a baby to term...well I frankly think we'd see a huge shift to the pro-choice side.
And another question for the pro-lifers, except for rape: how do you enforce that rule? Do women need to physically prove rape in order to get an abortion? Will there be a trial at the abortion clinic? Is it enough to simply claim you were raped without any proof? Are we going to end up putting innocent men in jail, just because some women want an abortion; or conversely, will women who were really raped be denied abortions if they don't have enough evidence to convict? What if the raper waives his right to a speedy trial, and it takes longer than 9 months to get to trial?
Ask the tough questions. Then maybe we'll see some progress.
19
Maybe rapist tend to vote Republican. Okay. Somebody stick a dildo up his ass and tell him he has to keep it there for nine months. Or you'll go to prison. Not to mention the fact that I have a right not have my DNA walking around out there mixed with a RAPIST. I wouldn't consent to the sex, so I wouldn't be consenting to the birth or to my body becoming the baby factory for rapists. It is a policy that actually encourages rape.
22
@12
I understand that, but in the broader context the procreation argument, at least as it pertains to His Will, tends to be toned down in favor of the simple "life=conception." Santorum attempts it here (and fails) but the anti-abortion rights crowd has a very shrewd understanding of marketing and framing. "Conception=life" is far more accessible and as I wrote above, even qualifies as secular.
You're missing the point. People like Santorum believe sex has one and ONLY one purpose - to make babies.
I understand that, but in the broader context the procreation argument, at least as it pertains to His Will, tends to be toned down in favor of the simple "life=conception." Santorum attempts it here (and fails) but the anti-abortion rights crowd has a very shrewd understanding of marketing and framing. "Conception=life" is far more accessible and as I wrote above, even qualifies as secular.
23
@12 - I think Santorum does in fact care about contraception; to quote: “Many of the Christian faith have said, well, that’s okay, contraception is okay. It’s not okay. It’s a license to do things in a sexual realm that is counter to how things are supposed to be.” I believe he would overturn Griswald v Connecticut if he could.
But this Santorum quote (and there's so many crazy ones to choose from) is about rape. So, I would say that Santorum's argument is actually more along the lines of "God (the christian one) has a purpose" rather than "god is punishing you". The belief that God gives you the gift of life via sex, rape or not; which a gift that you have no right to interfere with. It's a seriously crazy idea that, I guess, theologically allows one to believe that abortion in the case of rape is not OK, as what @10 said. I mean, seriously, how can this appeal to anyone but to the fringe of the fringe? To me he's trying to angle himself as king of American Christian Crazypeople(tm). But it makes for great headlines. And great fundraising for Planned Parenthood.
But this Santorum quote (and there's so many crazy ones to choose from) is about rape. So, I would say that Santorum's argument is actually more along the lines of "God (the christian one) has a purpose" rather than "god is punishing you". The belief that God gives you the gift of life via sex, rape or not; which a gift that you have no right to interfere with. It's a seriously crazy idea that, I guess, theologically allows one to believe that abortion in the case of rape is not OK, as what @10 said. I mean, seriously, how can this appeal to anyone but to the fringe of the fringe? To me he's trying to angle himself as king of American Christian Crazypeople(tm). But it makes for great headlines. And great fundraising for Planned Parenthood.
25
Anyone who has read the Old Testament knows that rape as a reproductive strategy receives divine endorsements on multiple occasions.This includes the practice of forcing female captives to bear the children of the soldiers who killed their families. A captive woman would then be required to marry her captor and spend the rest of her life raising his children.
Santorum's position here is consistent with his avowed preference for biblical morality.
Santorum's position here is consistent with his avowed preference for biblical morality.
26
@24 Indeed. The red tide of 2010 has already allowed for some states to enact horrifying rollbacks of reproductive rights. The only remedy besides repeal- judicial review- is nothing if not a slow process. Here's hoping it works.
29
Is it just Romney who feels this way? What about Romney, who I still believe will be the Repub nominee? Is he opposed to abortion on all grounds too?
31
OK, so Santorum says fetuses are people and need to be protected. Romney says corporations are people and need safeguards. WHAT ABOUT people, aren't they people? I need a safety net, too.
32
@29 - (you probably mean 'is it just santorum...') doubtful. Romney has fundraised for planned parenthood in the past, and a (distant) relative of his actually died during an illegal abortion operation. Even though his views have "evolved", if he stuck to the exact letter of Mormon church doctrine, abortion in the case of rape is allowed: (http://mormon.org/faq/church-position-on…)
"In 1973, the First Presidency of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints released the following statement regarding abortion, which is still applicable today: The Church opposes abortion and counsels its members not to submit to or perform an abortion except in the rare cases where, in the opinion of competent medical counsel, the life or good health of the mother is seriously endangered or where the pregnancy was caused by rape and produces serious emotional trauma in the mother. Even then it should be done only after counseling with the local presiding priesthood authority and after receiving divine confirmation through prayer.”
"In 1973, the First Presidency of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints released the following statement regarding abortion, which is still applicable today: The Church opposes abortion and counsels its members not to submit to or perform an abortion except in the rare cases where, in the opinion of competent medical counsel, the life or good health of the mother is seriously endangered or where the pregnancy was caused by rape and produces serious emotional trauma in the mother. Even then it should be done only after counseling with the local presiding priesthood authority and after receiving divine confirmation through prayer.”
34
I say until the Evangelicals (that's what these "Republicans" should be called) can take care of ALL "unplanned" and abandoned children in the Foster Care and broken homes they have no business telling me what I can and can not do with my body whether I'm raped or not. I'm not super religulous or anything but I have a feeling that's what Jesus would have done. Unless you're God or Jesus Christians, you shouldn't be so preachy on other peoples rights.
35
I was really hoping that the interviewer would ask him what he would do if his *12-year-old* daughter was raped and impregnated. And then told that the pregnancy would probably endanger her life. Would he still have the balls to say it's God's will? (BTW, I loved how he said it wasn't a religious issue and then cited God later on.)
36
"You could make the argument that, if she doesn't have this baby, if she kills her child, that that too could ruin her life."
Not if you're honest, you can't! But then, honesty is a foreign concept to politicians, and the GOP in particular.
Not if you're honest, you can't! But then, honesty is a foreign concept to politicians, and the GOP in particular.
37
@3: I find the idea of moving a rape baby from the victim's uterus into a gestation machine more horrifying and costly than simply aborting it. Especially if there isn't going to be anybody there to take care of it once it's done gestating.
38
As the spanish saying would say, Mr. Santorum acts like a clam: he buries himself with his tongue. So let him speak.
39
He didn't have a problem with abortion when it was his wife's life in danger. I doubt he'd really force his minor daughter to keep her rape baby or offer to raise it for her.
40
Question from Philosoraptor on the front page of Reddit:
"If a child conceived by rape is a blessing from God... does that mean rapists are angels doing God's work on Earth?"
"If a child conceived by rape is a blessing from God... does that mean rapists are angels doing God's work on Earth?"
42
@20! Yes! That's exactly what drives me crazy about the "It's God's will!" argument. If God exists (which he doesn't), then his "mysterious" ways of working are more than enough proof that we should do everything we can to NOT follow him...
43
It is telling that Santorum insists repeatedly that the fetus is 'her baby' several times. And framing the discussion around the responsibility of women. Effectively, the predator gets a lighter sentence than anything the courts could hand down. What a worldview.
What should happen is that any unaborted rape fetuses get transplanted into a particularly painful portion of the anatomy of the rapist and brought to term. In cases where the rapist cannot be identified, Rick Santorum's body will be offered to bring the pregnancy to term.
In cases of rape, it is absolutely not 'her' baby. Unbelievable.
What should happen is that any unaborted rape fetuses get transplanted into a particularly painful portion of the anatomy of the rapist and brought to term. In cases where the rapist cannot be identified, Rick Santorum's body will be offered to bring the pregnancy to term.
In cases of rape, it is absolutely not 'her' baby. Unbelievable.
45
@15: Exactly. Allowing rape to produce children encourages rape as a reproductive strategy. Why would anyone want a half-rapist-baby?
@10: Except that they don't seem to think it's as bad as murder: they don't seem to want the mother to spend life in prison for solicitation, accomplice, or conspiracy murder charges.
@6: "rape myself up a baby" is strangely hot.
@10: Except that they don't seem to think it's as bad as murder: they don't seem to want the mother to spend life in prison for solicitation, accomplice, or conspiracy murder charges.
@6: "rape myself up a baby" is strangely hot.
47
@17 I agree with much of what you've written (I take exception with calling them "prolifers," though; they're anti-choice activists). But when the pro-choice side, of which I am a part, continually brings up rape and incest as the definitive arguments for a woman's right to choose, it feels desperate and extremist. A woman should have the right to decide what to do with her body no matter what circumstance led to conception, and focusing on worst-case scenarios diverts attention from the core issue: The government should not have the right to determine under which circumstances an abortion is "necessary." It is a woman's choice to decide whether or not to carry a child—period. Tough questions like the ones you've posed are unfortunately rarely asked of the anti-choice crowd.
48
Perhaps Rick Santorum should be raped by some guy with AIDS and give Rick the "gift" of a terminal sexually transmitted disease. I wonder if Rick will consider that just another way of "god working in mysterious ways".
49
New idea: transplant the embryo into the impregnator rapist and give him enough sex hormones so that the chance of carrying to term is higher. Win/win for all.
50
Santoum is a Scumbag. He has the Nerve to say a child via Rape is a blessing from God. This man is true scum and has NO right to either run for or be president.
Maybe if his wife and daughter were actually raped, he would see things in a clear light.
Pure peice of garbage.
Maybe if his wife and daughter were actually raped, he would see things in a clear light.
Pure peice of garbage.
51
Why don't people get real and talk about the late-term "partial birth" abortion his wife had in 1996 when he was working to have them outlawed? He denies and denies and denies, but that's what it was. And to demonstrate his truly, deeply creepy soul, he took the dead fetus home to "meet the other kids". He is one deeply sick fuck!
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