Slog
News & ArtsThursday, October 1, 2009
Homo What He Said
Posted by Dan Savage on Thu, Oct 1, 2009 at 8:37 AM
A gay couple can be together for thirty years and still be regarded as total strangers by their own government and by their own president and their own Speaker. They can be denied access to hospitals, thrown out of shared apartments if one of them dies, barred from the funerals of their spouses, and denied over one thousand federal benefits. They can be forced to testify against one another in court, or be forced to leave the country in order to have a stable home if one of them is an immigrant.... One major political party regards this kind of cruelty and discrimination as something so vital it wants to enshrine it in the federal constitution—a position championed by the last "compassionate conservative" president. And his successor pays lip-service in small gatherings of gay activists, takes their money and work and support but will not lift a pinkie finger to help. All the time he is firing gay servicemembers for the crime of being gay.He may believe it is prudent to wait. That is his prerogative. It is my prerogative to call the first black president missing in action on the vital matter of a minority's civil rights.
1
Andrew Sullivan has spent the last eight years with his lips firmly locked on George Bush's backside, but he wants to call out Obama? Andrew Sullivan, the man who married his husband in Connecticut and has all the rights and benefits in that state that marriage grants, wants to call out Obama for not instantly gratifying his desire to have national marriage equality and portability? Here's a thought for Andrew Sullivan from a probably never going to get married old gay guy about as far from Connecticut as a person can get: Piss on you, asshole, for suddenly discovering full faith and credit after writing commentary on American politics and Constitutional issues from a snotty British perspective for all these years.
2
Sorry, but Obama deserves to be called out. He is missing on action, not only on gay issues but on most progressive or liberal issues as well. Some people were hoping that Obama would be another FDR. Right now I am only hoping that he will not be another Bush and hope is fading.
3
I was more upset by Sullivan comparing Gore Vidal to Micheal Moore. Sullivan seems to be ramping up the attack-posts on his blog. He must be desperate for hits. Shouldn't he be getting deported soon?
4
Using yesterday's cover-our-butts-again-cos-we-suck-at-lawyering press release from Lambda Legal to fuel a second day's worth of high moral dudgeon.
Cute. We gay-marriage supporters are becoming ever more sentimentalized and easily led. But not by anybody that seems to know what to do on a practical level beyond muster outrage.
But I dunno. Maybe that's all we got left.
Cute. We gay-marriage supporters are becoming ever more sentimentalized and easily led. But not by anybody that seems to know what to do on a practical level beyond muster outrage.
But I dunno. Maybe that's all we got left.
6
Sorry Andy-
buttfucking someone
(even for THIRTY YEARS!!!)
isn't the magic key
to Federal goodies and priviledges.
Cause,
we really don't give a shit who
or what
you're fucking.
We don't see any social benefit
to subsidizing your habit.
buttfucking someone
(even for THIRTY YEARS!!!)
isn't the magic key
to Federal goodies and priviledges.
Cause,
we really don't give a shit who
or what
you're fucking.
We don't see any social benefit
to subsidizing your habit.
7
Sorry Dan, love ya but fuck Andrew Sullivan, and fuck poster #6. They deserve each other, because they probably jerk off to the same Jesus pictures.
12
@8
Sorry, Bob.
If you're giving it to yourself it isn't a subsidy.
sub·si·dy (sŭb'sĭ-dē)
n. pl. sub·si·dies
1.Financial assistance given by one person or government to another.
2.Monetary assistance granted by a government to a person or group in support of an enterprise regarded as being in the public interest.
"regarded as being in the public interest."
there's the rub, eh?
Sorry, Bob.
If you're giving it to yourself it isn't a subsidy.
sub·si·dy (sŭb'sĭ-dē)
n. pl. sub·si·dies
1.Financial assistance given by one person or government to another.
2.Monetary assistance granted by a government to a person or group in support of an enterprise regarded as being in the public interest.
"regarded as being in the public interest."
there's the rub, eh?
16
@ 15, you can call me out when you register, stick with that name, AND post your bio. Until then, you learn from me.
18
@ 2 -- I'm not objecting to calling Obama out. I'm as unhappy with the footdragging on rights as anybody. What I object to is Sullivan suddenly discovering his deep love for gay equality after all these years with his head so far up the Republicans' butts it was hard to tell whose tongue was talking.
19
Sullivan's tirade aside, President Obama is not even giving slight hints or indications that he is going to make good on his promises to the gay community. This, for me, is scary. Since this is the case, it is our duty to once again energize the community to see these changes through. We don't need his outright support. If leaders like Dan are so serious about this they can set aside their current duties and work on this issue with us. The lectures and columns can wait. Deprive us from Savage Love for a month, Dan and work with us using your high profile.
I don't know what #6 is saying to rile you all up because I have unregistered turned off, but I guess I don't have to because it is just noise.
I don't know what #6 is saying to rile you all up because I have unregistered turned off, but I guess I don't have to because it is just noise.
20
19
we were just talking about what common knowledge it is that you are a Wankoppotamus with calluses on your palms and sticky hair.
we were just talking about what common knowledge it is that you are a Wankoppotamus with calluses on your palms and sticky hair.
22
@19
"If leaders like Dan..."
Leaders Like Dan!
BwaHaHahahahahahahaha!
heehee.
sorry...
"...are so serious about this they can set aside their current duties..."
And just who the Hell do you think is going to Lick all those DoorKnobs and titillate credulous 18 year old frat boys all across the country with their brazen hip willingness to say nasty words like poop and pecker??
"...and work on this issue with us."
What?! Posting 3 or 4 Youth Pastors a week isn't enough for you???
"The lectures and columns can wait. Deprive us from Savage Love for a month, Dan"
And just what will the perverts and degenerates and trans and bis and tris do without Dan telling them where to stick what for a whole month? The nation would not survive the SEXUAL ANARCHY!
"...and work with us using your high profile."
Help Us, Obi-Wan Kenobi!
You're Our ONLY HOPE.......
Go ahead, Dan.
Help the kids.
Show them your SuperPowers.
Get their kitty out of the tree.
Go ahead Dan.
Do 'something'.
"If leaders like Dan..."
Leaders Like Dan!
BwaHaHahahahahahahaha!
heehee.
sorry...
"...are so serious about this they can set aside their current duties..."
And just who the Hell do you think is going to Lick all those DoorKnobs and titillate credulous 18 year old frat boys all across the country with their brazen hip willingness to say nasty words like poop and pecker??
"...and work on this issue with us."
What?! Posting 3 or 4 Youth Pastors a week isn't enough for you???
"The lectures and columns can wait. Deprive us from Savage Love for a month, Dan"
And just what will the perverts and degenerates and trans and bis and tris do without Dan telling them where to stick what for a whole month? The nation would not survive the SEXUAL ANARCHY!
"...and work with us using your high profile."
Help Us, Obi-Wan Kenobi!
You're Our ONLY HOPE.......
Go ahead, Dan.
Help the kids.
Show them your SuperPowers.
Get their kitty out of the tree.
Go ahead Dan.
Do 'something'.
23
21
The Burger King said if you don't give him his outfit back right now he's going to kick your ass.
The Burger King said if you don't give him his outfit back right now he's going to kick your ass.
24
@19
"it is our duty to once again energize the community"
I remember the night Clinton was elected.
Gays partying,
and chanting:
"We're Here!
We're Queer!!
We're going to the White House!!!"
Those were some good times.
And it worked out so well.
Energized.
That was 1992....
"it is our duty to once again energize the community"
I remember the night Clinton was elected.
Gays partying,
and chanting:
"We're Here!
We're Queer!!
We're going to the White House!!!"
Those were some good times.
And it worked out so well.
Energized.
That was 1992....
26
@1 You have no idea what you're talking about. Sullivan has been raging about Bush for years, and endorsed Kerry in 2004. He supported him initially but has been against him ever since the torture revelations, quite a while ago now. And I don't see what being in favor of gays in the military and against the FMA have to do with full-faith-and-credit. Stop blathering.
27
Seattle LGBT Equality Weekend October 10 – 11, 2009
Seattle OUTProtest has brought together a grassroots coalition of gay, lesbian, bisexual, transgendered and straight people and organizations to organize a series of solidarity events to coincide with the National March for Equality this October.
March and Rally
Forty years after the Stonewall Rebellion, we march in solidarity with our brothers and sisters and allies in Washington, DC to demand equal protection in all matters governed by civil law in all 50 states and to show our public support for the Approval of Referendum 71 here in Washington state.
Sunday, October 11
2:00 pm: Volunteer Park, 10th Ave E & E Prospect
5:00 pm: Rally, Federal Courthouse, 7th & Stewart
Thinking Queerly: Community Workshops on LGBT Issues
Community organizers and activists will present a series of workshops on a range of issues affecting the lgbt community including Stonewall and lgbt movement history, homelessness, hate crimes and self defense, lgbt health, Don’t Ask Don’t Tell, lgbt legal issues, Gay-Straight Alliances, marriage equality, and more.
Saturday, October 10
9:30 am to 5 pm
Piggot Auditorium, Seattle University
HIV/AIDS Vigil
As the AIDS pandemic nears its fourth decade, we gather to educate and raise awareness about the continued struggles of people living with HIV/AIDS and their families, friends, and support networks as well as to demand all resources and all funding necessary for prevention, treatment, and a cure.
Saturday, October 10
Starting at 6 pm
Seattle Central Community College South Plaza, Broadway & E Pine
Generation Q Mega Mixer
Come mingle and mix with seasoned leaders and activists of the GLBTQ community at the Generation Q Mega Mixer. Young leaders (25 and under please) will have the opportunity to socialize, learn from, and quite possibly have a dance off with some of the community's most inspiring members in a relaxed social environment.
Sunday, October 11
6:30 pm
Sole Repair Shop, 1001 E Pike
Seattle LGBT Equality Weekend March & Rally
http://nationalmarch.seattleoutprotest.o…
Get involved with one of our planning committees! Contact for more time and details:
March/Rally Committee, March@seattleoutprotest.org
Workshops Committee, Workshops@seattleoutprotest.org
Outreach Committee, Outreach@seattleoutprotest.org
Mixer Committee, Mixer@seattleoutprotest.org
HIV/AIDS Vigil Committee, Vigil@seattleoutprotest.org
Biweekly General Organizing Meetings, please contact whitney@seattleoutprotest.org for time and location.
National Equality March: Equality Across America
www.equalityacrossamerica.org
Endorsed by Seattle Gay News, Radical Women, Queer Ally Coalition, International Socialist Organization, Socialist Alternative, Freedom Socialist Party, Gay City Health Project, Entre Hermanos, Cascades Rainbow Community Center/Skagit, Seattle OUTProtest, Community to Community Development, Bellingham, Sub Pop Records, 5th District Democrats (www.5thdems.org), American Friends Service Committee, Inlaws & Outlaws and the True Stories Project, Pride at Work, Washington Jobs with Justice - MLK, Seattle Education Association, Out in Tacoma, Rainbow Center of Tacoma, Queer Kidz, Temple B'Nai Torah, PFLAG Olympia, Amnesty International, Metropolitan Community Church - Seattle, Center for MultiCultural Health, Washington Marriage Alliance, The Backpack Project, A.N.S.W.E.R., Party for Socialism and Liberation, PFLAG - Olympia, The Queer Foundation, PFLAG - Bellevue
Approve Referendum 71
Keep the Domestic Partnership Law
More...
Seattle OUTProtest has brought together a grassroots coalition of gay, lesbian, bisexual, transgendered and straight people and organizations to organize a series of solidarity events to coincide with the National March for Equality this October.
March and Rally
Forty years after the Stonewall Rebellion, we march in solidarity with our brothers and sisters and allies in Washington, DC to demand equal protection in all matters governed by civil law in all 50 states and to show our public support for the Approval of Referendum 71 here in Washington state.
Sunday, October 11
2:00 pm: Volunteer Park, 10th Ave E & E Prospect
5:00 pm: Rally, Federal Courthouse, 7th & Stewart
Thinking Queerly: Community Workshops on LGBT Issues
Community organizers and activists will present a series of workshops on a range of issues affecting the lgbt community including Stonewall and lgbt movement history, homelessness, hate crimes and self defense, lgbt health, Don’t Ask Don’t Tell, lgbt legal issues, Gay-Straight Alliances, marriage equality, and more.
Saturday, October 10
9:30 am to 5 pm
Piggot Auditorium, Seattle University
HIV/AIDS Vigil
As the AIDS pandemic nears its fourth decade, we gather to educate and raise awareness about the continued struggles of people living with HIV/AIDS and their families, friends, and support networks as well as to demand all resources and all funding necessary for prevention, treatment, and a cure.
Saturday, October 10
Starting at 6 pm
Seattle Central Community College South Plaza, Broadway & E Pine
Generation Q Mega Mixer
Come mingle and mix with seasoned leaders and activists of the GLBTQ community at the Generation Q Mega Mixer. Young leaders (25 and under please) will have the opportunity to socialize, learn from, and quite possibly have a dance off with some of the community's most inspiring members in a relaxed social environment.
Sunday, October 11
6:30 pm
Sole Repair Shop, 1001 E Pike
Seattle LGBT Equality Weekend March & Rally
http://nationalmarch.seattleoutprotest.o…
Get involved with one of our planning committees! Contact for more time and details:
March/Rally Committee, March@seattleoutprotest.org
Workshops Committee, Workshops@seattleoutprotest.org
Outreach Committee, Outreach@seattleoutprotest.org
Mixer Committee, Mixer@seattleoutprotest.org
HIV/AIDS Vigil Committee, Vigil@seattleoutprotest.org
Biweekly General Organizing Meetings, please contact whitney@seattleoutprotest.org for time and location.
National Equality March: Equality Across America
www.equalityacrossamerica.org
Endorsed by Seattle Gay News, Radical Women, Queer Ally Coalition, International Socialist Organization, Socialist Alternative, Freedom Socialist Party, Gay City Health Project, Entre Hermanos, Cascades Rainbow Community Center/Skagit, Seattle OUTProtest, Community to Community Development, Bellingham, Sub Pop Records, 5th District Democrats (www.5thdems.org), American Friends Service Committee, Inlaws & Outlaws and the True Stories Project, Pride at Work, Washington Jobs with Justice - MLK, Seattle Education Association, Out in Tacoma, Rainbow Center of Tacoma, Queer Kidz, Temple B'Nai Torah, PFLAG Olympia, Amnesty International, Metropolitan Community Church - Seattle, Center for MultiCultural Health, Washington Marriage Alliance, The Backpack Project, A.N.S.W.E.R., Party for Socialism and Liberation, PFLAG - Olympia, The Queer Foundation, PFLAG - Bellevue
Approve Referendum 71
Keep the Domestic Partnership Law
28
Allegedly @6 speaks for America, land of the free, so long as their freedom is regulated to that narrow selection of activities that doesn't offend Allegedly, and fits into his personal notion of right. Allegedly's America is also Home of the Brave, so long as by bravery I mean endlessly gripes and derides while hiding behind anonymity.
Allegedly @6 speaks for America, for he is a patriot, so long as patriotism is chanting USA! USA! loud enough that his brain stops working. Allegedly's patriotism is by no means an interest in changing the country for the better, say to represent as ideally as possible the principles on which it was forged. That would be nazi socialism.
As a patriot, Allegedly @6 believes that we are all equal under law, but some of us, namely white male fundamentalist protestant Christians without health problems or mental disorders are more equal than the rest, and the less you are like a white male fundamentalist protestant Christian without health problems or mental disorders, the less equal you should be. This is not to say Allegedly is, in fact, a white male fundamentalist protestant Christian without health problems or mental disorders, he just loves such Earth-walking angels and secretly imagines poppies blossoming in their footprints.
Allegedly @6 believes marriage is subsidizing a habit like a drug addiction or gambling, hence he believes all marriages, gay or straight should be annulled, and gain no state benefits. He also believes rights are only valid when they provide a clear social benefit, which is why churches pay taxes and hunting licenses are issued against disabled people, designated freaks and senior citizens who have lived beyond their purposeful age. (We don't call it murder, but retirement.) This is one of the many measures that Allegedly's America takes to rid us of the surplus population.
Allegedly believes that the buttfucking activity within a couple for thirty years is the most significant determinant as to the validity of their relationship. To Allegedly, long-distance buttfuckery is very, very important.
More...
Allegedly @6 speaks for America, for he is a patriot, so long as patriotism is chanting USA! USA! loud enough that his brain stops working. Allegedly's patriotism is by no means an interest in changing the country for the better, say to represent as ideally as possible the principles on which it was forged. That would be nazi socialism.
As a patriot, Allegedly @6 believes that we are all equal under law, but some of us, namely white male fundamentalist protestant Christians without health problems or mental disorders are more equal than the rest, and the less you are like a white male fundamentalist protestant Christian without health problems or mental disorders, the less equal you should be. This is not to say Allegedly is, in fact, a white male fundamentalist protestant Christian without health problems or mental disorders, he just loves such Earth-walking angels and secretly imagines poppies blossoming in their footprints.
Allegedly @6 believes marriage is subsidizing a habit like a drug addiction or gambling, hence he believes all marriages, gay or straight should be annulled, and gain no state benefits. He also believes rights are only valid when they provide a clear social benefit, which is why churches pay taxes and hunting licenses are issued against disabled people, designated freaks and senior citizens who have lived beyond their purposeful age. (We don't call it murder, but retirement.) This is one of the many measures that Allegedly's America takes to rid us of the surplus population.
Allegedly believes that the buttfucking activity within a couple for thirty years is the most significant determinant as to the validity of their relationship. To Allegedly, long-distance buttfuckery is very, very important.
30
Not to quibble, Uriel, but when you claim that Allegedly@6 believes "we are all equal under law, but some of us, namely white male fundamentalist protestant Christians without health problems or mental disorders are more equal than the rest" (emphasis mine) you're missing an important fact. Allegedly@6 does appear to have a mental disorder.
What I believe was missed in the back-and-forth about subsidies, though, is the fact that, if anyone objects to same-sex marriages being subsidized by the government, they should explain why heterosexual marriages being subsidized by the government is acceptable. And good luck with that.
What I believe was missed in the back-and-forth about subsidies, though, is the fact that, if anyone objects to same-sex marriages being subsidized by the government, they should explain why heterosexual marriages being subsidized by the government is acceptable. And good luck with that.
31
Southern Gentleman @30, that Allegedly doesn't necessarily match his ideal is why I included the disclaimer: This is not to say Allegedly is, in fact, a white male fundamentalist protestant Christian without health problems or mental disorders, he just loves such Earth-walking angels and secretly imagines poppies blossoming in their footprints. I long suspected he doesn't live up to his own ideals. Whether or not he has a mental disorder, though, I suspect he goes undiagnosed.
I suspect that Allegedly @6 (and 11, 12, 15, etc.) actually approves of all the things America does subsidize, e.g. big oil, big automotive, big pharmaceuticals, big religion, big meat, Wall Street. corn syrup and South American puppet dictatorships.
I suspect that Allegedly @6 (and 11, 12, 15, etc.) actually approves of all the things America does subsidize, e.g. big oil, big automotive, big pharmaceuticals, big religion, big meat, Wall Street. corn syrup and South American puppet dictatorships.
32
Family benefits were designed to assist families in which one parent took care of children and wasn't in the workforce. These family faced higher expenses associated with raising children and reduced income; compared to a single person or couple with no children. Society recognized that it is in the public interest for someone to raise the next generation and willingly subsidized that activity and sought to protect the economically vulnerable stay at home parent- by providing 'family benefits' to wage earners; dental and health insurance coverage for the entire family, allowances for stay at home parents to be covered under the working spouse's retirement; etc. Divorce laws also reflected that concern. Not all married couples have children but at the time the benefits were being designed most did and 'married' and 'childrearing' were pretty close to synonymous.
Extending those 'family' benefits to non-childrearing couples reduces the available resources for the intended purpose, raising kids.
One could argue that 'married' no longer correlates to 'childrearing' very closely and that family benefits should thus be more tightly targeted to families that actually have children.
The benefits gays seek thru marriage; health care coverage, medical right of attorney etc are commendable social goals but should not be tied to marriage- Everyone deserves decent health insurance and it should not be tied to martial status, for example. Everyone should be able to designate a medical trustee, regardless of martial status, etc.
Extending those 'family' benefits to non-childrearing couples reduces the available resources for the intended purpose, raising kids.
One could argue that 'married' no longer correlates to 'childrearing' very closely and that family benefits should thus be more tightly targeted to families that actually have children.
The benefits gays seek thru marriage; health care coverage, medical right of attorney etc are commendable social goals but should not be tied to marriage- Everyone deserves decent health insurance and it should not be tied to martial status, for example. Everyone should be able to designate a medical trustee, regardless of martial status, etc.
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