Find Your Valentine
Slog
News & ArtsMonday, November 30, 2009
Crime Calm Down, People—Leave the Body Armor at Home
Posted by Dominic Holden on Mon, Nov 30, 2009 at 1:50 PM
Officers on the police scanner say that a would-be vigilante flagged down a cop near Cowen Park. The man was carrying a handgun and wearing body armor. He apparently wanted to help flush out the suspect from the park.
7
i was listening to this, and the officer commented that he thought the public wearing body armor was illegal, but was unable to find the statute. I spent some time in the RCW and didn't find this mentioned anywhere, either. Anyone know the truth?
9
The pros worked to get the suspect back on the street and got shot having a donut. They also missed him driving back up from Tacoma to hide out in his old house, and are currently resorting to a manhunt.
I fail to see how "pros" let the entire world through every news organisation imaginable tell the suspect where they will be looking for him.
I fail to see how "pros" let the entire world through every news organisation imaginable tell the suspect where they will be looking for him.
12
We'd all be better off if we all carried handguns everyday.
In fact, if every citizen carried an AK-47 everyday we would all be safer. Especially while at bars and places serving alcohol.
It would just be like the early days of Tombstone, AZ.
Oh nevermind....
In fact, if every citizen carried an AK-47 everyday we would all be safer. Especially while at bars and places serving alcohol.
It would just be like the early days of Tombstone, AZ.
Oh nevermind....
15
isn't it currently illegal to carry a weapon in a seattle public park?
am i getting that totally wrong?
am i getting that totally wrong?
17
@12, you should read the book *more guns less crime*, by economist John Lott he did a study and wrote a book on the very premise that CWP have no effect on crime rates. He found that the opposite was indeed true. Every jurisdiction that had a large number of CWP holders, had a significantly lower crime rate than areas with low, or banned CWP.
http://www.amazon.com/More-Guns-Less-Cri…
I realise that using hard data to make a statement is more complicated that most internet commenters. but you sound less silly than, OMG, GUNS SHOULD BE FREE, CAUSE THEN PEOPLE WILL DIE AND THAT PROVES THEY ARE BAD.
http://www.amazon.com/More-Guns-Less-Cri…
I realise that using hard data to make a statement is more complicated that most internet commenters. but you sound less silly than, OMG, GUNS SHOULD BE FREE, CAUSE THEN PEOPLE WILL DIE AND THAT PROVES THEY ARE BAD.
18
Oh come on, give the guy a break. He has probably been waiting a lifetime to play with his six-shooter and the bad guys.
19
@17, wait, you mean I've been wrong my entire life, and correlation DOES mean causation? Gee, thanks.
In other words, stuff your John Lott up your ass.
In other words, stuff your John Lott up your ass.
22
ive got a conceal permit and a bike, i should roam around the u district for a while and see if i can collect.
after i get some pagliacci pizza of course
after i get some pagliacci pizza of course
23
@19 sorry fnarf, I forgot the audience... my bad
U R DUMB, GUNS RULE CAUSE I SAY SO!!!!
also, I blame the cops again for this one.... " 125k reward ..... suspect may be in this area ..."
they should sell maps
U R DUMB, GUNS RULE CAUSE I SAY SO!!!!
also, I blame the cops again for this one.... " 125k reward ..... suspect may be in this area ..."
they should sell maps
24
maybe critical mass can ride through the park and get the reward, but then you would have to decide who gets it, cause critical mass isnt a group.
YOU COULD HAVE A SHOOT OUT TO PICK THE WINNAR!
YOU COULD HAVE A SHOOT OUT TO PICK THE WINNAR!
26
Sure it was a handgun and not a cardboard and foam sword? Cowen park is known for it's LARPers in crazy body armor.
32
Don't worry meanie, you aren't the only one that lacks an irrational fear of firearms on slog.
I took a rifle class this weekend, we only shot two or three babies and a cat.
I don't see any reason it would (or should) be illegal to wear body armor, but going there trying to get the guy is pretty damn stupid. This is one thing that should absolutely be left to the professionals. I've spent a lot of time in that park and it is a jungle, I'm sure looking for somebody in there is a nightmare.
I took a rifle class this weekend, we only shot two or three babies and a cat.
I don't see any reason it would (or should) be illegal to wear body armor, but going there trying to get the guy is pretty damn stupid. This is one thing that should absolutely be left to the professionals. I've spent a lot of time in that park and it is a jungle, I'm sure looking for somebody in there is a nightmare.
33
@17 every study I've ever read shows that the more guns in a society the more gun related crimes, deaths, suicides and accidental shootings there are.
Oh and you should read Michael Bellesiles' "Arming America: The Origins of a National Gun Culture" which shows that gun ownership was rare in America until the Civil War.
And the US is number 8 in regards to murders committed by guns:
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_mu…
Also, check out the firearm death rates per sate:
http://www.statemaster.com/graph/cri_mur…
Oh and you should read Michael Bellesiles' "Arming America: The Origins of a National Gun Culture" which shows that gun ownership was rare in America until the Civil War.
And the US is number 8 in regards to murders committed by guns:
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_mu…
Also, check out the firearm death rates per sate:
http://www.statemaster.com/graph/cri_mur…
34
@32 obviously you haven't spent that much time in the park.....it is NOT a jungle by any means, especially this time of year when there are NO LEAVES ON THE TREES......its a trail that is in between two ravine walls and the park is not even that much acreage.
35
@33 my book says that your the bad person, clearly.
I only offered an example from a someone who attempted to enter the study impartially. I could fire back with a bunch of pro gun stuff I just googled, ( cause thats how comments are won )but that wasn't my point.
oh, on your links, did you notice that Mexico is #5 on deaths per capita? Guns are basically illegal there. Seems to be working out well. Also, guns were up until recently banned in DC, which is #1 in your SATE map.
I wonder if there is a map like this for the UK, where it shows deaths per capita for pint glasses, butcher knives, and smarmy pissants who are beaten to death ( bare hands! ) for being hipsters in bars. but I digress.
Its interesting to me how politically, the same types of people who say that prohibition on drugs is bad and leads to more crime, not less, say the exact opposite about things like firearms. Other than the obvious logic fail, maybe its because things are sensationalised..
NAH fuck it. SUCK IT PRESUMED LEFTY GUN HATER, OR WHATEVER DESIGNATION YOU PREFER!
I only offered an example from a someone who attempted to enter the study impartially. I could fire back with a bunch of pro gun stuff I just googled, ( cause thats how comments are won )but that wasn't my point.
oh, on your links, did you notice that Mexico is #5 on deaths per capita? Guns are basically illegal there. Seems to be working out well. Also, guns were up until recently banned in DC, which is #1 in your SATE map.
I wonder if there is a map like this for the UK, where it shows deaths per capita for pint glasses, butcher knives, and smarmy pissants who are beaten to death ( bare hands! ) for being hipsters in bars. but I digress.
Its interesting to me how politically, the same types of people who say that prohibition on drugs is bad and leads to more crime, not less, say the exact opposite about things like firearms. Other than the obvious logic fail, maybe its because things are sensationalised..
NAH fuck it. SUCK IT PRESUMED LEFTY GUN HATER, OR WHATEVER DESIGNATION YOU PREFER!
36
Sweet #33, way to capitalize on the brutal murder of four cops to try to push your own political agenda of gun control.
37
At #35, don't assume gun haters are lefties, me and all my super lefty progressive friends love to shoot guns.
38
@35: mexico is probably higher than us due to the narco-terror war going on along our border, using guns smuggled INTO mexico from america. statistics can prove anything.
39
@34
Yes, things losing leaves makes it a lot easier than during the summer, but I've worked there with the Parks Dept searching out homeless encampments many times. If you think there aren't many places to hide (and many side trails off the main ones) then YOU haven't spent much time there.
Yes, things losing leaves makes it a lot easier than during the summer, but I've worked there with the Parks Dept searching out homeless encampments many times. If you think there aren't many places to hide (and many side trails off the main ones) then YOU haven't spent much time there.
40
Someone should let the moron in the bullet proof vest in on the fact that all 4 murdered police officers were wearing bullet proof vests. They had that and their professional training and experience going for them. My guess is if this Barney Fife wannabe ran into the killer, he'd make for a very easy victim.
41
Heard it on the scanner.
I got a laugh out of how the cop wanted to charge our would-be police sidekick with a crime for wearing body armor.
Um, no, officer, you can only request charges against people who have committed actual crimes. You do know that's not a crime, doncha?
I got a laugh out of how the cop wanted to charge our would-be police sidekick with a crime for wearing body armor.
Um, no, officer, you can only request charges against people who have committed actual crimes. You do know that's not a crime, doncha?
43
32: It's better than your irrational love of firearms. I don't even care about crime rates. All I know is that people who feel the need to carry weapons at all time are small-dicked pussies and paranoid freaks.
44
You know, if more people carried guns, especially concealed guns, we'd be inured to this kind of massive cop slaughter by gun nut crazies by now.
Of course, a lot of cops would be dead, and tons of innocent bystanders too.
Good thing we don't let gun nuts carry inside our community centers and parks in Seattle.
Of course, a lot of cops would be dead, and tons of innocent bystanders too.
Good thing we don't let gun nuts carry inside our community centers and parks in Seattle.
45
@43
I don't have an irrational love of firearms, they are a hobby I am casually involved in. I don't carry a gun (don't have a permit or even a pistol) and your stereotypes are worn out. I have even had female instructors at two classes I've taken. Grow up.
I don't have an irrational love of firearms, they are a hobby I am casually involved in. I don't carry a gun (don't have a permit or even a pistol) and your stereotypes are worn out. I have even had female instructors at two classes I've taken. Grow up.
46
So, you're saying that the open carry and concealed carry movements don't promote carrying weapons at all times for safety? Because all the open carry people I meet are hell bent on the idea that people must be armed at all times. And I'm pretty sure the guy who showed up armed to "help" the police is one of those people. You might not like the stereotype, but 1/2 of every gun enthusiast I've met seems to fit it. And until sensible gun enthusiasts condemn and disown those idiots, I'm going to just have to assume that people who make it a point to defend gun rights on the internet at every turn are in the same camp.
47
ARE YOU PEOPLE NUTS, YOUR THE ONES HIDING IN YOUR HOUSE WHEN IM CHASING SONE LOWLIFE IN THE STREETS AFTER I HAD JUST WITTNESED HIN BREAK INTO MY NEIGHBORS CAR AND NOBODY EVEN TURNED ON A LIGHT. WHAT ARE YOU AFRAID OF BUT YOUR OWN SHADO.
48
ARE YOU PEOPLE NUTS, YOUR THE ONES HIDING IN YOUR HOUSES WHEN IM CHASING SOME LOW LIFE FROM SOMTHING HE DID IN THE NEIGHBOR HOOD AND NOT EVEN A LIGHT TURNS ON. WHAT ARE YOU AFRAID OF BUT YOUR OWN SHADOW.
49
There are extremists in every group and the gun crowd is no exception. It doesn't help that things are so polarized by both sides that it can be hard to find moderates. Personally I think open carry in any environment outside of those where it is already expected (areas used for hunting or many small towns where people grow up shooting and wouldn't look twice at somebody with a rifle over their shoulder) is fine, but anywhere else shows a serious lack of tact if nothing else. Some of them do just want to look/feel like a badass.
Concealed carry is a totally separate issue. Personally I don't know what I'd do it, but I have no problem with RESPONSIBLE and LEGAL carry. People with concealed carry permits have a lower crime rate than the general population, you don't go through a background check and get your name on a government list because you are a violent criminal. Criminals simply stick a gun in their pocket and do their thing (which is why the parks ban is useless among other reasons). Some people have good reasons to carry for protection and as long as they do it safely and legally, it is their business. Some might be paranoid and/or annoying, but so what? As long as they aren't hurting anyone, who cares? States that have expanded concealed carry rights have not seen an increase in shootings.
I already said the guy showing up at the park was a dumbass. But this "responsible gun owners must denounce extremism" thing is the same argument the right uses about Islam. "Why don't moderate Muslims denounce suicide bombers or 9/11?!" They do, you just don't hear about it in the media. There also isn't a Moderate Muslims/Moderate Gun Owners Club that publicly criticizes the extremes. It just doesn't work that way, but it doesn't mean those people don't exist.
More...
Concealed carry is a totally separate issue. Personally I don't know what I'd do it, but I have no problem with RESPONSIBLE and LEGAL carry. People with concealed carry permits have a lower crime rate than the general population, you don't go through a background check and get your name on a government list because you are a violent criminal. Criminals simply stick a gun in their pocket and do their thing (which is why the parks ban is useless among other reasons). Some people have good reasons to carry for protection and as long as they do it safely and legally, it is their business. Some might be paranoid and/or annoying, but so what? As long as they aren't hurting anyone, who cares? States that have expanded concealed carry rights have not seen an increase in shootings.
I already said the guy showing up at the park was a dumbass. But this "responsible gun owners must denounce extremism" thing is the same argument the right uses about Islam. "Why don't moderate Muslims denounce suicide bombers or 9/11?!" They do, you just don't hear about it in the media. There also isn't a Moderate Muslims/Moderate Gun Owners Club that publicly criticizes the extremes. It just doesn't work that way, but it doesn't mean those people don't exist.
50
@47/48
WTF? Turn off the caps lock and learn to write a reasonably legible sentence.
Anyway, I'm not an expert and am not really interested in being the Slog Gun Rights Defender so I am not going to get too wrapped up in this. I just like to point out once in a while that it isn't just the far right that supports gun rights. I support legal and responsible gun ownership while also voting for Obama and McGinn (see? I'm don't have irrational love for guns, I overlooked certain gun rights aspects of both in favor of the larger picture) and being a member of the ACLU. I think the NRA are a bunch of fear-mongering asshats and just today threw out a membership application they sent after I took a safety class.
WTF? Turn off the caps lock and learn to write a reasonably legible sentence.
Anyway, I'm not an expert and am not really interested in being the Slog Gun Rights Defender so I am not going to get too wrapped up in this. I just like to point out once in a while that it isn't just the far right that supports gun rights. I support legal and responsible gun ownership while also voting for Obama and McGinn (see? I'm don't have irrational love for guns, I overlooked certain gun rights aspects of both in favor of the larger picture) and being a member of the ACLU. I think the NRA are a bunch of fear-mongering asshats and just today threw out a membership application they sent after I took a safety class.
51
with all the *small penis, low self esteem crazy* comments floating around, its wonder all anyone knows of gun owners are the really extroverted open carry types.
strange how that works.
strange how that works.
52
At the risk of looking less than progressive: I love a well prepared vigilante*. Samurai sword guy at westlake had nothing on this 'Punisher'.
* = I loves me some vigilante types because they a) show initiative and brass ones, a too rare thing b) sometimes shame cops & citizens into doing more to halt crime via the normal ways.
Kudos to crazy cowen park vigilante. Bystanders like this have come to the aid of many cops, like or not, and even saved lives: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newhall_mas…
@25 - body armor purchases are illegal for felons.
And I hope to gawd you're being sarcastic about "why":
The desire might come from the horrible bloodshed from this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Holly…
@33 & 44: this guy http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Massad_Ayoo… disagrees and says in states where CW bans are in effect, crime with guns is higher. Not that I like it. Concealed carry isn't my thing.
I like the constitution and I even like the original intent of the 2nd amendment and think it should continue. Auto/semi rifles? No. Handgun in the purse or bedroom? Sure, why not, so long as you keep it safe. Taser? Even better.
The hunting folks are on my shit list though: I think hunting - if allowed at all- should be limited to non-compound bow, and limited to critters wolf or perhaps brownbear -sized and larger. Hunters suck (hard), and the OverCompensation crowd Suck (themselves..oh wait, there's no way that'll reach)...
But I have a soft spot for the non crazy militia folk and their reverence for the bill of rights. Yes, yes, all three of 'em.
This is why I traded my NRA marksman FirstClass card (thanks BSA!) for an ACLU card long ago.
More...
* = I loves me some vigilante types because they a) show initiative and brass ones, a too rare thing b) sometimes shame cops & citizens into doing more to halt crime via the normal ways.
Kudos to crazy cowen park vigilante. Bystanders like this have come to the aid of many cops, like or not, and even saved lives: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newhall_mas…
@25 - body armor purchases are illegal for felons.
And I hope to gawd you're being sarcastic about "why":
The desire might come from the horrible bloodshed from this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Holly…
@33 & 44: this guy http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Massad_Ayoo… disagrees and says in states where CW bans are in effect, crime with guns is higher. Not that I like it. Concealed carry isn't my thing.
I like the constitution and I even like the original intent of the 2nd amendment and think it should continue. Auto/semi rifles? No. Handgun in the purse or bedroom? Sure, why not, so long as you keep it safe. Taser? Even better.
The hunting folks are on my shit list though: I think hunting - if allowed at all- should be limited to non-compound bow, and limited to critters wolf or perhaps brownbear -sized and larger. Hunters suck (hard), and the OverCompensation crowd Suck (themselves..oh wait, there's no way that'll reach)...
But I have a soft spot for the non crazy militia folk and their reverence for the bill of rights. Yes, yes, all three of 'em.
This is why I traded my NRA marksman FirstClass card (thanks BSA!) for an ACLU card long ago.
53
Well if that ain't country I'll kiss your ass. Hopefully they exchanged his vest for a more appropriate one - a straight jacket.
In an effort to keep
the
discourse respectful and on topic, commenting on this item is
available only to registered commenters.
Advertisement
Most Commented on Slog
-
SL Letter of the Day: Life Sentence by Dan Savage
-
SL Letter of the Day: Daddy Loves Who? by Dan Savage
-
Required Listening: Howard Stern on Ellen, JC Penney, Bullied Gay Kids, Rosie, Santorum, Bachmann, et al by Dan Savage
-
Crowdsourcing Uncut Police Video from the Dec. 12 Occupy Protest at the Port of Seattle by Eli Sanders
-
State Legislator Testifies That His Opposition to Same-Sex Marriage Came to Him from a Commercial for Jack in the Box by Christopher Frizzelle
-
"Let me be the first one to say: My business will refuse to participate in a same-sex marriage ceremony," by Republican Representative Matt Shea of the Spokane Valley by Eli Sanders
-
The Onion Is on a Roll: "Iran Worried U.S. Might Be Building 8,500th Nuclear Weapon" by Charles Mudede
-
"I don't know if I want to be here [if gay marriage passes]," by Republican State Senator Jay Rodne of North Bend by Eli Sanders
-
Announcing The Stranger's Tournament of Dunces! Who's the Dumbest Representative in the State House? by Christopher Frizzelle
-
Republicans Put Gay Marriage on the Ballot at Their Own Risk by Goldy
RSS
Facebook
Twitter
Comments (52) RSS