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News & ArtsFriday, July 30, 2010
Hetero Every Child Deserves a Mother and a Father
Posted by Dan Savage on Fri, Jul 30, 2010 at 12:18 PM
I'm generally opposed to forced sterilizations... but I'm willing to make an exception in this case.
1
If that father is 6', he is NOT 180 lb.
Anyway, the fact that she has shown no remorse means that the child will be (and currently IS) in danger. She needs to be in an institution.
Anyway, the fact that she has shown no remorse means that the child will be (and currently IS) in danger. She needs to be in an institution.
2
Yes something should be done about all those homeless people - going crazy and not eating - how dare they!! - OMG is this Fox news??? the same thing with the post above this one. Lets us condem those in a lower economic class without even any compassion...
3
Babies are supposed to be fat, you fucking lunatic! Seriously, why is this woman not in a mental health facility? Her mental illness is making her a danger to others, in this case her children.
6
So, show of hands for everyone who wants to pay taxes to increase funding for mental health services in the State of WA, despite our humongous budget deficit?
See, that's the problem: everybody wants SOMETHING DONE ABOUT THIS RIGHT NOW, but not very many seem to want to actually pay to get it done. Or do you think homeless crazy people walk around with buckets of money to pay for these things on their own?
And I just LOVE the responses from all the right-wing fundie types in the Times comments section. A judge follows the law exactly as it's written and they go all bat-shite crazy because he didn't take it upon himself to hand down a ruling that would have effectively exceeded his authority.
I guess it's only "judicial activism" when the judge makes a ruling they don't like, otherwise, it's perfectly okay.
See, that's the problem: everybody wants SOMETHING DONE ABOUT THIS RIGHT NOW, but not very many seem to want to actually pay to get it done. Or do you think homeless crazy people walk around with buckets of money to pay for these things on their own?
And I just LOVE the responses from all the right-wing fundie types in the Times comments section. A judge follows the law exactly as it's written and they go all bat-shite crazy because he didn't take it upon himself to hand down a ruling that would have effectively exceeded his authority.
I guess it's only "judicial activism" when the judge makes a ruling they don't like, otherwise, it's perfectly okay.
7
Aren't you supposed to be vacationing on a beach right now, Dan? Three posts in a row does not a vacation make.
8
Funny, that. I'm very much in favour of random sterilising 95% of the world's population. Preferably at birth, but I doubt it's possible for boys until their testicles have descended.
And tubal ligation is too big a surgical procedure to do for girls, so we really need an effective alternative there.
And tubal ligation is too big a surgical procedure to do for girls, so we really need an effective alternative there.
9
# 3 & #5 - Sorry the sarcasm when over your head or heads....Sometimes I forget....Yes she should be in a mental institution but if your state is anything like most states since Reagan that compassion is not longer with this country - see #6 response - we cannot afford that we are at WAR! We had a surplus with Clinton but well...if you have been awake you know what happened.
11
Hey Dan...could you please not link to the Blethen fishwrap, or at least warn us when you do? Some of us boycott the web site too. Thanks.
12
@1. Why isn't he 180? I was a skinny 6'5 in college and weighed 200. I ate constantly and never put on weight either. Now I'm bigger and still only about 230.
13
Holy fucking fuck. People should not try to raise kids unless they at least have a hut to take care of them in. What kind of person tries to care for a newborn on the street?
@1: Nah, I'm 6'3" and about 200. And I could stand to lose a few (read: 5 or 10) pounds.
@1: Nah, I'm 6'3" and about 200. And I could stand to lose a few (read: 5 or 10) pounds.
15
It's a miracle she got pregnant... at 5'5'' and 90 lbs, she should have stopped ovulating. Anorexics usually stop having the normal reproductive cycles for just this reason - they are not healthy enough to provide for their children. Evolution saw this comin'
16
@ 2 - This couple has become homeless in the aftermath of losing their first two children to protective services. They were NOT homeless when they were starving their babies - they are homeless NOW. "Economic class" has absolutely nothing to do with this story -- you can shove your little straw man argument right up your indignant ass. Maybe try KNOWING the facts about a story before you leap to withering condemnation, eh what?
FWIW, I think that, at the very least, if CPS is not checking on that newborn twice a week for the first year of its life, and once a week for the next six years, then CPS is not doing its job. There are obviously substantial mental health issues with both parents, and they have MORE than proven that they are unfit to parent children.
FWIW, I think that, at the very least, if CPS is not checking on that newborn twice a week for the first year of its life, and once a week for the next six years, then CPS is not doing its job. There are obviously substantial mental health issues with both parents, and they have MORE than proven that they are unfit to parent children.
17
This sounds a lot like postpartum depression gone HAYWIRE. This woman needs help now and if I lived in Washington, I would happily pay the taxes for it!
18
This is a reminder that eugenics was a good idea, but practiced with the wrong standards. If someone is this fucking insane, yes, they should be sterilized, not only because of the neglect and abuse that will be inflicted on the child, but also because of the odds favoring this child growing up to be bat shit insane him/her self!
Oh, you come from 5 generations of street drunks, and now you are a street drunk? No babies for you! Oh, your mentally retarded and will require the care of others for the rest of your life! No, you should not be allowed to pass on your DNA!
Oh, you come from 5 generations of street drunks, and now you are a street drunk? No babies for you! Oh, your mentally retarded and will require the care of others for the rest of your life! No, you should not be allowed to pass on your DNA!
19
@Bojac6 and @venomlash
I'm guessing that neither of you saw the picture of him. I'm 6'1 myself and have weighed everywhere from 170 to 210 at this height. It's possible to weigh 180 at 6', yes, but THAT guy (judging from the picture) does not. He's maybe... 205 lbs? Anyway, it's irrelevant except to note that the dead baby's starvation had nothing to do with the parents' ability to eat (obviously, gijo... :)...)
I'm guessing that neither of you saw the picture of him. I'm 6'1 myself and have weighed everywhere from 170 to 210 at this height. It's possible to weigh 180 at 6', yes, but THAT guy (judging from the picture) does not. He's maybe... 205 lbs? Anyway, it's irrelevant except to note that the dead baby's starvation had nothing to do with the parents' ability to eat (obviously, gijo... :)...)
21
@ 18
My parents are both mentally ill, and my mother was a drug addict. She did abuse me and endanger my life when I lived with her. At the age of 14 I was taken in by and aunt and uncle until I graduated high school, after that I was one my own.
Guess what? I'm not a junkie, I'm a successful college student, and plan to apply to law school in the fall after I retake my LSATs (I got a 160, but I'm sure I could get a 170 if I studied a bit more).
Given that both my parents are clinically insane, there was probably a chance I wouldn't turn out right. More of a chance given my mother did meth while pregnant and while nursing me. However, I'm doing all right.
Yes, someone who can't care for children has no business having them, but eugenics isn't the answer. Because even kids from messed up backgrounds can turn out to be pretty worthwhile people. Protect kids, get kids in bad situations out of those situations, and maybe sterilization would be a fitting injunction against people who continue to have children they abuse and neglect. But just because parents are messed up doesn't mean the children automatically will be messed up. So let's not call for sterilizing anyone you see unfit, because hey there are plenty of messed up people born to perfectly nice families.
My parents are both mentally ill, and my mother was a drug addict. She did abuse me and endanger my life when I lived with her. At the age of 14 I was taken in by and aunt and uncle until I graduated high school, after that I was one my own.
Guess what? I'm not a junkie, I'm a successful college student, and plan to apply to law school in the fall after I retake my LSATs (I got a 160, but I'm sure I could get a 170 if I studied a bit more).
Given that both my parents are clinically insane, there was probably a chance I wouldn't turn out right. More of a chance given my mother did meth while pregnant and while nursing me. However, I'm doing all right.
Yes, someone who can't care for children has no business having them, but eugenics isn't the answer. Because even kids from messed up backgrounds can turn out to be pretty worthwhile people. Protect kids, get kids in bad situations out of those situations, and maybe sterilization would be a fitting injunction against people who continue to have children they abuse and neglect. But just because parents are messed up doesn't mean the children automatically will be messed up. So let's not call for sterilizing anyone you see unfit, because hey there are plenty of messed up people born to perfectly nice families.
22
If I read one more comment about how eugenics is a good idea for mentally ill people, I might become homicidal. Just saying.
Plenty of people grow up in toxic environments and DON'T end up a bane to society. Plenty of drug and drink addicts and mentally ill people turn their lives around after having children.
The answer to a problem is NEVER "do this is all cases". And forcibly sterilising women is as anti-choice as banning abortion, really. Yuck.
Plenty of people grow up in toxic environments and DON'T end up a bane to society. Plenty of drug and drink addicts and mentally ill people turn their lives around after having children.
The answer to a problem is NEVER "do this is all cases". And forcibly sterilising women is as anti-choice as banning abortion, really. Yuck.
24
I'm for everyone being sterilized, and then if you want to have kids you have the procedure reversed. It would ensure that every child born is at least wanted by the woman in whose womb it resides.
27
It's a tough case. The woman is mentally ill, and she needs some kind of treatment. She'll probably wind up in jail - America's most popular mental health treatment facility.
It looks like there are already a lot of eyes on this couple, so the kid will eventually be okay.
It looks like there are already a lot of eyes on this couple, so the kid will eventually be okay.
29
@28 - if you're a dude, six weeks without an orgasm is tough, I'm sure. Depends on the individual, and their level of self-control. Takes some self-control to be a good parent.
My husband had one reversed 20 yrs ago, and fathered two kids after. And that was with 20 yrs ago technology.
My husband had one reversed 20 yrs ago, and fathered two kids after. And that was with 20 yrs ago technology.
31
What should be done is to have the family carefully supervised by child care services of the state and to attend a psychologist who can work through with her thinking. There's no doubt that there's some internal problem in her mind with obesity and with her husband that led her to do make the grave error she did. But to leap from what must be appropriately done with her case to "forced sterilizations" is an exercise in poor thinking that could only be proposed by those that are, shall we say 'exhuberant' and superficial in their behavior, characteristics often found in the lifestyle that the author claims to speak on behalf in this blog.
Maybe just as Labberton is projecting in a destructive manner her own insecurities unto her children, the author of this post who proposes the draconian measure of 'forced sterilizations' is also projecting 'his' own sad reality unto those who 'he' blindly sees as 'his' oppressors, opting to place the blame on the majority for the actions 'he' has chosen for 'his' life. Coming from such a source, any criticism, especially one that proposes even if it is tongue-in-cheek, the interruption of pregnancy, must be taken as the mere opinion from someone bitter, perhaps even jealous and who is on the fringes of society in being ideologically opposed to those who can bring human life to this world.
Maybe just as Labberton is projecting in a destructive manner her own insecurities unto her children, the author of this post who proposes the draconian measure of 'forced sterilizations' is also projecting 'his' own sad reality unto those who 'he' blindly sees as 'his' oppressors, opting to place the blame on the majority for the actions 'he' has chosen for 'his' life. Coming from such a source, any criticism, especially one that proposes even if it is tongue-in-cheek, the interruption of pregnancy, must be taken as the mere opinion from someone bitter, perhaps even jealous and who is on the fringes of society in being ideologically opposed to those who can bring human life to this world.
32
@29/30 Congratulations to your husband. Mine didn't reverse so well. Frankly, recommending surgery as a form of reversible birth control is pretty stupid. And as to your comments on self control and being a good parent: get fucked. I am an excellent parent to my children, and self control did nothing to make my reversal work.
33
@31: TL;DR
Also, don't quit your day job to become a psychiatrist. I've read better psychoanalysis in advertising flyers.
Also, don't quit your day job to become a psychiatrist. I've read better psychoanalysis in advertising flyers.
35
"shall we say 'exuberant' and superficial in their behavior, characteristics often found in the lifestyle that the author claims to speak on behalf in this blog. "
i love how you make the jump from poly-amorous and gay to forced sterilizations. That's pretty impressive there.
i love how you make the jump from poly-amorous and gay to forced sterilizations. That's pretty impressive there.
37
If ever there was a case for declaring someone "criminally insane", this is it. She doesn't need sterilisation; she needs hospitalisation. Her several criminal acts should surely be enough for the State to forcibly institutionalise her. Further, her husband is probably also pathological, and he is certainly an enabler.
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