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News & ArtsWednesday, October 7, 2009
Health / Politics This Is... Genius...
Posted by Dan Savage on Wed, Oct 7, 2009 at 3:56 PM
Senate Democrats have begun discussions on a compromise approach to health care reform that would establish a robust, national public option for insurance coverage but give individual states the right to opt out of the program.The proposal is envisioned as a means of getting the necessary support from progressive members of the Democratic Caucus—who have insisted that a government-run insurance option remain in the bill—and conservative Democrats who are worried about what a public plan would mean for insurers in their states.
2
Bring it on.
If this happens--if the local state legislature or governor of say, Minnesota opts out, and causes a detrimental effect on their constituents, it will be political poison of the absolute highest degree. At the same, it lets the crazies in the Red Nation do whatever the hell they want and lets the rest of us in the saner parts of the nation build the nation we're supposed to have.
How long until we see medical refugees from GOP-dominated states?
If this happens--if the local state legislature or governor of say, Minnesota opts out, and causes a detrimental effect on their constituents, it will be political poison of the absolute highest degree. At the same, it lets the crazies in the Red Nation do whatever the hell they want and lets the rest of us in the saner parts of the nation build the nation we're supposed to have.
How long until we see medical refugees from GOP-dominated states?
3
Can we still charge the states that opt-out? The damn red states have been pummeling us blue staters about socialism when they get back more money than they pay to the federal gubmint. Now's our chance to recoup from those dead-beats. Boot-straps, assholes, time to start pulling!
5
@3 No way--let them opt out of the taxation as well, but with the option to opt back in fully (with required funding shares/taxation) at any time, or "next calendar year".
The red states by population density and average income will already be paying in less to this system. Let them drop totally off the medical radar, if their expiring leadership wants that, but leave them the way back in.
This would never pass if they still had to pay, and you'd end up giving idiots like Beck and the Teabaggers all the ammunition you need to start a Fox News Civil War or some nonsense.
The red states by population density and average income will already be paying in less to this system. Let them drop totally off the medical radar, if their expiring leadership wants that, but leave them the way back in.
This would never pass if they still had to pay, and you'd end up giving idiots like Beck and the Teabaggers all the ammunition you need to start a Fox News Civil War or some nonsense.
9
A state government could avoid the political poison by putting it up for a vote.
Can you imagine, each state holding an election for this? The insurance companies would go broke advertising against it nationwide.
Can you imagine, each state holding an election for this? The insurance companies would go broke advertising against it nationwide.
10
Well, I would guess that the states that are most likely to opt out, also would be the ones that would end up being subsidized the most under a "socialized" health care system (e.g., poorer states in the south). So, good for the affordability of reform, but bad for the poor in those states.
This could be interesting... it's sort of like saying, hey, if your state doesn't want any stimulus money, you can opt out of it. How many states did that again (other than token refusals of small percentages)?
This could be interesting... it's sort of like saying, hey, if your state doesn't want any stimulus money, you can opt out of it. How many states did that again (other than token refusals of small percentages)?
11
i love it. i think we should extend this concept to other aspects of federal government. california could opt out of the DEA. utah could opt out of any federal funding for education. kansas could simply opt out.
12
Will this mean exodus of all the infirm from Texas to California, or what?
I still think it would be worth it. We can always tack on a modest residency requirement.
I still think it would be worth it. We can always tack on a modest residency requirement.
13
And we shall call those states "red states" - and we shall permit them to hold slaves and give them 2/3 of a vote in the Congress and this shall exist until the end of time ...
16
@9: That's what worries me about this idea. Once Eyman sets his sights on an initiative that would require the Washington government to opt out of public option coverage, even a reliably blue state like ours could be fucked.
This is an interesting strategic move, but it could definitely backfire in equally interesting ways.
This is an interesting strategic move, but it could definitely backfire in equally interesting ways.
17
Considering that my governor has already said that he'd opt out of the public option if he had the chance (never the fuck mind what the people actually want), I can't say as I'm terribly pleased about this.
18
Well, I'd be fucked. I live in Ohio. Good thing I'm joining the military for insurance, a home, and a job instead of going back to college, I guess.
19
Take heart, Leslie @18. We have a Dem governor and house, and decent public support for the public option:
http://www.quinnipiac.edu/x1322.xml?Rele…
"But the good news for the President is that by a 49 - 28 percent margin voters say they trust him more than congressional Republicans to handle health care. And voters say 50 - 33 percent that congressional Republicans are more interested in seeing Obama fail than in playing a constructive role in health care reform.
Ohio voters support 57 - 35 percent the idea of giving American consumers the option of buying health insurance from a government-run plan."
http://www.quinnipiac.edu/x1322.xml?Rele…
"But the good news for the President is that by a 49 - 28 percent margin voters say they trust him more than congressional Republicans to handle health care. And voters say 50 - 33 percent that congressional Republicans are more interested in seeing Obama fail than in playing a constructive role in health care reform.
Ohio voters support 57 - 35 percent the idea of giving American consumers the option of buying health insurance from a government-run plan."
20
This would be a boon to border cities next to states that drop the public option imo.
And - I can't imagine any state actually dropping this. They'd get run out of town.
And - I can't imagine any state actually dropping this. They'd get run out of town.
22
@17 - Well, then your governor can get voted out of office.
This might be the ticket to getting Democrats elected in Red States.
This might be the ticket to getting Democrats elected in Red States.
23
I like this. I like it a lot. Too bad it wouldn't keep the Lyndon Larouche, Paultard I sit next to at work whining about socialists taking over the country, but still I like it.
25
Yeah, because this worked so well for gay marriage... Oh, wait. Don't forget that 'red states' are barely made up of majority conservatives, and this plan would be fucking a lot of people out of a public option who desperately want one. I've already been told by my state reps that a public option is unfair (?!), but that forcing people to buy into private insurance is A-OK.
This is a terrible plan.
This is a terrible plan.
27
I'd like to know how the states get to opt out. Can Pawlenty or Jindal just unilaterally shut it down in those states and fuck everyone or do they have to get the state legislature to approve it?
28
this is a promising idea.
we red states could opt out and watch our freeloader moocher sucking-the-government-titty types flock to the blue states.
it would greatly lessen our social services burden, improve our schools, drastically lower the crime rate and leave the place smelling much fresher.
we red states could opt out and watch our freeloader moocher sucking-the-government-titty types flock to the blue states.
it would greatly lessen our social services burden, improve our schools, drastically lower the crime rate and leave the place smelling much fresher.
29
seriously it is a good idea because it allows the 'states as laboratories of democracy' concept to play out. states that want can participate. they WILL discover that it is ruinously expensive but the tinkering to make it work will eventually lead to more workable solutions.
30
Can we call all the red state citizens who'd be crossing state lines to get treatment illegal immigrants?
32
If someone from an opt-out Red state crosses into a Blue zone, can we brand them with a scarlet R on their foreheads so we can make sure they get no medical services in our state?
Or shoot them - that would work too.
Or shoot them - that would work too.
33
22 - Oh, he's already doomed. But he can fuck things up while he's still there. The whole "just be patient" approach isn't exactly great when it comes to health care.
34
"we red states could opt out and watch our freeloader moocher sucking-the-government-titty types flock to the blue states."
Sure. Have fun watching your freeloader moocher employers and industries who don't want to pay for health care plans flock to blue states too.
Sure. Have fun watching your freeloader moocher employers and industries who don't want to pay for health care plans flock to blue states too.
35
34
exactly.
when the state starts picking up the tab most employers are going to drop their coverage and send their employees to the state plan.
hope your state has a nice fat line of credit with China...
exactly.
when the state starts picking up the tab most employers are going to drop their coverage and send their employees to the state plan.
hope your state has a nice fat line of credit with China...
36
The public option does not mean that the government pays for the health care; it means they run the insurance program without collecting a profit. They may also decide to subsidize those who can't afford insurance, but that's completely separate from the existence of a public option--it would subsidize those with private insurance as well.
And if you can't imagine a state opting out of the public option, then you have not lived in a red state.
And if you can't imagine a state opting out of the public option, then you have not lived in a red state.
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