Friday, November 20, 2009
News Life and Death in a Recliner in South Carolina
Posted by Dan Savage on Fri, Nov 20, 2009 at 8:42 AM
At least a hundred people have forwarded me a link to this story, suggesting it for Slog since it has so many hilarious details. A morbidly obese man in South Carolina who couldn't get out of the recliner in his living room, his wife of two years who cleaned the recliner every morning because her morbidly obese husband used the chair as a toilet, the morbidly obese man, a former preacher, passing his time in the recliner "posting sermons online" and "talking about religion to other people on the Internet." And when the man died on his second wedding anniversary—of a heart attack at age 33—his wife telling the AP that she "had the worst anniversary" but her husband "had the best one he ever had because he's with Jesus now."
Hilarious?
Sorry, no. The story is an indictment of the American "health care" system. That man needed to be in a bed in a hospital, not in a recliner in a mobile home. Here are really damning details: Daniel Webb was in that recliner because paramedics deposited him there after bringing him home from the hospital. He'd been in the hospital for the emergency treatment of a weight-related knee injury. "Ada Webb said she begged hospital officials to keep him after doctors treated his knee injury in March. But the couple had no way to pay and were sent home." Webb was in the recliner for eight months, dying by inches, and didn't seek help "because he... didn't have health insurance."
Webb was a sick man who needed to be in a hospital—and, I'm sorry, but it sounds like he needed to be far away from his loving wife. In the eight months he was in that recliner Webb went from 550 pounds to "about 800 pounds," according to police. Webb had no health insurance and a feeder and/or enabler at home. I'm sorry, Slog tippers, but I don't think this story is particularly funny. I think it's a sad indictment of our health care "system."
Share via
3
On the one hand it is sad, and I agree an indictment of our health care clusterfuck.
On the other hand, at the beginning of 2009 I weighed over 300 lbs and could have easily kept going, like this guy did (I was 30 years old at the start of 2009.) Instead, I decided I was tired of being a miserable fat fuck and took control of my eating and started exercising.
I don't think I'm that special, I think anyone can do it. I think Webb made a choice to throw his life away. To keep going down the path he was on rather than turn it around. He made the easy choice.
I do wish there was a support network to help people like him, I do hope we get good heatlh care reform. I don't have insurance either, so I understand completely what kind of situation he was in.
And it's because of that I do have to put his share of the blame on him, and his wife's share on her. They are not totally innocent victims in this.
On the other hand, at the beginning of 2009 I weighed over 300 lbs and could have easily kept going, like this guy did (I was 30 years old at the start of 2009.) Instead, I decided I was tired of being a miserable fat fuck and took control of my eating and started exercising.
I don't think I'm that special, I think anyone can do it. I think Webb made a choice to throw his life away. To keep going down the path he was on rather than turn it around. He made the easy choice.
I do wish there was a support network to help people like him, I do hope we get good heatlh care reform. I don't have insurance either, so I understand completely what kind of situation he was in.
And it's because of that I do have to put his share of the blame on him, and his wife's share on her. They are not totally innocent victims in this.
4
I've never really thought that death was particularly funny to begin with. I guess I'm weird or something. It's sad how our society abandons people.
6
@ 3 Congrats on your transformation.
But no not everybody can do what you did.
It sounds as if his knee was severely injured. In that case he would not have been able to exercise.
Now he could have been better about what he ate. But if he couldn't move from the recliner, as is suggested, then no, he couldn't lose any weight.
But no not everybody can do what you did.
It sounds as if his knee was severely injured. In that case he would not have been able to exercise.
Now he could have been better about what he ate. But if he couldn't move from the recliner, as is suggested, then no, he couldn't lose any weight.
8
"Webb, 33, didn't ask for help for all those months, because he was ashamed and didn't have health insurance, said his wife, Ada."
That is just so sad.
Dan, you condemn his wife for letting him gain all that weight, but what would you do in her situation? She couldn't force him to exercise on a bad knee, and was probably devastated by how restricted his life had become -- reduced to living his life on a recliner. She probably couldn't bring herself to do anything except try to make him comfortable as possible. The article says that the paramedics were called back this week because he was in so much pain, pain that probably didn't just spring up a few days ago.
You can only attribute so much blame to her considering the man was already 500 pounds when they met four years ago. He didn't need "enabling."
That is just so sad.
Dan, you condemn his wife for letting him gain all that weight, but what would you do in her situation? She couldn't force him to exercise on a bad knee, and was probably devastated by how restricted his life had become -- reduced to living his life on a recliner. She probably couldn't bring herself to do anything except try to make him comfortable as possible. The article says that the paramedics were called back this week because he was in so much pain, pain that probably didn't just spring up a few days ago.
You can only attribute so much blame to her considering the man was already 500 pounds when they met four years ago. He didn't need "enabling."
9
@6: I had the physique of a veal calf when I started losing weight. He absolutely could have lost weight even with his knee being bad.
And I'm not special, anybody can do it. It's just most people don't.
And I'm not special, anybody can do it. It's just most people don't.
10
Someone was bringing him food -- enough of it that he could gain 300 pounds in eight months. That's enabling.
11
@8: He did need enabling, all hyper-obese people have enablers. When they cease being able to obtain or prepare their own food, someone else is enabling them. And we as a society do need to call them out on what they are doing. We can do it without being cruel (and I think Dan did avoid being cruel), but enablers do need to be told that what they are doing is helping their loved one kill themselves, and help them instead to turn things around.
13
That was hilarious.
You can't blame the health care system for this. There are so many many other issues at hand, all dealing with personal flaws and fractured people. It's hilarious.
Fuck you for turning it into an indictment of our medical system. We shouldn't have to pay for some fat fuck to stay in a hospital bed to get thin. He should be able to do this himself. Or with his family. Jesus, if we had to pay for every idiot who has no self-control and can't do jack shit for himself...oh, wait, that's the liberal mindset.
You can't blame the health care system for this. There are so many many other issues at hand, all dealing with personal flaws and fractured people. It's hilarious.
Fuck you for turning it into an indictment of our medical system. We shouldn't have to pay for some fat fuck to stay in a hospital bed to get thin. He should be able to do this himself. Or with his family. Jesus, if we had to pay for every idiot who has no self-control and can't do jack shit for himself...oh, wait, that's the liberal mindset.
15
@3 You also weighed around 200 pounds less. That is significant. You certainly don't balloon to 550 pounds at the drop of a hat, but comparing going to a healthy weight from 3XX to going down from 550 is... well, they're not quite the same.
16
@13: K so when you have a stroke and can no longer do stuff for yourself because of your lack of motor-control, I'll be sure to leave you under an overpass somewhere.
17
@15: It's not identical but usually the weight gain with the hyper-obese like this is also very fast. He went from 550 to 800 in 8 months. It's like a snowball. If I had kept going the path I was on I would have probably topped 400 by New Year's. Yes turning it around at 300 is probably easier, but that doesn't mean turning around at 550 is impossible. And at one point he was at 300, and could have made the choice then.
There is a level of personal responsibility here, but that doesn't mean we can't do more to help as a society.
If you crash your car because you were texting your BFF, that doesn't mean I won't stop and check to make sure you're ok and dial 9-1-1, even though your accident was due to your own stupidity.
There is a level of personal responsibility here, but that doesn't mean we can't do more to help as a society.
If you crash your car because you were texting your BFF, that doesn't mean I won't stop and check to make sure you're ok and dial 9-1-1, even though your accident was due to your own stupidity.
19
@14: Curse you, TGI Friday's and your "Death By Chocolate" multi-layer fudge cake! YOU DID THIS! MONSTERS!
20
So should there be wellness benchmarks in healthcare? Should people who do make an effort (and I'm not talking just the skinny or uber-fit) but those who don't smoke, do some exercise, etc. be given better rates than those who don't?
I've lived abroad twice and folks, it's NOT just a bum knee or bad metabolism. Many Americans just don't want to make an effort. We also drive a lot more than we walk which would make a world of difference (we also snack a lot more). We have many more healthcare issues because we want medicine to cure us when taking care of ourselves is the first step to better health and better healthcare in this country.
That said, this story is just plain 'ol sad. I wonder how the funeral home got him out of the chair.
I've lived abroad twice and folks, it's NOT just a bum knee or bad metabolism. Many Americans just don't want to make an effort. We also drive a lot more than we walk which would make a world of difference (we also snack a lot more). We have many more healthcare issues because we want medicine to cure us when taking care of ourselves is the first step to better health and better healthcare in this country.
That said, this story is just plain 'ol sad. I wonder how the funeral home got him out of the chair.
21
Not the health care system's fault.
Repeat after me, girls-
p e r s o n a l . r e s p o n s i b i l i t y
The travesty and tragedy would have been to keep him in the hospital and sink $3-400,000 of borrowed public money into it.
(hey Dan, fast forward 10 years and substitue posting sex columns instead of sermons and do you see yourself? you won't be able to fight the fat demon off forever...)
Repeat after me, girls-
p e r s o n a l . r e s p o n s i b i l i t y
The travesty and tragedy would have been to keep him in the hospital and sink $3-400,000 of borrowed public money into it.
(hey Dan, fast forward 10 years and substitue posting sex columns instead of sermons and do you see yourself? you won't be able to fight the fat demon off forever...)
22
A Jesus freak from South Carolina? How much you wanna bet his 'sermons' were about the 'evils' of 'government run healthcare'
23
@10: The dude weighed 500 pounds when they met. He clearly had health and diet problems, and whatever let him physiologically get to 500 pounds in the first place almost certainly contributed to that kind of rapid weight gain. The fact he was sitting in a recliner 24/7 was also a big part of the problem.
His wife brought him food because he had a bum knee and couldn't cook for himself. Was she frying up donuts and shoving them in his face?
@11: "[B]ut enablers do need to be told that what they are doing is helping their loved one kill themselves, and help them instead to turn things around."
My sticking point here is that Dan condemned the woman because she let him gain weight on the recliner -- which was clearly influenced by the fact he was completely sedentary. It says right in the article he was already 500 pounds when they met, so she sure didn't help him gain any more after they became a couple.
I can't deny she did enable him, because she's the one who married him and, out of misguided compassion, just accepted what was obviously a life-threatening medical condition, and didn't ever seem to encourage him to lose weight in the four years she had known him. *That* was her enabling -- her passivity.
But Dan didn't call *that* out. He called her out for bringing food to an injured man. What?
"Turn things around." They had let things get to an awful point, had no money for health care, and the husband was impaired enough to have to live on a *recliner.* How do you turn things around?
Yes, of course, they had serious, serious personal responsibility for this, but sometimes you can't say, "Well, just turn it around." Sometimes a situation does just get hopeless. They missed their opportunities, and now it's just a little sad.
More...
His wife brought him food because he had a bum knee and couldn't cook for himself. Was she frying up donuts and shoving them in his face?
@11: "[B]ut enablers do need to be told that what they are doing is helping their loved one kill themselves, and help them instead to turn things around."
My sticking point here is that Dan condemned the woman because she let him gain weight on the recliner -- which was clearly influenced by the fact he was completely sedentary. It says right in the article he was already 500 pounds when they met, so she sure didn't help him gain any more after they became a couple.
I can't deny she did enable him, because she's the one who married him and, out of misguided compassion, just accepted what was obviously a life-threatening medical condition, and didn't ever seem to encourage him to lose weight in the four years she had known him. *That* was her enabling -- her passivity.
But Dan didn't call *that* out. He called her out for bringing food to an injured man. What?
"Turn things around." They had let things get to an awful point, had no money for health care, and the husband was impaired enough to have to live on a *recliner.* How do you turn things around?
Yes, of course, they had serious, serious personal responsibility for this, but sometimes you can't say, "Well, just turn it around." Sometimes a situation does just get hopeless. They missed their opportunities, and now it's just a little sad.
24
I don't see the health care connection. If he had stayed in the hospital for his knee, he eventually would have gotten better and eventually gone home where he undoubtedly would still have gone from morbidly obese to complete shut-in obese. It probably would have taken a lot longer since a healed knee would permit him the mobility he lacked, but if he had an enabling wife then it was the path he was already taking.
26
@16 Please do. If I can't be self-sufficient, I don't want to be living anyways... To not be able to control my actions and be dependent on everybody else sounds like torture.
27
@23: She helped him go from 500 to 800. He didn't spend 24/7 in the recliner until his final days. She enabled him by bringing him way more food than he had any business eating, he was incapable of leaving the trailer for quite some time there, so yes she had control of his diet. She's not 100% to blame, but she does have some blame in this, and other enablers need to be aware of what they are doing.
@24: If our health care system was worth a shit he would have been able to get psychiatric and medical help a long time ago that would have steered him away from this path a long time ago. In the article it even says that he wanted help but had no insurance and no way to pay for that help, and he was embarrassed because of that.
@24: If our health care system was worth a shit he would have been able to get psychiatric and medical help a long time ago that would have steered him away from this path a long time ago. In the article it even says that he wanted help but had no insurance and no way to pay for that help, and he was embarrassed because of that.
28
@10: And what was she supposed to do in those eight months after his injury? "Ok, now that you have basically no life outside this recliner, it's time to go on a diet." "Ok, now that you can't even walk, it's time to start a jazzercise routine." "Oh hey, maybe we can get your stomach stapled with all that health insurance we've got."
I can see your point that she let him stay the way he was up until his injury. They both left it way too late, but by the time his knee was shot, I'm saying there was basically zero opportunity for her to do anything.
I can see your point that she let him stay the way he was up until his injury. They both left it way too late, but by the time his knee was shot, I'm saying there was basically zero opportunity for her to do anything.
29
Of course she helped him get fatter. He was 500 pounds when they met -- if she thought he was a hottie at 500, then you know he got a little more hot with every extra pound.
@12: I think he ate LawrimoreHottie69...he seems to have gone missing.
@12: I think he ate LawrimoreHottie69...he seems to have gone missing.
32
If the health care system hadn't been so shitty, he would have gotten help with personal hygiene. Apparently, he was so incapacitated by his knee that he couldn't go to the toilet. He had bed sores from sitting in his on shit and on the same spot. A special bed or wheel chair might have been all he had needed. That's the real scandal.
33
@ 28, I'm not getting you. The man had to have eaten one hell of a huge amount of food to have gained that much that quickly. Now, there may be more to it than meets the eye - he probably had a slow metabolism, which played a part in how big he already was at a relatively young age. But I still don't see him being fed only 2,500 calories a day (the recommended intake for men - and that's presuming a basic level of activity - this guy probably could have subsisted on 1,000 if he was confined to his recliner) and gaining so much so fast.
No, his wife, who undoubtedly acted out of love, probably fed him constantly, and his diet probably was nearly void of fresh fruits and vegetables and high in chips, soda, Twinkies, fast food, and the like. That's how these things almost always work.
It's hard to fault someone who does something out of love, but there are a lot of people who have mental issues that cause their love to manifest itself in enabling other people's problems. It ought to be pointed out when it happens.
No, his wife, who undoubtedly acted out of love, probably fed him constantly, and his diet probably was nearly void of fresh fruits and vegetables and high in chips, soda, Twinkies, fast food, and the like. That's how these things almost always work.
It's hard to fault someone who does something out of love, but there are a lot of people who have mental issues that cause their love to manifest itself in enabling other people's problems. It ought to be pointed out when it happens.
34
We need more flexibility in our health care system. While this man should not be taking up an expensive in-hospital bed, our system easily could include post-care follow up at his home at a fraction of the cost. If he and his wife chose not to accept professional advice on health care by someone who actually sees the situation, then so be it. If you throw a life preserver and the drowning man doesn't reach for it.... oh well.
35
16 - Having a stroke and reaching the weight of five human beings in 33 years is not the same thing.
36
South Carolina is a lot worse than you think, even after you read this.
No, it's really really bad.
Or, at least, that's what my church-going mom who lives there says.
No, it's really really bad.
Or, at least, that's what my church-going mom who lives there says.
37
Dan, you're just reaping what you've been sowing for quite some time. Every time you make one of your posts that mocks fat people or mocks the fat acceptance movement (which is just about fat people saying treat us like human beings and not like pieces of shit, gosh, so much like the gay pride movement!), the comments are a giant shitstorm of people saying hateful things about fat people, making horrible dehumanizing jokes, or spewing a big pile of unhelpful "facts" like "it's easy, it's just calories in/calories out, why are you fatties so dumb that you can't lose weight omg it's soooo easy."
Sometimes there are sympathetic/empathetic commenters, and thank heaven for them. But the majority of the comments on all your weight-related Slog posts? They're fucking horrible, and you wouldn't stand for it if the comments were about any other group other than fatties.
So you're shocked and dismayed that a bunch of Slog tippers sent you that article, all "LOL let's mock the dead fat guy!!!"? I don't understand your reaction. You've created a nice safe space here for exactly that attitude. You've encouraged it.
Sometimes there are sympathetic/empathetic commenters, and thank heaven for them. But the majority of the comments on all your weight-related Slog posts? They're fucking horrible, and you wouldn't stand for it if the comments were about any other group other than fatties.
So you're shocked and dismayed that a bunch of Slog tippers sent you that article, all "LOL let's mock the dead fat guy!!!"? I don't understand your reaction. You've created a nice safe space here for exactly that attitude. You've encouraged it.
38
@37: It really is 99% calories in vs. calories out. Distraction with other stuff, and building up a big mental block that weight loss is some mysterious magical unicorn to be chased is a big part of why many people don't try or fail when they do try.
For 99% of people if they would just eat less every day than they did the day before, and get up off their butts more than they did the day before, they will lose weight. The problem it's a long and winding road, and weight loss isn't a constant downward line, it's bumpy and goes up and down along the way. But if you stick to the simple rules of eating less and moving more, you will lose weight over time.
You have every right to chose not to do that, and I'm not trying to say you're a bad person if you don't. But don't make the lame old excuse that "it's not that easy", because while it's not the easiest thing in the world, it is really that simple.
For 99% of people if they would just eat less every day than they did the day before, and get up off their butts more than they did the day before, they will lose weight. The problem it's a long and winding road, and weight loss isn't a constant downward line, it's bumpy and goes up and down along the way. But if you stick to the simple rules of eating less and moving more, you will lose weight over time.
You have every right to chose not to do that, and I'm not trying to say you're a bad person if you don't. But don't make the lame old excuse that "it's not that easy", because while it's not the easiest thing in the world, it is really that simple.
39
@24- In a hospital he would have:
a) Gotten his knee repaired so he could at least walk.
b) Gotten counselling on diet and exercise, and how to exercise when you're so fat you fuck up your knees.
c) Been fed a reasonable diet for a while.
It would have helped. His death was not inevitable. Plenty of 300 pound people lose weight. Dumping him on his couch with a busted knee certainly made it harder rather than easier for this guy to change the direction of his life.
a) Gotten his knee repaired so he could at least walk.
b) Gotten counselling on diet and exercise, and how to exercise when you're so fat you fuck up your knees.
c) Been fed a reasonable diet for a while.
It would have helped. His death was not inevitable. Plenty of 300 pound people lose weight. Dumping him on his couch with a busted knee certainly made it harder rather than easier for this guy to change the direction of his life.
40
Very poor poster child for health-care reform.
It's one thing to ask the general public to step up and help hard-working people dealt an unforseeable blow by fate. It's another thing entirely to ask the general public to step up and stage interventions for those hell-bent on self-destructive behavior.
To act like there is no such distinction plays into the stereotype of liberals as people who don't believe in personal responsibility. Then again, maybe that's accurate...
It's one thing to ask the general public to step up and help hard-working people dealt an unforseeable blow by fate. It's another thing entirely to ask the general public to step up and stage interventions for those hell-bent on self-destructive behavior.
To act like there is no such distinction plays into the stereotype of liberals as people who don't believe in personal responsibility. Then again, maybe that's accurate...
41
@40- I'd agree, but fat preachers from the deep South seem absurdly popular with Universal Health Care's opposition, so maybe in this case it'd work.
I don't think Dan wants to put this guy on any posters. He's just pointing out how society could have helped avert a tragedy.
I don't think Dan wants to put this guy on any posters. He's just pointing out how society could have helped avert a tragedy.
42
Dave M, no, it's not that simple. Not everyone's body works the same. It's great that diet and exercise worked for you. For a couple of years they worked for me, and now they don't -- nothing changed in my diet and workout habits, but the weight came back, and since my physical health is textbook perfect aside from the fact that I am fat, there's nothing that can be done about it outside of weight loss surgery, which my insurance will not cover because I'm not fat ENOUGH. This is just they way I am built. It's much healthier to accept that and maintain my already healthy lifestyle rather than to do whatever it would take to get skinny enough so that people will treat me like a human being.
I am not going to debate this subject with you. I am tired as hell of debating this subject with people like you and people like Dan Savage, people who insist that I'm just not trying hard enough or just not doing the right things and if I would just try what they did to lose weight it would totally work for me because it worked for them and it's just so simple. Stop assuming that you know what anybody else's body is going to do based on what your own body did.
I am not going to debate this subject with you. I am tired as hell of debating this subject with people like you and people like Dan Savage, people who insist that I'm just not trying hard enough or just not doing the right things and if I would just try what they did to lose weight it would totally work for me because it worked for them and it's just so simple. Stop assuming that you know what anybody else's body is going to do based on what your own body did.
43
Actually, Dave M, you proved my whole point for me. Dan's created a nice safe space here for people to come rag on fat people. And when people like me come here and post comments about their experiences being fat, people like you feel compelled to tell us we're doing it wrong, you minimize our experiences that we share with you, you dismiss everything we say with "well-meaning" advice about what we should be doing to be more acceptable, the "right" kind of people.
It just strikes me as sadly funny is all.
It just strikes me as sadly funny is all.
44
@42 When was the last time you saw an immobile and morbidly obese shut-in who also only consumed 750 calories a day?
Seriously.
Seriously.
45
Knees weren't designed to carry 500 lb people. They undoubtedly told him that at the hospital, as well as informing him about how to lose weight (it's not rocket science, but it does take discipline that is sometimes hard for everyone to muster). Suggesting that he should have been kept in the hospital until he was thin enough for a bum knee to carry him is a ridiculous assertion. This story definitely isn't funny, but neither is it an indictment of the health care system. I don't want a health care system that would have kept this guy in the hospital until he was a svelte 250 and had learned all-new eating habits. That's insane.
46
@44, when was the last time you personally spoke to a morbidly obese shut-in about their diet so that you could speak intelligently about their intake?
Seriously.
Seriously.
47
@43: Wow, HauntedLeg, you sure are ungracious. Dave M could very well have been snide and condescending but he went to great pains to balance his comments and eliminate any accusatory tone.
But hey, you're obviously a bitter fat person who has self-selected not to reduce your caloric intake while also increasing your exercise. You've given up. And while you sit there, growing a little bigger every day, you hate yourself a little more, too, and spew hate spores into society and comment boards.
And by the way, Dan didn't make it safe for me to say that...you did, with your whining, finger-pointing and petulant display above.
But hey, you're obviously a bitter fat person who has self-selected not to reduce your caloric intake while also increasing your exercise. You've given up. And while you sit there, growing a little bigger every day, you hate yourself a little more, too, and spew hate spores into society and comment boards.
And by the way, Dan didn't make it safe for me to say that...you did, with your whining, finger-pointing and petulant display above.
48
@38,
It's the easiest thing in the world? Yeah, that explains why only 3 percent of people who try to lose weight succeed and keep it off over the long term, because it's sooo fucking easy.
It's the easiest thing in the world? Yeah, that explains why only 3 percent of people who try to lose weight succeed and keep it off over the long term, because it's sooo fucking easy.
49
@48: I actually think he's saying the concept of reduce calories/increase exercise is very simple. I see nothing in his posts to indicate he thinks the actual process of DOING so is a (hee hee) cake walk.
50
Ah, yes, baconpussy. Because I disagree with you, I must be a big fat loser, because only big fat losers would disagree with something so obvious and simple (except if it were so obvious and simple, wouldn't there be a lot less fat people?). Oh, and by talking about my own life I'm whining. Yes, of course. Of course. Just keep proving my original point for me. It's quite generous of you.
51
@37 - I agree somewhat in that the obesity in this story adds an unnecessary side issue to the health care problem. I suspect many, many uninsured patients are sent home from hosptials with severe untreated auxillary health problems that fester and increase and ultimately lead to death due to the fear of burgeoning medical bills should they seek follow up care. An uninsured 180 pound man dropped in a recliner with a bum knee and failing kidneys could end up dead, too. They wouldn't release him with failing kidneys and no follow up? Don't be so sure - they don't do the same tests on the uninsured.....
52
And I don't understand how I'm "ungracious". Why must I be gracious to someone who reads my comment and then totally dismisses everything I say? You're certainly not gracious, baconpussy, by leaping into the discussion to call me names. I didn't call anyone names but there you are belittling me. Tell me, what purpose does that serve?
53
#9 - this guy could not even make it to the bathroom. There was something seriously wrong here for that to occur. His knee injury was so serious that he was unable to move from that chair? If that is so - he should NOT have been at home.
I also think food is an addiction for some people. They have proved this with animal studies. What I also think (all on my own) is that not all people are susceptible, and those that are, may not be to the same extent. Think about drugs or cigarettes. Some have no problem stopping - maybe were never addicted. Some have a little trouble. Some have extensive trouble but manage to quit but never stop feeling the draw and even avoid all situations that tempt them. Others NEVER are able to stop. Ever. Even though going through constant attempts, failure every time.
True story. ( : =
I also think food is an addiction for some people. They have proved this with animal studies. What I also think (all on my own) is that not all people are susceptible, and those that are, may not be to the same extent. Think about drugs or cigarettes. Some have no problem stopping - maybe were never addicted. Some have a little trouble. Some have extensive trouble but manage to quit but never stop feeling the draw and even avoid all situations that tempt them. Others NEVER are able to stop. Ever. Even though going through constant attempts, failure every time.
True story. ( : =
54
I'm betting that at least 100 lbs. (and probably more) of the weight gain in the last eight months was fluid related to congestive heart failure.
55
Dwight @ 39, I agree that this incident exacerbated his situation, but I doubt that diet counseling would have gotten him to change his ways, especially with the enabling wife at home.
See me @ 24 again; I acknowledged that he would at least have been able to get around for a while if they fixed his knee, making it likely that he would be alive today. It's much more of a stretch to think that good food and diet while at the hospital, along with counseling (which I wouldn't take as a given) would have made a long term impact on his lifestyle. I can easily imagine his wife sneaking him Ding Dongs while there.
I would agree that not getting treatment was a definitive turn in the end of his life, but it's still more because of how he and his wife handled it rather than because the health care system just didn't care. There are thousands of better examples of our system fucking over and killing people than this.
See me @ 24 again; I acknowledged that he would at least have been able to get around for a while if they fixed his knee, making it likely that he would be alive today. It's much more of a stretch to think that good food and diet while at the hospital, along with counseling (which I wouldn't take as a given) would have made a long term impact on his lifestyle. I can easily imagine his wife sneaking him Ding Dongs while there.
I would agree that not getting treatment was a definitive turn in the end of his life, but it's still more because of how he and his wife handled it rather than because the health care system just didn't care. There are thousands of better examples of our system fucking over and killing people than this.
59
I completely agree with @37, who said exactly what I was thinking. Regardless of who you think is at fault, and whether fat people can or should do whatever it takes to lose weight, the fact is that you fostered the environment, Dan, and the chickens came home to roost.
How you could not make a direct correlation with your other pet cause right now (stuff about the Right fostering an environment that will get the president assassinated and predicting that they will claim they NEVER SAID TO KILL HIM - a matter on which I completely agree with you) is beyond me. Please take a few moments to examine the pattern. The environment you created spawned nasty behavior, in which people lined up to Slog tip you about this man's hilarious morbidly obese death.
How you could not make a direct correlation with your other pet cause right now (stuff about the Right fostering an environment that will get the president assassinated and predicting that they will claim they NEVER SAID TO KILL HIM - a matter on which I completely agree with you) is beyond me. Please take a few moments to examine the pattern. The environment you created spawned nasty behavior, in which people lined up to Slog tip you about this man's hilarious morbidly obese death.
60
What I especially like is that if anyone speaks up in defense of fat people, the trolls here automatically jump in with the HURF DURF BUTTEREATER comments. It's a lot like calling someone a nigger-lover, you know? Keep it classy, Slog.
61
37
"They're fucking horrible, and you wouldn't stand for it if the comments were about any other group other than fatties. "
ever seen a slog thread about catholics?
blacks?
mormons?
dan and slog have plenty of hate to go around.
"They're fucking horrible, and you wouldn't stand for it if the comments were about any other group other than fatties. "
ever seen a slog thread about catholics?
blacks?
mormons?
dan and slog have plenty of hate to go around.
62
haunted leg, you make the classic mistake of thinking that bacon whatever has a useful purpose to the group at large. it seeks only attention from Dan. Dan says A, it supports A. Dan says B, it supports B. you see, Dan hates pitbulls, so all he can afford to keep around is baconpussy. this individual is not alone, so many Dan dittoheads/@sskissers here.
he doesn't really make it a safe place for the insults, but insulting the overweight and obese is completely acceptable here, more than that, it is encouraged and enjoyed by so many.
someone asked who thought that story would be funny? well, it is no surprise to those who read Dan's comments on the overweight that most of his fans would find it funny. that is, until he posts the story online and says it's not. then they all agree that it's not funny but terribly sad, just like Dan said.
while it wouldn't surprise me if 99% of his fans emailed him this story for his pleasure and amusement, it also wouldn't surprise me if that was just a story for Dan to try to balance his usual trashing of the overweight and obese. Once people like you, haunted leg, call him on his bad behavior, he sometimes seems to reflect and then attempt to clarify or in cases like this, try to lessen his more strident opinions on the matter with more stories that attempt to show he isn't completely heartless.
so keep up the good work. and don't let the idiots get you down with their childish grade school "oh yeah, you're fat" comments. now, cue baconpussy with an oh so witty reply about fat ladies singing or some such in reply to this. nothing worse than watching someone without any comedic talent attempt to be witty.
he doesn't really make it a safe place for the insults, but insulting the overweight and obese is completely acceptable here, more than that, it is encouraged and enjoyed by so many.
someone asked who thought that story would be funny? well, it is no surprise to those who read Dan's comments on the overweight that most of his fans would find it funny. that is, until he posts the story online and says it's not. then they all agree that it's not funny but terribly sad, just like Dan said.
while it wouldn't surprise me if 99% of his fans emailed him this story for his pleasure and amusement, it also wouldn't surprise me if that was just a story for Dan to try to balance his usual trashing of the overweight and obese. Once people like you, haunted leg, call him on his bad behavior, he sometimes seems to reflect and then attempt to clarify or in cases like this, try to lessen his more strident opinions on the matter with more stories that attempt to show he isn't completely heartless.
so keep up the good work. and don't let the idiots get you down with their childish grade school "oh yeah, you're fat" comments. now, cue baconpussy with an oh so witty reply about fat ladies singing or some such in reply to this. nothing worse than watching someone without any comedic talent attempt to be witty.
63
Haunted Leg: "Classy" is not now, and never has been a word I'd use to describe Slog. If that's what you're looking for, you're in the wrong place.
64
@62: I think you have me confused with baconcat. He's got more of the doggy lipstick for Dan than do I.
I actually am rather neutral on the whole Dan thing.
But yes, I am childish.
I actually am rather neutral on the whole Dan thing.
But yes, I am childish.
65
The problem isn't just the fact that he didn't have health insurance.
As others have said, he probably wouldn't have ended up losing that weight if he had been able to stay in the hospital. Perhaps he would've been more mobile, and that would've helped him to maintain his weight at the same level for longer, but he probably would have remained morbidly obese.
The problem also lies in American culture. Our food culture, our car culture, and the fact that the government encourages further car usage and unhealthy eating through policies such as corn subsidies, favoring suburbanization, allowing fast food to enter the schools, and junk food to be advertised everywhere (including to young children who don't understand healthy diets or advertising), ballooning food portions at restaurants, etc. When I eat out at a typical American restaurant, I usually end up with two meals, but the sad thing is that for a lot of people, it's just one meal.
So, part of the reason that he didn't exercise or get out was because he was ashamed. But I'm also not sure how "fat acceptance" (in the sense of saying there's nothing wrong with being fat) would have helped him. He clearly needed to lose weight, and not just because it would've made him more attractive (and to be honest, 500 lb people aren't sexy to almost anyone, that's just the way it is, and it's not "oppression" for unhealthy people to be also considered unsexy), but because it really was about his health. I'm sure that fat people could use more support, but I don't think that promoting the notion that there are no negative consequences to being obese would have helped him. Alcoholics can also be too ashamed to get help, but the response to that isn't to say there's nothing wrong.
As others have said, he probably wouldn't have ended up losing that weight if he had been able to stay in the hospital. Perhaps he would've been more mobile, and that would've helped him to maintain his weight at the same level for longer, but he probably would have remained morbidly obese.
The problem also lies in American culture. Our food culture, our car culture, and the fact that the government encourages further car usage and unhealthy eating through policies such as corn subsidies, favoring suburbanization, allowing fast food to enter the schools, and junk food to be advertised everywhere (including to young children who don't understand healthy diets or advertising), ballooning food portions at restaurants, etc. When I eat out at a typical American restaurant, I usually end up with two meals, but the sad thing is that for a lot of people, it's just one meal.
So, part of the reason that he didn't exercise or get out was because he was ashamed. But I'm also not sure how "fat acceptance" (in the sense of saying there's nothing wrong with being fat) would have helped him. He clearly needed to lose weight, and not just because it would've made him more attractive (and to be honest, 500 lb people aren't sexy to almost anyone, that's just the way it is, and it's not "oppression" for unhealthy people to be also considered unsexy), but because it really was about his health. I'm sure that fat people could use more support, but I don't think that promoting the notion that there are no negative consequences to being obese would have helped him. Alcoholics can also be too ashamed to get help, but the response to that isn't to say there's nothing wrong.
66
My parents were starting to get up there (they weren't nearly that high in weight, but probably close to "obese" by BMI) and you know what, they did start to exercise and eat less. They also have been off-and-on on low carb diets (altho I think they generally reduce the amount of refined carbs they have even now).
But probably most importantly is they found something to do for exercise besides go to the gym or using the treadmill (although they do those things too, sometimes). I really can't blame anyone for not going to the gym. I'm fairly thin at this point in my life, but I'll admit my diet isn't the healthiest, and I don't get lots of exercise (but I do walk or bike 2 miles to and from class on weekdays)... but going to the gym is just boring. It's not enjoyable for me. And if I was getting fat, going to the gym would not be at all appealing.
What my parents got into was ballroom dancing, which they do in class and on the weekends at bars/restaurants. Walking or biking to work is far more appealing than going to the gym, but it's not very easy for people in a lot of places in America - which fits with my point that it's American culture - even if you don't want to drive to work, you might have no choice. And not just because you live so far away, but because there aren't sidewalks and bike lanes/paths in as many places.
But probably most importantly is they found something to do for exercise besides go to the gym or using the treadmill (although they do those things too, sometimes). I really can't blame anyone for not going to the gym. I'm fairly thin at this point in my life, but I'll admit my diet isn't the healthiest, and I don't get lots of exercise (but I do walk or bike 2 miles to and from class on weekdays)... but going to the gym is just boring. It's not enjoyable for me. And if I was getting fat, going to the gym would not be at all appealing.
What my parents got into was ballroom dancing, which they do in class and on the weekends at bars/restaurants. Walking or biking to work is far more appealing than going to the gym, but it's not very easy for people in a lot of places in America - which fits with my point that it's American culture - even if you don't want to drive to work, you might have no choice. And not just because you live so far away, but because there aren't sidewalks and bike lanes/paths in as many places.
67
"Here is a quotation from the February 1957 number of the American journal, Antibiotic Medicine and Clinical Therapy:
"Kekwick and Pawan, from the Middlesex Hospital, London, report some news for the obese. All of the obese subjects studied lost weight immediately after admission to hospital and therefore a period of stabilisation was required before commencing investigation.
"If the proportions of fat, carbohydrate and protein were kept constant, the rate of weight loss was then proportional to the calorie intake.
"If the calorie intake was kept constant, however, at 1,000 per day, the most rapid weight loss was noted with high fat diets . . . But when the calorie intake was raised to 2,600 daily in these patients, weight loss would still occur provided that this intake was given mainly in the form of fat and protein.
"It is concluded that from 30 to 50 per cent of weight loss is derived from the total body water and the remaining 50 to 70 per cent from the body fat.
In other words, doctors now have scientific justification for basing diets for obesity on reduction of carbohydrate rather than on reduction of calories and fat." (excerpt from http://ourcivilisation.com/fat/chap1.com )
The doctors placed their obese subjects on 1,000 calorie per day diets, with three different distinctions-one group's diet was comprised of 90% carbs, one group's was 90% protein, and the last group's diet was 90% fat.
Those on the 1,000 calorie-per-day diet that was 90% carbohydrate GAINED WEIGHT!!! 1,000 calories per day--that is considered nearly a starvation diet, and these subjects gained nearly half a pound per day.
The subjects on the 90% protein diet lost over 1/2 pound per day. Those on the 90% fat diet lost nearly one pound per day.
Don't tell me it's calorie in/calorie out and that all calories affect our bodies in the same way. Even when their calories were INCREASED to 2,600 per day, they still lost weight when the diet ratio remained low carbohydrate.
The Kekwik/Pawan study was later confirmed by Dr. Benoit. There are even more studies out there, but those are the only ones I can ever remember the doctors' names, and so they're the only ones I can look up when I'm away from home.
This has nothing to do with exercise--this is entirely diet based, and is tied to our bodies' insulin response. So many people here get hard-ons about scientific evidence for every other topic, but you ignore all the work showing that just cutting calories back and increasing exercise is not the golden ticket to cure obesity that you think it is.
More...
"Kekwick and Pawan, from the Middlesex Hospital, London, report some news for the obese. All of the obese subjects studied lost weight immediately after admission to hospital and therefore a period of stabilisation was required before commencing investigation.
"If the proportions of fat, carbohydrate and protein were kept constant, the rate of weight loss was then proportional to the calorie intake.
"If the calorie intake was kept constant, however, at 1,000 per day, the most rapid weight loss was noted with high fat diets . . . But when the calorie intake was raised to 2,600 daily in these patients, weight loss would still occur provided that this intake was given mainly in the form of fat and protein.
"It is concluded that from 30 to 50 per cent of weight loss is derived from the total body water and the remaining 50 to 70 per cent from the body fat.
In other words, doctors now have scientific justification for basing diets for obesity on reduction of carbohydrate rather than on reduction of calories and fat." (excerpt from http://ourcivilisation.com/fat/chap1.com )
The doctors placed their obese subjects on 1,000 calorie per day diets, with three different distinctions-one group's diet was comprised of 90% carbs, one group's was 90% protein, and the last group's diet was 90% fat.
Those on the 1,000 calorie-per-day diet that was 90% carbohydrate GAINED WEIGHT!!! 1,000 calories per day--that is considered nearly a starvation diet, and these subjects gained nearly half a pound per day.
The subjects on the 90% protein diet lost over 1/2 pound per day. Those on the 90% fat diet lost nearly one pound per day.
Don't tell me it's calorie in/calorie out and that all calories affect our bodies in the same way. Even when their calories were INCREASED to 2,600 per day, they still lost weight when the diet ratio remained low carbohydrate.
The Kekwik/Pawan study was later confirmed by Dr. Benoit. There are even more studies out there, but those are the only ones I can ever remember the doctors' names, and so they're the only ones I can look up when I'm away from home.
This has nothing to do with exercise--this is entirely diet based, and is tied to our bodies' insulin response. So many people here get hard-ons about scientific evidence for every other topic, but you ignore all the work showing that just cutting calories back and increasing exercise is not the golden ticket to cure obesity that you think it is.
68
@29: re your second paragraph: We can only hope, lol. (And no, I HAVEN'T read all the other comments to see if LH69 has shown up.)
69
@46 I dated a former one for 8 months. He went on a hardcore diet of only water and 3 cans of tuna a day, and lost a couple hundred pounds. He still had a lot of skin left from it as well.
So, shut up with your "Some people can't help it if they weight 500lbs." I have little against fat people. BUT, if you're so fat you developed KNEE problems before you hit 30, there's something wrong. If you have to shit your piece of furniture because you're so fat you can't move, that's gross.
So, shut up with your "Some people can't help it if they weight 500lbs." I have little against fat people. BUT, if you're so fat you developed KNEE problems before you hit 30, there's something wrong. If you have to shit your piece of furniture because you're so fat you can't move, that's gross.
70
@69, when did I say some people can't help it if they weigh 500 pounds? You need to calm down. Oh, and your former lover who went on the water and tuna crash diet? That's fucking horrifying. I can't believe you'd advocate that anyone else should do that.
71
I'm pretty sure when they released this guy from the hospital they made it very clear to the wife (and him) he needed to lose weight. He gained 300 lbs in 8 months. His wife was the one responsible for bringing him his meals. I think it's safe to guess she wasn't bringing him salads. There is such a thing as a "feeder". One type seem to have 'Munchausen by proxy syndrome'. They enjoy their status of martyrs and saviors. They enjoy the attention they get for their sacrifice. They enjoy being the center of attention and the sympathy. Illnesses always get worse instead of getting better with those caretakers. There's another type feeder; the smother lover. They feed and feed their loved one until they're too fat too leave. They make it so that they're dependent on them for everything. They tell their victim, "I'm the only one who loves you. I'm the only one who could ever love you."
@ 45,
He should have gone to a nursing home. Long term facilities are for people who are physically unable to care for themselves. For people on medicaid and medicare, there's a 2+ year waiting list to get in one. If we had socialized medicine people could get into privately run nursing homes instead of dying alone at home.
@ 45,
He should have gone to a nursing home. Long term facilities are for people who are physically unable to care for themselves. For people on medicaid and medicare, there's a 2+ year waiting list to get in one. If we had socialized medicine people could get into privately run nursing homes instead of dying alone at home.
72
If he had insurance he probably would've been assigned a dietician and counselor and maybe he would've gotten better.
I don't think that being healthy and being thin are mutually exclusive, eating healthy and exercising are good for you, but you should do them because they make you feel good, regardless of whether you lose weight.
I don't think that being healthy and being thin are mutually exclusive, eating healthy and exercising are good for you, but you should do them because they make you feel good, regardless of whether you lose weight.
73
@70: Don't be horrified by the diet. Embrace the diet. You might end up getting laid. Which is the clear antidote to dislodging that churlish bug up your cooter.
74
If I'm calculating right (and I might not be), doesn't that mean that he was being served around 4,500 calories per day ABOVE the amount necessary to maintain his weight? That's some enabling!
75
@70 far less horrifying than shitting your furniture.
It's more than what you get to eat if you get a stomach band.
And, he was able to enjoy life again once he got down to a managable overweight from a morbidly obese. It's called being healthy.
It's more than what you get to eat if you get a stomach band.
And, he was able to enjoy life again once he got down to a managable overweight from a morbidly obese. It's called being healthy.
76
With single-payer, the dude would have never been able to get treatment for his non-life-threatening knee issue in the first place, and anyone that thinks they'd be willing or able to lift a finger for him after he eclipsed the 500lb mark is smoking crack. Lots of cost, miniscule benefit = dead fat guy. Sorry.
77
The ignorance of the medical realities of super-obesity is staggering. People who don't have deranged metabolisms CANNOT, no matter how much they stuff themselves, eat enough to weigh 800 pounds. Studies of normal-weight prisoners who volunteered to overeat until they gained weight all rapidly lost it without dieting -- just by going back to their normal eating habits -- once the study was over. Sumo wrestlers have to work on carefully crafted weight gain diets to put on the levels of fat they're seeking. It's not easy.
Those who are not super-obese so often think that the lifestyle changes they utilize to control their normal weight or take off a few pounds they gained over the holidays will also work for the super-obese, but this is almost never the case. Those lessons just don't address the issues that are truly in play, and the reality is that virtually no super-obese people lose large amounts of weight without medical interventions ranging from bariatric surgery to medically supervised fasts and skin reduction surgery.
Sometimes, especially when caught early enough, lifestyle changes do the trick, but it has NOTHING to do with "will power" or any other virtue -- it's because exercise and changing what you eat, such as eliminating carbohydrate levels that jack up your blood sugar, IN AND OF THEMSELVES alter the metabolism.
But sometimes the condition has progressed beyond that point, and there is no hope at all without a medical intervention -- because extreme obesity is a MEDICAL condition. And yes, like many medical problems, it may have a psychological component, but in my experience, that's more often the result of the metabolic disorder than the cause of extreme obesity.
For example, I lost 187 pounds and have kept it off for more than 6 years now. I did it with a therapeutic controlled-carb diet. The minute I went on that diet -- which was NOT a controlled calorie diet -- and got off the blood sugar roller coaster, I found my constant sense of starvation and complete lack of energy, both of which I thought were "emotional" problems, vanished overnight.
Not everyone is as lucky as I was, to find what worked to turn my metabolic disorder around on my first try. I have friends who have spent 20 years of their lives desperately seeking the thing that would work for them. For most, the ultimate answer was bariatric surgery -- an expensive and dangerous procedure that is also a MEDICAL one.
If you haven't walked a mile in the metabolism of a super-obese person, most likely you have no idea what the fuck you're talking about. In which case, shutting up is a very, very, very good idea. The person who said this guy took the "easy" way should most particularly consider taking that advice. The idea that it's "easy" to lie in a chair and eat until you die, shitting and pissing where you lie, is callous and irrational. Most extremely obese people I know wish they could never see food again as long as they live. I know I did.
I'm grateful for the change in my life, but instead of walking around telling people, "I did it, therefore you can too!", I have chosen not to forget what it was like to be trapped in the hell of super-obesity, and to try to have compassion for those who, unlike me, did not find a path out before the medical care that most cannot afford or obtain without health insurance (and often not even then) became the only hope.
More...
Those who are not super-obese so often think that the lifestyle changes they utilize to control their normal weight or take off a few pounds they gained over the holidays will also work for the super-obese, but this is almost never the case. Those lessons just don't address the issues that are truly in play, and the reality is that virtually no super-obese people lose large amounts of weight without medical interventions ranging from bariatric surgery to medically supervised fasts and skin reduction surgery.
Sometimes, especially when caught early enough, lifestyle changes do the trick, but it has NOTHING to do with "will power" or any other virtue -- it's because exercise and changing what you eat, such as eliminating carbohydrate levels that jack up your blood sugar, IN AND OF THEMSELVES alter the metabolism.
But sometimes the condition has progressed beyond that point, and there is no hope at all without a medical intervention -- because extreme obesity is a MEDICAL condition. And yes, like many medical problems, it may have a psychological component, but in my experience, that's more often the result of the metabolic disorder than the cause of extreme obesity.
For example, I lost 187 pounds and have kept it off for more than 6 years now. I did it with a therapeutic controlled-carb diet. The minute I went on that diet -- which was NOT a controlled calorie diet -- and got off the blood sugar roller coaster, I found my constant sense of starvation and complete lack of energy, both of which I thought were "emotional" problems, vanished overnight.
Not everyone is as lucky as I was, to find what worked to turn my metabolic disorder around on my first try. I have friends who have spent 20 years of their lives desperately seeking the thing that would work for them. For most, the ultimate answer was bariatric surgery -- an expensive and dangerous procedure that is also a MEDICAL one.
If you haven't walked a mile in the metabolism of a super-obese person, most likely you have no idea what the fuck you're talking about. In which case, shutting up is a very, very, very good idea. The person who said this guy took the "easy" way should most particularly consider taking that advice. The idea that it's "easy" to lie in a chair and eat until you die, shitting and pissing where you lie, is callous and irrational. Most extremely obese people I know wish they could never see food again as long as they live. I know I did.
I'm grateful for the change in my life, but instead of walking around telling people, "I did it, therefore you can too!", I have chosen not to forget what it was like to be trapped in the hell of super-obesity, and to try to have compassion for those who, unlike me, did not find a path out before the medical care that most cannot afford or obtain without health insurance (and often not even then) became the only hope.
78
@77 -- A mish mash of opinion, personal anecdote and scolding. Glad you're thinner now and hope you stay that way. It's too hard to sort out all your garble in your empassioned note.
To be over 300 pounds takes some major effort in order to keep supplying the body calories enough to turn to fat. The body doesn't spontaneously create fat, and the body will indeed lose weight if food stops coming --- it's called starvation and is well documented in countless ways.
Poorly designed weight reduction diets do not take into account a variety of needs and the balance necessary to maintain health.
Exercise is necessary in many ways.
But to assert as many have here that reducing food intake won't result in weight loss is just plain stupid.
The guy's wife has to be more mentally imparied than he was to keep bringing him enormous amounts of food, clean his body as best she could, smell his rotting flesh all day and watch him die in front of her without calling for help.
PS -- I am a former fattie, if it matters to you.
To be over 300 pounds takes some major effort in order to keep supplying the body calories enough to turn to fat. The body doesn't spontaneously create fat, and the body will indeed lose weight if food stops coming --- it's called starvation and is well documented in countless ways.
Poorly designed weight reduction diets do not take into account a variety of needs and the balance necessary to maintain health.
Exercise is necessary in many ways.
But to assert as many have here that reducing food intake won't result in weight loss is just plain stupid.
The guy's wife has to be more mentally imparied than he was to keep bringing him enormous amounts of food, clean his body as best she could, smell his rotting flesh all day and watch him die in front of her without calling for help.
PS -- I am a former fattie, if it matters to you.
79
@76: I live in Canada. My boyfriend's uncle used to be around 500lbs. With our nice little socialized medicare, he was able to get dietary help, as well as back surgery that he got from being obese. He is now 190. So yes, it does work.
80
My landlady is almost 400 lbs, and she mostly eats McDonalds, Burger King, pizza, lasagna, and ice cream. I have never seen her walk anywhere. We live in Canada, so at least if she ends up immobilized, there will be help for her.
81
I'm overweight, but not obese - I carry about 50# more than I should [and, yes, it's from not exercising]. Anyway, my knee was crushed in a car accident - I mean CRUSHED. The doctor's wanted to amputate and I nearly threw up the first time I saw it when I woke up after the accident. I refused the amputation and - because I had great health insurance - was able to get the 9 surgeries to rebuild the damn thing.
So I've been hopsitalized 9 times for a messed-up knee. The hospital staff made me stand up, weight bearing, on my injuried (sometimes broken) leg every time. It is standard medical practice. This guy would have been treated the same - they wouldn't have released him at all if he hadn't been able to stand for 120 seconds. In my case there was never a time when I could not get out of bed to use the bathroom (no bedpans for me - uck!). ONE TIME I needed help, but most of the time I was able to get by with just a crutch. And I'm not in great athletic shape by a long stretch of the imagination.
My point in boring you with this story is that this poor dead fat man DID NOT have to be confined to his recliner. He should have been able to get out of the chair to use the toilet. He might have needed his wife's help, sure. He could have lifed his torso with his arms, then leaned on her to the bathroom - she wouldn't have had to carry him or even support most of his weight. But you don't get so weak that you can't get out of a chair - with or without a busted knee - unless you really try.
Yeah, the lack of health care was partially responsible for killing this man. But he certainly did nothing to help himself.
So I've been hopsitalized 9 times for a messed-up knee. The hospital staff made me stand up, weight bearing, on my injuried (sometimes broken) leg every time. It is standard medical practice. This guy would have been treated the same - they wouldn't have released him at all if he hadn't been able to stand for 120 seconds. In my case there was never a time when I could not get out of bed to use the bathroom (no bedpans for me - uck!). ONE TIME I needed help, but most of the time I was able to get by with just a crutch. And I'm not in great athletic shape by a long stretch of the imagination.
My point in boring you with this story is that this poor dead fat man DID NOT have to be confined to his recliner. He should have been able to get out of the chair to use the toilet. He might have needed his wife's help, sure. He could have lifed his torso with his arms, then leaned on her to the bathroom - she wouldn't have had to carry him or even support most of his weight. But you don't get so weak that you can't get out of a chair - with or without a busted knee - unless you really try.
Yeah, the lack of health care was partially responsible for killing this man. But he certainly did nothing to help himself.
82
Ya know, gaining 300 pounds in 8 months is an indication of an underlying medical problem in addition to the starting weight. If he had weighed 150 and gained like that, he would have been hospitalized with pancreatic cancer or kidney failures or congestive heart failure or some such.
But because he was obese to begin with, the only reason for his continued weight gain had to be his wife overfeeding him. You can be obese and still fall prey to illnesses not predicated on your weight.
If he had lost 200 pounds in that time frame I hope someone would have recognized that there might be a wasting problem, such as AIDS.But no, all of the medical problems of the obese stem from their weight, and any weight loss is a good thing, no matter how abnormal it is.
But because he was obese to begin with, the only reason for his continued weight gain had to be his wife overfeeding him. You can be obese and still fall prey to illnesses not predicated on your weight.
If he had lost 200 pounds in that time frame I hope someone would have recognized that there might be a wasting problem, such as AIDS.But no, all of the medical problems of the obese stem from their weight, and any weight loss is a good thing, no matter how abnormal it is.
83
I am at 300 - and have been for a decade.
6' 4" - and big framed and hung and hairy and handsome.
I never get called fat. Yes, bearish.
Fuck you skinny tiny people.
6' 4" - and big framed and hung and hairy and handsome.
I never get called fat. Yes, bearish.
Fuck you skinny tiny people.
84
"Fat" can be simply a descriptor of someone's % body fat and sort of a clinical, medical term. Some people use the term this way with no malice. However, there is this classist, moralistic judgement that often gets wrapped up with calling someone "fat." Colloquially, "fat" often has connotations of ugly and lazy = stupid = worthless human being. There is that tone of utter contempt in people's voices when they say the word. Fat = worthless human being is not true, and that, I'm pretty sure, is what "fat rights" people take issue with.
Sure, many people who are overweight are undisciplined in their diet and exercise. Many have some minor impulse control problems. But it doesn't mean that they are intellectually lazy or intellectually undisciplined. That is an association gone too far.
Furthermore, weight seems to go hand-and-hand with people's notion of what 'class' is. This gets played out on TV because the smart and classy protagonists are always thin and then the only time you see overweight people is on Jerry Springer. Since our society is pretty class-stratified in a very scary social-'Darwinism' sort of way, this is maybe the root of the problem.
Sure, many people who are overweight are undisciplined in their diet and exercise. Many have some minor impulse control problems. But it doesn't mean that they are intellectually lazy or intellectually undisciplined. That is an association gone too far.
Furthermore, weight seems to go hand-and-hand with people's notion of what 'class' is. This gets played out on TV because the smart and classy protagonists are always thin and then the only time you see overweight people is on Jerry Springer. Since our society is pretty class-stratified in a very scary social-'Darwinism' sort of way, this is maybe the root of the problem.
85
@81: Schweighsr, maybe the hospital you used has the 120-second standing rule, but not all do. I was in the Swedish Hospital ER two weeks ago with a back injury--had to be taken in by stretcher in an ambulance because I couldn't walk to a car or sit up in one-- and literally could not stand even for five seconds. In fact, sitting straight up was more pain than I could manage. I repeatedly asked to be admitted to the hospital overnight as I was going to be unable to make it to the bathroom in my home and they repeatedly declined. I am insured, but they still sent me home that day. It took about 20 excruciating minutes for me to be taken off the bed and put into a wheelchair. And no, I'm not obese.
86
I live in Canada and have a friend that was severely obese. With our universal health care, she received medication for her low thyroid, and treatment for her previously-undiagnosed ADHD (which she had unknowingly self-medicated with chocolate, since it made it easier for her to concentrate). Since then, she's been able to get onto a lifestyle routine that's led to her losing about 40lbs in the last 9 months. She still has a ways to go, but she's amazingly more healthy.
Who knows what this guy had going on that made him reach 500 lbs by the time he got married? If he had access to a yearly physical, there's at least some chance that something would have come up. Even if he didn't, perhaps they would have figured out something in hospital, if the doctors weren't doing the minimum possible to get him out of there without charging him too much.
Who knows what this guy had going on that made him reach 500 lbs by the time he got married? If he had access to a yearly physical, there's at least some chance that something would have come up. Even if he didn't, perhaps they would have figured out something in hospital, if the doctors weren't doing the minimum possible to get him out of there without charging him too much.
87
@79/86- Your reality-based examples will not sway the minds of the faith (in God and God's perfect tool, The Market)-based reasoning of the anti-universal care citizens of America.
88
@67 and 77: Glad you both brought up the huge effects of refined carbohydrates on weight gain. I get really tired of reading the endless "calories in calories out is the only fact of weight loss" comments in these threads. Everyone who is interested in passing judgement on the obese should first read "Good Calories Bad Calories" by Gary Taubes.
89
Just some general drive-by comments:
1. A multi-billion dollar industry has a compelling interest in selling crash diets to fat people and pimping the idea that fat people need crash diets.
2. Crash diets and yo-yo dieting transform the human body into an incredibly efficient fat generating a fat storing engine.
3. Someone who is already obese will have a very difficult time reversing the damage they've already done to their body's metabolism, and statistics indicate that most who try will fail.
4. Regular, consistent exercise, combined with moderate intake of healthy foods will, in almost all cases, lead to a healthy (or healthier) body, other environmental and emotional factors being equal. In the case of the morbidly obese, this process happens far too slowly for people to overcome the bad habits that made them fat in the first place.
5. The industrialization of the food supply, creating toxic, edible substances like high fructose corn syrup and partially hydrogenated vegetable oils, has produced a high-calorie, low nutrition diet for most Americans. Human bodies are poorly adapted to the American diet.
6. A lot of people with naturally efficient metabolisms and relatively healthy lifestyles are, in fact, insensitive jerks who don't have a clue how difficult it is for obese people to become healthy against cultural and statistical odds.
7. A lot of obese people are, in fact, lazy and/or stupid liars who, for shame or denial, need to believe that becoming healthy is a magical process out of their reach.
Where does all of this leave us? A few common-sense principles. Be nice to people whether they're skinny, fat, or somewhere in between. Never promote a crash diet; they are all inherently unhealthy, life-threatening, money-making scams. Don't buy or consume processed foods. If you are obese, be honest with yourself and others about how you got that way, and choose either to do something about it or not.
More...
1. A multi-billion dollar industry has a compelling interest in selling crash diets to fat people and pimping the idea that fat people need crash diets.
2. Crash diets and yo-yo dieting transform the human body into an incredibly efficient fat generating a fat storing engine.
3. Someone who is already obese will have a very difficult time reversing the damage they've already done to their body's metabolism, and statistics indicate that most who try will fail.
4. Regular, consistent exercise, combined with moderate intake of healthy foods will, in almost all cases, lead to a healthy (or healthier) body, other environmental and emotional factors being equal. In the case of the morbidly obese, this process happens far too slowly for people to overcome the bad habits that made them fat in the first place.
5. The industrialization of the food supply, creating toxic, edible substances like high fructose corn syrup and partially hydrogenated vegetable oils, has produced a high-calorie, low nutrition diet for most Americans. Human bodies are poorly adapted to the American diet.
6. A lot of people with naturally efficient metabolisms and relatively healthy lifestyles are, in fact, insensitive jerks who don't have a clue how difficult it is for obese people to become healthy against cultural and statistical odds.
7. A lot of obese people are, in fact, lazy and/or stupid liars who, for shame or denial, need to believe that becoming healthy is a magical process out of their reach.
Where does all of this leave us? A few common-sense principles. Be nice to people whether they're skinny, fat, or somewhere in between. Never promote a crash diet; they are all inherently unhealthy, life-threatening, money-making scams. Don't buy or consume processed foods. If you are obese, be honest with yourself and others about how you got that way, and choose either to do something about it or not.
Most Commented on Slog
-
Stephen Fry v. the Catholic Church by Dan Savage
-
Neologism Needed by Dan Savage
-
Palin's Cheat Sheet by Dan Savage
-
SL Letter of the Day: The Toilet Brush Off by Dan Savage
-
Straight Up by Dan Savage
-
Every Child Deserves a Mother and a Father by Dan Savage
-
Tea Party Crowd Believes That Only Good Spellers Should Vote by Dan Savage
-
Every Child Deserves a Mother and a Father by Dan Savage
-
The Green Police Super Bowl Commercial by Charles Mudede
-
Was This On Slog Yesterday? by Dan Savage
RSS
Facebook
Twitter
Comments (90) RSS