Slog
News & ArtsTuesday, May 25, 2010
Chow Bill the Butcher Responds, Sort Of
Posted by Bethany Jean Clement on Tue, May 25, 2010 at 1:38 PM
Two weeks ago in The Stranger, Matthew Richter examined the claims of new Pacific Northwest butcher chain Bill the Butcher and found them spurious. Here's some of article:
William Von Schneidau vouches for the quality of Bill the Butcher's meat. According to the signage above Bill the Butcher's meat cases, the beef, pork, lamb, veal, goat, chicken, fish, and game are all "certified organic and natural."But there's one thing Von Schneidau and Owens won't share, and that's the names of the putatively organic ranches that supply the shops. "But if we get to know [the ranchers] and we actually know them—we actually know them by their first names, we talk to them every day—that's good enough for us," says Owens. "We have the relationships, and that's good enough to have source verification that we trust."
Von Schneidau says that the names of the farms aren't important to his clients: "We don't want to confuse the consumer getting into too many 'this farm, that farm' things." Within the next six months, he says, the Bill the Butcher supply chain will be solidified, and then they'll consider revealing sources to their customers. Meanwhile: "If I did a blind test with you, and we served a top sirloin from five different farms... nobody will notice the difference anyway."
We've seen in comments on the story that the names of the farms are important to Bill the Butcher's (potential) clients. The Stranger hasn't heard from the company in response to the story. However, an "open letter" showed up last week on the Bill the Butcher website, reading in part:
In our marketing, in our signage, on our web site, and in our brochure we have never represented our meat as being “100 percent certified organic.” Instead, we have said “organic and natural, grass fed and local” to best represent our total mix of meaty offerings.
Transparency is of the ultimate importance to us and we are creating a system that allows us to track our meat from the farm to our cases. You will be able to learn not only where our meat comes from and who raises it, but also what the animal ate, how it was harvested and the interesting nuances that nobody has ever attempted to reveal, such as the specific breed/bloodline of the animal. We’ll provide you with information allowing you to pinpoint your ultimate preferences in the quest for your perfect steak...
We will start showcasing our ranchers and farmers, those who agree to be featured, next week. As you may already know our meat and poultry comes from Snohomish County, King County, Anacortes, Lopez Island, Spanaway, Duvall, Arlington and Mt. Vernon in Washington, and from Wyoming, Idaho and Montana...
Our business is just getting started, and we have had some growing pains that are being addressed with an internal training program to ensure accuracy at every level in the shops. But our mission is crystal clear: to bring the butcher shop back to the neighborhood, with clean, environmentally healthy meats brought to you directly from local farmers and ranchers.
It looks like Bill the Butcher has learned something here, going from "We don't want to confuse the consumer getting into too many 'this farm, that farm' things" at the time of Richter's interview to "You will be able to learn not only where our meat comes from and who raises it, but also what the animal ate, how it was harvested and the interesting nuances that nobody has ever attempted to reveal." Sounds great.
We stand by Richter's reporting. When he shopped at both the Woodinville and the Madison Valley branches of Bill the Butcher, everything was being sold as certified organic, according to the very butchers on the other side of the counter. The "internal training program" is a great idea. It would've been an even better one prior to opening four shops in nine months and misrepresenting products to customers.
It's "next week" now, so yesterday, The Stranger visited the Madison Valley branch of Bill the Butcher. Of approximately 58 cuts of meat, only one was labeled as organic, the pork short ribs. Nothing was labeled with the ranch it came from. We bought some prime rib and asked where it was from. The butcher was skillfully evasive, moving on to the next customer without answering the question.
Where's the "showcasing our ranchers and farmers"? Hint: They don't have to "agree to be featured," not unless you're buying meat under conditions of anonymity. And conditions of anonymity with meat—well, that would just be weird.
As for "in our signage... we have never represented our meat as being '100 percent certified organic,'” here's a photo of the sign at the Madison Valley Bill the Butcher taken on May 4, the same signage as at the Laurelhurst and Redmond branches:
2
I'm sitting in Chipotle at Kent Station eating a shredded beef burrito.
Bad synthesizer bands are playing.
The tables are all aluminum and wood.
Mexi-girls man the line and seem agitated and are pushing a lot of carts around the soda machine.
This is my life today.
Bad synthesizer bands are playing.
The tables are all aluminum and wood.
Mexi-girls man the line and seem agitated and are pushing a lot of carts around the soda machine.
This is my life today.
4
That photo doesn't disprove Bill the Butcher's defense. The sign doesn't say "100%" anywhere. It represents the product as possibly being organic, but not which product. I'd say they covered their asses by not being overly specific.
5
I'd say they shouldnt have brought attention at all to it unless it WAS 100 percent. why bother if its not? i'd rather eat somewhere completely honest upfront and grumpily anti-organic and old school than a place that drops a few key phrases like "sustainable" in order to gain some customers.
7
I think the problem is that they were purposely trying to be vague. I mean you go to QFC and buy beef and the package says organic and you know it is organic. No questions. If I went to a place that had organic as one of their selling points, I wouldn't want to be confused. I would want to know what was organic or not. They should have been honest from day one, especially, if they want to tell you your chicken's whole life story in the future. Seems like a little organic sign would be clear and simple.
I am glad that the stranger called them out. Who else has time to figure it out. But is Bill the Butcher going to be better than random meet at Trader Joes, probably.
When I say that I am Asian, I don't need to put 100% percent before it to prove it. They were trying to get away with something. 100% is just a cop out.
I am glad that the stranger called them out. Who else has time to figure it out. But is Bill the Butcher going to be better than random meet at Trader Joes, probably.
When I say that I am Asian, I don't need to put 100% percent before it to prove it. They were trying to get away with something. 100% is just a cop out.
8
This is a brilliant business plan. I'm going to open a pharmacy and hang a sign that says "FDA approved" over the medicine shelves. Of course, most of the "medicines" will merely be capsules filled with melamine powder. But my ass will be covered, because I never promised the customers that any specific medicine was FDA approved. As Lloyd Blankfein would probably say, caveat emptor!
It represents the product as possibly being organic, but not which product. I'd say they covered their asses by not being overly specific.
This is a brilliant business plan. I'm going to open a pharmacy and hang a sign that says "FDA approved" over the medicine shelves. Of course, most of the "medicines" will merely be capsules filled with melamine powder. But my ass will be covered, because I never promised the customers that any specific medicine was FDA approved. As Lloyd Blankfein would probably say, caveat emptor!
9
It doesn't disprove Bill the Butcher's defense if you're a wienie lawyer. If you're just a regular person who wants to buy some meat without having to worry about being mislead, then it looks pretty bad. Maybe not exactly lying, but close enough. If you're going to represent yourself as being a fancy place that cares about where the meat comes from, then scrupulous honesty is really your best policy, not weaselly vagueness.
10
Higher profit margins through semantic pedantry. Thank Greenspan for the Oxford comma!
Seriously, this kind of letter-of-the-law, "That's only what you THOUGHT we said" technically-not-lying is just intolerable. Fuck these weaselly shitheads.
Seriously, this kind of letter-of-the-law, "That's only what you THOUGHT we said" technically-not-lying is just intolerable. Fuck these weaselly shitheads.
12
The terms Organic, Natural, and Sustainable aren't defined by the FDA to mean anything. "Certified Organic" means certified organic by FDA rules/laws. The rest are advertising terms.
I'm curious what the FDA process is for validating that food labeled as "Certified Organic". Are there "certified organic" inspectors? They could all be lying.
@8, go ahead and open that pharmacy. Nutritional supplements and vitamins aren't considered "food", so the FDA doesn't actually require that they contain what the packages say they contain. Your ass is already covered. Fill capsules with dirt and rake in the $$$.
Buy beef directly from a local farm if you care what you're getting and who is getting your money.
I'm curious what the FDA process is for validating that food labeled as "Certified Organic". Are there "certified organic" inspectors? They could all be lying.
@8, go ahead and open that pharmacy. Nutritional supplements and vitamins aren't considered "food", so the FDA doesn't actually require that they contain what the packages say they contain. Your ass is already covered. Fill capsules with dirt and rake in the $$$.
Buy beef directly from a local farm if you care what you're getting and who is getting your money.
13
“Organic and natural, grass fed and local” to me, means all four of those at once. At worst, either both of the first two or both of the second two. Perhaps what was meant was "Organic or natural or grass-fed or local."
14
Balderdash-Right on! BTB is trying to take advantage of its customers with this kind of behavior. I fell for it one time, before the Stranger's excellent article. But even that one time, I was confused by a response I got about a product. A response from the man himself at the Wville store. Now I know it wasn't me, it was him. And I think it was him being deliberately obscure. Well, my $$ will be going elsewhere. I hope the organic and/or small sustainable focused farms in this state shun this bastard. And, Stranger reporter, is there some fraud going on here? I mean letter-of-the-law fraud? That can be investigated by, I don't know, the AG's office?
15
@4 I would prefer not having to parse the language of the claims made by my butcher. Once you get to the point of "well we didn't say 100%" you've lost me as a customer.
I went in to the Madison Park store about a week before the story broke and got some tasty New Yorks. Since then I have been waiting for them to improve and they haven't. I am not even all that concerned about whether it is organic or not, but I sure as hell don't like to be tricked.
So go fuck yourself Bill.
I went in to the Madison Park store about a week before the story broke and got some tasty New Yorks. Since then I have been waiting for them to improve and they haven't. I am not even all that concerned about whether it is organic or not, but I sure as hell don't like to be tricked.
So go fuck yourself Bill.
16
It's like Twelve Baskets Catering, who claims to buy locally grown and harvested (hello Sysco and FSA?) and mill their own organic flour (for their FSA-made desserts?) - all lies, trying to make a buck by fooling consumers. Funny that the churchy people who run the place have no qualms about lying to their customers.
17
See rowefarms.ca or freshfromthefarm.ca for how this should be done. Neither uses the term "organic" but both have a list of minimum standards their suppliers need to adhere to in order to be sold there, and both have maps with names/locations of farms at their physical stores.
18
#4, if you don't say WHICH is certified organic, you're kind of implicitly saying that it's ALL certified organic, no?
Nice follow up to their response. It's really pointless to showcase sources if they aren't going to showcase ALL of them or at least tell you which meat comes from the sources that they showcased.
Nice follow up to their response. It's really pointless to showcase sources if they aren't going to showcase ALL of them or at least tell you which meat comes from the sources that they showcased.
19
I think this level of sniping is unnecessary. It's clear what they want to do and be, it's clear they're working towards that, and all you're doing is giving them shit while they try to get there. This is classic leftist behavior: scream and rant at our closest allies instead of our actual enemies. I'll happily shop at Bill the Butcher.
20
@19: "I think this level of sniping is unnecessary. It's clear what they want to do and be"
Yes, they want to market their products as appealing to specific virtues without actually being responsible for providing those virtues through the process of paying for them.
But they've apparently figured out that's a bad idea.
Honestly, JST, the Stranger is trying to hold a local business that alleges a particular worldview to the standards that the business is promulgating. Seems like a consumer reporting service to me.
Yes, they want to market their products as appealing to specific virtues without actually being responsible for providing those virtues through the process of paying for them.
But they've apparently figured out that's a bad idea.
Honestly, JST, the Stranger is trying to hold a local business that alleges a particular worldview to the standards that the business is promulgating. Seems like a consumer reporting service to me.
21
#19, "It's clear what they want to do and be, it's clear they're working towards that"
Yeah, and their "ground beef shoulder" is actually 50% anus. But it's ok, because they *want* it to be 100% beef shoulder, and they're working towards it.
Yeah, and their "ground beef shoulder" is actually 50% anus. But it's ok, because they *want* it to be 100% beef shoulder, and they're working towards it.
22
Typical leftists, demanding actual transparency and accountability instead of just a vague desire for those things.
25
Buffoony Jean, you're eating dead animals. As in slaughtered, dead, rotting flesh. The fact that you're pitching a hissy fit over the "organic" state of this dead flesh is really fucking hilarious. Keep it up, girl. It's good comedy.
26
I shopped at the Madison Valley location of Bill the Butcher shortly after they opened and was told all the beef was organic and grass fed, though the butcher did acknowledge that it was not necessarily grass finished. With that, however, I was assured that none of the animals were fed meat corn, but rather organic mixed grains.
I appreciate the concept but there is no excuse for deceiving your customers with outright lies. What kind of "system" do you need to "track" local meat? It's all bullshit to me, and I'm not going back.
I appreciate the concept but there is no excuse for deceiving your customers with outright lies. What kind of "system" do you need to "track" local meat? It's all bullshit to me, and I'm not going back.
27
"I think this level of sniping is unnecessary. It's clear what they want to do and be, it's clear they're working towards that, and all you're doing is giving them shit while they try to get there. This is classic leftist behavior: scream and rant at our closest allies instead of our actual enemies. I'll happily shop at Bill the Butcher."
You are quite possibly insane, or at the very least a shill.
You are quite possibly insane, or at the very least a shill.
28
What a scam, has anybody turned this guy into the Washington State Organic Program for labelling fraud?
"The WSDA Organic Food Program's mission is to protect consumers and support the development of the organic industry by ensuring the integrity of organic products."
For more information, e-mail us or call (360) 902-1805.
organic@agr.wa.gov
Martin Beagle Organic Program Manager 360-902-1924
Brenda Book Organic Certification Manager 360-902-2090
"The WSDA Organic Food Program's mission is to protect consumers and support the development of the organic industry by ensuring the integrity of organic products."
For more information, e-mail us or call (360) 902-1805.
organic@agr.wa.gov
Martin Beagle Organic Program Manager 360-902-1924
Brenda Book Organic Certification Manager 360-902-2090
29
The solution is simple: Shop at places that DO identify where their product is from. There are alternatives to BTB. Rain Shadow Meats, for one.
30
There's always Organic To Go whose bread products come from Franz.
Franz makes great products with no high fructose corn syrup but they don't make anything ORGANIC.
Get over it people, 95% of places that claim to be organic are pulling the same punches. Oh, that and there is little scientific evidence that eating organic is any healthier.
Franz makes great products with no high fructose corn syrup but they don't make anything ORGANIC.
Get over it people, 95% of places that claim to be organic are pulling the same punches. Oh, that and there is little scientific evidence that eating organic is any healthier.
31
I am disgusted by Bill the Butcher's shameless deceit and trickery. We should have seen it coming when a chain of 3 to 5 stores opened up in a short time frame, and yet its name suggests some guy in overalls who's just your friendly neighborhood butcher. Right.
I will never step foot in that store again, and will personally see to it that everyone I know hears about their false claims and back-peddling.
I will never step foot in that store again, and will personally see to it that everyone I know hears about their false claims and back-peddling.
32
Last I heard, calling something organic, when it is not, is illegal. Even if you don't add the words certified - did something change with the federal law??
33
I think The Stranger's writers/editors would be more effective at getting to the truth with a well-rounded report if they also investigated what the terms "Organic" and "Natural" mean & whether it's possible that Bill The Butcher is doing the right thing or not. No argument that their employees should be better trained about what to call certified organic. From my reading of Michael Pollan and Joel Salatin's books, I learned that the backers of "Certified Organic" aren't necessarily looking out for what's truly best for consumers but more for a way to distinguish their products with a label that allows them to charge more. I think you'll find that the very best meat, poultry, eggs and vegetables you can buy aren't going to be labeled "Certified Organic". But you will find that *most* certified organic stuff out there comes from the industrial organic world which has manipulated the rules for their benefit.
34
Good Job Stranger writers! Way to show how a butcher fails to use a comma. Whats next an article about how, despite Everyday Music's signs you failed to find one band that performs Rock Pop Soul Jazz Techno Rap Classical Metal Folk Country?
35
Bill,
If transparency is of such high regard, why was it when the state told you that you were violating smoked meat processing restrictions, your comment to me was that "we'll just do it on the week-ends when there are no inspectors out working"? I have had so many problems with the Woodinville store. Yes, most of them "growing pain" related. But I'm over it. The quality of product HAS gone down since opening, and I have grown weary of paying for your mistakes and then not having quality stand up...
If transparency is of such high regard, why was it when the state told you that you were violating smoked meat processing restrictions, your comment to me was that "we'll just do it on the week-ends when there are no inspectors out working"? I have had so many problems with the Woodinville store. Yes, most of them "growing pain" related. But I'm over it. The quality of product HAS gone down since opening, and I have grown weary of paying for your mistakes and then not having quality stand up...
36
I was shocked when I read in the Bill the Butcher shop who some of the "local producers" are who meet their high standards. I personally know some of these producers and it is a big stretch to claim that any meat from these producers meets their own "Bill the Butcher Natural" meat specification. While it could be very true that most of the producers listed in book available at the local shops are legit (I know some that are) and meet the Bill the Butcher Natural specification it is very clear that not all the producers who are listed meet this.
Their is a very big difference in raising livestock in a sustainable model that provides care, compassion and a stress free life to a model in which livestock are raised in confinement or crowed areas who are sick, fed anything but fresh grass or a good quality forage, not checked up on regularly, have no clean place to lie down or any option of drinking fresh clean water, who have been brought into the area on a high stress trip for a short time in a overcrowded trailer driven from near by states where they have been purchased as culls at non local farms our even worse livestock auction houses.
We should ask Bill about his state of the art tracking system. Is it one that insures that while the animal is alive it is properly cared for? How can we be assured that the meat we are buying at his local shops is one that is raised in a stress free sustainable model.
Their is a very big difference in raising livestock in a sustainable model that provides care, compassion and a stress free life to a model in which livestock are raised in confinement or crowed areas who are sick, fed anything but fresh grass or a good quality forage, not checked up on regularly, have no clean place to lie down or any option of drinking fresh clean water, who have been brought into the area on a high stress trip for a short time in a overcrowded trailer driven from near by states where they have been purchased as culls at non local farms our even worse livestock auction houses.
We should ask Bill about his state of the art tracking system. Is it one that insures that while the animal is alive it is properly cared for? How can we be assured that the meat we are buying at his local shops is one that is raised in a stress free sustainable model.
37
What wholesale house are they really buying thier meat from ? maybe the same one QFC uses
Would be interesting if that farmer was a large or small wholesaler
Would be interesting if that farmer was a large or small wholesaler
38
Wish I had seen this article earlier. I ordered a Thanksgiving turkey from them earlier in November. For $60 (pre-paid) I was told it would be a locally produced bird from Carnation WA. I was even shown the brochure from the farm that was supposedly supplying it. I picked up the bird late last week, got it home and it's from Diestel Farms in CA. The Diestel brand is sold by Whole Foods for about $2.50 a pound so my $60 "local" turkey would have cost $30 at Whole Foods. I called Bill the Butcher (Madison location) and was told there was misinformation from their main office; they were surprised when they got the birds as well. Fine, but the right business thing to do would be to fess up to their customers at delivery and offer them a refund, not hand them a pre-bagged bird so they can find out when they get it home. What a scam!
Advertisement
Most Commented on Slog
-
It's Spring! Who's Ready for Street Harassment? by Cienna Madrid
-
New Gun Enthusiast... by Dan Savage
-
SL Letter of the Day: Gonna Boil My Laptop After Answering This One by Dan Savage
-
Bigot Florist Files Countersuit by Dominic Holden
-
America Doesn't Care About Black People by Charles Mudede
-
US Military Grants Itself the Power to Police American Streets and "Quell" "Civil Disturbances" by Brendan Kiley
-
SL Letter of the Day: Living Discomfortably by Dan Savage
-
Slog Super Poll: Who Should Be Mayor? by Dominic Holden
-
Black Market Elimination Fail: Draft Pot Rules Call for Ban on Hash and Hash Oil by Ben Livingston
-
Tim Burgess Quits the Mayor's Race by Dominic Holden
Stranger Personals
The Stranger
RSSSeattle Art & Performance Quarterly
A complete guide to Seattle's current art, film, dance, and theater season.
Facebook
Twitter
Comments (38) RSS