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News & ArtsMonday, October 24, 2011
Occupy Occupy Seattle Votes to Camp at Seattle Central
Posted by Dominic Holden on Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 11:37 PM
Accomplishing what the General Assembly narrowly failed to do last night, Occupy Seattle voted by the four-fifths majority required to overcome a "block" to move the nighttime encampment from Westlake Park to Seattle Central Community College campus beginning on Saturday.
Here's the Twitter update:
The thinking goes, according to several Occupiers I've spoken to, that SCCC is a more secure location than a city park (where camping is illegal) because the campus is private property. Many folks believe that police would require the college's permission to shoo demonstrators off campus. School faculty and students could, in theory, find a way to roll out the red carpet.
But I'm not sure if SCCC will prove more hospitable: College president Dr. Paul Killpatrick reportedly doesn't want the occupiers. The move could even backfire. Police could use the college's opposition as impetus to completely clear protesters off the property, rather than deploy the tolerance-harassment treatments they have used down at Westlake. All that said, I really hope this—or some other location—works out for them. Occupy Seattle needs a stable base camp, and Westlake Park is a miserable place for people to sleep at night.
1
The first student who gets blocked from getting to his or her class and the whole lot of them will be swept away by cops. Rightfully so. This isn't 1971, and SCCC ain't Berkeley (Berkeley ain't Berkeley anymore either).
3
From my meeting notes, Corey from our Legal group said, "As we speak in this park, we have a legal right to be here. Multiple federal courts have upheld that right against the same laws City is trying to enforce against us being here. If we move to SCCC, no matter what has been said, it is not a location we have legal right to set foot upon. Without invitation, it's illegal. Would become an unlawful protest. Here, we are lawful protest. One of the fundamental principles of Occupy Seattle is taking part in lawful and peaceful protest. Have legal right to be here. Can continue to fight that battle. Can win that battle. Legal precedent supports this. No legal right to be on SCCC property, which is reserved for students. It's not an open space at which we have right to speak or protest. Looking at severe consequences."
Some resultant discussion:
Q: If it's legal, why are cops arresting us?
A: They're doing it unconstitutionally. This is a public space to which we have a right. We do not have that at SCCC.
Q: It may be legal during the day, but is not at night. Overnight, people endure constant harassment from police regardless of Constitution.
A: Understands concerns. We have legal recourse to those police actions. Will not have legal recourse at SCCC. Has been here every night after 10pm, knows what the cops are doing.
Some resultant discussion:
Q: If it's legal, why are cops arresting us?
A: They're doing it unconstitutionally. This is a public space to which we have a right. We do not have that at SCCC.
Q: It may be legal during the day, but is not at night. Overnight, people endure constant harassment from police regardless of Constitution.
A: Understands concerns. We have legal recourse to those police actions. Will not have legal recourse at SCCC. Has been here every night after 10pm, knows what the cops are doing.
4
Think of the possibilities: every Occupy Seattle post would bear the coveted "Two-Block Radius" tag.
7
#3 has it on the head. This is a potentially very bad move. Unless the school comes out in support of the camp in (which I see as doubtful) then they will not welcome this kind of thing and they will ask the protesters to be removed, which is within their rights to do. Did anyone expect that this would be a nice little camping trip in Westlake, with RV's and Kumbaya sing-a-longs with cops eating Smores? I don't see this improving the situation, but here's to hoping (*makes another Smore*).
8
Yes, because nothing will scare the establishment more than a campsite in a community college, especially one called SCCC: the Stupid Can Come College. But the again, you'll be on cool Cap Hill, closer to your friends and bars, away from the squares downtown.
Good move guys, way to become irrelevant! And here I was thinking they'd vote for some self-immolation.
Good move guys, way to become irrelevant! And here I was thinking they'd vote for some self-immolation.
9
So there's gonna be a camp at City Hall (for argument's sake, let's call them "The Popular Front of Judea"), one at SCCC ("The People's Front of Judea") and no doubt a hard core splinter group refusing to leave Westlake (we'll call them the "Judean People's Front").
Wow, you've really shown the Seattle establishment! Stick it to the man then hit the bars! …..it'll be a Nickelsville for spanging community college students taking a break from remedial math and English Comp classes, bumming cigarettes from folks leaving bars and clubs.
Wow, you've really shown the Seattle establishment! Stick it to the man then hit the bars! …..it'll be a Nickelsville for spanging community college students taking a break from remedial math and English Comp classes, bumming cigarettes from folks leaving bars and clubs.
10
Occupy Seattle, your mother called. She said to get a good night's sleep and some clean underwear.
11
The visit to the site gave wonderful information. Visit: bangalorewithlove dot com(send gifts and flowers to Bangalore).
12
This is the most moronic decision. It's as if the Civil Right movement only protested in front of Ebenezer Baptist Church or the Apollo Theater. Let's annoy and hassle people who support us already and let the oligarchy go about their business unmolested. How does making it more difficult for poor, working class, and immigrant students to attend school advance the cause?
14
Surprise! Seattle's version of "Occupy" has become a navel-gazing circle jerk mired in patented-in-Seattle "process".
I'm sympathetic to the perspective of this movement, but it's time to put up or go home. And by "put up", I mean REAL civil disobedience. Blockade bank branches downtown. Set up camp on private property and force the police to arrest you.
As far as I can tell, the only goal of Occupy Seattle is to figure out a place where they can set up a perpetual camp. Big fucking deal.
I'm sympathetic to the perspective of this movement, but it's time to put up or go home. And by "put up", I mean REAL civil disobedience. Blockade bank branches downtown. Set up camp on private property and force the police to arrest you.
As far as I can tell, the only goal of Occupy Seattle is to figure out a place where they can set up a perpetual camp. Big fucking deal.
15
Giving the impending default of the Smith Tower they could probably rent permanent office space there (or anywhere near downtown given the 20 percent vacancy rates) for a song.
The could stay overnight by telling the landlords they are a "high tech startup" doing all nighters on a new project.
(I spent months sleeping under my desk at Connectsoft...back in the day...)
The could stay overnight by telling the landlords they are a "high tech startup" doing all nighters on a new project.
(I spent months sleeping under my desk at Connectsoft...back in the day...)
16
@1: Camping over on the side of the building isn't going to prevent students from getting to the entrance, 20 whole feet away. The most they'd be able to bother is the outdoor daycare area, but they'll be off campus and back in Westlake before the daycare even opens.
17
"the only goal of Occupy Seattle is to figure out a place where they can set up a perpetual camp. Big fucking deal."
Occupyville! Team up with nickelsville and start a tents' rights movement and soap drive.
Occupyville! Team up with nickelsville and start a tents' rights movement and soap drive.
18
Yes, all those immigrant students at SCCC. I guess they are working too hard getting ahead in life without a sense of entitlement to bother joining lily white Occupy Seattle.
19
The symbolic value of Westlake was that it's the "center" of something - attention if nothing else - and provided a focus of attention and sympathy, and a rallying point, at least until Oct 15th. Then things started to peter out in endless discussions about what I'm not sure. Now, Westlake, which was so important has lost its importance, and the occupiers are looking more like squatters looking for a home. SCCC may or may not be welcoming, but I'm guessing the latter, in which case there will be a confrontation that will garner very little, if any sympathy. One can only hope that someone is organizing action thats focused on greater change than the location of an encampment. OWS remains the only occupation that really matters, and the best way to support it is to either join it, or organize escalating actions at home.
20
I don't see the point of overnight camping for this protest in the first place. How does camping in a downtown park (or SCCC campus) have any effect on Wall Street or the 1% in any way. They could protest from dawn till dusk without hassle, you know, when people actually see them during the commutes and work day. Why camp out? It will only get colder and wetter and more miserable in coming months, all to no purpose.
21
Only in Seattle does a national movement, that most people agree with, become a cluster fuck of stupidity.
If you ever wanted to see the Seattle Process as applied to social protest you've got it.
If you ever wanted to see the Seattle Process as applied to social protest you've got it.
22
Legal and Tactical were ignored because a) a group of SCCC students came down to tell the campers that they would be safe and happy at SCCC (never mind the President of the school saying they weren't welcome and the fact that they'd be subject to arrest), and b) they were telling this to people too worn out and cold to see the longer view. The SCCC students kept coming back night after night until they could convince enough other students to come with them and campers to vote with them. And on Sunday, at the GA, the real reason for their push became obvious when one of the students revealed that the students wanted them on their campus to help fight against hikes in tuition and issues around transportation (check it out in the minutes for the meeting at occupyseattle.org).
But tuition hikes, transportation issues, and cost-of-living problems affect ALL students, not just those at SCCC, and are thus part of what we are fighting against. Part of the core principles of the movement is that we work in the best interest of the larger issues, not allow ourselves to be co-opted by the interests of individuals or small groups.
But that's exactly what happened last night.
The General Assembly voted in defiance of of that core principle, and in favor of SCCC students who say they support the movement but obviously find walking down the hill to protest too much effort and staying for the full length of GA meetings (leaving after their proposals are voted on) too tedious.
Considering this lack of resolve on their part, it seems difficult to believe that they'll stand between the campers and the arresting police.
Now, instead of SCCC students walking down the hill to protest, the ENTIRE Occupy Seattle movement has to shuttle back and forth between the two sites--assuming they have the will to keep a real presence at Westlake, which seems highly unlikely.
Some of us will not be moving to SCCC (why get arrested if there are no media outlets around to report on it?) and will try to do what we can to maintain a Westlake presence.
More...
But tuition hikes, transportation issues, and cost-of-living problems affect ALL students, not just those at SCCC, and are thus part of what we are fighting against. Part of the core principles of the movement is that we work in the best interest of the larger issues, not allow ourselves to be co-opted by the interests of individuals or small groups.
But that's exactly what happened last night.
The General Assembly voted in defiance of of that core principle, and in favor of SCCC students who say they support the movement but obviously find walking down the hill to protest too much effort and staying for the full length of GA meetings (leaving after their proposals are voted on) too tedious.
Considering this lack of resolve on their part, it seems difficult to believe that they'll stand between the campers and the arresting police.
Now, instead of SCCC students walking down the hill to protest, the ENTIRE Occupy Seattle movement has to shuttle back and forth between the two sites--assuming they have the will to keep a real presence at Westlake, which seems highly unlikely.
Some of us will not be moving to SCCC (why get arrested if there are no media outlets around to report on it?) and will try to do what we can to maintain a Westlake presence.
23
The First Amendment protections of public assembly do not apply to non-public spaces. SCCC is private property.
If the school elects, they can demand that the protestors be removed as trespassers.
The Mayor's Office would then have no choice other than to arrest any protestors at the building for illegal trespass.
One one hand, this could quickly end the protest. On the other, it could also weed out the chaotic element present in the GA. The bull-headed idiots who decided to move to SCCC rather than on public land will be removed from the protest itself by the police. The remainder, those who don't move to SCCC, will then be able to steer the GA in the direction of reason and away from SCCC.
If the school elects, they can demand that the protestors be removed as trespassers.
The Mayor's Office would then have no choice other than to arrest any protestors at the building for illegal trespass.
One one hand, this could quickly end the protest. On the other, it could also weed out the chaotic element present in the GA. The bull-headed idiots who decided to move to SCCC rather than on public land will be removed from the protest itself by the police. The remainder, those who don't move to SCCC, will then be able to steer the GA in the direction of reason and away from SCCC.
24
HEY YOU GUYS: I FAIL TO SEE HOW CAMPING OUTSIDE IS AN EFFECTIVE PROTEST OR COMMENTARY ON THE STATE OF AMERICAN CAPITALISM AND POLITICAL POWER.
25
@3 is 100% wrong. Courts have repeatedly held that there can be time place and manner restrictions placed on speech so long as they are content neutral. The City has every legal right to close parks at night and remove people who are there.
26
The strategy behind this is to reach out to students, faculty, and staff to grow and reinforce the movement, and then to focus on regular outreach and direct action focused on banks downtown. Several actions at banks are also planned this week - other news media besides the Stranger managed to pick up this point. Stay tuned.
27
@26, it's just...beautiful, the way you are growing your movement by shrinking it. I expect to see another round of voting soon, whereby you all choose to Occupy Mom's Basement.
30
@27,,
No, let this thing play out. There are two possible results, neither of them bad.
1) They're right. The teachers, faculty and staff, as well as the students, somehow convince the President to change his tune. This creates a warm, safe environment in a nurturing community which will allow the Occupation to grow and develop.
2) They're wrong. Cops show up at the door as soon as the protestors do, and everyone is led off in paddy wagons to King County lockup. The President of SCCC declares this nonsense is over. But who is it that will be sitting in jail? Precisely the part of the GA that has led to numerous poor decisions in the last two weeks. And who is not in jail, and therefore able to form the GA while everyone else is in jail? The rationalists who opposed this idea to begin with. They immediately vote to pursue a less self-destructive course, allowing the movement to find new digs in a more appropriate setting.
Either way, Occupy Seattle wins.
No, let this thing play out. There are two possible results, neither of them bad.
1) They're right. The teachers, faculty and staff, as well as the students, somehow convince the President to change his tune. This creates a warm, safe environment in a nurturing community which will allow the Occupation to grow and develop.
2) They're wrong. Cops show up at the door as soon as the protestors do, and everyone is led off in paddy wagons to King County lockup. The President of SCCC declares this nonsense is over. But who is it that will be sitting in jail? Precisely the part of the GA that has led to numerous poor decisions in the last two weeks. And who is not in jail, and therefore able to form the GA while everyone else is in jail? The rationalists who opposed this idea to begin with. They immediately vote to pursue a less self-destructive course, allowing the movement to find new digs in a more appropriate setting.
Either way, Occupy Seattle wins.
31
This gives protesters better access to public restrooms, convenience stores, and nightlife, but the name change to "Occupy Seattle Central" doesn't really work for me.
32
Or...the rationalists, cyberneticians, sociocrats, and technophiles will try to enter the camp at SCCC because it will be a wild, swirling mass of beautiful chaos and the second they enter and tell everyone they are being too emotional they will find themselves unconscious...
33
Good point, Statler. It would be nice if the rationalists could get together in either case and throw off the shackles of camping-centered, do-nothingness, non-consensus consensus that is currently plaguing the movement.
34
"This gives protesters better access to public restrooms, convenience stores, and nightlife, "
Yes, only when the 99% can go clubbing will the 1% crumble.
Yes, only when the 99% can go clubbing will the 1% crumble.
35
So many movements changed course drastically when they moved from the public spaces to schools. France 1968 comes to mind, for one. Union protests in parks eventually got to the students who occupied schools and then... pow.
So many great slogans out of that one, by the way.
On the other hand, this is mostly the work of the same small group of students that are on campus every day yelling at us about how we're not revolutionary enough and how we need to buy Bob Avakian's bible because old white guys are totally right on with everything at all times and you're an asshole if you think you know better than old white dudes (see also: Christian Collectivists).
So many great slogans out of that one, by the way.
On the other hand, this is mostly the work of the same small group of students that are on campus every day yelling at us about how we're not revolutionary enough and how we need to buy Bob Avakian's bible because old white guys are totally right on with everything at all times and you're an asshole if you think you know better than old white dudes (see also: Christian Collectivists).
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