Sunday, November 1, 2009
Crime Stay Tuned: More Details on the Shooting
Posted by Dominic Holden on Sun, Nov 1, 2009 at 11:03 AM
Seattle Police will provide more information about last night's tragic shooting of two officers, one fatal, sometime this afternoon. Police haven't yet settled on a time for their press briefing, according to SPD spokesman Mark Jamieson. We'll have someone there and will post an update as soon as we have more information. (The Seattle Times appears to have the most detailed info this morning).
In the meantime, this is just devastatingly sad. Police officers are the gutsiest people on our streets, our closest approximations of Supermen and Wonder Women. That someone would shoot two of them—while they're just sitting in a parked patrol car—makes my heart bleed. (Yes, I know that not every officer is an angel, but we have a good bunch in Seattle and no cop, or anyone, deserves this.) Homicide detectives are out in force, doing whatever magic they do to catch the fucking scum who shot these two. But what do we do—us ordinary folks who aren't superheroes?
UPDATE: Seattle Police will hold a press briefing at 3:00 p.m. Eli will post the details.
UPDATE 2: The Seattle Times reports that the victim was nine-year police veteran Timothy Brenton, 39, who was married and had two young kids, according to the officer's uncle.
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1
Excuse me? Who are you sucking up to, Mr. Holden?
http://www.thestranger.com/seattle/Conte…
November 27, 2007
NEWS
Head Banger
Eyewitnesses Shocked at Police Conduct
by JONAH SPANGENTHAL-LEE
On November 23, two men lay handcuffed on the ground near the intersection of Northeast 45th Street and University Way. A crowd gathered in front of the nearby Sureshot Cafe and, according to witnesses, watched as two officers held one of the men down while another officer bashed the man's head into the pavement "10 or 15 times." As if the scene weren't dramatic enough, "Someone in the crowd pointed to the... newspaper dispenser we were all standing around," says Alan Gibson, who witnessed the incident. "[It] read 'City settles suit with man beaten by police.'"
http://www.thestranger.com/seattle/Conte…
November 27, 2007
NEWS
Head Banger
Eyewitnesses Shocked at Police Conduct
by JONAH SPANGENTHAL-LEE
On November 23, two men lay handcuffed on the ground near the intersection of Northeast 45th Street and University Way. A crowd gathered in front of the nearby Sureshot Cafe and, according to witnesses, watched as two officers held one of the men down while another officer bashed the man's head into the pavement "10 or 15 times." As if the scene weren't dramatic enough, "Someone in the crowd pointed to the... newspaper dispenser we were all standing around," says Alan Gibson, who witnessed the incident. "[It] read 'City settles suit with man beaten by police.'"
2
@1
What's your point?
That the "Stranger" should never print any stories critical of the police? The police are never above the law and media outlets have an obligation t investigate all matters of police misconduct.
The world is not black and white. One can respect police officers that do their job while at the same time be vigilant against abuse.
Your post is absurd.
What's your point?
That the "Stranger" should never print any stories critical of the police? The police are never above the law and media outlets have an obligation t investigate all matters of police misconduct.
The world is not black and white. One can respect police officers that do their job while at the same time be vigilant against abuse.
Your post is absurd.
3
What is it with unregistered dopes who include links in their posts? Don't you notice that they don't turn into hyperlinks when you preview them?
5
Dom's reacting emotionally, which is valid.
My dad was a Chicago cop and a homicide detective. He'd be the first to tell you that cops aren't superheroes. But the shooting is tragic and sad. My mom, who gave me her worrywartism, used to start every time the phone rang when my dad was at work... because she didn't it to be "the call," the calls the families of those two cops got last night.
I feel for them too. Sad, sad, sad.
My dad was a Chicago cop and a homicide detective. He'd be the first to tell you that cops aren't superheroes. But the shooting is tragic and sad. My mom, who gave me her worrywartism, used to start every time the phone rang when my dad was at work... because she didn't it to be "the call," the calls the families of those two cops got last night.
I feel for them too. Sad, sad, sad.
6
The List Grows (last 3 months):
1) Cop Killing
2) Killing at Federal Way Transit Center
3) Slaying on Kent East Hill
4) Shooting at South Center parking lot
The List Grows (last 3 months):
1) Cop Killing
2) Killing at Federal Way Transit Center
3) Slaying on Kent East Hill
4) Shooting at South Center parking lot
9
@1- Yeah there are abusive cops. Just like there are abusive black people. The vast majority of times I've been threatened by strangers in Seattle they were young African Americans. Why is it okay to hate cops based on, say, the above instance you mentioned..... yet not okay to have hostile feelings about young black people based on maudi gras killing, the stomping murder of Eric Towes, James Paroline, Tuba Man, nightclub shootints, and countless amounts of serious random crime downtown and belltown that are disproporatitely black on white?
10
I can't find the word "black" anywhere in the Seattle Times article, or the CD News reporting, or Seattlecrime.com, or the SPD Blotter.
11
Stop looking at anyone as superheros, okay?
Not Obama, not cops, not Spaghetti monster in the sky.
There are heros and those who fall short in everyone one of us, in every group, and our focus needs to be on strengthening the forces for what is noble and going after what is base.
For example, if cops were not so abusive at times, and if our society as a whole wasn't so abusive and racist as to make African American communities criminals because of our silly drug laws, can't toke pot but a fifth of tanqueray is a okay, then maybe, just maybe
we'd have more of the citizenry more aligned with the good cops
and maybe they'd cooperate more.
But as long as we continue these ridiculous drug laws we are the ones plaguing communities with crime and making them unpolicable and plaguging the cops with the job of locking up half the black males who like half the white males do do drugs sometimes.
IOW if we all take care of business better for everyone, our society needs to be set up so no one is a superhero but we collectively are.
Not Obama, not cops, not Spaghetti monster in the sky.
There are heros and those who fall short in everyone one of us, in every group, and our focus needs to be on strengthening the forces for what is noble and going after what is base.
For example, if cops were not so abusive at times, and if our society as a whole wasn't so abusive and racist as to make African American communities criminals because of our silly drug laws, can't toke pot but a fifth of tanqueray is a okay, then maybe, just maybe
we'd have more of the citizenry more aligned with the good cops
and maybe they'd cooperate more.
But as long as we continue these ridiculous drug laws we are the ones plaguing communities with crime and making them unpolicable and plaguging the cops with the job of locking up half the black males who like half the white males do do drugs sometimes.
IOW if we all take care of business better for everyone, our society needs to be set up so no one is a superhero but we collectively are.
12
I'm just tired of seeing that assumption in the comments. Maybe it will turn out to be a (black) gang thing, but I haven't forgotten the OK City bombing, when everybody was screaming "Arab" and it turned out to be McVeigh.
Also tired of assumptions (not so much in Slog, but the Times comments, etc.) about the CD.
OK I'm done. I hate commenting.
Also tired of assumptions (not so much in Slog, but the Times comments, etc.) about the CD.
OK I'm done. I hate commenting.
13
@ 12 is right. If you read the reports, it's possible that the surviving officer didn't even see the assailants clearly at all. Yeah, yeah, it's the CD so chances are they're black, but so fucking what? It won't matter until the police can tell you who they're looking for.
Jason doe's posts reveal far more about jason doe than they do about the case at hand.
Jason doe's posts reveal far more about jason doe than they do about the case at hand.
16
I find it hilarious that noone has yet thought of asking Mayor McCheese about his reaction to the random shooting of a police officer with a handgun.
I wonder if the shooter will have a valid concealed weapon's permit?
I wonder how this logic will play out with his asinine decision regarding his official position of concealed weapons in the public's hands? Just imagine if someone who formerly had a formerly legal concealed weapon in their possession, who decided to follow McCheese's version of reality and was present and able to render assistance, yet due to his law no longer carried said weapon.
But I'm sure Mayor McCheese would tell you that on average we'd rather see random people targeted and assassinated on city streets...
'cause you know..... like there is no random violence in the world, and especially in Seattle city limits...
just ask any hipster... they'll tell you that if only we had a city wide gun ban this tragedy would surely have never happened...
right?
I wonder if the shooter will have a valid concealed weapon's permit?
I wonder how this logic will play out with his asinine decision regarding his official position of concealed weapons in the public's hands? Just imagine if someone who formerly had a formerly legal concealed weapon in their possession, who decided to follow McCheese's version of reality and was present and able to render assistance, yet due to his law no longer carried said weapon.
But I'm sure Mayor McCheese would tell you that on average we'd rather see random people targeted and assassinated on city streets...
'cause you know..... like there is no random violence in the world, and especially in Seattle city limits...
just ask any hipster... they'll tell you that if only we had a city wide gun ban this tragedy would surely have never happened...
right?
18
@16: Yeah, if only an armed person trained in the use of their weapon had been present at the scene, things would've turned out differently. You know, like an on-duty police officer, armed with a service revolver.
19
Just imagine if someone who formerly had a formerly legal concealed weapon in their possession, who decided to follow McCheese's version of reality and was present and able to render assistance, yet due to his law no longer carried said weapon.
Or maybe they'd do as good as job as Officer Nick Davis (killed when he fought with a man who had fled a First Hill restaurant without paying the bill. The man was able to gain control of Davis' gun, shooting and killing the officer) or would-be hero Dan McKown (the guy who pulled a gun on the Tacoma Mall shooter and was shot five times, leaving him, McKown, paralyzed for life).
Can't wait to see how the UW vigilante force (University District Defenders) do in upcoming months.
Remember, every illegally gun on the streets starts off as a legally owned one.
Or maybe they'd do as good as job as Officer Nick Davis (killed when he fought with a man who had fled a First Hill restaurant without paying the bill. The man was able to gain control of Davis' gun, shooting and killing the officer) or would-be hero Dan McKown (the guy who pulled a gun on the Tacoma Mall shooter and was shot five times, leaving him, McKown, paralyzed for life).
Can't wait to see how the UW vigilante force (University District Defenders) do in upcoming months.
Remember, every illegally gun on the streets starts off as a legally owned one.
20
I just love some of the morons who try posting to SLOG... it really fuels my desire to read humor every day to see the Simpleton responses...
@18 my response to you is "Yeah... you know... like those on scene who were completely ambushed at random had any chance trapped in their vehicles. You know... in the horrifying moments directly after the first bullets flew".... I'm sure that a rookie cop in the drivers seat was the best person on scene to render assistance and fight back right? Much better than someone who wasn't directly in the line of fire, could assess the situation to render assistance to the Police in a moment of terror, and provide possible valuable assistance by changing the equation a bit, and providing some firecover for the officers under siege... right? I'm pretty sure if citizen had just happened by with a weapon, and started firing at the suspect vehicle, at the very least it would have distracted the thug and turned his attention to the other fire, thus providing valuable milliseconds that might have provided those officers with time to duck, find cover, escape, gather their bearings etc, and instead of 1 dead officer, maybe we'd have saved a valuable life.
But go with your thoughts moron. Your snarkiness belies your lack of intellectual ability...
And tiktok we've proven here on numerous occassions that you are a stupid fucking credulous hack of the highest degree...
If we lived in your world, only criminals would have guns, as you'd disarm all the police right?
I would much rather have a world of brave private citizens like McKown, than some moron hipster like yourself. At least McKown acted honorably in his attempts at defending himself and others in another tragedy. Imagine how much worse the situation might have been if the Tacom mall shooter had extra time to go around finding defenseless mall goers, instead of having to spend precious seconds directing his attention at someone who could kill him for his actions. That situation might have otherwise resulted in dozens more citizens being shot.
And your last comment is so completely moronic it would be laughable if you didn't believe in your own words, which makes it downright sad. First you might try completely an accurate sentence, but I won't waste time mocking you for that.
Rather I'll mock your logic. It's a pathetic play on words that you still demonize a piece of metal instead of focusing on what it takes to use the tool. You provide a typical liberal whack job response, which I thank you for. It again shows that you refuse to assign blame where it belongs. Time and time again it has been pointed out that in places where guns have been outright banned, only criminals have guns. In fact London PD has gone back to carrying guns after the infamous London gun ban only stripped guns out of the hands of law abiding citizens. The criminals outgunned the police, and Scotland Yard etc were forced to go back to arming their officers who came to a gun fight with billy clubs.
Yes Tiktok as has been pointed out to you earlier... you are the classic liberal who benefits from an armed citizenry and police force keeping you safe(r) in this country, than you otherwise would be in other countries rife with lawlessness. What "right" guarantees your ability to speak, write/blog so freely again? And what right protects that right? Can you connect the dots?
I bet not.
/soapbox
More...
@18 my response to you is "Yeah... you know... like those on scene who were completely ambushed at random had any chance trapped in their vehicles. You know... in the horrifying moments directly after the first bullets flew".... I'm sure that a rookie cop in the drivers seat was the best person on scene to render assistance and fight back right? Much better than someone who wasn't directly in the line of fire, could assess the situation to render assistance to the Police in a moment of terror, and provide possible valuable assistance by changing the equation a bit, and providing some firecover for the officers under siege... right? I'm pretty sure if citizen had just happened by with a weapon, and started firing at the suspect vehicle, at the very least it would have distracted the thug and turned his attention to the other fire, thus providing valuable milliseconds that might have provided those officers with time to duck, find cover, escape, gather their bearings etc, and instead of 1 dead officer, maybe we'd have saved a valuable life.
But go with your thoughts moron. Your snarkiness belies your lack of intellectual ability...
And tiktok we've proven here on numerous occassions that you are a stupid fucking credulous hack of the highest degree...
If we lived in your world, only criminals would have guns, as you'd disarm all the police right?
I would much rather have a world of brave private citizens like McKown, than some moron hipster like yourself. At least McKown acted honorably in his attempts at defending himself and others in another tragedy. Imagine how much worse the situation might have been if the Tacom mall shooter had extra time to go around finding defenseless mall goers, instead of having to spend precious seconds directing his attention at someone who could kill him for his actions. That situation might have otherwise resulted in dozens more citizens being shot.
And your last comment is so completely moronic it would be laughable if you didn't believe in your own words, which makes it downright sad. First you might try completely an accurate sentence, but I won't waste time mocking you for that.
Rather I'll mock your logic. It's a pathetic play on words that you still demonize a piece of metal instead of focusing on what it takes to use the tool. You provide a typical liberal whack job response, which I thank you for. It again shows that you refuse to assign blame where it belongs. Time and time again it has been pointed out that in places where guns have been outright banned, only criminals have guns. In fact London PD has gone back to carrying guns after the infamous London gun ban only stripped guns out of the hands of law abiding citizens. The criminals outgunned the police, and Scotland Yard etc were forced to go back to arming their officers who came to a gun fight with billy clubs.
Yes Tiktok as has been pointed out to you earlier... you are the classic liberal who benefits from an armed citizenry and police force keeping you safe(r) in this country, than you otherwise would be in other countries rife with lawlessness. What "right" guarantees your ability to speak, write/blog so freely again? And what right protects that right? Can you connect the dots?
I bet not.
/soapbox
21
What do we do?
We snitch on the pussy-assed bastard, that's what we (should) do!
You gotta beef and you wanna be a Man? Then walk up on on him face to face and try to draw, old west styley.
Sucka-punches are for pussies, which makes this worthless, no-dick, piece-of-shit guy the King of the Ball-less Wusses!
He gets no respect. He gets no cred. He gets no sanction.
Rat his motherfuckin ass out or give him a bullet to the back of the head. He only gets those two options. Period!
We snitch on the pussy-assed bastard, that's what we (should) do!
You gotta beef and you wanna be a Man? Then walk up on on him face to face and try to draw, old west styley.
Sucka-punches are for pussies, which makes this worthless, no-dick, piece-of-shit guy the King of the Ball-less Wusses!
He gets no respect. He gets no cred. He gets no sanction.
Rat his motherfuckin ass out or give him a bullet to the back of the head. He only gets those two options. Period!
22
@16/20 " Just imagine if someone who formerly had a formerly legal concealed weapon in their possession, who decided to follow McCheese's version of reality and was present and able to render assistance, yet due to his law no longer carried said weapon."
Yes, and just *imagine* if a flying unicorn had magically appeared and deflected the bullets, or the cops had parked somewhere else, or the driver of the killer's car had decided to stop for a burger, or pigs had flown out of your ass! Oh, the different things we'd see!
Way to grind your ax on a murder victim's body, jackass. Just *imagine* if your parents had never met! What a wonderful world this would be, indeed.
Yes, and just *imagine* if a flying unicorn had magically appeared and deflected the bullets, or the cops had parked somewhere else, or the driver of the killer's car had decided to stop for a burger, or pigs had flown out of your ass! Oh, the different things we'd see!
Way to grind your ax on a murder victim's body, jackass. Just *imagine* if your parents had never met! What a wonderful world this would be, indeed.
23
@22 You are also a fucking pussy bastard. Grind my ax? Far from it. After the dust has settled, Mayor McCheese will thankfully be out of office, and his stupid fucking credulous hackery of moronic anti gun ideas will fade into history with him.
I want this guy found bad, and I won't allow you to paint my point differently. The fact that this gun crime happened in Mayor McCheese's city, the fact that it was random, the fact that it was committed with a handgun, and the Mayor's illegal misguided fanaticism with de-arming the citizenry should be sufficient reasons to draw a logical conclusion that the question will soon be asked.
So ya jackass Switzerblog, go fucking crawl back in your hole. I too greive for the family of the slain officer. As a former LEO, my family thankfully never had to receive the call that unfortunately was made to this officer's.
I truly hope this guy gets strung and quartered in the center of Pioneer Square. If there was ever a case for a public execution to be carried out slowly and in public view, this would be it. I'm seething raw with anger right now... so I'll stop now before I really go off...
No crime in my history of living in this fucking shit hole county has ever come close to making me as angry as this one has...
And I know I'm not alone.
I want this guy found bad, and I won't allow you to paint my point differently. The fact that this gun crime happened in Mayor McCheese's city, the fact that it was random, the fact that it was committed with a handgun, and the Mayor's illegal misguided fanaticism with de-arming the citizenry should be sufficient reasons to draw a logical conclusion that the question will soon be asked.
So ya jackass Switzerblog, go fucking crawl back in your hole. I too greive for the family of the slain officer. As a former LEO, my family thankfully never had to receive the call that unfortunately was made to this officer's.
I truly hope this guy gets strung and quartered in the center of Pioneer Square. If there was ever a case for a public execution to be carried out slowly and in public view, this would be it. I'm seething raw with anger right now... so I'll stop now before I really go off...
No crime in my history of living in this fucking shit hole county has ever come close to making me as angry as this one has...
And I know I'm not alone.
24
Ever norice how these losers cry like girls and ask for their mamas on 'The First 48', my fav black comedy show.
26
@23 and a few other posters: your other subjectively related issues have plenty of appropriate places to be discussed. This is not one of them. The worst thing about the internet is that we all (yes, me, too) think our point of view is worth sharing, whether it's the time and place or not.
27
Reality Check = Macho posturing bullshitter, looking for something to be angry about.
His "former LEO" experience = Mall security officer
If you don't like this "fucking shit hole county", why don't you go live someplace else? Better yet, just let your seething raw anger get the best of you and have an aneurysm?
His "former LEO" experience = Mall security officer
If you don't like this "fucking shit hole county", why don't you go live someplace else? Better yet, just let your seething raw anger get the best of you and have an aneurysm?
29
Shouldn't you be giving the Times a "Stupid Fucking Credulous Hack" award because they didn't interview anyone who was pro cop killing in the article?
30
@27 for the record I was a sworn officer
Not that you fucking care ya moron.
Unfortunately making a higher salary (for a period of time) usually necessitates taking a risk to move to a place where crime is higher, and sacrifice a modicum of security in order to get just a bit ahead in life. Don't worry however... my residence here is a limited time engagement.
Is it any wonder why folks who retire normally move where 1. the climate is better, or 2. where life is safer/slower paced? ... you know... after you either "make it", "hit the lottery" or "retire", folks almost invariably move elsewhere outside the urban decay of large cities...
Interesting anomaly... hmmmm
Not that you fucking care ya moron.
Unfortunately making a higher salary (for a period of time) usually necessitates taking a risk to move to a place where crime is higher, and sacrifice a modicum of security in order to get just a bit ahead in life. Don't worry however... my residence here is a limited time engagement.
Is it any wonder why folks who retire normally move where 1. the climate is better, or 2. where life is safer/slower paced? ... you know... after you either "make it", "hit the lottery" or "retire", folks almost invariably move elsewhere outside the urban decay of large cities...
Interesting anomaly... hmmmm
31
@30 et al: "I'm pretty sure if citizen had just happened by with a weapon, and started firing at the suspect vehicle, at the very least it would have distracted the thug and turned his attention to the other fire, thus providing valuable milliseconds that might have provided those officers with time to duck, find cover, escape, gather their bearings etc, and instead of 1 dead officer, maybe we'd have saved a valuable life."
That's a great description of the fantasy you had about how if you were there you'd have saved the day. Too bad it didn't happen. Too bad it never happens, except in fantasies like yours.
That's a great description of the fantasy you had about how if you were there you'd have saved the day. Too bad it didn't happen. Too bad it never happens, except in fantasies like yours.
33
@23: My family HAS gotten that call. Call me a pussy all you want; if I got you to focus on the officer lost and not your imaginary vigilante, for even ONE FUCKING MOMENT, mission accomplished. @26 is more polite than me, but the point is the same - you want to argue about a concealed weapons ban in city parks, that's a legitimate conversation...another place, another time. But how about not hijacking the tremendous loss that this officer's family - including his brothers and sisters on the force - are dealing with to grind that ax?
34
This scares me more than anything. A trigger happy coward like Reality Check "protecting" us from criminals. Thank the lord, it's former LEO.
As a former LEO
This scares me more than anything. A trigger happy coward like Reality Check "protecting" us from criminals. Thank the lord, it's former LEO.
36
You know, there are about 190 million privately owned guns in the United States, and most of them are owned by people with an IQ in the 85 to 95 point range. The miracle here is that, nationally, we only have about 1,000 accidental gun deaths and 10,000 gun-related homicides a year.
And as bad as 10,000 gun-homicides is -- the U.S. has the worst murder rate in the industrialized world -- on the scale of other shit Americans do, it's just not that big a deal. For example, the infant mortality rate in the United Kingdom is about 4.8 deaths per 1,000 live births. In the United States it's about 6.3 deaths per 1,000 live births. In 2004 there were about 4,112,000 live births in the United States. Assuming that the United States could achieve an infant mortality rate comparable to that of the United Kingdom if we really wanted to, that means that in 2004 the people of the United States allowed about 6,150 infants to die because we basically couldn't be bothered to do better.
There are lots of other statistics like that; car deaths, pollution, food poisoning, etc. The combined death toll for shit that would be fairly easy to fix runs into the hundreds of thousands.
Anti-gun people respond to all this by saying that, unlike cars, industry and prepared food, the ownership of guns serves no useful purpose. So those other deaths are unfortunate, but gun deaths are unnecessary. However, both our federal and our state constitutions contain provisions protecting the private ownership of firearms, so evidently intelligent people can differ on this issue. I don't own a gun personally, and probably never will, but I do recognize that degree of political freedom we enjoy in the United States is predicated on the idea that we're willing to feed a certain number of people into a meat grinder every year because giving people the right to make very important choices means living with the consequences when they choose badly. You might consider that proposition in its broad sense if you ever find yourself needing to fill a prescription for, say, RU-486.
More...
And as bad as 10,000 gun-homicides is -- the U.S. has the worst murder rate in the industrialized world -- on the scale of other shit Americans do, it's just not that big a deal. For example, the infant mortality rate in the United Kingdom is about 4.8 deaths per 1,000 live births. In the United States it's about 6.3 deaths per 1,000 live births. In 2004 there were about 4,112,000 live births in the United States. Assuming that the United States could achieve an infant mortality rate comparable to that of the United Kingdom if we really wanted to, that means that in 2004 the people of the United States allowed about 6,150 infants to die because we basically couldn't be bothered to do better.
There are lots of other statistics like that; car deaths, pollution, food poisoning, etc. The combined death toll for shit that would be fairly easy to fix runs into the hundreds of thousands.
Anti-gun people respond to all this by saying that, unlike cars, industry and prepared food, the ownership of guns serves no useful purpose. So those other deaths are unfortunate, but gun deaths are unnecessary. However, both our federal and our state constitutions contain provisions protecting the private ownership of firearms, so evidently intelligent people can differ on this issue. I don't own a gun personally, and probably never will, but I do recognize that degree of political freedom we enjoy in the United States is predicated on the idea that we're willing to feed a certain number of people into a meat grinder every year because giving people the right to make very important choices means living with the consequences when they choose badly. You might consider that proposition in its broad sense if you ever find yourself needing to fill a prescription for, say, RU-486.
38
I've sorta been sitting this one out, but since Judah raised the issue, I'll respond to one point he made. I just became aware of the results of a recent CDC study regarding whether gun ownership deters burglaries. According to their numbers, 500,000 burglaries a year are deterred, interrupted, or otherwise stopped from happening because the resident had a gun. When you consider that the CFC is not now, and never has been, much of a "friend" of gun owners, that's a pretty amazing statistic.
39
@33 You are trying to define this thread just as much as you are charging that I am... it would appear that you are now backtracking to appear the better person ... however that is a thinly veiled attempt.
You might consider that this thread is a crime report about a terrible tragedy that occurred to a Seattle police officer.
The point of this thread is no more about the city gun ban issue, than it is about the grief of the family and SPD in the aftermath of this story.
If you insist on parsing hairs about the intent of this story, you would be well advised to save your comments about the sure to follow story on the outpouring of grief and the growing memorial at the site of the tragedy. That is the thread to bring your comments about the lost officer's family, friends and deeds.
peace.
You might consider that this thread is a crime report about a terrible tragedy that occurred to a Seattle police officer.
The point of this thread is no more about the city gun ban issue, than it is about the grief of the family and SPD in the aftermath of this story.
If you insist on parsing hairs about the intent of this story, you would be well advised to save your comments about the sure to follow story on the outpouring of grief and the growing memorial at the site of the tragedy. That is the thread to bring your comments about the lost officer's family, friends and deeds.
peace.
40
@34 Keshmeshi you need to paint me as "trigger happy" to justify your made up assumptions about me. The truth of the matter is ... you actually know very little... but know one thing. My personality, convictions, politics, etc etc.. are much more in line with the average LEO than any of your musings, belief system, politics etc...
And consider that although you and many others here have an opinion, it isn't a mainstream opinion.
Sleep well at night knowing that there are many officers out there who share my traits.
:)
And consider that although you and many others here have an opinion, it isn't a mainstream opinion.
Sleep well at night knowing that there are many officers out there who share my traits.
:)
41
Yeah? Because I'm pretty sure the average LEO would prefer an outright ban on private ownership of handguns. Certainly LEO unions seem to advocate as much at every available opportunity.
The idea of banning guns is, in fact, a mainstream opinion. It may not be a majority opinion, but then a majority of Americans don't believe in evolution. Having the majority agree with you doesn't necessarily mean your opinion isn't stupid. In fact, insofar as half of all Americans are stupider than the average American (to paraphrase George Carlin) I would tend to argue that holding a "mainstream" opinion may actually be a good reason to re-examine one's convictions.
My personality, convictions, politics, etc etc.. are much more in line with the average LEO than any of your musings
Yeah? Because I'm pretty sure the average LEO would prefer an outright ban on private ownership of handguns. Certainly LEO unions seem to advocate as much at every available opportunity.
And consider that although you and many others here have an opinion, it isn't a mainstream opinion.
The idea of banning guns is, in fact, a mainstream opinion. It may not be a majority opinion, but then a majority of Americans don't believe in evolution. Having the majority agree with you doesn't necessarily mean your opinion isn't stupid. In fact, insofar as half of all Americans are stupider than the average American (to paraphrase George Carlin) I would tend to argue that holding a "mainstream" opinion may actually be a good reason to re-examine one's convictions.
42
One more correction, Judah: The vast majority of cops support private ownership of guns. Many are NRA members. I think you're confusing police unions with police chiefs, who are political appointees.
44
@42: My dad... disagrees. Cops in URBAN places typically don't support the NRA, or the private ownership of concealed weapons. The NRA backs COP-KILLER BULLETS. Hello? Do you know any cops?
45
"I've sorta been sitting this one out, but since Judah raised the issue, I'll respond to one point he made. I just became aware of the results of a recent CDC study regarding whether gun ownership deters burglaries. According to their numbers, 500,000 burglaries a year are deterred, interrupted, or otherwise stopped from happening because the resident had a gun. When you consider that the CFC is not now, and never has been, much of a "friend" of gun owners, that's a pretty amazing statistic."
Who are you talking about here? The Center for Disease Control? The CFC? Huh? Where is this study?
Who are you talking about here? The Center for Disease Control? The CFC? Huh? Where is this study?
46
Guns aren't the problem. Guns in the hands of young black men are the problem.
Anybody else here love my favorite black comedy show, "The First 48"?
The best laughs always comes when they get caught in the stolen car, with the murder weapon, after leaving their phone, wallet and fingerprints at the crime scene. Then they bring 'em for questioning, pants around they ankles, and they start crying for their mamas!
Oh man, that sh*t is funny everytime!
Anybody else here love my favorite black comedy show, "The First 48"?
The best laughs always comes when they get caught in the stolen car, with the murder weapon, after leaving their phone, wallet and fingerprints at the crime scene. Then they bring 'em for questioning, pants around they ankles, and they start crying for their mamas!
Oh man, that sh*t is funny everytime!
47
Dan, I know a whole lot of cops (probably a lot more than you do), and I stand by my original statement. And by the way, any cop who tells you he doesn't support the NRA because of "cop-killer bullets" isn't very well-informed, because there's basically no such thing.
And Tiktok, yes, the CDC, Centers for Disease Control. I only have a paper copy of it, but I'm sure it will hit the interwebs soon.
And Tiktok, yes, the CDC, Centers for Disease Control. I only have a paper copy of it, but I'm sure it will hit the interwebs soon.
48
Excuse me? The SS190 duty round for the FN P90? Or, come to that, pretty much any tungsten-core bullet?
any cop who tells you he doesn't support the NRA because of "cop-killer bullets" isn't very well-informed, because there's basically no such thing.
Excuse me? The SS190 duty round for the FN P90? Or, come to that, pretty much any tungsten-core bullet?
50
Judah, without going into too much detail (for reasons that should be obvious), all sorts of things will penetrate a threat level IIA vest. And the types of ammo that will penetrate a level III vest aren't really commonly available anyway. So yeah, the whole thing is pretty bogus.
51
@47: ... and how did you get this magical paper copy of a CDC report that's so new that it hasn't hit the internet or the newspapers or the blogs yet?
52
tiktok,
you are a moron. Do you know any specifics about the assailant that killed officer Davis? I am willing to bet you do not do research before spouting garbage.
you are a moron. Do you know any specifics about the assailant that killed officer Davis? I am willing to bet you do not do research before spouting garbage.
53
@34 and @41 et al...
You'll be happy to know, that today I've just accepted a new job that will be getting me back to law enforcement as a sworn officer for a state agency.
You can congratulate me later.
Sadly I'll be moving out of state at the end of the month, and will be too busy to frequent here much.
Feel free to celebrate at the next SLOG Happy..
I won't even bother to reply to your erroneous assumptions about LEO's, their unions and preferences. Fifty Two Eighty has done a great job of trying to keep the record accurate.
Good day.
You'll be happy to know, that today I've just accepted a new job that will be getting me back to law enforcement as a sworn officer for a state agency.
You can congratulate me later.
Sadly I'll be moving out of state at the end of the month, and will be too busy to frequent here much.
Feel free to celebrate at the next SLOG Happy..
I won't even bother to reply to your erroneous assumptions about LEO's, their unions and preferences. Fifty Two Eighty has done a great job of trying to keep the record accurate.
Good day.
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