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News & ArtsFriday, October 9, 2009
The Ladies Don't Ask, Don't Tell
Posted by Bethany Jean Clement on Fri, Oct 9, 2009 at 9:38 AM
Who's impacted disproportionately by the military's ridiculous policy? As noted in Morning News, it's the ladies. CNN:
In fiscal year 2008, the Air Force dismissed 56 women and 34 men....the Army removed more women under the "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" policy at a greater rate than men when compared with the ratio of women to men in each service... 36 percent were women, although women make up only 14 percent of troops in the Army, the data showed.
Odd on a number of counts: that the usual specter of homosexuality in the military is the unstoppable man-on-man buggery that is GAY SECKS, that the military's still getting rid of any warm bodies at all in its time of need... and are the women just less likely to shut up?
1
I suspect a greater proportion of the women in the military are gay than men. This is too their credit.
But this is not a new story. Randy Shilts documented this years ago in his book "Conduct Unbecoming"
But this is not a new story. Randy Shilts documented this years ago in his book "Conduct Unbecoming"
2
I wonder how many women were discharged because they refused a commanding officer's come-ons. "Oh you must be gay then!".
3
all the more reason that Obama's a piece of shit for lying to the lgbt community:
http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/tue-oc…
http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/tue-oc…
4
Do more bulldaggers than lipsticks join the forces? And is it therefore harder to hide the fact that they may be lesbians?
7
I have a sneaking suspicion that more lesbians get kick out than gay men because there are more lesbians in general. I think it's accurate to say that obviously straight men and lesbians are much much more prone to the machismo mindset that the military attracts. Not to say that straight women and gay men aren't as well, just not nearly as high in numbers.
We run into the same issues on the Quake Rugby team- we constantly find that it's easier to recruit straight men then gay men. Meanwhile, on the women's rugby teams the lesbians vastly outnumber the straight women.
We run into the same issues on the Quake Rugby team- we constantly find that it's easier to recruit straight men then gay men. Meanwhile, on the women's rugby teams the lesbians vastly outnumber the straight women.
8
So, doesn't it make Obama both homophobic AND sexist for not ending DADT? Or is this just another opportunity for Obama's worshippers to make more excuses for him to continue acting like Bush? End the fucking ban already.
9
Women in the armed forces who turn down the advances of men risk being labelled as lesbian, and thus getting an investigation started.
It's not that there are more lesbians in the military than gay men, they are more likely to be investigated and confronted, DADT or not.
It's not that there are more lesbians in the military than gay men, they are more likely to be investigated and confronted, DADT or not.
11
a lot of straight women, especially attractive straight women, have served.
@9 is spot on.
Not to put down the fine service our continually-harassed lesbian serving members have done to our country.
@9 is spot on.
Not to put down the fine service our continually-harassed lesbian serving members have done to our country.
12
I'm told by friends in the military that it's because you'll be accused if you refuse to sleep with a man -- officer, enlisted man, doesn't matter. You put out or you're put out.
13
i'm sure sexism has nothing to do with it.
@1 and that ilk:
assuming the women in the military must be dykes, is exactly the kind of sexist homophobia that gets women pushed out more often.
since people like to believe being in the military proves masculinity, and disproves femininity, it's pretty clear why one witch hunt is has more victims than the other.
going with "it must be something about those women!" is a more than little faulty in the logic department. it's like saying black people are the victims of racism more, because of their excessive blackness.
@1 and that ilk:
assuming the women in the military must be dykes, is exactly the kind of sexist homophobia that gets women pushed out more often.
since people like to believe being in the military proves masculinity, and disproves femininity, it's pretty clear why one witch hunt is has more victims than the other.
going with "it must be something about those women!" is a more than little faulty in the logic department. it's like saying black people are the victims of racism more, because of their excessive blackness.
14
I'm in the military and my observations are that there may be 3 contributing reasons for the disparity:
1. It *seems* to me that there are more lesbians than gay men, but that's just one person's experience. Gaydar only goes so far.
2. I've never actually seen anyone be investigated for rejecting a man's advance, just for people who 'get caught' or 'tell'. I don't doubt that it happens, but...
3. I'm willing to bet women are more likely to let themselves get caught or to come out to their commanders, simply because it's just not as big a stigma in the macho military world to be a lesbian. Homophobia and sexism go hand and hand... so homophobic rhetoric makes an hourly appearance (at least) in macho places like flying squadrons. You can bet the gay men in those environments are keeping themselves deeper in the closet than the women. Heck, most of these outwardly homophobic men would just think it were hot if they found out they worked with lesbians...
Just my take.
1. It *seems* to me that there are more lesbians than gay men, but that's just one person's experience. Gaydar only goes so far.
2. I've never actually seen anyone be investigated for rejecting a man's advance, just for people who 'get caught' or 'tell'. I don't doubt that it happens, but...
3. I'm willing to bet women are more likely to let themselves get caught or to come out to their commanders, simply because it's just not as big a stigma in the macho military world to be a lesbian. Homophobia and sexism go hand and hand... so homophobic rhetoric makes an hourly appearance (at least) in macho places like flying squadrons. You can bet the gay men in those environments are keeping themselves deeper in the closet than the women. Heck, most of these outwardly homophobic men would just think it were hot if they found out they worked with lesbians...
Just my take.
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