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News & ArtsTuesday, December 28, 2010
Savage Love SL Letter of the Day: Can't Help You
Posted by Dan Savage on Tue, Dec 28, 2010 at 5:47 PM
This is going to be a bit complicated, so I apologize in advance.I am a queer, cis-gendered woman in my 20s who prefers male partners (sexually and romantically). For awhile now I’ve really enjoyed straight anal porn and fantasies, but have never felt comfortable with the idea of receiving anal or pegging. In my fantasies my perspective has always been that of the male and I’ve only recently realized that this is not because I want to get fucked in the ass or fuck a guy in the ass—it’s because I want to fuck another girl in the ass. As awesome as this revelation was, I have a few roadblocks to actually achieving this fantasy:
1. I have never had sex with a woman. The only thing I’ve ever done is make out with girls, but not even girls I’m attracted to.
2. I’ve never had anal sex in any form, though I’ve read a lot of how-tos and know the general theory behind how to make it good for both people, and I don’t really think anal’s something you just bust out with on the first fuck, especially if it’s the first time you’re having sex with a person of the gender you aren’t usually sexual with.
3. I’m in no way interested in having any form of a relationship with a woman, and I’m worried that without one I won’t find someone to help me fulfill this fantasy—partly because I am usually only attracted to women I feel an emotional bond with (as in, my friends).
4. I’m not out (well, I am to like 3 people), and I don’t ever intend on being fully out. Yes, I know this is partly due to internalized homophobia; yes, I know that’s massively fucked up (especially because I’ve been involved in several queer rights groups); yes, it’s also because I’m a bit of a coward and am afraid of the fallout with my family; and no, I still don’t ever want to come out completely. However, I feel like I would need to be out to pick up women in bars, etc.I’m currently dating a guy who is everything I’ve ever wanted, but I’m not sure how he would feel about me sleeping with a woman without him, especially given the fact that I get emotionally attached easily to people I’ve been intimate with. I’d be interested in doing a group-type scenario, where I’m a temporary dom to a random sub girl in front of other people and he then doms me, but I’m strangely uninterested in threesomes.
I realize that my first step should be to find out how my guy feels about the whole thing and my second would be to decide whether he or my fantasy is more important if he’s not down, but the steps that come after it, like actually going and finding some hot femme sub to fuck, freak me the fuck out. A lot of it has to do with my previously mentioned internalized homophobia and my lack of desire to have anything more than casual sex with a woman, but I just feel so screwed up and jumbled in my head about this. I guess I don’t really have a specific question—just a desire for any advice you can give me at all.
Scared Wannabe Anal Pirate
My response after the jump...
•••••••••••••••
Okay...
You're not sexually attracted to women you don't know—because you have to have some sort of a relationship with a women before you want to fuck her in the ass—but you don't wanna realize this assfucking fantasy with a woman you know because you tend to become attached to the people that you're intimate with and you don't want to be attached to the woman whose ass you fuck; you can't pick up strange women—women you wouldn't be attracted to anyway since you wouldn't have a relationship with them—because you're not out (and as much as I hate to be the bearer of bad news: very few of the out lesbian and bi women who congregate in dyke bars are dying to get fucked in their asses by "queer, cis-gendered" closet cases with zero interest in a relationship and boyfriends at home), and you're never coming out because you're a coward and you can't hit on your friends because then they would know you're not entirely straight—although I wouldn't describe you as anywhere near queer—and the news would quickly spread that you wanna fuck all your female friends in their asses and that could complicate your friendships and what if you family finds out and blah blah blah Eyes Wide Shut completely unrealistic dom/sub assfucking scenario... and scene.
Can't help you, SWAP.
I get lots of letters like yours: bisexual but not out, no intention of ever coming out, never had a relationship with a same-sex partner, never had sex with a same-sex partner, and an opposite-sex partner at home who doesn't know/wouldn't approve/wants to watch. So you're not alone. And, like so many of the closeted bisexuals who write me, you've got all the sex-radical/women's studies lingo down pat: you're cis-gendered (whatever to "cis"; here's hoping it winds up in the same landfill with "monosexual," and soon) and you're queer! Just not out! And never had a same-sex experience! But you're TOTALLY a member of my great, big, loving LGBTQITSLFABDB family. (That's lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgendered, queer, intersexed, two-spirted, leather/fetish, and allied, blah-de-blah).
You're not queer.
Now you don't need my permission to call yourself queer—very quietly, where no one can hear—and, hey, I knew I was gay when I was 14 and I wasn't out to anyone and being closeted didn't make me any less gay. So being a closeted bisexual doesn't make you any less bisexual. (But I was FOURTEEN FUCKING YEARS OLD when I was gay and closeted and still living at home with my Catholic parents—Catholic and religious parents—and I somehow managed to come out to my whole family by the time I was 18. Ova the fuck up, SWAP.) But "queer" to me has always implied a degree of bravery and bravado, a what-the-fuck attitude, and a life lived openly and honestly. If someone like you is queer, well, perhaps membership criteria are laxer than they should be.
Sigh.
Sorry to unload. It's just that questions like yours—and, truth be told, people like you—annoy me. Because everything you want you can have: there are kinky bi women out there who would be into the scenario you describe: you, your strap-on, your boyfriend. But those women are not going to kick down your closet door and beg you to fuck their asses. You'll have to go find one, SWAP, and finding one—or a series of them (fantasies rarely evaporate once they've been realized; if you like it, you'll want to do this again and again)—will require you to do what everyone else does when they're looking for a sex partner or a playmate: advertise, flirt, drink, flirt, hit on people, and, if nothing else works, rent. But you'll be outing yourself in the process, which you don't want to do/are too cowardly to do, which brings us back to...
I can't help you, SWAP—but you can help yourself.
2
@2 I had to look it up, something to do with acting in accordance with the roles of the gender you've been assigned.
3
Good lord, stop whining and own your own sexuality.
"I wanna but I'm afraid!" Oh please. You're in your 20s stop behaving like a 13 year old.
"I wanna but I'm afraid!" Oh please. You're in your 20s stop behaving like a 13 year old.
4
@1 looks like a woman, feels like a woman, as opposed to looks like a woman, but feels like a man (which is basically the Mr. Rogers version of what @2 said) ...but I'm also confused: I thought she said she was a "queer woman who isn't attracted to other women," or did I miss something? (Because I was thinking that would make her straight?)
5
Cis was devised as a contrast for trans-gendered.
To SWAP, the best thing you can do is out yourself. It's easier than you think, and the great benefit to it is that when you're out, you'll have some confidence that your lover(s) and friends like you for who you are, not who they think you might be. That's a huge benefit.
To SWAP, the best thing you can do is out yourself. It's easier than you think, and the great benefit to it is that when you're out, you'll have some confidence that your lover(s) and friends like you for who you are, not who they think you might be. That's a huge benefit.
6
@1, it means she's straight. She's biologically a woman, and she's only sexually interested in men, only romantically interested in men, and she's only ever had sex with men. That sounds like "straight" to me. Not gay.
But she likes the theory of radical queer politics so much that she wants to be one, EVEN THOUGH SHE ISN'T.
Which is sad, because it is perfectly possible -- necessary, even -- to be as pro-gay as you want to be without pretending that you are yourself gay if you are not in fact gay. I don't think that does anyone, gay or straight, any favors. Quite the opposite; it suggests a fundamental difficulty in accepting what gay actually means, and associates gay with "lying to oneself". Which is kind of icky.
I can see why Dan is annoyed. I'm annoyed. Some people get so wrapped up in the gender-identity political discussion that they disappear up their own asses, and not in a good way.
But she likes the theory of radical queer politics so much that she wants to be one, EVEN THOUGH SHE ISN'T.
Which is sad, because it is perfectly possible -- necessary, even -- to be as pro-gay as you want to be without pretending that you are yourself gay if you are not in fact gay. I don't think that does anyone, gay or straight, any favors. Quite the opposite; it suggests a fundamental difficulty in accepting what gay actually means, and associates gay with "lying to oneself". Which is kind of icky.
I can see why Dan is annoyed. I'm annoyed. Some people get so wrapped up in the gender-identity political discussion that they disappear up their own asses, and not in a good way.
7
The only way I can see this being realized is with a lot of time and effort. Lazy Wannabe Anal Pirate seems more like.
Either that or she needs to consult a professional.
Either that or she needs to consult a professional.
8
Glad to see Dan read all that, it just looks like whiny crap to me. All that to say she wants to fuck other women, but is too chickenshit to admit it (apparently). Was it really so hard to say that?
10
SWAP needs to take it up the butt, from her boyfriend. Of course she's not comfortable with the idea of receiving anal. It's a weird, disorienting idea, if you've never done it. That's why she should do it, so she understands, really understands, what the person on the other end of her dildo will feel like. So, first, she should take it up the butt a few times (or a few dozen times). Then, she should practice pegging her boyfriend, if he's enthusiastic. Get used to the sensations involved with both sides of the butt fucking. All this time, she can also fantasize up the wazoo about pegging a hot femme sub. Once she knows a little more about what she's doing, then she'll be a little older, a little wiser, and a little more ready to own up to her own desires. And she can figure out then if she's really straight, or gay, or bi, or dom, or sub, or what.
11
The worst/best part of this letter was: "I’m currently dating a guy who is everything I’ve ever wanted"
Hence the letter. The sooner Microsoft invent a programmable partner the happier I'm going to be.
Hence the letter. The sooner Microsoft invent a programmable partner the happier I'm going to be.
12
I'd suggest some counseling. Not really so much to get to the root of her kink or anything like that, but just cause she sounds like she could use someone to talk to about this all (and perhaps some more.) So is "CIS" an acronym? Or an abbreviation?
14
I'd love to hear her personal definition of "queer." Or, then again, maybe hearing it would make me want to stick a pencil in my eye.
I imagine it goes something like, "I'm a woman who doesn't conform 100% to traditional gender roles and sometimes gets off on the idea of being with an unattainable, imaginary woman-type-person...while actually only fucking and wanting to be in relationships with men."
In other words, straight.
I imagine it goes something like, "I'm a woman who doesn't conform 100% to traditional gender roles and sometimes gets off on the idea of being with an unattainable, imaginary woman-type-person...while actually only fucking and wanting to be in relationships with men."
In other words, straight.
15
Trans and cis are prepositions borrowed from Latin. Trans means across something. Cis means "not across" or "on this side of" something.
16
@6 I agree. I've met people like this and they are fucking infuriating. It's like they are trying to be left wing for the sake of itself, so the redefine "queer" to mean "anything greater than 0 on the Kinsey scale" so that they can feel like they are outside the mainstream and are being repressed. To be frank, SWAP sounds like a "Daddy's Money Lesbian," I doubt that she'll ever act upon her urge to do another woman up the butt, and she will always complain about how the heteronormative society is repressing her.
17
Dear Dan,
I am a woman. I am bisexual. I am consumed by an intense burning sensation right now. It is hatred for SWAP, and it won't go away. Help me, Dan!
-Your (Dan's, SLOG's, not SWAP's) Friend in SF
I am a woman. I am bisexual. I am consumed by an intense burning sensation right now. It is hatred for SWAP, and it won't go away. Help me, Dan!
-Your (Dan's, SLOG's, not SWAP's) Friend in SF
19
Cis is lat/science talk and is sort of the opposite of trans. Trans means to cross two things, in this case, genders, while cis means to...well...not cross, or be parallel to.
It's kind of an obscure way of saying homo and hetero but without the specific connotations. It's also used a lot in biochemistry.
It's kind of an obscure way of saying homo and hetero but without the specific connotations. It's also used a lot in biochemistry.
20
Can I just say to you all that I too am a cisgendered queer, for the simple reason that the way my profile pic overlaps the corner of my blockquote @18 gives me shivers up my spine?
Whew. Out at last. Also, I am wearing a velvet sports jacket.
Whew. Out at last. Also, I am wearing a velvet sports jacket.
21
wow. the only way i can deal with this letter without banging my head against the wall is by assuming that she is using "queer" in the traditional sense, to mean "weird" or "unusual." we all know that's not the case here, but i'm just going to go ahead and pretend.
22
@12 "Cis" is a Latin prefix for "this side of." It's the opposite of "trans" which means "that side of." Thus, transatlantic, cisatlantic (That side of the Atlantic, this side of the Atlantic).
23
'Monosexual' is a bit of satirical rhetoric to deploy against people who think we bisexuals are abnormal; cis is a useful word to use for talking about trans issues. I'd happily trash monosexual but keep cis. However, you don't need to append it to every damn thing you say about yourself.
What was it Dan said a few weeks ago about some people being 'gray'? I mean, what would be the point of SWAP coming out as bisexual? If I hit on her, she'd still turn me down and probably freak out on me because I'm not her friend, and she only fancies her friends! Ultimately sexual descriptors are only as good as how useful they are, and in every useful way SWAP is straight and kinky.
What was it Dan said a few weeks ago about some people being 'gray'? I mean, what would be the point of SWAP coming out as bisexual? If I hit on her, she'd still turn me down and probably freak out on me because I'm not her friend, and she only fancies her friends! Ultimately sexual descriptors are only as good as how useful they are, and in every useful way SWAP is straight and kinky.
24
Girl needs to stay home, masturbate to her fantasy, do some honest introspection and try to sort herself. And try to stay the fuck away from whatever nutso online community is encouraging her to decide she needs to be some "queer" sexual rebel when she's really not.
Also I hope if she ever tries to pick up any lesbians or bisexual women while she is still carrying all this baggage around her target smells the crazy and RUNS.
Also I hope if she ever tries to pick up any lesbians or bisexual women while she is still carrying all this baggage around her target smells the crazy and RUNS.
26
'Monosexual' is a bit of satirical rhetoric to deploy against people who think we bisexuals are abnormal; cis is a useful word to use for talking about trans issues. I'd happily trash monosexual but keep cis. However, you don't need to append it to every damn thing you say about yourself.
What was it Dan said a few weeks ago about some people being 'gray'? I mean, what would be the point of SWAP coming out as bisexual? If I hit on her, she'd still turn me down and probably freak out on me because I'm not her friend, and she only fancies her friends! Ultimately sexual descriptors are only as good as how useful they are, and in every useful way SWAP is straight and kinky.
What was it Dan said a few weeks ago about some people being 'gray'? I mean, what would be the point of SWAP coming out as bisexual? If I hit on her, she'd still turn me down and probably freak out on me because I'm not her friend, and she only fancies her friends! Ultimately sexual descriptors are only as good as how useful they are, and in every useful way SWAP is straight and kinky.
27
SWAP, sweetie, take the pressure off yourself. You really want to be queer, but you've tried kissing women and didn't enjoy it. Now after a lot of rummaging around you've found a fantasy that involves a woman. But you don't want it enough to actually make it happen.
Hon, you don't have to be queer. Just be an ally.
Hon, you don't have to be queer. Just be an ally.
28
Dear Dan Savage,
I want to have my cake, and eat it too. And I'd like to fuck my cake. And not tell anybody that I fuck cake, including the cake I am fucking. What do I do?
I want to have my cake, and eat it too. And I'd like to fuck my cake. And not tell anybody that I fuck cake, including the cake I am fucking. What do I do?
29
@20 I, myself, am a sissy-gendered person, as I am afraid of spiders and mucus. I do not own a velvet sports jacket, although that sounds "rad," but I do have an exceptionally fluffy bathrobe.
30
This might be the stupidest thing I have ever read in my life. Cis gendered? Get a fucking hobby, college girl.
32
Dan, you have walked away from a potentially lucrative sex blog commission. You are truly ethical. Sir, I salute you!
Also: big bonus points for "questions like yours—and, truth be told, people like you—annoy me."
Also: big bonus points for "questions like yours—and, truth be told, people like you—annoy me."
33
Yeesh Dan!
It's me, not you don't worry. We've just grown apart.
Twenty-plus years ago when I discovered the Stranger paper version (at the same time realizing The Weekly had turned into fish-wrap and the Stranger was more than an indy music rag) I used to pick it up every week for 1) local politics, which was the best coverage in town-- and I work in local politics-- and 2)Savage Love for a bit of titilation in my dreary work day.
Now I am very old, and the political coverage is good (but not quite what it was back when) and S.L. focuses on the most uninteresting subjects like the current one wherein a 20-y-o agonizes about her possible or imagined sexuality and you have to respond with a straight face.
Don't worry, it's me, not you, and you get paid for it.
Happy Holidays!
It's me, not you don't worry. We've just grown apart.
Twenty-plus years ago when I discovered the Stranger paper version (at the same time realizing The Weekly had turned into fish-wrap and the Stranger was more than an indy music rag) I used to pick it up every week for 1) local politics, which was the best coverage in town-- and I work in local politics-- and 2)Savage Love for a bit of titilation in my dreary work day.
Now I am very old, and the political coverage is good (but not quite what it was back when) and S.L. focuses on the most uninteresting subjects like the current one wherein a 20-y-o agonizes about her possible or imagined sexuality and you have to respond with a straight face.
Don't worry, it's me, not you, and you get paid for it.
Happy Holidays!
34
- At first I though she was a male to female tranny.
- Then I thought she was lesbian.
- Then I thought she was a male who identifies as female but is comfortable with her penis.
And after 5 minutes of Googling, I learn she's a straight woman.
Christ, what an asshole.
- Then I thought she was lesbian.
- Then I thought she was a male who identifies as female but is comfortable with her penis.
And after 5 minutes of Googling, I learn she's a straight woman.
Christ, what an asshole.
35
I can kinda-sorta-maybe see where she's coming from. But only on the "I'm only attracted to women who are my friends" thing. Personally, I believe that anyone can fall in love with anyone, but I'm generally only attracted to guys. A solid connection would already have to exist for me to entertain the idea of a romp with a woman. Therefore, friends first, and then maybe lovers after. It's the whole "but I don't want to get attached to the ladyfriend that I bone, but I'm already attached because we're friends" thing that's really boggling the ol' noodle...
36
Oh SWAP. If you must call yourself queer despite your nearly exclusive interest in men, lack of experience with women, and utter disinterest in being out or dating other women, then at least go shove your face in a few pussies.
The least you can do is give a few apologetic orgasms in exchange for the word.
The least you can do is give a few apologetic orgasms in exchange for the word.
38
speaking in my capacity of spokesperson for lesbians and bi women who actually have sex and relationships with other women, I have to say STFU straight girl.
In my capacity as a member of a buttfucking women triad, I say we wouldnt touch you and your teenage queer cisgendered personality with a 10 foot strap on.
And because I AM a member of these two groups and a few other ones, we declare you anathema and encourage you to the straight lifestyle, which you seem to match category for category and we refuse you the right to use the term queer. No doubt a woman who uses the phrase cisgendered for women and men living as women and men, you will ignore this and go right on trying to be one of us actual hip homos.
In my capacity as a member of a buttfucking women triad, I say we wouldnt touch you and your teenage queer cisgendered personality with a 10 foot strap on.
And because I AM a member of these two groups and a few other ones, we declare you anathema and encourage you to the straight lifestyle, which you seem to match category for category and we refuse you the right to use the term queer. No doubt a woman who uses the phrase cisgendered for women and men living as women and men, you will ignore this and go right on trying to be one of us actual hip homos.
39
Just to clarify, according to trans friends, cisgender actually means someone comfortable in the gender/sex they were born with, and transgender means someone who is not comfortable in the gender/sex they were born with. I think. It gets very confusing. I balked at the term in a big way because I was like "Really? We need more academic speak confusing things?" But when you look at it as a partner term for transgender (to make that term less of an isolating one), then I am cool with it.
However, I am less cool with the writer. This kid claiming to be queer just needs to stop worrying about academic terms so much and figure out how to come to terms with her sexuality. And then have a good time... with less worry about academic terms. Whippersnappers...
However, I am less cool with the writer. This kid claiming to be queer just needs to stop worrying about academic terms so much and figure out how to come to terms with her sexuality. And then have a good time... with less worry about academic terms. Whippersnappers...
42
@29, I'm not really what you'd call a sissy, but I can flounce pretty well when I need to, and I love things that only a certain kind of gay man seems to really be devoted to -- opera, show tunes, pink wine, flamboyant dancing. Ascots. I own two tuxedos (one of which I very nearly fit into). Basically I aspire to the condition of Cary Grant, or Rock Hudson minus the picking up boys at the bus station part. Or a white Sammy Davis (I wish).
A gay friend told me the other night that I'm way more gay than he is. Which was a complement.
But, alas, I am straight, and I don't try to cover it up with any of this cis business. I'm "out as a straight person" and this SWAP person needs to think about maybe doing the same.
A gay friend told me the other night that I'm way more gay than he is. Which was a complement.
But, alas, I am straight, and I don't try to cover it up with any of this cis business. I'm "out as a straight person" and this SWAP person needs to think about maybe doing the same.
43
Dan, do you filter your letters? or pick them randomly?
Did you ask your tech savvy at risk youth to find the most annoying and cringeworthy letter you can find?
I don't know how old this girl is, but I know she's young. If you hadn't published this letter, I'm sure she'd look back on what she wrote years from now, when she's less pretentiously half educated on sexual minority academic speak, and be very grateful that it was not published.
But alas, this letter has been published so she can be torn apart. If she's as pretentious and naive as this letter suggests, then these honest comments are going to be shredding.
She sounds delusional and annoying.
Personally, I was also delusional and annoying when I was younger. I didn't go around calling myself 'Cis' gendered at every opportunity, but I'm sure I was more annoying then than I am now, and I'm sure I'll look back at this time in my life and cringe when I'm older too.
As for binning the words 'cis gendered' and 'monosexual' well I think binning 'cis gendered' will make discussions about trans people more confusing, and I think if we bin 'mono sexual' then the monosexuals will continue to impose their bigoted "I exist and you kind of sort of don't" world view on bisexuals as they have for millenia.
Keep them both I say, and Dan, stop publishing letters like this pleeeeese!
Did you ask your tech savvy at risk youth to find the most annoying and cringeworthy letter you can find?
I don't know how old this girl is, but I know she's young. If you hadn't published this letter, I'm sure she'd look back on what she wrote years from now, when she's less pretentiously half educated on sexual minority academic speak, and be very grateful that it was not published.
But alas, this letter has been published so she can be torn apart. If she's as pretentious and naive as this letter suggests, then these honest comments are going to be shredding.
She sounds delusional and annoying.
Personally, I was also delusional and annoying when I was younger. I didn't go around calling myself 'Cis' gendered at every opportunity, but I'm sure I was more annoying then than I am now, and I'm sure I'll look back at this time in my life and cringe when I'm older too.
As for binning the words 'cis gendered' and 'monosexual' well I think binning 'cis gendered' will make discussions about trans people more confusing, and I think if we bin 'mono sexual' then the monosexuals will continue to impose their bigoted "I exist and you kind of sort of don't" world view on bisexuals as they have for millenia.
Keep them both I say, and Dan, stop publishing letters like this pleeeeese!
44
@43 -- Quite frankly, some people need torn apart by being confronted with how they sound. I'd say there's a better than average shot that down the road she'll point to the response to this letter (either from Dan, the comments here, or both) as the wake-up call she needed.
45
This girl is straight but wants to get her bad strap-on self behind another another girls behind, but doesn't know how her boyfriend would react. Well let me tell you how he'll react..or should react. He should take her hand and pull over to New Horizons or Desire in Cancun or some other swing club (or connect websites whatever) and help her get her freak on. The girls will love it and the boy gets to watch and play later. If he won't, I volunteer.
46
Normally I am all for letting someone define their own sexuality. But not being attracted to the same gender makes you a TEXTBOOK HETEROSEXUAL. I can't claim I'm black when I'm white, I can't claim I'm male when I'm female. You can't claim queer when you're fucking not.
47
I'm not sure I completely understand the term cis-gendered. Would this apply to my situation?
My wife has a 'man brain' - she's not emotional at all, likes movies with car chases and explosions, plays sports, likes cars, power tools and doing yard work. She wears no make up, never had her ears pierced, doesn't do pink and never wears a dress - not even on her wedding day. She's the breadwinner in our family - I primarily cook, clean and take care of the kids. 500 Days of Summer was my favourite movie from 2010, I don't do sports, tools and I don't like cars. etc.
However we are the most boring straight couple in the world. Personally we identify 100% as our biological gender and have no desire to be with someone of the same sex. I don't consider myself even the slightest bit 'queer'. Our situation evolved out of practical division of labour within our marriage - she has far better hand eye co-ordination so she did those tasks that required those skills etc.
My wife has a 'man brain' - she's not emotional at all, likes movies with car chases and explosions, plays sports, likes cars, power tools and doing yard work. She wears no make up, never had her ears pierced, doesn't do pink and never wears a dress - not even on her wedding day. She's the breadwinner in our family - I primarily cook, clean and take care of the kids. 500 Days of Summer was my favourite movie from 2010, I don't do sports, tools and I don't like cars. etc.
However we are the most boring straight couple in the world. Personally we identify 100% as our biological gender and have no desire to be with someone of the same sex. I don't consider myself even the slightest bit 'queer'. Our situation evolved out of practical division of labour within our marriage - she has far better hand eye co-ordination so she did those tasks that required those skills etc.
48
My impulse is to not be so hard on her. I think it's an improvement that people want to be identified as bi or queer or gay, when you look at the context of the country we live in. It could easily go the other way.
However, the response made it clear that Dan wasn't picking on her personally, but was putting the letter forward as being representative of many other letters of the same type that are received.
I don't want to be, say, caddy about this, but unfortunately one of the side effects of being totally accepting of sexual freedom is the possibility of folks being totally liberated and positive...and yet never having had the sex.
However, the response made it clear that Dan wasn't picking on her personally, but was putting the letter forward as being representative of many other letters of the same type that are received.
I don't want to be, say, caddy about this, but unfortunately one of the side effects of being totally accepting of sexual freedom is the possibility of folks being totally liberated and positive...and yet never having had the sex.
50
Well, Fnarf, I can relate. Our family had a rather unhealthy devotion to the Wizard of Oz, and I had memorized every song from A Chorus Line when I was 12...but, alas, I too am straight. What can "cis" learn from this? You don't have to be queer to be fabulous, honey.
51
This statement is bullshit and IRRITATING:
"This is going to be a bit complicated, so I apologize in advance."
No no. Fix it. Cut out the everything-and-the-kitchen-sink approach, and ASK THE FUCKING QUESTION YOU WANT TO ASK. Get to it for christsake.
You are *not* sorry. You're trying to get like twenty for the price of one. You're actually being inconsiderate with your verbal diarrhea. This letter is like water torture!
"This is going to be a bit complicated, so I apologize in advance."
No no. Fix it. Cut out the everything-and-the-kitchen-sink approach, and ASK THE FUCKING QUESTION YOU WANT TO ASK. Get to it for christsake.
You are *not* sorry. You're trying to get like twenty for the price of one. You're actually being inconsiderate with your verbal diarrhea. This letter is like water torture!
53
Finally, I am sure SWAP will be a nice person when she isn't a twenty something teenager any more.
54
@47: it's not primarily behaviours or doing male-stereotypical things, as in your example, but what the person identifies with. You're fine in your (hopefully) proud straight selves, and are not-boring in your own not-queer ways.
56
SWAP needs to stop feeling the need to feel special. YOU ARE STRAIGHT, SWAP. THAT IS ALSO OKAY. JUST BECAUSE IT DOESN'T HAVE ANY EXTRA-FUN OPPRESSION ATTACHED DOESN'T MAKE IT BAD.
57
I got tired of trying to understand / comprehend the whole thing.
Γνώση εαυτού (know thy self), could be a good springboard for a un-hindered sexual life .
I guess when you are going to reach 30, you will look back in disbelief at that crap you wrote some years ago.
Happy fuckings, peggings and all
Γνώση εαυτού (know thy self), could be a good springboard for a un-hindered sexual life .
I guess when you are going to reach 30, you will look back in disbelief at that crap you wrote some years ago.
Happy fuckings, peggings and all
58
I'm ruffled from the comments here, and I want to make sure I don't offend in my own life by claiming to belong to groups I don't belong to. I'm a woman, born a woman, dress like a woman, feel like a woman and I only date MTF crossdressers. I know there's lots of people who don't consider crossdressers to be part of the LGBT community--that the "T" stands for transsexual and only women in men's bodies and men in women's bodies count. I think that's too strict, I think that people who have both genders in them and are happy with their original genitalia should also count as "T". But do I fall into that LGBT somewhere too, at least queer? Or is there another name for me, besides the derogatory tranny-chaser? Although I suppose if the Laboutin fits...
60
@47, both you and your wife are cis-gendered and straight. Being cis-gendered means that when you think about yourself and say "I am a man", this internal reality matches the biological reality that you are an XY human. Trans-gendered is that when you look inside you identify yourself with one gender but when you look in the mirror you see another. It's a pretty fucked up situation, actually.
Your wife may like the things typically associated with men and act in ways typically associated with men, but if she feels female on the inside (not feminine, female) she's cis-gendered.
Using cis-gendered is ridiculous in this letter because it gives no relevant information, since it is in no way related to being trans. In any event, whatever happened to "rounding yourself up to straight"? Dan tells guys who are only attracted to women and only romantically interested in women, but who occasionally like recieving head from men, that they are allowed to round themselves up to straight. This strikes me as a very similar situation. Incidentally, to any gay guys out there, what the fuck is up with blowing guys who won't admit they're just a bit bi? I can understand wanting to get head in such a situation, but being willing to give it to a shame-ridden individual?
In any event this girl wants something but is willing to take no risks to get it. Therefore she won't get it. If your boyfriend is "everything you want" but won't be receptive to you coming out as bi and following up on those interests, then he's either not "everything you want" or you don't really want to act on those fantasies.
Your wife may like the things typically associated with men and act in ways typically associated with men, but if she feels female on the inside (not feminine, female) she's cis-gendered.
Using cis-gendered is ridiculous in this letter because it gives no relevant information, since it is in no way related to being trans. In any event, whatever happened to "rounding yourself up to straight"? Dan tells guys who are only attracted to women and only romantically interested in women, but who occasionally like recieving head from men, that they are allowed to round themselves up to straight. This strikes me as a very similar situation. Incidentally, to any gay guys out there, what the fuck is up with blowing guys who won't admit they're just a bit bi? I can understand wanting to get head in such a situation, but being willing to give it to a shame-ridden individual?
In any event this girl wants something but is willing to take no risks to get it. Therefore she won't get it. If your boyfriend is "everything you want" but won't be receptive to you coming out as bi and following up on those interests, then he's either not "everything you want" or you don't really want to act on those fantasies.
61
This immediately reminded me of one of my all-time favorite SLOG exchanges from Nov. 7, 2007:
For the past 15 years, I've identified as bisexual: I've been in monogamous relationships with men and women. I married a wonderful guy a few years ago. However, I recently realized that I identify as gay. I've talked to my husband about this and he's okay with it. I decided to stay with him and remain monogamous. We have a great relationship—and great sex. We left open the possibility of me taking a female lover in the future, if needed. For now, I'm happy with him. I flirt with girls, we talk openly about my preferences, but I haven't had sex with a woman since before I married him. And I'm okay with that.
So, here's my dilemma: Is it right to call myself a lesbian if I'm married to (and sexually involved with) a man? I hesitate to stay with the "bi" label, since I have no interest in other men. Can I call myself a lesbian even though I'm not sleeping with women?
Lesbian And Married To A Man
Dan: No.
For the past 15 years, I've identified as bisexual: I've been in monogamous relationships with men and women. I married a wonderful guy a few years ago. However, I recently realized that I identify as gay. I've talked to my husband about this and he's okay with it. I decided to stay with him and remain monogamous. We have a great relationship—and great sex. We left open the possibility of me taking a female lover in the future, if needed. For now, I'm happy with him. I flirt with girls, we talk openly about my preferences, but I haven't had sex with a woman since before I married him. And I'm okay with that.
So, here's my dilemma: Is it right to call myself a lesbian if I'm married to (and sexually involved with) a man? I hesitate to stay with the "bi" label, since I have no interest in other men. Can I call myself a lesbian even though I'm not sleeping with women?
Lesbian And Married To A Man
Dan: No.
62
Too much baggage. If you can't put the luggage down you'll just have to do what millions of others do; Live your life without living your sexual fantasies.
63
Marrena you're a straight woman who dates straight men. The fact that they're exclusively men who cross-dress makes you somewhat unusual, but not queer. That doesn't mean you're not a nice person, of course, but I'd consider you "Allied" (which at least here in Toronto, still gets you considered part of Pride Day)
I don't think you're at all like the letter-writer. You're able to define yourself simply, easily and without complicated terms.
I don't think you're at all like the letter-writer. You're able to define yourself simply, easily and without complicated terms.
64
As a Women's Studies learnin' leftie, I have to say "the left" takes some of the blame for attitudes like SWAP's. A lot of us view straight allies with skepticism, or with an eye that they've simply been brainwashed by the heteronormative discourse of blah blah blah Derrida blah. I have experienced many groups within LGBT communities who think a hetero person just can't possibly understand. So I get why someone who has only the vaguest curiosity in fooling around with women -- very specific women -- would rush to identify as "queer." Sure she's being a pretentious douche, but there's a big community of pretentious douches who encourage it.
65
I'm a"cis-gendered queer" and I'd stay the hell away from someone like SWAP. Jeebus. I'm with Dan, she's not queer, and with @9, what a trainwreck. What she has is a fantasy -- and she should man up with her bf about it and they can play around with it to see where it goes.
66
I am intensely curious as to what she would say when she 'comes out' to her family and what she fears. What did she tell those three people who already know? Does she have some really strange (hetero) fantasy or fetish that she think qualifies her as queer? Coming out as into S&M or some other fetish, I think, doesn't necessarily qualify as queer, nor even require coming out except to partners. Everyone else doesn't really care.
I also somewhat agree with 64 - it seems like one of the current trends is to pick apart privilege, being as apologetic as possible that one was born with any degree of it. If you can't point to at least one part of your identity that isn't oppressed, you're an overprivileged asshole who doesn't get it and never will. So perhaps the letter writer, being at least self-aware enough to know that she doesn't want a penis nor a girlfriend, picks the much more amorphous word 'queer'. Of course, she refuses to 'come out' except to three people, so the idea of her using queer as a way to gain acceptance among the radical left is probably not working out the way she had hoped.
Personally, I think the cause of sexual freedom is most helped by people just being honest about who they are. *I'm* a cisgendered hetero woman, and neither more nor less awesome than fabulous drag queens, butch lesbians, MTF, FTM, or perfect Kinsey 3s (actually - the drag queens are probably way more awesome than me). I don't feel a need to force labels that don't fit upon either myself or anyone else, and I believe this attitude is probably the most helpful in the long run when it comes to equal rights for all.
I also somewhat agree with 64 - it seems like one of the current trends is to pick apart privilege, being as apologetic as possible that one was born with any degree of it. If you can't point to at least one part of your identity that isn't oppressed, you're an overprivileged asshole who doesn't get it and never will. So perhaps the letter writer, being at least self-aware enough to know that she doesn't want a penis nor a girlfriend, picks the much more amorphous word 'queer'. Of course, she refuses to 'come out' except to three people, so the idea of her using queer as a way to gain acceptance among the radical left is probably not working out the way she had hoped.
Personally, I think the cause of sexual freedom is most helped by people just being honest about who they are. *I'm* a cisgendered hetero woman, and neither more nor less awesome than fabulous drag queens, butch lesbians, MTF, FTM, or perfect Kinsey 3s (actually - the drag queens are probably way more awesome than me). I don't feel a need to force labels that don't fit upon either myself or anyone else, and I believe this attitude is probably the most helpful in the long run when it comes to equal rights for all.
68
The less offensive, similar letter Dan did not answer:
"Dear Dan, I recently decided--er, excuse me, recently *recognized* thanks to my awakening at my college's Woman's Center--that my sexuality is the center of the whole, wide universe. (Very empowering moment, I assure you. Too bad about all those other gals there who thought their vags/romantic fantasies were the center of the universe, though.)
So, anyway, where will I find the people who correctly perceive this fact and the related fact that my needs, therefore, form this realities' core and sole function of existence? Obviously, my vag needs people who will do whatever it is that I want , without complaint or any reciprocal obligations on my part. Those people are oddly not finding me on their own.
Signed, Veruca Salt, all growed up!
"Dear Dan, I recently decided--er, excuse me, recently *recognized* thanks to my awakening at my college's Woman's Center--that my sexuality is the center of the whole, wide universe. (Very empowering moment, I assure you. Too bad about all those other gals there who thought their vags/romantic fantasies were the center of the universe, though.)
So, anyway, where will I find the people who correctly perceive this fact and the related fact that my needs, therefore, form this realities' core and sole function of existence? Obviously, my vag needs people who will do whatever it is that I want , without complaint or any reciprocal obligations on my part. Those people are oddly not finding me on their own.
Signed, Veruca Salt, all growed up!
69
(whatever to "cis"; here's hoping it winds up in the same landfill with "monosexual," and soon)
Thank you, thank you, a million times THANK YOU.
70
Guise, "cis" and "trans" are perfectly good prefixes, but they only work well when both sides of the double bond have the same "heavy" substituent. When you get more complicated things like, say, 1,2-dichloro-1-bromoethene, you need to use E (for entgegen, opposite) and Z (for zusammen, together).
71
@37 - not shaving your legs for that long didn't bother you? I'm pretty OCD about hair removal, I drool over the idea of getting that laser stuff that removes hair permanently. Hey Dan, am I queer if I lust after the machines that make my legs silky and smooth forever??
Seriously, SWAP needs to grow up. I'm a hetero woman and I would LOVE to have a boyfriend who is "everything I ever wanted." Hell, I'd love to have a boyfriend who's 75% of everything I ever wanted!
And you're not "queer" you're just "weird". Weird is good. I subcribe to Elle and Sports Illustrated, I cook and I'm in 5 fantasy football leagues, I wear makeup and sparkly jewelry and watch football and chug beer and paint myself for big games. Own your personality!!
Seriously, SWAP needs to grow up. I'm a hetero woman and I would LOVE to have a boyfriend who is "everything I ever wanted." Hell, I'd love to have a boyfriend who's 75% of everything I ever wanted!
And you're not "queer" you're just "weird". Weird is good. I subcribe to Elle and Sports Illustrated, I cook and I'm in 5 fantasy football leagues, I wear makeup and sparkly jewelry and watch football and chug beer and paint myself for big games. Own your personality!!
72
@63--thank you, RealityBites. Good to know where I stand. Although I do think my boyfriends fall into the "T" category of LGBT. If we are out on a date and my date is dressed, many of the social issues that transsexuals face he also faces. There's no outward difference between a crossdresser and a transsexual.
74
I had to read this one a few times, though I should have stopped at "queer woman...who prefers male partners (sexually and romantically)."
Trying to make sense out of this--is she *actually* queer and only prefers males out of fear of coming out? Maybe the "queer" was a typo and she meant to write "straight"? I am trying very hard to give her the benefit of the doubt.
Oo oo, maybe she's bisexual but only *slightly* prefers males over females? I mean, one viewing of The Kids Are All Right and I'm reminded of why men are so much easier to date.
Trying to make sense out of this--is she *actually* queer and only prefers males out of fear of coming out? Maybe the "queer" was a typo and she meant to write "straight"? I am trying very hard to give her the benefit of the doubt.
Oo oo, maybe she's bisexual but only *slightly* prefers males over females? I mean, one viewing of The Kids Are All Right and I'm reminded of why men are so much easier to date.
78
So I wrote a fucking essay in response to this thread, and then realized that the likelihood of anyone reading it was pretty low. So I'll just summarize, and probably come off looking like more of an asshole without the long-winded contextualization and explanation. Yes, it was WAY longer than this is.
SWAP's being kind of a dick, wanting to keep her hetero privilege while reaping the benefits of decades of activism that put the activists into socially-marginalized and often physically-dangerous circumstances. She wants to occasionally NSA-fuck women in the ass without, in secret, so that she isn't marginalized. Either drag your ass out of the closet, SWAP, or quit whining.
To everyone here who thinks they have the power/authority/right/whatever to arbitrate Who Is Queer and Who Is Not: fuck off. "Queer" as an identity, a label, a community is a cultural construct. It is a site of contested meaning, multiple interpretations, shifting definitions, contextually-specific readings, and all sorts of other indefinite and indistinct terms-of-explication. It is precisely this indefinite nature that has led to the development of Queer Theory as an academic discipline. You didn't invent the term, you didn't decide it should be applied to (some group of) sexually-non-normative people, and you don't get to say who is and who is not queer by virtue of the fact that you proclaim yourself to be queer. For a much better explanation of why you can't tack down a concrete definition of "queer", or really any community-defining term, than I feel like doing here, go read David Valentine's Imagining Transgender: An Ethnography of a Category. It's a really good book, and it explores contested meanings and constructions of "transgender" out in the wild, as it were.
Finally, I think the exclusionary approach toward defining a "queer community" taken by some (and particularly LG) members of the LGBTQRSTUVWXYZ grouping is a self-defeating political strategy. You're cutting off your noses to spite your faces. You're further-marginalizing people who are likely themselves marginalized by "straight" discourse, with whom you have much in common, including fighting against the marginalization of sexual minorities. Not all people you would call "straight" would be called "straight" by other "straight" people. Some "straight" people are part of marginalized sexual minorities all the same ("straight" BDSM is a good example). The "you don't get to call yourself queer" thing is getting really old, especially since you have no more authority to assert this than they have to assert that they're queer. Stop it. You need all the community you can muster, because the Religious Right has a fuckton of cash and probably won't stop fighting against the rights of sexual minorities until our sex laws look like Saudi Arabia's or Uganda's.
@58, 63: I'd deploy "queer" to describe Marrena, because I deploy "queer" to cover any non-normative sex/gender/sexuality that works to destabilize and undermine Butler's heterosexual matrix. I do this because I find it to be the least-problematic (while still useful/effective) usage. Dressing in "women's" clothing is kinda by-definition gender-non-normative for a man/male (otherwise they're not "women's" clothes, eh?), making Marrena's partners queer (genderqueer) and specifically not-entirely-masculine. As a woman, for her to be "hetero" sexual she'd have to be fucking men, and I promise you that normative cultural discourse doesn't view men who regularly dress in women's clothes as "real men," meaning she's NOT straight and is therefore queer.
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SWAP's being kind of a dick, wanting to keep her hetero privilege while reaping the benefits of decades of activism that put the activists into socially-marginalized and often physically-dangerous circumstances. She wants to occasionally NSA-fuck women in the ass without, in secret, so that she isn't marginalized. Either drag your ass out of the closet, SWAP, or quit whining.
To everyone here who thinks they have the power/authority/right/whatever to arbitrate Who Is Queer and Who Is Not: fuck off. "Queer" as an identity, a label, a community is a cultural construct. It is a site of contested meaning, multiple interpretations, shifting definitions, contextually-specific readings, and all sorts of other indefinite and indistinct terms-of-explication. It is precisely this indefinite nature that has led to the development of Queer Theory as an academic discipline. You didn't invent the term, you didn't decide it should be applied to (some group of) sexually-non-normative people, and you don't get to say who is and who is not queer by virtue of the fact that you proclaim yourself to be queer. For a much better explanation of why you can't tack down a concrete definition of "queer", or really any community-defining term, than I feel like doing here, go read David Valentine's Imagining Transgender: An Ethnography of a Category. It's a really good book, and it explores contested meanings and constructions of "transgender" out in the wild, as it were.
Finally, I think the exclusionary approach toward defining a "queer community" taken by some (and particularly LG) members of the LGBTQRSTUVWXYZ grouping is a self-defeating political strategy. You're cutting off your noses to spite your faces. You're further-marginalizing people who are likely themselves marginalized by "straight" discourse, with whom you have much in common, including fighting against the marginalization of sexual minorities. Not all people you would call "straight" would be called "straight" by other "straight" people. Some "straight" people are part of marginalized sexual minorities all the same ("straight" BDSM is a good example). The "you don't get to call yourself queer" thing is getting really old, especially since you have no more authority to assert this than they have to assert that they're queer. Stop it. You need all the community you can muster, because the Religious Right has a fuckton of cash and probably won't stop fighting against the rights of sexual minorities until our sex laws look like Saudi Arabia's or Uganda's.
@58, 63: I'd deploy "queer" to describe Marrena, because I deploy "queer" to cover any non-normative sex/gender/sexuality that works to destabilize and undermine Butler's heterosexual matrix. I do this because I find it to be the least-problematic (while still useful/effective) usage. Dressing in "women's" clothing is kinda by-definition gender-non-normative for a man/male (otherwise they're not "women's" clothes, eh?), making Marrena's partners queer (genderqueer) and specifically not-entirely-masculine. As a woman, for her to be "hetero" sexual she'd have to be fucking men, and I promise you that normative cultural discourse doesn't view men who regularly dress in women's clothes as "real men," meaning she's NOT straight and is therefore queer.
79
@72 -- Marrena, given that you *only* date crossdressers, I suppose that suggests you get satisfaction by dating guys dressed as women. You may actually be more queer than your boyfriends. But. Who cares?
Reminds me of the Wanda Sykes joke: "I still say 'black,' I do. Because 'African American' -- there's no bonus; it's not going to make your life any easier. You don't see black people standing around going, 'Woo yeah, African American. Man, I tell you, this beats the hell out of being black. We should have made the switch years ago.'"
Reminds me of the Wanda Sykes joke: "I still say 'black,' I do. Because 'African American' -- there's no bonus; it's not going to make your life any easier. You don't see black people standing around going, 'Woo yeah, African American. Man, I tell you, this beats the hell out of being black. We should have made the switch years ago.'"
80
@78 -- Totally love that you told everyone that no one has a right to define who is and isn't queer. And then you go right ahead and define who is and isn't queer.
81
@77: HUH?
Sucrose and aspartame are nothing alike, chemically speaking. Sucrose is a disaccharide formed by a particular bond between glucose and fructose, two common hexoses. Aspartame is the methyl ester of an aspartic acid/phenylalanine dipeptide. They are NOT isomers of each other.
Now, cis- and trans- fats are examples of cis-trans isomerism. Look it up.
Sucrose and aspartame are nothing alike, chemically speaking. Sucrose is a disaccharide formed by a particular bond between glucose and fructose, two common hexoses. Aspartame is the methyl ester of an aspartic acid/phenylalanine dipeptide. They are NOT isomers of each other.
Now, cis- and trans- fats are examples of cis-trans isomerism. Look it up.
82
"A lot of us view straight allies with skepticism, or with an eye that they've simply been brainwashed by the heteronormative discourse"
Can someone please explain this?
Can someone please explain this?
83
The funny part is that the more you try to work this kind of thing out in your head -- as opposed to through action -- is that it gets bigger and bigger the more you think about it. Often, I imagine, people finally try the thing they've obsessed over, only to find out that it's not that big a deal.
The sad part is... if you're too much of a coward to Come Out about your secret desires, then you must LIVE IN YOUR MISERY. It's a process, and it takes the time it takes, but people, come the fuck out!
The sad part is... if you're too much of a coward to Come Out about your secret desires, then you must LIVE IN YOUR MISERY. It's a process, and it takes the time it takes, but people, come the fuck out!
84
This reminds me of an argument I had recently on a completely unrelated forum. Basically I was told that if "A" and "B" are in a same-sex relationship, B can still identify as straight, and A has no right to take any issue with it. Because it's not A's business what B identifies as. If A shows any interest whatsoever in B's sexuality, it means A is an intolerant, controlling jerk. It was followed by a huge lecture on gender and sexual attraction vs. romantic attraction with lots of personal examples BLAH BLAH BLAH.
85
Enough people have ripped into the LW personally, but in answer to her question: What about a prostitute? If you want this to be a one-time NSA, then pony up!
86
@79 well obviously a lot of people care, with all the posters here jumping on this woman for calling herself queer. I don't want to step on any toes.
87
Jesus Christ, this was the most annoying letter I have ever read here. "I am a queer, cis-gendered woman in my 20s who prefers male partners (sexually and romantically)." When did that stop meaning heterosexual. And Dan is dead-on when he says "But "queer" to me has always implied a degree of bravery and bravado, a what-the-fuck attitude, and a life lived openly and honestly." If you are not openly "queer," it defeats the entire meaning of that self-appellation.
89
@86, fuck people's toes, honestly. Personally, I would see you as straight with an interesting kink. However if you feel more comfortable with queer (which is a damned vague concept, so far as I can tell) then fine. I think people are objecting to her using the term not because her very specific "I want to fuck girls in the ass who are friends of mine without having a relationship" isn't "gay" enough, but because she's so clearly emotionally fucked up about her desires. "Queer" carries a connotation of liberation, of comfort with one's own weirdness. You are clearly in touch with your desires and don't have to jump through a hundred rhetorical hoops to justify yourself. As such, though I personally wouldn't use it for you, I don't suppose you using the term would upset too many people.
It's upset some people of course, because some people are whiny little bitches who think that certain terms belong to them and them alone. Stomp on their toes with gusto.
It's upset some people of course, because some people are whiny little bitches who think that certain terms belong to them and them alone. Stomp on their toes with gusto.
90
@86, fuck people's toes, honestly. Personally, I would see you as straight with an interesting kink. However if you feel more comfortable with queer (which is a damned vague concept, so far as I can tell) then fine. I think people are objecting to her using the term not because her very specific "I want to fuck girls in the ass who are friends of mine without having a relationship" isn't "gay" enough, but because she's so clearly emotionally fucked up about her desires. "Queer" carries a connotation of liberation, of comfort with one's own weirdness. You are clearly in touch with your desires and don't have to jump through a hundred rhetorical hoops to justify yourself. As such, though I personally wouldn't use it for you, I don't suppose you using the term would upset too many people.
It'll upset some people of course, because some people are whiny little bitches who think that certain terms belong to them and them alone. Stomp on their toes with gusto.
It'll upset some people of course, because some people are whiny little bitches who think that certain terms belong to them and them alone. Stomp on their toes with gusto.
91
argg my attempt to correct my comment has led to double-lameness. Second one is the less mediocre one. My bad.
92
@86 -- I guess my point is, you obviously care too.... if you really just didn't want to step on toes, you wouldn't have mentioned it in the first place. In any case, I've noticed two different meanings/ usages of the term "queer". On the one side are the peeps who feel like "gay" or "lgbt" is too narrow... for instance my friend, a ftm transman who was a lesbian as a woman but now only sleeps with gay men. This reading of "queer" is, say, left of homosexual. The other use is people like you, the letter writer, and an annoying girl I knew who suggested that interracial couples are queer. That reading of "queer" is right of homosexual. I say, call yourselves whatever you want.
I, for one, only respond to "the sovereign nation of Santababy".
I, for one, only respond to "the sovereign nation of Santababy".
93
The only people who use the word privilege are the ones with the most privilege themselves. People without privilege don't have money to waste on liberal arts classes where one is likely to learn $2 words like privilege.
Also, people who talk about privilege all the time are fucking bores.
Also, people who talk about privilege all the time are fucking bores.
94
There is so much confusion here: cisgender just means not transgender. It has nothing to do with straight or gay. It just means, "Society considers me essentially a woman [for example], based on the genitalia I was born with, and I agree."
Basically, if you're confused by the term "cisgender," you are probably cisgender.
In other news, I think it's possible to be be basically straight and also, in a way, queer, but this girl is not it. Dan nailed it.
Basically, if you're confused by the term "cisgender," you are probably cisgender.
In other news, I think it's possible to be be basically straight and also, in a way, queer, but this girl is not it. Dan nailed it.
95
go ahead and view your straight allies with skepticism. we will take our support and money elsewhere if you don't really need it.
96
I guess I'll leave the only supportive comment.
SWAP, I can kind of relate. You're straight/mostly straight, but you're bicurious. That's great. I bet at least 1/2 of straight people aren't fully straight. You want to fuck around with a girl, but an open gay or bi girl won't have anything to do with you. This is how you solve this problem: 1) Tell the bf 2) Find a friend/acquaintance/sex worker who's willing to act out this fantasy with you 3) Repeat step two if necessary.
As a straight/mostly straight woman of a similar age who has only dated and fucked men but is interested in fucking but probably not dating women, I get it. You don't need to be out about this to anyone other than the people you're fucking though because it's not a huge part of your identity that influences your day to day life (as being gay or bi would be). Find a bicurious woman. I'm not sure how, but that's the solution. I'm a femme woman who loves being fucked in the ass. I'm attracted to femme women as well. If I knew you and you were femme and hot, I'd probably let you do me. If you discover where all the bicurious women are (post-college), please write back and let us know.
Everyone is flipping out on you because they think "queer" should be reserved for people who are gay or bi, and that makes sense. They resent that you've spent a lot of time reading gender studies stuff and no time being queer-yet you identify as queer. I get that your intentions are good, that's why you identified as cis-gendered. You're trying to be supportive, non-discriminating, and non-assuming.
If you're in college, pick up a girl on campus. If not, let's see if the commentators can offer advice on finding a bicurious woman without resorting to a prostitute or the ever so successful pickup line, "I have no experience and am not really gay or bisexual-I don't think. I also have a boyfriend. Can I fuck you up the ass?"
Best of luck, SWAP. Until the online dating sites let people identify as bi-curious (WTF, OkCupid?), it's finding someone who knows somebody who knows somebody who is bicurious. *Sigh*
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SWAP, I can kind of relate. You're straight/mostly straight, but you're bicurious. That's great. I bet at least 1/2 of straight people aren't fully straight. You want to fuck around with a girl, but an open gay or bi girl won't have anything to do with you. This is how you solve this problem: 1) Tell the bf 2) Find a friend/acquaintance/sex worker who's willing to act out this fantasy with you 3) Repeat step two if necessary.
As a straight/mostly straight woman of a similar age who has only dated and fucked men but is interested in fucking but probably not dating women, I get it. You don't need to be out about this to anyone other than the people you're fucking though because it's not a huge part of your identity that influences your day to day life (as being gay or bi would be). Find a bicurious woman. I'm not sure how, but that's the solution. I'm a femme woman who loves being fucked in the ass. I'm attracted to femme women as well. If I knew you and you were femme and hot, I'd probably let you do me. If you discover where all the bicurious women are (post-college), please write back and let us know.
Everyone is flipping out on you because they think "queer" should be reserved for people who are gay or bi, and that makes sense. They resent that you've spent a lot of time reading gender studies stuff and no time being queer-yet you identify as queer. I get that your intentions are good, that's why you identified as cis-gendered. You're trying to be supportive, non-discriminating, and non-assuming.
If you're in college, pick up a girl on campus. If not, let's see if the commentators can offer advice on finding a bicurious woman without resorting to a prostitute or the ever so successful pickup line, "I have no experience and am not really gay or bisexual-I don't think. I also have a boyfriend. Can I fuck you up the ass?"
Best of luck, SWAP. Until the online dating sites let people identify as bi-curious (WTF, OkCupid?), it's finding someone who knows somebody who knows somebody who is bicurious. *Sigh*
98
Hey, "monosexual" is a perfectly fine word. I'll even use it in a sentence: "All you creepy little monosexuals with your creepy little monosexual lives creep me out -- if I were to say that I would never bed a black person, people would be uncomfortable with my open racist attitudes, but were supposed to be accepting of your sexist ones?"
See, it's very useful.
See, it's very useful.
99
I think this woman just really wants to be a part of the LGBT and S&M communities, so she's convinced herself that she is.
It's okay if you aren't, sweetheart.
It's okay if you aren't, sweetheart.
100
@96, if you hang out in poly, kinky, or geeky communities -- about half of the women are bi. Or at least bi-curious, or you know, "hetero-flexible", which is an awful term but means only that we fantasize mostly about men, but are happy to be seduced by an attractive woman.
101
I still think jumping straight to anal is a hard sell to any woman you just met, no matter how bi-curious she is. Particularly since SWAP has no anal experience. If pegging a girl is the fantasy, the reality has to start with getting more comfortable with anal, on both ends.
102
I must associate being queer with being a sort of out and open lifestyle. Although I feel very queer while single or in a relationship with a women, I feel decidedly un-queer while in a relationship with a man.
It isn't that I've stopped being bisexual, and I'm not stuck on monogamy, but I'm not poly and don't have a lot of interest in FFM three-ways, so dating a man just mentally yanks me out of the category of "queer people."
It isn't that I've stopped being bisexual, and I'm not stuck on monogamy, but I'm not poly and don't have a lot of interest in FFM three-ways, so dating a man just mentally yanks me out of the category of "queer people."
103
@101 Erica P
Very true.
If she tried to peg a stranger with no experience in pegging, the resulting awkwardness could turn her off of her fantasy forever. Of course, that might be a good thing in this case.
Very true.
If she tried to peg a stranger with no experience in pegging, the resulting awkwardness could turn her off of her fantasy forever. Of course, that might be a good thing in this case.
104
@95 I think my comment was misinterpreted. I was *criticising* that aspect of queer politics, not justifying it.
105
First things first - I think the letter writer is young, confused, and trying to lay hands on some terminology that fits what's going on in her head. It's easy to say labels don't mean anything and to just "be yourself," but when you're not *sure* what the fuck you are, labels can be helpful in terms of organizing what's going on in your *own* brain.... "I don't know what I *am*, but I don't think I'm X, Y, or Z (right now)." And, of course, when you're young and confused and start out by trying to rule out what you're *not,* eventually you start making declarative statements about what you *are* that might be true and might just be erroneous conclusions. In other words, for this particular person, "queer" seems to be a misnomer based on the information given, and "cisgender" is irrelevant.
Re: queer and cis/trans however, for those who are more toward the trans end of the spectrum, "queer" can be a handy, and accurate, word. When a person's gender either doesn't match their physical body, or is just generally in flux or set to neutral, it screws with our commonly held definitions of sexuality, too. For example, a person who was assigned female at birth (has female "parts", if you like) who identifies as male, is taking testosterone, maybe even looks male "downstairs" (testosterone does that), *but* who, due to dress or behavior or some quirk of genetics, still gets "read" as female. If this person dates men, are they a gay man? A straight "woman" (the answer to this is of course "no", but I mention it to debunk the obvious, and to acknowledge that when one is indeed read that way, it does send a different message and carry a different weight, even if the person hates it). Do we call that person "a FTM transgender person who's attracted to men"? Just "queer"? What *is* that orientation called, when the gender - the yardstick by which we define sexual orientation - is no longer considered an obvious or even necessarily a constant? The fairest answer is that it's called whatever that particular person wants it to be called, which would (again) of course not be "straight woman" in this particular example. But if we take "straight woman" off the table (and we should) then we're talking about.... man, who likes men, but gets *read* as a straight woman, and... well, that's the kind of situation where queer can be both handy and accurate - depending on the person, of course, and their preference.
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Re: queer and cis/trans however, for those who are more toward the trans end of the spectrum, "queer" can be a handy, and accurate, word. When a person's gender either doesn't match their physical body, or is just generally in flux or set to neutral, it screws with our commonly held definitions of sexuality, too. For example, a person who was assigned female at birth (has female "parts", if you like) who identifies as male, is taking testosterone, maybe even looks male "downstairs" (testosterone does that), *but* who, due to dress or behavior or some quirk of genetics, still gets "read" as female. If this person dates men, are they a gay man? A straight "woman" (the answer to this is of course "no", but I mention it to debunk the obvious, and to acknowledge that when one is indeed read that way, it does send a different message and carry a different weight, even if the person hates it). Do we call that person "a FTM transgender person who's attracted to men"? Just "queer"? What *is* that orientation called, when the gender - the yardstick by which we define sexual orientation - is no longer considered an obvious or even necessarily a constant? The fairest answer is that it's called whatever that particular person wants it to be called, which would (again) of course not be "straight woman" in this particular example. But if we take "straight woman" off the table (and we should) then we're talking about.... man, who likes men, but gets *read* as a straight woman, and... well, that's the kind of situation where queer can be both handy and accurate - depending on the person, of course, and their preference.
106
@1 I had to look it up too.
... So .... this is just a straight chick? Who ... is kind of kinky and likes gay bars so she thinks she's queer? I don't get it.
... So .... this is just a straight chick? Who ... is kind of kinky and likes gay bars so she thinks she's queer? I don't get it.
107
I agree with those who suggest SWAP should tell the boyfriend about whatever her potential fantasy is (which it sounds like she is not completely clear on, but talking to the boyfriend and playing around with it would help clarify probably). Talk about your fantasies, start ass-fucking, experiment with the boyfriend! Then see where you're at.
Also I'm pretty sure if you aren't interested in relationships with women, no coming out is necessary. If you tell certain friends about the details of your sex life, you might tell them about this. If you only ever want to be in relationships with men, why would you need to come out to the family as anything but straight?
Also I'm pretty sure if you aren't interested in relationships with women, no coming out is necessary. If you tell certain friends about the details of your sex life, you might tell them about this. If you only ever want to be in relationships with men, why would you need to come out to the family as anything but straight?
108
The letter writer is not really asking a question. She is just saying: "I have some very slight bi-curiosity. Yet I lack the ovaries to execute on it. Have pity on me."
109
i bet you anything that if the LW somehow does find a woman who is willing to allow her to experiment, some days or weeks later LW will be crying about how she was manipulated into sex she didn't like, and she probably won't like it, since she is straight.
111
BORING. I'm queer....except I don't actually want to sleep with a woman, or date a woman, or have a relationship with a woman, or cuddle, or let anyone know I have these fantasies in any way.
PLEASE EXPLAIN TO ME HOW ARE YOU QUEER?
I'm totally straight, and I think I'm queerer than this chick.
PLEASE EXPLAIN TO ME HOW ARE YOU QUEER?
I'm totally straight, and I think I'm queerer than this chick.
112
Dunno about you, Dan, but her comment that "[She's] in no way interested in having any form of a relationship with a woman" made me wonder about hiring out professionally. This could be a way to test things out, no?
113
After reading the letter I thought she was really annoying, but after reading the comments I feel sorry for her.
I agree the terminology was confusing, but I guess what she means is that she is queer because she finds (some) women attractive, wants to sleep with them and fuck them in the arse. Maybe the word queer is a bit strong, but who cares?
I think her problem, and why everyone hates her, is she is completely over the top about it. Firstly, why would her family need to know? Like any kink, that will never become a relationship, family really don't need to know. There is nothing really to come out about... to anyone, it is a kink, not an identity.
Also hitting on your friends, is a really bad idea for something like this. She does need to "Ova up" and tell the boyfriend, as she knows.
This requires internet, she has very specific requirements, like getting to know each other first etc, but the internet is a very big place. It doesn't seem like it would be pleasant for the other person, due to the fact that she is a big bag of crazy, and seems to have very little interest in the other persons pleasure, unless the other women has a clit up her ass. As long as she is upfront about what she wants I don't see a problem. There are lot of people who want a lot worse.
I agree the terminology was confusing, but I guess what she means is that she is queer because she finds (some) women attractive, wants to sleep with them and fuck them in the arse. Maybe the word queer is a bit strong, but who cares?
I think her problem, and why everyone hates her, is she is completely over the top about it. Firstly, why would her family need to know? Like any kink, that will never become a relationship, family really don't need to know. There is nothing really to come out about... to anyone, it is a kink, not an identity.
Also hitting on your friends, is a really bad idea for something like this. She does need to "Ova up" and tell the boyfriend, as she knows.
This requires internet, she has very specific requirements, like getting to know each other first etc, but the internet is a very big place. It doesn't seem like it would be pleasant for the other person, due to the fact that she is a big bag of crazy, and seems to have very little interest in the other persons pleasure, unless the other women has a clit up her ass. As long as she is upfront about what she wants I don't see a problem. There are lot of people who want a lot worse.
114
She is a women who wants to fuck women. I don't see how it is a threat that she wants to identify as queer. "Truly Lesbian" women don't want to fuck women they aren't attracted to either.
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