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News & ArtsFriday, July 22, 2011
Panic Oslo Looks Like Oklahoma
Posted by Charles Mudede on Fri, Jul 22, 2011 at 8:01 PM
BBC:
A terrorism expert tells the BBC that Ansar al-Jihad al-Alami, or the Helpers of the Global Jihad, a terror group that claimed responsibility for the explosion in Oslo, was not behind the attackThe smoke is beginning to clear. We are starting to see something like Timothy McVeigh. If this is the case, this will be a big blow for the anti-immigration Progress Party.
UPDATE: If this is the suspect (his name has been released: Anders Behring Breivik), he could not be more Nordic. Norway might be in for some serious soul-searching.
UPDATE: Not 10 killed in Oslo but nearly 90 by what now is certainly an act of domestic terrorism:
At least 87 people have been killed in two attacks in Norway.Police said at least 80 people were killed in a shooting spree a youth camp of the ruling Labour Party.
They told reporters early on Saturday they had discovered many more victims after initially putting the death toll at 10.
"The updated knowledge we are sitting on now is at least 80," police chief Oystein Maeland said. "We can't guarantee that won't increase somewhat," he said, adding some were badly injured.
2
From Google Translate: So far we have been informed that there are seven dead in Oslo, ten severely injured. Several of our young people are killed, more are also missing and injured. One person has been arrested in connection with this, and I have been informed that he is Norwegian
4
"Norwegian" doesn't necessarily mean blonde hair and blue eyes. He could be a Norwegian citizen AND a dark hair, dark skinned Muslim. Or he could be a blonde hair and blues eyes Muslim. Or he could be a foreigner, meaning the late-breaking news is incorrect (as it often is).
Let's wait to cast judgment until we actually have substantial information, and not make rushed analysis based on our political leanings. By jumping up and saying "IT'S A MCVEIGH SCENARIO" before there's any real info, you're no better than the Fox News comments that say "IT'S A GAT-DANG MUSLIN."
Let's wait to cast judgment until we actually have substantial information, and not make rushed analysis based on our political leanings. By jumping up and saying "IT'S A MCVEIGH SCENARIO" before there's any real info, you're no better than the Fox News comments that say "IT'S A GAT-DANG MUSLIN."
5
@ 4
Yeah. See if you can get that by the braying mental midgets over at FoxNation.
"Let's wait to cast judgment until we actually have substantial information"
Yeah. See if you can get that by the braying mental midgets over at FoxNation.
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@5- You mean to tell me there's stupid people somewhere on the Internet? Outrageous.
Way to miss the point, douchebag
Way to miss the point, douchebag
7
one part of it does look like Oklahoma City in another way...
woah, holy fuck.
Google Streetview before the explosion, this is the focus of several loops running on the news. Picture of same place after explosion
(from reddit)
oh, and also the Seattle Times comments section was like gold, what w/ it's typical kneejerk reaction, at least for about the first 200 posts or so when then the info came out it may have been homegrown, then things sort of quited down. hmmm?
woah, holy fuck.
Google Streetview before the explosion, this is the focus of several loops running on the news. Picture of same place after explosion
(from reddit)
oh, and also the Seattle Times comments section was like gold, what w/ it's typical kneejerk reaction, at least for about the first 200 posts or so when then the info came out it may have been homegrown, then things sort of quited down. hmmm?
8
If upon learning of this abject tragedy you can even think of who benefits politically, you disgust me no matter your point of view. You are less a functioning, feeling human than a cynical, opportunistic psychopath. Go home and pray for your soul.
9
@8, then I'd recommend not reading the comments at the Washington Post. And I always thought naively that the Seattle Times forums had cornered the market on crazy.
11
It's a self-fulfilling Coulter prophesy. He knew he was destined to be a terrorist so he decided to pre-emptively bomb his own country, kill his own leaders and convert himself to Christianity.
12
"he could not be more Nordic. Norway might be in for some serious soul-searching."
What the hell does that mean? That now Norwegians have to learn not to automatically trust their blond, blue-eyed brethren? Way to promote false stereotypes and make an entire country out to be backwards racists.
What the hell does that mean? That now Norwegians have to learn not to automatically trust their blond, blue-eyed brethren? Way to promote false stereotypes and make an entire country out to be backwards racists.
13
This is terrible. Hard to imagine really. Norway you were my refuge from all this nonsense.
As for soul-searching? Really? I don't think we did any serious soul-searching after the Oklahoma bombings. Maybe we should've. But I dunno. Crazy gonna craze.
Charles do you ask Muslims they need to soul-search if a Muslim crazy bombs someplace?
As for soul-searching? Really? I don't think we did any serious soul-searching after the Oklahoma bombings. Maybe we should've. But I dunno. Crazy gonna craze.
Charles do you ask Muslims they need to soul-search if a Muslim crazy bombs someplace?
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@12: "What the hell does that mean? That now Norwegians have to learn not to automatically trust their blond, blue-eyed brethren? Way to promote false stereotypes and make an entire country out to be backwards racists."
What on earth are you babbling about?
What on earth are you babbling about?
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@13: "As for soul-searching? Really? I don't think we did any serious soul-searching after the Oklahoma bombings. Maybe we should've. But I dunno. Crazy gonna craze."
Lord knows we should never investigate domestic terrorists in the United States. Ever. Nor should we discourage them.
Lord knows we should never investigate domestic terrorists in the United States. Ever. Nor should we discourage them.
16
Oh. BTW. He's a Christian Conservative.
In frigg'n Norway? The LEAST religious country in western Europe?
Way to go, dude. Prediction: I don't think people are gonna flock to your religion now.
In frigg'n Norway? The LEAST religious country in western Europe?
Way to go, dude. Prediction: I don't think people are gonna flock to your religion now.
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@14, see @13. There's no reason for Norwegians to do soul-searching just because the guy is blond and blue-eyed.
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Anders Breivik. Recently bought a farm, which gave him cover to buy lots and lots of fertilizer and diesel gas. Right-wing conservative Christian nationalist. Hates Muslims, posts frequently to anti-Muslim websites. Advanced World of Warcraft player (yes, really).
I wonder if Bruce Bawer ever met this guy.
I wonder if Bruce Bawer ever met this guy.
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@15 "Soul-searching" now means investigate?
Really.
That's what you think that means?
Like:
"Columbo is here to soul-search this here homicide."
The implication of very loaded terms like "soul-search" are wee bit more moralizing and emotionally laden in most people's understanding of the them.
And how you then jumped to the conclusion I was saying that the U.S. or the Norwegians shouldn't investigate our domestic terrorism can only be symptomatic of how much low quality crack you must have smoked today.
Really.
That's what you think that means?
Like:
"Columbo is here to soul-search this here homicide."
The implication of very loaded terms like "soul-search" are wee bit more moralizing and emotionally laden in most people's understanding of the them.
And how you then jumped to the conclusion I was saying that the U.S. or the Norwegians shouldn't investigate our domestic terrorism can only be symptomatic of how much low quality crack you must have smoked today.
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No. We need to invade The Word of Warcraft.
I know this. I soul-searched it. You see I went to Soul-searching journalism school. I'm a soul-search journalist. It's like being a combination of Dr. Strange and Seymour Hersh.
I know this. I soul-searched it. You see I went to Soul-searching journalism school. I'm a soul-search journalist. It's like being a combination of Dr. Strange and Seymour Hersh.
25
about the response in comment sections: everything stokes the racist beehive; and nothing seems to stoke it like a bombing and shooting attack against other white peeps, even if the targets are tolerant hippie commies, and the perp is white---in their mind it is that very tolerance what brought this on.
logic, reason, and respect for actual humans as worthwhile entities never enter the picture.
but when bombs are daily deployed against innocent others from our drones and fighters, there is usually nary a peep.
basic humanity demands better. but of course that is just crazy talk.
logic, reason, and respect for actual humans as worthwhile entities never enter the picture.
but when bombs are daily deployed against innocent others from our drones and fighters, there is usually nary a peep.
basic humanity demands better. but of course that is just crazy talk.
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or, god forbid we'd ever call the right wing killers of abortion doctors what they really are... Terrorists, full stop.
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@27 Hey. I like fishing in Idaho!
Can't we use some sort of bio weapon that only effects people who eat jello salad... and the antidote is sushi? That should weed out any accidental liberal collateral. Leaving the pristine environment unharmed.
Can't we use some sort of bio weapon that only effects people who eat jello salad... and the antidote is sushi? That should weed out any accidental liberal collateral. Leaving the pristine environment unharmed.
29
WARNING: HORRIFYING PHOTO
This is an aerial picture of the killer standing with his rifle while a boy in the water begs for his life. Stomach-turning. This is what the extreme right wing looks like.
http://bildr.no/view/933067
This is an aerial picture of the killer standing with his rifle while a boy in the water begs for his life. Stomach-turning. This is what the extreme right wing looks like.
http://bildr.no/view/933067
30
Well, you can guarantee one thing for all of this, Norway will not open it's doors any wider to Muslims.
And who says terrorism doesn't work?
And who says terrorism doesn't work?
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@33: In this case I think it's spelled "DUH-HURP!"
It's got that regional diphthong in it. From too much sister fucking.
It's got that regional diphthong in it. From too much sister fucking.
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@29
Jesus. I saw shit like that in Afghanistan - bodies piled in a little creek until it ran near red.
Never thought it would happen in the west, though.
Jesus. I saw shit like that in Afghanistan - bodies piled in a little creek until it ran near red.
Never thought it would happen in the west, though.
37
"I never normally feed the trolls, but fuck off you bald, dead fascist. Just fuck off"
Sure, but that doesn't mean I'm wrong. Do you think any future Norwegian government is going to allow more Muslims? No way.
You all spent the past 10 years justifying and denying muslim fascism. Now it's our turn.
Sure, but that doesn't mean I'm wrong. Do you think any future Norwegian government is going to allow more Muslims? No way.
You all spent the past 10 years justifying and denying muslim fascism. Now it's our turn.
38
@ 6
I didn't miss the point at all. On the contrary. I was merely stating an observational fact... Dick.
Way to miss the point, douchebag
I didn't miss the point at all. On the contrary. I was merely stating an observational fact... Dick.
39
"You all spent the past 10 years justifying and denying muslim fascism. Now it's our turn."
our turn? for what?
bombing and killing them because they are not christians? we've been there & done that.
sorry loopykins @37, your talk is not only ill-informed and counterproductive, it is also stupid and overtly bigoted.
our turn? for what?
bombing and killing them because they are not christians? we've been there & done that.
sorry loopykins @37, your talk is not only ill-informed and counterproductive, it is also stupid and overtly bigoted.
40
But wait, I thought 'war' made terrorists? I read that on a Subaru in Seattle...about 1000 times.
41
@ 37
What the fuck does this have anything to do with Muslim Fascism you comprehensively impaired twit?
You all spent the past 10 years justifying and denying muslim fascism. Now it's our turn.
What the fuck does this have anything to do with Muslim Fascism you comprehensively impaired twit?
42
Ummm, unregistered: It's clear you don't understand what happened in Oslo. Or what we're talking about on this page. I don't know why you're posting what you're posting, except possibly you think that anytime there's some explosion somewhere it'll give you a reason to post your insulting hate.
Whatever.
Listen, there's a very strong belief among liberals & progressives that those who profess anti-Muslim sentiments are complete idiots at best, and sick, cruel murderers at worst. Every single word you've written on this page supports that conclusion. So it's not really a "belief" any more: it's backed up w/ cold, hard evidence.
The only thing I should add is that if/when you go on your murderous killing spree, make sure you kill yourself first.
Whatever.
Listen, there's a very strong belief among liberals & progressives that those who profess anti-Muslim sentiments are complete idiots at best, and sick, cruel murderers at worst. Every single word you've written on this page supports that conclusion. So it's not really a "belief" any more: it's backed up w/ cold, hard evidence.
The only thing I should add is that if/when you go on your murderous killing spree, make sure you kill yourself first.
44
the resident trolls sound like people who could/or would do this sort of thing just because of their shitty ignorance:
Balbir Singh Sodhi was gunned down on Sept. 15, 2001 in Mesa, Arizona. The turban-wearing Sikh was killed outside his gas station. Sodhi's killer spent the hours before the murder in a bar, bragging of his intention to "kill the ragheads responsible for September 11." He has been convicted and sits on death row.
Waqar Hasan of Dallas, Texas was also murdered on Sept. 15, 2001. The 46-year-old Pakistani, was shot to death in a convenience store he owned. Hasan was murdered by Mark Stroman, who was convicted of also murdering Vasudev Patel days later in nearby Mesquite, Texas.
Cordell noted that Stroman admitted to authorities to blinding a third victim, a Bangladeshi, in between the murders of Hasan and Patel. After his arrest Stroman bragged, "I did what every American wanted to do after Sept. 11th but didn't have the nerve."
Balbir Singh Sodhi was gunned down on Sept. 15, 2001 in Mesa, Arizona. The turban-wearing Sikh was killed outside his gas station. Sodhi's killer spent the hours before the murder in a bar, bragging of his intention to "kill the ragheads responsible for September 11." He has been convicted and sits on death row.
Waqar Hasan of Dallas, Texas was also murdered on Sept. 15, 2001. The 46-year-old Pakistani, was shot to death in a convenience store he owned. Hasan was murdered by Mark Stroman, who was convicted of also murdering Vasudev Patel days later in nearby Mesquite, Texas.
Cordell noted that Stroman admitted to authorities to blinding a third victim, a Bangladeshi, in between the murders of Hasan and Patel. After his arrest Stroman bragged, "I did what every American wanted to do after Sept. 11th but didn't have the nerve."
45
Those who profess anti-American sentiments are complete idiots at best, and sick, cruel murderers at worst.
46
Listen, there's a very strong belief among conservatives & moderates that those who profess anti-American sentiments are complete idiots at best, and sick, cruel murderers at worst.
49
At least 80 confirmed dead so far on Utøya. The number is still going up. It's a terrible massacre of teenagers trapped on an island.
50
Holy fuck, the Seattle Times reports that the guy killed 80 at the camp. That's in addition to the seven known dead from the explosion.
51
Death toll up to 80. Maybe we'll stop absolving disgruntled white guys from the term "terrorism". Never forget # Laughner #McVeigh #Bush/Iraq # IRS Plane Terrorist # Columbine # Random Mall Shooters #DC Jewish Museum # University of Texas Tower Shooting # Tiller Shooting # Immigration Center Massacre, Binghamton, NY # Amish School Slaughter # Northern Illinois University in DeKalb Killings # Wedgewood Baptist Church Massacre # Mark Stroman
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@52. Correction: What Bush, Obama, NATO, and the "civilized west" call every damn day since 9/11.
54
"What Bush, Obama, NATO, and the "civilized west" call every damn day since 9/11."
There you have it. Obama = Osama. Same sides of the same coin. Both terrorists.
There you have it. Obama = Osama. Same sides of the same coin. Both terrorists.
55
BTW, Glenn Greenwald debunks the peaceful Norwegian meme when it comes to the guilty until proven innocent Muslims who were originally heading this attack.
56
HuffPo says the killer was active in Right-Wing circles and was a Nationalist. That sounds an awful lot like code for Nazi. Truly horrifying.
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@29 Fnarf,
Please settle down. I didn't nor will I view the link. For the record, a "terrorist" comes in ALL shapes, sizes, political or religious motivations. In my view, McVeigh isn't too much different than Bin Laden.This is a human tragedy. What happened in Norway today was ghastly and uncivilized.
Let's wish Norway well.
Please settle down. I didn't nor will I view the link. For the record, a "terrorist" comes in ALL shapes, sizes, political or religious motivations. In my view, McVeigh isn't too much different than Bin Laden.This is a human tragedy. What happened in Norway today was ghastly and uncivilized.
Let's wish Norway well.
58
I demand profiling of conservative white guys in airports. Pull them over for extra interrogation. Let's face it, they have a past history of setting off bombs.
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@56, he wasn't a Nazi, he was a Nationalist, a mainstream right-winger in Norway, with ties to the international anti-Muslim movement, centered in Europe but with plenty of representation in the US as well. The killer was a follower of Bruce Bawer, who has been published in The Stranger and had a guest-blogging stint on Andrew Sullivan last week. This is what you get when you play with this kind of person. 80 kids. Shot in the water while trying to swim away.
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@59, Given the resurgence of Nazism in Europe in recent years, and the killer's right-wing politics and xenophobic nationalism, it did not seem an unreasonable conclusion to draw. Of course I'm drunk and stoned, so I'm in no position to judge what constitutes a reasonable conclusion.
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@Lark - you posted on the wrong thread... but based on the comments you made in the other one, now I know why you're a republican.
63
Forget this BS about peaceful Norwegians. Norwegians = vikings = terrorists. Terrorism is part of the Norwegian cultural heritage which they practiced from Russia to Spain for about 300 years.
64
Charles, unless you're trying to perpetuate the myth that OKC was the work of a lone individual with no ties to political ideology, I'm not sure your comparison with the Progress Party holds. After all, the powerholders said ties represent haven't suffered at all in the States if the last mid-terms and the current climate are any indication.
66
Well I feel vindicated. It would seem Breivik was part of a Norwegian neo-Nazi internet group called Nordisk.
67
Anti-immigration is such a bizarre ideology. I swear those people must think that if you were to get on an airplane and fly to another country you'd actually see the map drawn borders permeating the landscapes.
68
I'm sort of a leet huntard on World of Warcraft. Gaddamit, now I am neonazi Oklahomian musllim terrorist from Norway. Stupid World of Warcraft.
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