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News & ArtsTuesday, June 15, 2010
??!! The Art of Indian Mumbo Jumbo
Posted by Charles Mudede on Tue, Jun 15, 2010 at 3:14 PM
After 15 days of investigation, India’s Defense Institute of Physiology and Allied Sciences concluded its study of 82-year-old yogi Prahlad Jani on Thursday, May 6.Yes, it's all trick. We will not even argue about that. But why have so many people so easily fallen for what is so clearly a trick, a joke, a bit of spiritual nonsense? That is the question that needs an answer.Jani, who claims to have lived without food or water since his childhood, was under the close watch of three video cameras 24 hours a day. Researchers conducted various medical tests on him. The research team, consisting of 35 scientists, could not find any evidence that Jani ate or drank anything during the 15 days.
...Dr. G. Ilavazhagn according to the Daily Mail. “What is truly astonishing, and something we have no explanation for, is that he has not passed stools or urine. To my knowledge, that is medically unprecedented.”
1
The great James Randi has said that scientists are easily fooled because they are not used to being fooled. They don't look for tricks. These scientists need to get a magician on the team in order to figure out how he's doing it.
2
Why?
Because they can't imagine the lengths that people will go to in order to delude other people.
And LJM is right.
Because they can't imagine the lengths that people will go to in order to delude other people.
And LJM is right.
3
i firmly believe that food is an addictive drug. we don't need it: it's just that no one has ever survived the withdrawls.
5
People believe in God and miracles because they are frightened out of their minds by the concept of death.
By the way, there's a Virgin Mary on my tortilla. Wanna see it?
By the way, there's a Virgin Mary on my tortilla. Wanna see it?
6
And despite wearing a floor-length robe with flowing, oversized sleeves draped around his cane, scientists were baffled by his ability to levitate, the report continues.
And who would want to put this to closer scientific evaluation? Nobody wants a dead yogi on their hands.
And who would want to put this to closer scientific evaluation? Nobody wants a dead yogi on their hands.
7
It seems the investigators here have run afoul of their need to physically document their assertions. If they could just circumvent that impulse, rest assured science would carry the day.
8
@6 - last time we had that, the guy woke up after three days and they started a religion around it.
9
Declaring oneself a scientist does not automatically make what one does science.
"[Doctors] think that yoga exercises may have caused Jani’s body to undergo a biological transformation."
I'd like to know where these guys got their doctorates, 'cause it can't be all that grueling a program.
"[Doctors] think that yoga exercises may have caused Jani’s body to undergo a biological transformation."
I'd like to know where these guys got their doctorates, 'cause it can't be all that grueling a program.
10
is it so hard to believe?
Maybe it is possible- possible until proven otherwise perhaps. I would say now's the time to rekindle some of that childhood awe and hope that impossible things can happen- and they change our perception of what is impossible and what is within our power.
Maybe it is possible- possible until proven otherwise perhaps. I would say now's the time to rekindle some of that childhood awe and hope that impossible things can happen- and they change our perception of what is impossible and what is within our power.
11
@10 - Yes, it is so hard to believe. If these results can be reproduced under properly controlled laboratory conditions, it may become easier to believe. In the meantime, I'm fully willing to call this bullshit.
There is a difference between a magician who takes your money to entertain you with tricks and a fraud who tricks you to take your money.
There is a difference between a magician who takes your money to entertain you with tricks and a fraud who tricks you to take your money.
12
@5 You are correct. Death and defying death are human obsessions. But if you think about it long enough, yoou come to realise there is nothing wrong with a permenant end to your existense. It makes perfect sense.
14
@12 technically, every day part of you becomes something else and part of something else becomes part of you - air, water, food, excrement, etc
15
Everyone here is operating under the assumption that 1) everything in the universe can be knowable by our present form of consciousness, 2) that all phenomenon can be reproduced (& measured) under laboratory conditions and 3) the observer is always separate and discreet from the observation. The final two assumptions are not true, and have been proven to not be true. #1 is more complex, and all too often is reduced to tautologies.
I am not going to pass judgment on this phenomenon until I have more information. Until then, it is both true and false.
I am not going to pass judgment on this phenomenon until I have more information. Until then, it is both true and false.
16
While a VISTA volunteer attorney in Hawaii in 1978 I had a client who claimed to be a "breatharian" who lived on nothing but sunlight and whatever he could breath in (he would sit in papaya fields taking deep breaths). He wanted my advice on how to keep from being committed. He looked like a walking skeleton - I found out it was common for breatharians to become disoriented, wander into traffic and get killed. Oh well, I kept him out of the nut house anyway. Here is a link to a Wiki article on these guys, and Jani is mentioned:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breatharian
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breatharian
17
What is religion but a way to give us comfort...answers to questions we haven't any answers for yet?
Why are we here? What happens after you die? Why does the sun rise each day?
...and what is science but a way for us to find the answers for ourselves, without having to resort to magic, fables and lies (or simply accepting our naive and ignorant childhood awe)?
We've managed to accumulate a lot of answers...and we're looking for the answers to every question we can think of... We may never know all of the answers, but we're not so afraid of the questions any more.
The thing is...you can refute the tenets of religion with science--not that those who believe will listen or change their minds. BUT, you can't really refute the tenets of science with religion... Science will learn, adapt and better explain with every discovery.
To borrow a phrase from the smart Beatle, there is nothing you can know that can't be known. Either this is an elaborate hoax or science will learn something new about the human condition.
I am not so discomforted by not yet knowing which...sorry, religion.
Why are we here? What happens after you die? Why does the sun rise each day?
...and what is science but a way for us to find the answers for ourselves, without having to resort to magic, fables and lies (or simply accepting our naive and ignorant childhood awe)?
We've managed to accumulate a lot of answers...and we're looking for the answers to every question we can think of... We may never know all of the answers, but we're not so afraid of the questions any more.
The thing is...you can refute the tenets of religion with science--not that those who believe will listen or change their minds. BUT, you can't really refute the tenets of science with religion... Science will learn, adapt and better explain with every discovery.
To borrow a phrase from the smart Beatle, there is nothing you can know that can't be known. Either this is an elaborate hoax or science will learn something new about the human condition.
I am not so discomforted by not yet knowing which...sorry, religion.
19
@18 - I don't know. I haven't observed him under controlled laboratory conditions. I haven't observed him under any conditions, come to think of it. All I can say is that the claim is very suspicious, given what we do know about human physiology. As our (vast but admittedly incomplete) understanding of our bodies is currently, this isolated incident is quite likely some kind of trick. If he is faking it, he wouldn't be the first person to fool a scientist. If he's not faking it, we have some modifications to make to our understanding of human physiology.
No one's claiming to be all-knowing here. We're just unwilling to accept at face value a claim that goes against established scientific understanding, especially when said understanding is a vast body of biological, chemical, physical data that can be reliably reproduced in a laboratory setting.
No one's claiming to be all-knowing here. We're just unwilling to accept at face value a claim that goes against established scientific understanding, especially when said understanding is a vast body of biological, chemical, physical data that can be reliably reproduced in a laboratory setting.
20
@18 - If I had to guess, the most obvious answer is pretty gross. I'd say he is 'recycling' his waste products.
21
@16 - interesting, thanks for that link.
The article goes on the mention Jani was allowed to visit followers and gargle and bath unsupervised, among other accusations.
Anyways, I suppose that wasn't really Charles' question, but there's too much I didn't know surrounding this story to stay on track here. Read the descriptions of DIPAS, it sounds like a cross between Area 51 and a North Face jacket testing facility.
The article goes on the mention Jani was allowed to visit followers and gargle and bath unsupervised, among other accusations.
Anyways, I suppose that wasn't really Charles' question, but there's too much I didn't know surrounding this story to stay on track here. Read the descriptions of DIPAS, it sounds like a cross between Area 51 and a North Face jacket testing facility.
28
Dudes. You'll never belieber this but I've been without food, water, sunlight or sex for weeks on end.
World of Warcraft makes crack look like Sanka.
World of Warcraft makes crack look like Sanka.
29
Ooh! I was gonna nominate @24 for the win, but @26 nips 'em at the tape!
All the additional snark you may require:
http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/2010/…
All the additional snark you may require:
http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/2010/…
30
Guys, you'll never belieber this, but I've never played World of Warcraft.
That being said, I haven't stopped eating (chewing/digesting at all times, even during sleep) since my childhood and now I have the spastic colon of an 82 year old.
That being said, I haven't stopped eating (chewing/digesting at all times, even during sleep) since my childhood and now I have the spastic colon of an 82 year old.
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