Slog
News & ArtsFriday, March 19, 2010
Religion Benediction
Posted by Dan Savage on Fri, Mar 19, 2010 at 9:52 AM
2
I just love how that bastard Ratzinger dresses the Irish bishops down for doing the same goddamned thing he did in Munich.
3
When you see it in perspective, it's really just another in a very long line of inhumanity to man. Raping children is just another outrage. And anyone willing to overlook all the other outrages commited by this church will just ignore this one as well. But I'm certainly happy I don't associate with such a vile institution. Just remember this every time one of the archbishops gives us a lecture on morality.
4
Bet you Hollywood libertines will beat them first with the likes of Polanski ....
wait, they already have :
http://bighollywood.breitbart.com/jjmnol…
wait, they already have :
http://bighollywood.breitbart.com/jjmnol…
9
Are you high, LC? SLOG is a SEATTLE blog, not a Hollywood blog. Try to find a SLOG POST defending Polanski if you're going to criticize them on these grounds.
10
@4: Why is your reaction to clerical child rape "but Polanski did it and I bet you support it!"
From what I've read on here, I think most Slog commenters--and most people in general, who aren't Whoopi Goldberg--support throwing Polanski's ass in jail. Even if he did make the claimed plea agreement, he fled the country.
Regardless, centuries of protecting pedophiles while trying to claim moral superiority is a pretty heinous crime. There's a reason that, back in medieval Europe, popes were painted in church murals as sinners in Hell, just like everyone else. The pope isn't really supposed to be morally infallible.
From what I've read on here, I think most Slog commenters--and most people in general, who aren't Whoopi Goldberg--support throwing Polanski's ass in jail. Even if he did make the claimed plea agreement, he fled the country.
Regardless, centuries of protecting pedophiles while trying to claim moral superiority is a pretty heinous crime. There's a reason that, back in medieval Europe, popes were painted in church murals as sinners in Hell, just like everyone else. The pope isn't really supposed to be morally infallible.
11
Polanski belongs to the church of the new age, secular, atheist and sexual libertine artists, meaning Hollywood.
That's enough to give him impunity and a safe lifetime stay in europe.
That's enough to give him impunity and a safe lifetime stay in europe.
13
If Pius XII were alive today, I'd think the Mulleavy sisters did his frock.
And I predict beatification of Benedict within 5 years of death. The more odious the offense, the more energetic the whitewash.
And I predict beatification of Benedict within 5 years of death. The more odious the offense, the more energetic the whitewash.
14
The 'fearless' leader belongs to and actively promotes the Hollywood culture to the extent that 'he' has coined up the revolting term "gold star pedophiles", so it is pertinent to this.
15
@ 4, 11
Ah Loves- er I mean Hateschild,
Your shifless, poisonous, feeblemindedness comes shining through with that post...
Priests had been molesting children long before Polanski. The reason he fled to Europe was because his crime was committed in the US.
Polanski hypocritically isn't preaching morality and condemnation to anyone. He broke the law and he should pay just like anyone else.
Regardless, it seems strange that a church saturated in chronic sex scandals should dictate the moral behavior for the rest of the world...
Ah Loves- er I mean Hateschild,
Your shifless, poisonous, feeblemindedness comes shining through with that post...
Priests had been molesting children long before Polanski. The reason he fled to Europe was because his crime was committed in the US.
Polanski hypocritically isn't preaching morality and condemnation to anyone. He broke the law and he should pay just like anyone else.
Regardless, it seems strange that a church saturated in chronic sex scandals should dictate the moral behavior for the rest of the world...
16
@ 14, No. Wrong. Complete and utter fail. There have been no opinions ever given by any of the SLOG writers that even remotely can be interpreted this way. Try to prove me wrong and find such a post, or apologize for once again bearing false witness. Your soul depends on it.
17
isn't the reverse true then, LC, by your logic?? If priests get away with it, and Popes get away with coverups etc, then Polanski should be given a pass too?
18
LC, it is quite obvious you don't care two cents about children. I would guess that if given the choice between protecting a child from harm or damaging the reputation of a christian church, you wouldn't hesitate to protect the church & let the child fend for him/herself.
Your pleas about protecting children are a red herring. Instead of reacting the way that most, if not all, decent people would react, being appalled at the actions of priests molesting boys, instead you use the issue to bring up a strawman argument. What is your point? That people who you hate do bad things? So what? We know you hate them, and if someone in that group you hate would walk on water, you'd say it's because the water rejected them. That how hate works.
What you are really doing here is trying to defend the catholic church w/o seeming to defend them. Which, just by doing so, makes you a rather sick fuck in my eyes.
And let's not kid ourselves. Individuals preying on children is one thing. A heinous crime worthy of punishment, indeed. What the catholic church did was raise this behavior into an industry. It went on for generations. As long as their are records, or living witnesses, we have proof. Where there are none, it stands to reason that it was still going on. For centuries. A child molestation industry that had no desire to stop, only cover it's tracks.
Most normal people would react in horror. You do not, so it's easy to conclude that you are quite abnormal, and possess an aberrant and abhorrent morality. Or, as stated above, a real sick fuck.
Your pleas about protecting children are a red herring. Instead of reacting the way that most, if not all, decent people would react, being appalled at the actions of priests molesting boys, instead you use the issue to bring up a strawman argument. What is your point? That people who you hate do bad things? So what? We know you hate them, and if someone in that group you hate would walk on water, you'd say it's because the water rejected them. That how hate works.
What you are really doing here is trying to defend the catholic church w/o seeming to defend them. Which, just by doing so, makes you a rather sick fuck in my eyes.
And let's not kid ourselves. Individuals preying on children is one thing. A heinous crime worthy of punishment, indeed. What the catholic church did was raise this behavior into an industry. It went on for generations. As long as their are records, or living witnesses, we have proof. Where there are none, it stands to reason that it was still going on. For centuries. A child molestation industry that had no desire to stop, only cover it's tracks.
Most normal people would react in horror. You do not, so it's easy to conclude that you are quite abnormal, and possess an aberrant and abhorrent morality. Or, as stated above, a real sick fuck.
19
LC, this is not germane to the debate. "Hollywood culture", I assume you mean liberals in the US, does not protect child abusers, and "gold star pedophiles" are no more child abusers than men with a rape fantasies that don't rape anyone are rapists.
The Catholic church however does protect child rapists. Polanski who is almost universally reviled, and certainly not protected here on Slog, has nothing to do with this. Stay on topic.
The Catholic church however does protect child rapists. Polanski who is almost universally reviled, and certainly not protected here on Slog, has nothing to do with this. Stay on topic.
20
This outrage is justified. I heard on a NPR story (about this child abuse scandal in Ireland) that there is a way for baptized Catholics to renounce their affiliation with the church. If you are baptized, they still count you as Catholic. I still have my baptism certificate yellowing away in a box somewhere.
21
The Catholic Church is not a religious institution. They are a carefully crafted business that allowed your children to be raped then took your money and your mind while they were doing it. All in the hopes that you would one day go to HEAVEN.
Finer snake oil salesmen you will never encounter.
Finer snake oil salesmen you will never encounter.
22
@17 None should get away with it, if they have truly done such an atrocious crime then they must face the law and harshly. I'm just pointing to the hypocrisy that libertines ( like the 'fearless' leader ) usually exhibit of pointing only to the abominable acts that have happened within Catholic hierarchy personnel ( not teachings ) , while at the same time looking the other way and even excusing equally monstrous individuals like ( and he's not the only within libertine circles to engage in such ) Polanski.
23
LC, I think what's really going on here is that you're trying to create a distraction. You can't defend the coverups of some terrible crimes committed by priests and other leaders of the Catholic Church so you throw out a complete red herring in an attempt to draw peoples' attention away. Even when people here say that Polanski should be punished--a position I share--you ignore it and keep harping on "Hollywood libertines".
As has been documented, Cardinal Ratzinger, in 2001, wrote a paper titled De delictis gravioribus in which he instructed bishops to report sexual abuse by priests exclusively to the Vatican under threat of excommunication.
However hard you try to make the connection the crimes committed by some Catholic church leaders and the active role of covering up those crimes played by other leaders does not compare to how anyone here feels about Roman Polanski.
As has been documented, Cardinal Ratzinger, in 2001, wrote a paper titled De delictis gravioribus in which he instructed bishops to report sexual abuse by priests exclusively to the Vatican under threat of excommunication.
However hard you try to make the connection the crimes committed by some Catholic church leaders and the active role of covering up those crimes played by other leaders does not compare to how anyone here feels about Roman Polanski.
24
By the way, Loveschild, you've claimed (although you're unable to provide evidence) that "most of the" abuse scandal "is being driven by anti-Christian demagogues".
In the past you've rushed to judge those who were simply accused of crimes. While, in at least one case that I know of, the evidence seemed pretty damning, the fact that you're rushing to the defense of priests and insisting that there should be an investigation before anyone rushes to judgment is some pretty blatant hypocrisy on your part. Before you accuse others of being hypocrites you should examine your own attitudes.
In the past you've rushed to judge those who were simply accused of crimes. While, in at least one case that I know of, the evidence seemed pretty damning, the fact that you're rushing to the defense of priests and insisting that there should be an investigation before anyone rushes to judgment is some pretty blatant hypocrisy on your part. Before you accuse others of being hypocrites you should examine your own attitudes.
25
Hey, as a secular, atheist and sexual libertine artist I take offense to the notion that I also condone child rapists so long as they make nice movies.
You, Loveschild, obviously DO condone child rapists, as your only defense for the Catholic Church is to point at the idiots who do defend Polanski and say they condone him but not the church. That, my dear, is a child's argument. You claim to have children, yes? Scenario:
You have five children: Abby, Billy, Cindy, Danny, and Eugene.
Abby steals money from your wallet, and uses some of her illicit earnings to buy a camera, with which she takes pictures that Billy and Cindy really like.
Abby is caught when you notice the missing cash, is spanked by you, grounded and has her camera taken away.
Billy: "She didn't deserve it! Just look at the pictures she made! Aren't they pretty?"
Cindy: "Well, yeah, they're pretty, but gosh, she DID steal, so she deserves her whooping."
You hold your ground and Abby remains grounded.
Danny then steals money from you, and uses it to buy kisses on the school playground.
Danny is caught when you notice the money is missing, and also spanked and grounded.
Cindy: "Gosh, he stole money too, he deserves his spankin'"
Eugene (That would be Loveschild) points at Cindy: "Hey, you can't say that! You like the same things Billy likes, and he likes thieves like Abby! Now your saying Danny is a thief, and that you don't like him! But you can't not like Danny, cause you like thieves just like Billy likes thieves!"
Cindy (the Slog commenters and Dan Savage, for the slow): "What? No, I said Abby's pictures are pretty, but she deserved her spanking just like Danny deserved his!"
Eugene: "If you like the same things as Billy, then you like stealing, so nyah! So you can't say you don't like Danny, 'cause there's no such thing as two people liking the same superficial things like pictures taken by a bad guy, but disagreeing about whether or not the bad guy is bad! If you like what a bad guy does, you like everything about a bad guy and you are also a bad guy! And you can never point out that some other bad guy is a bad guy!"
Cindy: "You're an idiot, and I'm not playing with you anymore."
She takes her toys away from Eugene and goes home.
More...
You, Loveschild, obviously DO condone child rapists, as your only defense for the Catholic Church is to point at the idiots who do defend Polanski and say they condone him but not the church. That, my dear, is a child's argument. You claim to have children, yes? Scenario:
You have five children: Abby, Billy, Cindy, Danny, and Eugene.
Abby steals money from your wallet, and uses some of her illicit earnings to buy a camera, with which she takes pictures that Billy and Cindy really like.
Abby is caught when you notice the missing cash, is spanked by you, grounded and has her camera taken away.
Billy: "She didn't deserve it! Just look at the pictures she made! Aren't they pretty?"
Cindy: "Well, yeah, they're pretty, but gosh, she DID steal, so she deserves her whooping."
You hold your ground and Abby remains grounded.
Danny then steals money from you, and uses it to buy kisses on the school playground.
Danny is caught when you notice the money is missing, and also spanked and grounded.
Cindy: "Gosh, he stole money too, he deserves his spankin'"
Eugene (That would be Loveschild) points at Cindy: "Hey, you can't say that! You like the same things Billy likes, and he likes thieves like Abby! Now your saying Danny is a thief, and that you don't like him! But you can't not like Danny, cause you like thieves just like Billy likes thieves!"
Cindy (the Slog commenters and Dan Savage, for the slow): "What? No, I said Abby's pictures are pretty, but she deserved her spanking just like Danny deserved his!"
Eugene: "If you like the same things as Billy, then you like stealing, so nyah! So you can't say you don't like Danny, 'cause there's no such thing as two people liking the same superficial things like pictures taken by a bad guy, but disagreeing about whether or not the bad guy is bad! If you like what a bad guy does, you like everything about a bad guy and you are also a bad guy! And you can never point out that some other bad guy is a bad guy!"
Cindy: "You're an idiot, and I'm not playing with you anymore."
She takes her toys away from Eugene and goes home.
26
All the Hollywood libertines who think that Polanski's not a bad guy are, I imagine, organizing death panels on Planet X with Bigfoot and Nessie for coworkers, and will shoot you with Saddam Hussein's WMDs if you scare their pet chupacabras.
27
@20: This is from the site NPR was talking about: http://www.countmeout.ie/faq/
You submit a formal defection to the bishop of your diocese, telling them when/where you were baptized, and that you understand you will no longer be able to receive sacraments. You're basically asking to be ex-communicated.
@22: One could argue that Catholic teachings really have encouraged this. If you do something bad, say a few Hail Marys and it's all kosher.
Also, excommunications are applied so capriciously, these pedophiles haven't been defrocked, yet I know someone who was baptized by a priest who was excommunicated for refusing to stop saying mass in Latin after the reforms from Vatican II.
The problems of personnel and teachings are deeply entwined, because the personnel ultimately created the teachings. The personnel have long--and arbitrarily--decided on the teachings.
For instance, a council of bishops and laypeople examined the topic of contraception in marriage when it was first becoming an issue. A handful of bishops decided to ignore the position that this group decided upon of contraception within marriage and declare it immoral instead, because they just happened to feel like it.
Next you'll tell us that the Catholic Church has never been anti-Semitic, because the Inquisition--and the title that the pope granted to the Spanish monarchs, "the Catholic Kings of Spain," for helping to carry it out--was just carried out by a few rogue agents.
Official Roman Catholic dogma depends 100% on the whims of the top clergy at any given time.
You submit a formal defection to the bishop of your diocese, telling them when/where you were baptized, and that you understand you will no longer be able to receive sacraments. You're basically asking to be ex-communicated.
@22: One could argue that Catholic teachings really have encouraged this. If you do something bad, say a few Hail Marys and it's all kosher.
Also, excommunications are applied so capriciously, these pedophiles haven't been defrocked, yet I know someone who was baptized by a priest who was excommunicated for refusing to stop saying mass in Latin after the reforms from Vatican II.
The problems of personnel and teachings are deeply entwined, because the personnel ultimately created the teachings. The personnel have long--and arbitrarily--decided on the teachings.
For instance, a council of bishops and laypeople examined the topic of contraception in marriage when it was first becoming an issue. A handful of bishops decided to ignore the position that this group decided upon of contraception within marriage and declare it immoral instead, because they just happened to feel like it.
Next you'll tell us that the Catholic Church has never been anti-Semitic, because the Inquisition--and the title that the pope granted to the Spanish monarchs, "the Catholic Kings of Spain," for helping to carry it out--was just carried out by a few rogue agents.
Official Roman Catholic dogma depends 100% on the whims of the top clergy at any given time.
28
Considering the dirt you can dig up on Mother Teresa, if they canonize Pope Benny it may just go a ways to making people view saints the same way many today view wack-job right-wing conservatives.
Yaaay?
Yaaay?
29
I imagined LC saying all of that in a shrill, desperate, crazy cat-lady fashion. Suits her quite well, considering she just called all of Europe pedophile supporters and still insists Atheism (synonymous in most cases with "I don't give a crap") is a religion. Not to mention that she believes accepting those with pedophilic predispositions who show unwavering self-restraint is fierce advocacy of the act.
She's already admitted she hates all of Europe passionately, she's just blurring the lines between Europe and everything else she hates with every fiber of her spiteful being.
She's got the crazy down pact. Just need to verify the cat situation.
She's already admitted she hates all of Europe passionately, she's just blurring the lines between Europe and everything else she hates with every fiber of her spiteful being.
She's got the crazy down pact. Just need to verify the cat situation.
31
And LC continues to bring teh stupid on so many levels it's amazing his/her/their/its head can hold that much.
32
I'm sick of christians talking about "Hollywood" culture when they clearly have no problem with raping children, stomping on women's and minorties rights and promoting facism.
34
@30: Cat's I'd classify more towards atheism, agnosticism, or deism. They seem to have moral compasses and a sense of ethics of sorts, but they don't really give a toss, and I have yet to see one stay awake through even a short service of any sort.
@31: I imagine it's at the point where she's renting from U-Haul just to be able to bring a full load of teh stupid.
@33: Thank you.
@31: I imagine it's at the point where she's renting from U-Haul just to be able to bring a full load of teh stupid.
@33: Thank you.
35
@34, I don't think a U-Haul would be necessary, quite a but of nothing fits in even the smallest spaces.
Also why classify cats? Being a stuffed stripy tiger, couldn't you just speak for them?
Also why classify cats? Being a stuffed stripy tiger, couldn't you just speak for them?
36
@35 That stuffed stripey tiger has some great insights into human nature, having said once, "I don't know which is worse...that everyone has his price, or that the price is always so low."
However have you ever known a cat who'd allow someone else, no matter how intelligent, to speak on his or her behalf?
However have you ever known a cat who'd allow someone else, no matter how intelligent, to speak on his or her behalf?
37
@36, Frankly most cats I've known have been above speaking, and indeed are above our petty human discourse.
Anyway, Venomlash, should we ever cross paths off the intertubes, and this goes for you too Southern, and quite a few of the people around these parts, I would so buy you a round of your alcoholic beverage of choice.
No drink for you, LC and Alleged and company, sorry.
Anyway, Venomlash, should we ever cross paths off the intertubes, and this goes for you too Southern, and quite a few of the people around these parts, I would so buy you a round of your alcoholic beverage of choice.
No drink for you, LC and Alleged and company, sorry.
38
@35: Me using Hobbes as my avatar is actually sort of an accident. It dates from when I joined a comp sci/programming community called DaniWeb (I recommend them highly). I was too lazy to find and upload an avatar all my own, so I went with Hobbes, who was in their rather limited avatar library.
Also, what tiger isn't stripy?
@36: A little gem of Watterson I remember:
Calvin: Do you think that babies are born sinners? That they come into the world with the will to do evil?
Hobbes: No, I think they're just quick studies.
Calvin: Whenever you discuss certain things with animals, you get insulted.
Also, what tiger isn't stripy?
@36: A little gem of Watterson I remember:
Calvin: Do you think that babies are born sinners? That they come into the world with the will to do evil?
Hobbes: No, I think they're just quick studies.
Calvin: Whenever you discuss certain things with animals, you get insulted.
39
@38, I suppose all tigers are stripy, but it sounds good. If you think that's redundant, how do you feel about names like 'The La Brea Tar Pits' or 'The Rio Grande River'?
I loved Calvin and Hobbes when I was little, by the way, and still look back on the strip with much fondness.
I loved Calvin and Hobbes when I was little, by the way, and still look back on the strip with much fondness.
40
How fucking dare anyone out there make fun of Benedict after all she has been through!
All you people care about is readers and making money off of her!!
SHE’S A HUMAN! What you don’t realize is that Benedict is making you all this money and all you do is write a bunch of crap about her!!!!!!
All you people want is MORE!!! MORE MORE MORE MORE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
LEAVE HER ALONE! You are lucky she even performed for you BASTARDS!
LEAVE BENEDICT ALONE!!! Please!
Leave Benedict alone please!!!
Leave Pope Benedict alone!…Right now!…I mean it!!
Anyone that has a problem with her you deal with ME, because she is not well right now!!
LEAVE HER ALONE!!!!!
All you people care about is readers and making money off of her!!
SHE’S A HUMAN! What you don’t realize is that Benedict is making you all this money and all you do is write a bunch of crap about her!!!!!!
All you people want is MORE!!! MORE MORE MORE MORE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
LEAVE HER ALONE! You are lucky she even performed for you BASTARDS!
LEAVE BENEDICT ALONE!!! Please!
Leave Benedict alone please!!!
Leave Pope Benedict alone!…Right now!…I mean it!!
Anyone that has a problem with her you deal with ME, because she is not well right now!!
LEAVE HER ALONE!!!!!
41
Loveschild, your references to different strawmen are confusing me. Try using real examples, and making references to real people (Who the fuck is "Fearless Leader"?) if you want to be taken seriously.
The reason we focus on these people is because they are the ones being hypocritical. Btw, while what Polanski did was wrong, I heard something about consent somewhere (am I wrong?), but the Catholic priests have raped... RAPED children. That means they have repeatedly FUCKED MULTITUDES OF CHILDREN AGAINST THEIR WILL.
They were trusted community leaders who used their position to RAPE CHILDREN. If you truly love these little'uns, as you claim to, then it reasonably follows that you would be on our side in condemning these molesters.
The reason we focus on these people is because they are the ones being hypocritical. Btw, while what Polanski did was wrong, I heard something about consent somewhere (am I wrong?), but the Catholic priests have raped... RAPED children. That means they have repeatedly FUCKED MULTITUDES OF CHILDREN AGAINST THEIR WILL.
They were trusted community leaders who used their position to RAPE CHILDREN. If you truly love these little'uns, as you claim to, then it reasonably follows that you would be on our side in condemning these molesters.
42
Don't go there, 41. First because you don't know that those children didn't "consent" too, in the twisted minds of their molesters, and second because talking about a child consenting to being raped is... ugh.
43
One of the biggest lies ever swallowed is that Religion = 100% Trustworthy.
Unfortunately, many have swallowed the lie and when that happens the ability to discern is lost, the ability to question is exterminated. When that is lost, is when we hear of heinous crimes being minimized, discover that scape goats have been sought, and attempts are made to deflect our attention. When confronted with reality and fact, the faithful may denounce an individual, but will continue to support the lie. Hence, the Pope can have sharp words for others and seemingly be able to act as though his actions were benign, at best, with regard to De delictis gravioribus. And our fellow SLOGger can defend the Roman Catholic Church with a straw man argument about Hollywood, while benignly believing that she is not some how condoning the abuse of children.
Unfortunately, many have swallowed the lie and when that happens the ability to discern is lost, the ability to question is exterminated. When that is lost, is when we hear of heinous crimes being minimized, discover that scape goats have been sought, and attempts are made to deflect our attention. When confronted with reality and fact, the faithful may denounce an individual, but will continue to support the lie. Hence, the Pope can have sharp words for others and seemingly be able to act as though his actions were benign, at best, with regard to De delictis gravioribus. And our fellow SLOGger can defend the Roman Catholic Church with a straw man argument about Hollywood, while benignly believing that she is not some how condoning the abuse of children.
44
@loveschild - ROMAN Catholic Church? ROMAN Polanski? It's all just a conspiracy between our spiritual/moral leaders and cultural/entertainment institutions to abuse children! They're one and the same!
45
42, not how I meant it, sorry. But consensual sex with a post-pubescent person (while very, very wrong and deserving prosecution) is still not as bad as raping a small child (oh, for instance a 9-year-old Irish child who just lost his/her parents and landed in an orphanage separate from his/her siblings). The former is despicable, the latter is beyond words and has been institutionalized for at least decades.
46
All of this comes down to the fact that the Roman Catholic Church has been passing the buck on any number of direly pressing issues since the pontificate of Paul VI--the abuse scandal being the most horrific of all. The all too predictable election of Joseph Ratzinger to succeed John Paul II was, IMO, an essentially cowardly move and now it looks like it's biting the Vatican on its berobed ass. Unfortunately, there's no agreed-upon procedure for the valid deposition of a pope, and only two popes in history have ever abdicated, so we're stuck with Bennie 16 until he shuffles off this mortal coil.
Meanwhile, you can always think of Pope John XII, who died in flagrante delicto with his mistress. His opponents claimed it was a punishment from God. More constructively, countries around the world need to present a united front to the Vatican on clerical sexual abuse--perpetrators WILL be dealt with and if found guilty will be treated as criminals. The Catholic Church can either cooperate or continue to suffer damage if it continues to cover up.
Meanwhile, you can always think of Pope John XII, who died in flagrante delicto with his mistress. His opponents claimed it was a punishment from God. More constructively, countries around the world need to present a united front to the Vatican on clerical sexual abuse--perpetrators WILL be dealt with and if found guilty will be treated as criminals. The Catholic Church can either cooperate or continue to suffer damage if it continues to cover up.
47
@ 43,
sadly, that's how religious (or any other dogmatism) works, trusting the authority and not asking questions. If people critically scrutinized the Bible there would be no Christians as we know them, though maybe another religion would be formed based on the 10% (or less?) morally and scientifically acceptable parts of the Bible.
@ 45,
the girl in question was 13, and was given alcohol and drugs before she was raped. (Vaginally and anally, if those details matter.) While it was a single instance and not institutionalized crime, it doesn't make that single child's experience any less traumatic.
sadly, that's how religious (or any other dogmatism) works, trusting the authority and not asking questions. If people critically scrutinized the Bible there would be no Christians as we know them, though maybe another religion would be formed based on the 10% (or less?) morally and scientifically acceptable parts of the Bible.
@ 45,
the girl in question was 13, and was given alcohol and drugs before she was raped. (Vaginally and anally, if those details matter.) While it was a single instance and not institutionalized crime, it doesn't make that single child's experience any less traumatic.
48
tiare,
I knew she was 13 (very bad but could be worse), but I was not aware of the Jesus Juice factor. I probably didn't make myself clear enough in saying that I was not sure about the details of the Polanski thing. I now feel compelled to agree with you. And no, those details do not matter: rape = rape = rape in any orifice.
Btw, when I was younger, I was one of those Christians that followed the 10%, though I generally viewed the Bible as an extraneous remnant from a dark past. The book was a bit to smitey for me.
I knew she was 13 (very bad but could be worse), but I was not aware of the Jesus Juice factor. I probably didn't make myself clear enough in saying that I was not sure about the details of the Polanski thing. I now feel compelled to agree with you. And no, those details do not matter: rape = rape = rape in any orifice.
Btw, when I was younger, I was one of those Christians that followed the 10%, though I generally viewed the Bible as an extraneous remnant from a dark past. The book was a bit to smitey for me.
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