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News & ArtsFriday, May 6, 2011
City The First Day: 59,600 Phone Books Rejected, Yellow Pages Seeks Injunction
Posted by Dominic Holden on Fri, May 6, 2011 at 6:31 PM
Since we live in the internet, we won't weigh the merits of hard-copy phone books. We also won't discuss whether Yellow Pages companies have a free-speech right to deliver dozens of pounds of doorstops filled with advertisements to your porch, because then I would also have a Constitutional right to deliver a thousand anvils engraved with messages to your lawn.
Let the facts speak for themselves: Yesterday, Seattle's city-run, yellow pages opt-out registry went live, allowing residents to stop delivery of several brands of yellow pages delivered in the city. During the first 12 hours, 8,800 households logged on and opted out of 59,600 phone books, according to the office of Seattle City Council member Mike O'Brien, who sponsored legislation to create the registry. Peak traffic at noon showed 1,300 people were on the site at the same time. That's barely a dent in the 2 million books delivered each year in Seattle, but it was only the first 12 hours.
Who's pissed? Yellow Pages, Dex, and SuperMedia, which filed a motion yesterday—what a coincidence—asking a federal judge for a temporary restraining order to stop the opt-out registry. There's been a lawsuit underway for a while that claims doorstops made of ads are protected by the First Amendment or something, but the phone book companies want immediate action. Here's the temporary restraining order they filed.
Those fuckers. You can opt-out here.
1
Clearly we need to put this up to a state wide vote, but not until we have a minimum of 10 years worth of debating and planning.
2
These are not delivered by mail, so... could a condo board or apartment manager put up a notice saying clearly that delivery of these is not permitted - akin to the no solicitation messages; and given that, would delivery of phone books then constitute trespass? (If left outside property, well, that would be litter.)
3
"thousand anvils" is the most apt analogy. Thanks, i'll use it with my few remaining libertarian friends.
4
@2: "could a condo board or apartment manager put up a notice saying clearly that delivery of these is not permitted - akin to the no solicitation messages; and given that, would delivery of phone books then constitute trespass? (If left outside property, well, that would be litter.) "
They just leave them outside to rot.
They just leave them outside to rot.
5
You know, despite your rhetoric, I really like you, Dominic. I've defended you to countless centrists and center-lefties in Seattle. You serve a good purpose... you raise issues... stir the shitstorm, etc. But, this is the last straw: your fabulous, Dominic-endorsed "opt-out" website doesn't work. I've tried three browsers on Mac and PC -- all of them clam up (conveniently) at the address-entry page.
Of course, if y'all were really serious about this, you'd partner up with your pals in the city, and just give us the phone number of a friendly city civil servant to call for the opt out option. But, if this website has shown me anything, it's that y'all aren't serious. I've had three spam e-mails from them since trying to opt out... How special.
Of course, if y'all were really serious about this, you'd partner up with your pals in the city, and just give us the phone number of a friendly city civil servant to call for the opt out option. But, if this website has shown me anything, it's that y'all aren't serious. I've had three spam e-mails from them since trying to opt out... How special.
7
So the phone book companies believe they'll make more money by delivering a clearly undesired product to thousands of people than they would by targeting their product to those who want it.
I thought spam was already illegal?
I thought spam was already illegal?
8
@5 It quite literally took me less than three minutes to register, fill out my address, and opt-out. You have to read and follow instructions and the site might not be designed for optimal usability but your rant is not really true.
9
@5: 1) It worked fine for me, like @8 said, and 2) why are you blaming Dominic for your problems? Because it's a "Dominic-endorsed" site? That's just stupid.
Have another glass of whine and learn how to complain effectively.
Have another glass of whine and learn how to complain effectively.
11
And Dex, if I may just add:
What part of "WE DON'T WANT YOUR FUCKING PHONEBOOKS" do you not understand?
What part of "WE DON'T WANT YOUR FUCKING PHONEBOOKS" do you not understand?
14
Worked fine for me. I first opted out of all phone books and then spent about an hour opting out of every catalog for uninspired blah furniture (yes, that's you, Pottery Barn, and your 14 spin-off catalogs), modular carpet pieces (Flor, you suck), children's clothes (Hanna, I love you but I can get your footie pajamas at Costco), and random stupid ideas like self-cleaning kitty litter trays and shiatsu massage pillows (Hammacher Schlemmer, I'm talking to you). The website worked and it felt fucking great!
15
not only is it working for me, but i don't have to put up with albertson's, safeway, qfc, rite aid, costco, office depot, none of which are remotely close to where i live ?
hofuckingsannah !
hofuckingsannah !
16
Why do I need to give yet another website my email address? Why can't I just submit my street address, the one I don't want phonebooks delivered to, and that's the end? Of course they want my email. So they can send me new, awesomer spam.
17
Seattlebikeguy @16:
1. register an internet domain for about 9 bucks/year
2. assign it to your free google apps account
3. you can then have as many xyz@mydomain.com email addresses as you want, and manage them automatically. I signed up here as catalogchoice.org@mydomain.com
4. stop whining, makes you sound ridiculous. Get off my lawn!
1. register an internet domain for about 9 bucks/year
2. assign it to your free google apps account
3. you can then have as many xyz@mydomain.com email addresses as you want, and manage them automatically. I signed up here as catalogchoice.org@mydomain.com
4. stop whining, makes you sound ridiculous. Get off my lawn!
18
really? #17 why the fuck go through that much work ? i'm not giving up my email addy for spam any more than 16 / its all ways a screw job besides people have shit to do like play warcraft and smoke pot and shit. you expect em to go through all that ?
19
Dom's up to his usual standards... the site, catalog choice, has been around for years. Seattle and several cities are helping fund or potentially even "sponsor" that site but it is NOT a "city-run" site. It may seem a trivial distinction but his friend (#5) bought into the misrepresentation. If you are going to consider yourself a reporter or journalist you should at least attempt the very lowest level of due diligence...
20
Pissy whiners, too lazy to do something about avoiding the spam, or just deleting it. Just sit there on your couch eating Cheetos while they deliver useless dead tree pulp. Fuck you.
21
I have multiple email accounts, one of which I've had since 1996 and I consider my spam account. I sign up for everything with that one and don't really pay attention to it unless I'm looking for a coupon for something. Problem solved!
22
@4 my association or concierge must do something, because I have never seen phone books in or near my condo building (nor in the recycling).
23
I really don't see the 1st amendment angle. How does the right to say something in public trump the right to shelter ones self from said speech in ones own home? If the John Birch society or the RCP suddenly had enough money to begin delivering monthly newsletters to every house in King County, would everyone be forced to accept that?
25
If phone books are free speech, why wouldn't "I don't want a phone book, thanks" be protected speech as well?
DEX et all are gonna lose this one.
DEX et all are gonna lose this one.
26
@23, the First Amendment angle is simply that the ordinance and its enforcement are government actions that affect speech.
As to your question why can't an individual shield themselves from objectionable speech in their home, that is not the issue in this case--the challenge is to the government action. As to governments enforcing laws that enable individuals to shield themselves in their homes, here's what the Supreme Court has said:
"We have, of course, recognized the important interest in allowing addressees to give notice to a mailer that they wish no further mailings which, in their sole discretion, they believe to be erotically arousing or sexually provocative. [citation] But we have never held that the government itself can shut off the flow of mailings to protect those recipients who might potentially be offended. The First Amendment 'does not permit the government to prohibit speech as intrusive unless the "captive" audience cannot avoid objectionable speech.' [citation] Recipients of objectionable mailings, however, may " 'effectively avoid further bombardment of their sensibilities simply by averting their eyes.' " [citation] Consequently, the 'short, though regular, journey from mail box to trash can ... is an acceptable burden, at least so far as the Constitution is concerned.' "
As to your question why can't an individual shield themselves from objectionable speech in their home, that is not the issue in this case--the challenge is to the government action. As to governments enforcing laws that enable individuals to shield themselves in their homes, here's what the Supreme Court has said:
"We have, of course, recognized the important interest in allowing addressees to give notice to a mailer that they wish no further mailings which, in their sole discretion, they believe to be erotically arousing or sexually provocative. [citation] But we have never held that the government itself can shut off the flow of mailings to protect those recipients who might potentially be offended. The First Amendment 'does not permit the government to prohibit speech as intrusive unless the "captive" audience cannot avoid objectionable speech.' [citation] Recipients of objectionable mailings, however, may " 'effectively avoid further bombardment of their sensibilities simply by averting their eyes.' " [citation] Consequently, the 'short, though regular, journey from mail box to trash can ... is an acceptable burden, at least so far as the Constitution is concerned.' "
27
I'm afraid Dex et al don't have that much to worry about. I managed to successfully opt out, but it took too long, was way too complicated, and resulted in a cryptic error message in my e-mail interface. I'm tech savvy, patient and determined enough to get through it, but most of my non-techie family will give up, if they even become motivated enough to give it a try.
29
If someone is free speeching it up on a street corner I can walk down the street if I don't like what they are saying. If someone puts up a billboard I don't like I can take a different route in order to avoid it or, you know, just keep my eyes on the road. If someone puts their free speech on television or the radio I can change the channel or shut it off. If someone free speeches it up on the internet I can choose not to frequent their site if I don't like the content or the advertisements (or I can even buy fancy software to block all the content I find objectionable). It is much harder to choose to ignore the phone book on your doorstep. Believe me, I've tried and my apartment management and later condo owners association got really upset at me when I just left the phone book on my doorstep for weeks/months at a time. If it's going to be me my responsibility to dispose of it, and I pay ($) in the form of HOA dues for garbage/recyling removal, then I should be able opt out of recieving it in the first place. They can have their free speech but not if it costs me money to avoid "hearing" it. You can't technically call it free then can you? It ought to be something you have to OPT IN for but if not then at very least you should be allowed to opt out.
30
Also, advertisers must be starting to realize what a waste of their money the phone book is so those companies that produce the phone books must already be loosing revenue. The only way they can keep making money using this model is to a) require business to buy phone book ads if they want to buy internet ads and/or b) hugely inflate the number of people their ads reach by not allowing people to opt out of recieving the phone book and then claiming that they reach all the people they deliver the phone book to even though most of those people just toss the book out. A better way to make money would be to change the model -- increase the price of internet ads (and possibly the price of hard copy phone book ads as well) and then either eliminate the hard copy phone book all together or allow people who want it to purchase for a reasonable price (+shipping).
31
I opted out months ago. Got a letter today saying, " our records indicate that your address is on our do not deliver list. UNFORTUNATELY, your address falls on a mailed route and postal regulations prevent us from stopping delivery of our phone book. However, we have sent your information to the local Postmaster asking them to not deliver our phone book.
We hope this effort results in the non delivery of our phone book to your address. If not, please know that our phone book is 100% recyclable and can be recycled through your local recycling options. Any questions, please call 800-243-0219 ".
This makes me see red!!!
We hope this effort results in the non delivery of our phone book to your address. If not, please know that our phone book is 100% recyclable and can be recycled through your local recycling options. Any questions, please call 800-243-0219 ".
This makes me see red!!!
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