Wednesday, September 9, 2009
Religion No Pepsi! Coke!
Posted by Dan Savage on Wed, Sep 9, 2009 at 9:12 AM
What I find most remarkable about this story...
The Bell Shoals Baptist megachurch in Brandon, Florida is making headlines for carting 10 Pepsi machines out of its premises and replacing them with machines from Coca-Cola, because, they say, Pepsi donated to Prop 8, sponsors Gay Pride parades, and runs ads that cater to homosexuals.
...is that a single church—albeit a megachurch—has 10 FUCKING SODA VENDING MACHINES on its premises. You would think the good Christians—the mega-Christians?—at Bell Shoals Baptist would be able to go an hour or two on Sunday without a cold can of corn syrup. And psst... Bell Shoals Baptist? Coke supports gay rights too. Your best gay-hatin' cola option may be Zamzam Cola. They used to be a subsidiary of Pepsi but that was before the Islamic Revolution. But if the "official soft drink of the Hajj" doesn't appeal to you, how about asking your parishioners to go without soda pop for an hour a week? Tell them they can offer up their agony to their Lord, Jesus Christ. Their savior hung on the cross for their sins for three hours—for offenses that include, presumably, the sin of gluttony—with nails driven through his hands and feet. He suffered and died roughly 1900 years before soda pop was even invented—which means that the men and women who rode dinosaurs to Noah's place to watch him build the ark had nothing but water to drink.
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1
That's not a surprise at all. Even in slim 'n' slender Colorado, you should check out the chubbs that populate Colorado Springs and go to the Denver 'burb megachurches, then head up to liberal heathen Boulder where you have to look hard for a waist over 30 inches.
6
Dude, the coke machines are more for the youth ministries, where you can play guitar hero - praise for Jesus (www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,412541,00.h… play paint ball for Jesus, including cave man paint ball (sling shots instead of guns). They get thirsty.
The parents are drinking lattes that they purchased at the in church coffee house.
The parents are drinking lattes that they purchased at the in church coffee house.
8
It's about time people of faith start becoming as active in the defense of their beliefs and principles as the other side is pushin thru their ideology and imposing it on the rest of us. It's nice to see our side flex some muscles for a change. If gay groups have teached us something it is that we must let those who take in our dollars that we will not support them by buying their products if they start advocating and funding causes that are contrary to our values.
"it's healthier to be straight, than to be gay. You're at less risk of certain sexual transmitted diseases" Dan Savage, podcast 150
"it's healthier to be straight, than to be gay. You're at less risk of certain sexual transmitted diseases" Dan Savage, podcast 150
9
I've seen a pair of coke machines get blessed back in Texas. They finessed a deal for 5 cent cans and would charge 75 cents. The remainder would go into some fund or other.
Of course, it's Texas. I've seen many odd things get blessed before. Trucks, baseball bats, a donkey and I even once saw the blessing of an overpass.
Of course, it's Texas. I've seen many odd things get blessed before. Trucks, baseball bats, a donkey and I even once saw the blessing of an overpass.
10
@8 That argument would only work if they switched their soda-allegiance to a “Christian-owned” company. They are still giving their money to a secular company that cares nothing for their beliefs or political preferences.
11
The hanging Jesus was given a vinegar-soaked rag to quench his thirst. This is a case where we really to know WWJD. A Real Christian would suck vinegar while suffering the agonies of long windbag sermons.
14
@8:
You obviously tuned out of Ms. Vel-DuRay's grammar class.
So, you expend many kilobytes talking about how it's dangerous for gays to boycott supporters of R-71, but now you're advocating the same thing? Hypocrites have their own circle of hell, don't you know?
You fail at interpreting context, but that's alright -- par for course. By the way, Loveschild, there's one group whose HIV infection rate is rising exponentially and will likely be the number one HIV infected group in the country in as little as one decade, and is currently the number one infected demographic in the world. Maybe you should remove that plank, bubbeh.
If gay groups have teached us something
You obviously tuned out of Ms. Vel-DuRay's grammar class.
it is that we must let those who take in our dollars that we will not support them by buying their products if they start advocating and funding causes that are contrary to our values.
So, you expend many kilobytes talking about how it's dangerous for gays to boycott supporters of R-71, but now you're advocating the same thing? Hypocrites have their own circle of hell, don't you know?
"it's healthier to be straight, than to be gay. You're at less risk of certain sexual transmitted diseases" Dan Savage, podcast 150
You fail at interpreting context, but that's alright -- par for course. By the way, Loveschild, there's one group whose HIV infection rate is rising exponentially and will likely be the number one HIV infected group in the country in as little as one decade, and is currently the number one infected demographic in the world. Maybe you should remove that plank, bubbeh.
15
Please... the people in this church don't care that Coke also supports gay rights. They just wanted a chance to throw a hissy fit and feel like they were taking action about something. They are people of action, who do things to show that they have beliefs.
16
You mean like you, LC.
Hanging out on a gay man's blog, and listening to his sex advice pod casts. The people you claim to share your values with, wouldn't come here. The ones that do come here are closeted individuals, who like to proclaim their disgust, while simultaneously clutching their pearls and stroking their swimsuit area.
If your morals forbid you to buy anything from Columbia City Baking, because they support R 71, then they also forbid you to come here.
Make up your mind.
Hanging out on a gay man's blog, and listening to his sex advice pod casts. The people you claim to share your values with, wouldn't come here. The ones that do come here are closeted individuals, who like to proclaim their disgust, while simultaneously clutching their pearls and stroking their swimsuit area.
If your morals forbid you to buy anything from Columbia City Baking, because they support R 71, then they also forbid you to come here.
Make up your mind.
17
@12: Nope! It's going through what feels like the 10th traffic revision, according to my friend. It's pretty dangerous and is apparently strung together with glue and prayers.
18
@16: Exactly. Her ad impressions pay for circulation of the Stranger, which in turn funds getting the word out to 90,000 people to vote to Approve R-71.
I had someone tell me that WND makes a lot of money off of disgusted liberals headed over to read their "kooky" opinions and wingnuttery. They went on to basically describe how it's easy to make money off of opening up "discussion" forums for the fringe and those who disagree with the fringe or to stack the more inflammatory pages with ads from your top dollar ad networks so you make money off of getting linked at HuffPo or Joe.My.God..
I think Dan should have the web guy go in and see how many replies Loveschild has made, get an equivalent dollar amount from ad impressions and then buy a new shirt with that money. That way, Loveschild gets the idea and he finally has a second shirt to wear on national TV.
Win-win!
I had someone tell me that WND makes a lot of money off of disgusted liberals headed over to read their "kooky" opinions and wingnuttery. They went on to basically describe how it's easy to make money off of opening up "discussion" forums for the fringe and those who disagree with the fringe or to stack the more inflammatory pages with ads from your top dollar ad networks so you make money off of getting linked at HuffPo or Joe.My.God..
I think Dan should have the web guy go in and see how many replies Loveschild has made, get an equivalent dollar amount from ad impressions and then buy a new shirt with that money. That way, Loveschild gets the idea and he finally has a second shirt to wear on national TV.
Win-win!
19
Baconcat,
That would be interesting, to calculate.
Loveschild is either of two things, a parody of a pearl clutcher or a closeted fag hag. I'd have more respect if it was the latter, the religious bully routine is getting old.
That would be interesting, to calculate.
Loveschild is either of two things, a parody of a pearl clutcher or a closeted fag hag. I'd have more respect if it was the latter, the religious bully routine is getting old.
21
Not surprising. If it was here, they'd probably have a full-service espresso bar (I believe some of the local megachurches actually do). It's all just bells and whistles that conservative megachurches use to get butts in the seats, which equals dollars in the collection plates. Personally, I'm waiting to see who'll be the first to install a McDonald's in their church.
22
"strung together with glue and prayers." Well, that's a lovely ironic ending. I think I like your humor, Baconcat.
23
Seriously, LC in what grade did you quit school? Like you, this church just made fools of themselves. Coca Cola routinely makes it onto the list of the most gay friendly companies. Guess what, so did both Microsoft, and Apple, so you are supporting gay causes just by using a computer. Thanks!
You're so much fun. Your ignorance and silliness provides me with so much entertainment.
You're so much fun. Your ignorance and silliness provides me with so much entertainment.
24
Dan, mega-churches (like most churches) are in use every day, not just for Sunday morning services. Mid-week services, bible classes, day care, community meetings, domestic terrorism/doctor murdering planning sessions, etc. A Big God Box is going to have multiple floors, and a few machines on each floor.
25
19 "fag hag" , do you honestly fail to see the hypocrisy on that dear? what's that about the planks in one's eye. Your blissful ignorance or arrogance (it seems a combination) on the principles and commandments of the Christian faith makes me once again doubt the truthfulness of your alleged adherence to the faith cause we are commanded to know and be of aid (be of comfort by speaking truth) to those in need not the healthy. The more I see what you advocate, defend and comment here the more i'm certain that you haven't even started on the path of salvation. None the less, regardless of that being the case or you simply having turned your back on the Living Word that are the Scriptures, i'll keep you in my prayers, cause all human life no matter what they do to try to bring down the faith is precious unto the eyes of the Lord.
26
Never mind the whole cold can of corn syrup controversy. Most Catholics can't go one hour on Sunday without a taste of wine either.
Dominus vobiscum, everybody!
Dominus vobiscum, everybody!
27
Didn't the Romans offer Christ a sponge soaked in Coke to relieve His thirst as he hung on the cross? I thought I read that somewhere...
29
When I was a church-going lad a million years ago, we drank from the water fountain. I can't remember if there two of them.
30
@ 29, maybe that's why they have pop machines now. That's a lot healthier than the average drinking fountain in terms of germ control, especially in a megachurch where all the kids practice unsafe sex.
31
@25: Where in the bible does it tell you that tolerance is disagreeable? Where in the bible does it say that you should question the faith of others when you're called to the carpet? Where in the bible does it say that you should be a better person than others instead of simply being a better you?
And speaking of living the word, Matthew 6:6 tells you to keep your prayers private. You aren't stating a community prayer of greater benefit, you're speaking to a deeply personal prayer that attacks the faith and heart of another.
It's like telling everyone your birthday wish-- it just won't come true, now! And all the better, because from the outside, Kim is definitely a better christian than you are, even if she's humble enough not to PARROT THAT FACT FROM EVERY PARAPET.
BY THE WAY GUYS, DID YOU KNOW THAT LOVESCHILD IS CHRISTIAN AND BELIEVES IN TRADITIONAL MARRIAGE? SO YOU BETTER NOT DISAGREE WITH HER OR YOU'RE GOING TO HELL. UNLESS YOU CHANGE AND AGREE WITH HER, IN WHICH CASE, LOVESCHILD HAS DECIDED YOU WON'T GO TO HELL.
And speaking of living the word, Matthew 6:6 tells you to keep your prayers private. You aren't stating a community prayer of greater benefit, you're speaking to a deeply personal prayer that attacks the faith and heart of another.
It's like telling everyone your birthday wish-- it just won't come true, now! And all the better, because from the outside, Kim is definitely a better christian than you are, even if she's humble enough not to PARROT THAT FACT FROM EVERY PARAPET.
BY THE WAY GUYS, DID YOU KNOW THAT LOVESCHILD IS CHRISTIAN AND BELIEVES IN TRADITIONAL MARRIAGE? SO YOU BETTER NOT DISAGREE WITH HER OR YOU'RE GOING TO HELL. UNLESS YOU CHANGE AND AGREE WITH HER, IN WHICH CASE, LOVESCHILD HAS DECIDED YOU WON'T GO TO HELL.
32
Growing up, we had a soda machine in our teen room (only one in the building; we weren’t mega). But it seems wrong to have commerce in the church, really. I know it’s not the same as money-changers, but it doesn’t seem right. If they offered soda for free or for “donation” then perhaps… but I think it sends the wrong message for a church to host a soda machine.
One of the reasons churches use to persuade teens to save sex for marriage is how unhealthy it is to have multiple lovers. Disease, heartbreak, poor mental health, etc are all said to be negative consequences of premarital sex (my youth pastor mentioned some positives of sex (post-marriage, of course), but he NEVER said anything about orgasms…). If these pastors, youth leaders specifically, are that concerned for the health and well-being of their charges, it stands to reason they’d speak more against soda and processed food consumption and less about sex, which has been shown to have many more positive health benefits than corn syrup and aspartame. And if you believe that God created us perfectly and He created our planet and food sources so well, then it stands to reason that churches should spend at least some time focusing on healthy eating and the preservation of God’s green earth.
One of the reasons churches use to persuade teens to save sex for marriage is how unhealthy it is to have multiple lovers. Disease, heartbreak, poor mental health, etc are all said to be negative consequences of premarital sex (my youth pastor mentioned some positives of sex (post-marriage, of course), but he NEVER said anything about orgasms…). If these pastors, youth leaders specifically, are that concerned for the health and well-being of their charges, it stands to reason they’d speak more against soda and processed food consumption and less about sex, which has been shown to have many more positive health benefits than corn syrup and aspartame. And if you believe that God created us perfectly and He created our planet and food sources so well, then it stands to reason that churches should spend at least some time focusing on healthy eating and the preservation of God’s green earth.
33
25, Loveschild, again, I know you'll ignore this fact, but you don't follow the Bible my dear. You just pick and choose to find things to attack others you don't like, and ignore what you don't want to follow.
34
i thought they drank wine like motherfuckers in the ancient ME. water was way riskier, disease-wise. wine was safer.
36
35, What's more surprising is that there is a McDonald's in a Texas church, when the anti-gay religious wing-nuts are protesting McDonald's stance on gay rights.
http://www.wnd.com/images/misc/MICKEYone…
Loveschild, do you go to McDonalds?
http://www.wnd.com/images/misc/MICKEYone…
Loveschild, do you go to McDonalds?
37
8 - what on Earth makes you think this is a new thing? Groups have been boycotting pro-equality companies for years, just as groups have boycotted anti-equality companies.
38
Oh come on, LC isn't even trying anymore, either her troll of this blog has started to reach it's productive end or her sanity has.
39
@28 Oh, fuck me running. Why did I think that conservative Christendom hadn't sunk that far? I just don't know.
Now, if you'll excuse me, I'm going to found a new church in the sporting goods aisle of the Marysville Wal-Mart.
Now, if you'll excuse me, I'm going to found a new church in the sporting goods aisle of the Marysville Wal-Mart.
40
@30, what? Drinking fountains aren't germy. That's ridiculous. Why do you think the water is running? Surely your mother taught you not to put your mouth on the faucet.
41
@ 34 exactly. Pretty sure Noah et al had plenty of wine they preferred to water, TYVM. Safer from contaminants AND more fun.
42
@ 40, my mother did. You're mother did too. But what about that kid's mother?
We're talking about megachurch drinking fountains here...
We're talking about megachurch drinking fountains here...
43
Ah crap, I used "you're" instead of "your." Well, that's just an indication of my need to go back to bed.
44
10 soda vending machines in a church is a beautiful symbol of people that have no idea what's actually wrong with their lives.
45
Danny, you know the bible better than that! They had wine in Noah's day (Gen. 9:20-21). So those churches need to install God-approved wine vending machines instead.
46
Dan, don't be so Catholic in your thinking: Megachurches don't "offer up their agony" for anybody.
What will you want next? Incense and statues?
What will you want next? Incense and statues?
47
"It's about time people of faith start becoming as active in the defense of their beliefs and principles as the other side is pushin thru their ideology and imposing it on the rest of us."
I can't remember smelling irony so thick.
Also, I grew up a few miles down the road from the church in question. I definitely feel a little guilt by association. :(
I can't remember smelling irony so thick.
Also, I grew up a few miles down the road from the church in question. I definitely feel a little guilt by association. :(
48
Also, you're sorely underestimating if you think they spend one hour a week at church. My cousins belonged to such a megachurch, and spent at least 2-3 evenings a week there, either for classes or social events. That's above and beyond the half of Sunday that they'd spend there, too.
Their entire social lives revolved around that church building. I'm frankly surprised the place didn't build apartments on the church grounds to negate the possibility of their parishioners living a moment (or spending money) outside their insular little world.
Their entire social lives revolved around that church building. I'm frankly surprised the place didn't build apartments on the church grounds to negate the possibility of their parishioners living a moment (or spending money) outside their insular little world.
49
@25: "cause all human life no matter what they do to try to bring down the faith is precious unto the eyes of the Lord."
That would include gay people too, wouldn't it?
That would include gay people too, wouldn't it?
50
Whatever soda company they allow in their compound, the soda machines need to be the old-fashioned kind that only accept coins.
No dollar bills!
Exact change only!
Otherwise, they'll have to throw the money changers out of the temple. Yes, vending machines are unbiblical.
As is usury, but you don't hear much about that nowadays, do ya? When's LC going to go after the credit card companies and check cashing firms?
No dollar bills!
Exact change only!
Otherwise, they'll have to throw the money changers out of the temple. Yes, vending machines are unbiblical.
As is usury, but you don't hear much about that nowadays, do ya? When's LC going to go after the credit card companies and check cashing firms?
51
Loveschild you glorious bigot @ 25,
My faith demands that I treat people with justice and equality. It demands that I refrain from judging others, especially non believers.
I have no problem with the title "Fag Hag" or "Fruit Fly", I'm not clutching some fake pearls here. I need to be able to address the needs of the women I work with, who are in the process of recovering from abuse and trying to become sexually wbole and healthy. Savage is an invaluable resource for me, and them. And, I give credit where credit is due. Lots of good heartbroken Christian women are learning about how helpful and understanding Dan Savage is, and they learn he's gay and he's married. Their fears are falling away. I'm helping a new generation of Fag Hags everyday.
Nope, Loveschild, I'm honored to have the title "Fag Hag" and I own it with pride. There is no plank. You on the other hand have a long in your eye.
My faith demands that I treat people with justice and equality. It demands that I refrain from judging others, especially non believers.
I have no problem with the title "Fag Hag" or "Fruit Fly", I'm not clutching some fake pearls here. I need to be able to address the needs of the women I work with, who are in the process of recovering from abuse and trying to become sexually wbole and healthy. Savage is an invaluable resource for me, and them. And, I give credit where credit is due. Lots of good heartbroken Christian women are learning about how helpful and understanding Dan Savage is, and they learn he's gay and he's married. Their fears are falling away. I'm helping a new generation of Fag Hags everyday.
Nope, Loveschild, I'm honored to have the title "Fag Hag" and I own it with pride. There is no plank. You on the other hand have a long in your eye.
52
Loveschild @ # 25:
The love (yes, love!) that exists between a fag hag and and a fag is nothing to be ashamed of. Indeed, as Kimmie says, it is something to be proud of. It is an oasis of gentleness and shared interests and fun and bitchiness and bizarre humor and support and kindness and crativity .... it is one of the things that makes life worth living. If you don't have it in your life, I feel sorry for you. And if you are a closet fag hag - go to counselling and give up the closet! Life is a lot better out of it, I promise.
The love (yes, love!) that exists between a fag hag and and a fag is nothing to be ashamed of. Indeed, as Kimmie says, it is something to be proud of. It is an oasis of gentleness and shared interests and fun and bitchiness and bizarre humor and support and kindness and crativity .... it is one of the things that makes life worth living. If you don't have it in your life, I feel sorry for you. And if you are a closet fag hag - go to counselling and give up the closet! Life is a lot better out of it, I promise.
57
Loveschild,
I forgot to say it. But you understand that I forgive you? You can judge me 70 X 7 times, and it doesn't matter. You can attempt to shame me, 70 X 7 times and it still won't matter. I have no room in either my heart or my life for unforgiveness, bitterness, vitriol, or judgemental-ism. It's just not who I am. And, more importantly it is not who I want to be.
I forgot to say it. But you understand that I forgive you? You can judge me 70 X 7 times, and it doesn't matter. You can attempt to shame me, 70 X 7 times and it still won't matter. I have no room in either my heart or my life for unforgiveness, bitterness, vitriol, or judgemental-ism. It's just not who I am. And, more importantly it is not who I want to be.
58
@kim in portland I actually want to print out your religious disputes with LC and hand them out at Churches. It so perfectly demonstrates how faith and being a sensible, tolerant, curious human being is not only possible, but preferable.
59
58 There's only one that can forgive our sins (yours and mines as well) and that is our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, not you Kim. He died in the cross for them (in case you didn't know) and as such it will be to him that we will have to someday bring our works to. I humbly follow the Scriptures which are the words of our heavenly Father and follow in the footsteps of our Lord cause he would minister to the prostitutes, those acting out alternative proclivities, alcoholics, the homeless, those with uncurable diseases etc. So must those of us who have come to know Him, who are his followers, bring on the good news to those that are being kept in chains by all sorts of afflictions. It is our responsability to let them know that Christ came to overcome and brake away all earthly maladies and afflictions. For Jesus said, "It is not the healthy who need a doctor, but the sick" 13 But go and learn what this means: 'I desire mercy, not sacrifice.'For I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners."
Matthew 9: 12-13
Therefor I do not think myself above the Lord to give or deny forgiveness, all I can do is Love. Just as I love mr Savage (and I do agree with him on many things, especially on one thing that happen to me today) as a creation of the Almighty that he is, and just as I love KKK Rob (as trying at it is due to his racism), I love you Kim. Why would I submit myself to this sort of abuse if I didn't care and felt love in my heart for them enough, to tell them the truth so that they break away the chains that are keeping them down? That's the difference between someone like you and me, you choose to sugarcoat with lies (sacrificing the truth to gain popularity here) to make them feel good in the short run but that in the long will lead them to despair and agony. While I tell them the truth (let them know about the mercy from the one who created us all) of the Living Word. And tho it might not be what they want to hear at first (just as an alcoholic doesn't want to hear that he/she needs to put the beer away) in the end it will lead them to a more joyous and complete life, just as our Savior said, "I came so that they may have life, and have it abundantly.” (John 10:10), we must strive to see all of his children receive it. Unlike you I don't want it just for myself but for others too, and that includes them. Again, I love you Kim, In God's only and true Love.
60
Forgive me, Kim.
LC? Yeah, Jesus said a lot of crap. And a lot of words were stuffed in his mouth after he was dead. Do you know when most of the gospels were written, LC? The man had been dead for decades. Some of the ideas credited to Christ are pretty nice. It speaks well of the folks who came up with them. And it speaks well of Christians like Kim, and Christians in general, that some focus on the more humane, uplifting ideas credited to Christ, and not the psychotic, megalomaniacal crap that makes you wet, LC.
Yes, yes: Jesus likes you better, LC, because you hate more than Kim. Kim doesn't hate at all, actually. But hate—and hatin' hard—that is the truest measure of a follower of Christ.
LC? Yeah, Jesus said a lot of crap. And a lot of words were stuffed in his mouth after he was dead. Do you know when most of the gospels were written, LC? The man had been dead for decades. Some of the ideas credited to Christ are pretty nice. It speaks well of the folks who came up with them. And it speaks well of Christians like Kim, and Christians in general, that some focus on the more humane, uplifting ideas credited to Christ, and not the psychotic, megalomaniacal crap that makes you wet, LC.
Yes, yes: Jesus likes you better, LC, because you hate more than Kim. Kim doesn't hate at all, actually. But hate—and hatin' hard—that is the truest measure of a follower of Christ.
61
@18 If it makes you feel any better, fewer than 1% of my daily readers typically click on any single outgoing link, including when I link WND or Free Republic. I'm aware of the issue of sending revenue-driving page views to asshats and try to include of enough of the relevant nonsensery within my own page (within obvious re-use limits).
62
Loveschild @ 59,
I'm sorry you feel you've been given the right to judge others. Sorry, for the ugliness that fills you. You're words here are without grace, condemnation is all you proclaim. That great hope you think you offer, is hollow. You're hatred and judgement has silenced those who may have been willing to hear.
If you are Christ's representative here, then you've failed at your goal. If people can't like you and therefore trust you, then it is impossible for them to like or trust, God, who they can not see.
Those that found healing in Jesus during his earthly ministry, didn't find it through, judgement, vitriol and hatred. They found it because, he touched them and they understood that he liked them. They trusted him.
You are forgiven, Loveschild. You are forgiven for your slander and judgemental attitude towards me, I bear you no ill will nor do I hold your words here against you. Since, you are fond of quoting scriptures.
Then Peter came to Jesus and asked, "Lord, how many times shall I forgive my brother when he sins against me? Up to seven times?"
Jesus answered, "I tell you, not seven times, but seventy-seven." Matthew 18: 21-22.
I'm sorry you feel you've been given the right to judge others. Sorry, for the ugliness that fills you. You're words here are without grace, condemnation is all you proclaim. That great hope you think you offer, is hollow. You're hatred and judgement has silenced those who may have been willing to hear.
If you are Christ's representative here, then you've failed at your goal. If people can't like you and therefore trust you, then it is impossible for them to like or trust, God, who they can not see.
Those that found healing in Jesus during his earthly ministry, didn't find it through, judgement, vitriol and hatred. They found it because, he touched them and they understood that he liked them. They trusted him.
You are forgiven, Loveschild. You are forgiven for your slander and judgemental attitude towards me, I bear you no ill will nor do I hold your words here against you. Since, you are fond of quoting scriptures.
Then Peter came to Jesus and asked, "Lord, how many times shall I forgive my brother when he sins against me? Up to seven times?"
Jesus answered, "I tell you, not seven times, but seventy-seven." Matthew 18: 21-22.
63
To clarify...
"Jesus likes you better, LC, because you hate more than Kim. Kim doesn't hate at all, actually. But hate—and hatin' hard—that is the truest measure of a follower of Christ."
I don't believe that hating is the truest measure of a follower of Christ. I'm suggesting that LC believes that's the case. LC certainly acts like that's what she believes. The best example of a follower of Christ I've ever known personally was my mother. She loved everyone. Didn't like everyone, she was quick to point out, but sincerely loved everyone. And never felt a need to pass judgement or condemn. She was confident in her faith, and secure in it. She was a Christian in the Kim in Portland mold, not the cracked LC mold.
"Jesus likes you better, LC, because you hate more than Kim. Kim doesn't hate at all, actually. But hate—and hatin' hard—that is the truest measure of a follower of Christ."
I don't believe that hating is the truest measure of a follower of Christ. I'm suggesting that LC believes that's the case. LC certainly acts like that's what she believes. The best example of a follower of Christ I've ever known personally was my mother. She loved everyone. Didn't like everyone, she was quick to point out, but sincerely loved everyone. And never felt a need to pass judgement or condemn. She was confident in her faith, and secure in it. She was a Christian in the Kim in Portland mold, not the cracked LC mold.
64
Dan @60,
I'm perplexed by your request for forgiveness, you're welcome to your opinion. Needless to say, if you ever did need it, you always have it in a heartbeat.
I'm perplexed by your request for forgiveness, you're welcome to your opinion. Needless to say, if you ever did need it, you always have it in a heartbeat.
66
@ 59, you never did explain how someone who "loves" can ever threaten someone with bodily violence, as you have when some of us have angered you by daring to compare gay rights to civil rights. Can you do that now?
67
63 Upon reflection, perhaps I have been somewhat too forceful in my sharing of what the Scriptures say in order to have a more happy and fruitful life. But it has always been in response to some attempt at indoctrination or imposition on your part or that of other gay lobby groups. Like I said on another post you can do what you want but you have no right to force it upon the larger population and codified it into law without their consent and approval. And you have no right to go unchallenged when you lie. I have applauded your honesty (like I have in 8), but when you are in the wrong someone needs to let you know.
If im not mistaking your religious upbringing which is deeply connected to your ancestry (that being irish) holds the same views as mine. So this is not something that has to do with the different dogmas of any particular denomination. The good news of liberation and freedom of certain behaviors that as you have recognized in your podcast 150 is not healthy, is a principle Christian tenet regardless of the church denomination. In God's Love.
http://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/congre…
If im not mistaking your religious upbringing which is deeply connected to your ancestry (that being irish) holds the same views as mine. So this is not something that has to do with the different dogmas of any particular denomination. The good news of liberation and freedom of certain behaviors that as you have recognized in your podcast 150 is not healthy, is a principle Christian tenet regardless of the church denomination. In God's Love.
http://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/congre…
69
68 And i'm sorry you insist on lying to this people. It's hurting them Kim, you might be applauded by them now but if you have truly come to know Christ you should know better than to trying to seek their praise in this way, that is thru deception. A word of complement and praise founded on a false premise will be like a house constructed in the sand, when the waves reach it, it will disappear and leave those who reside on it homeless. You know that you're not helping them, you're just helping them dig the hole further, advancing their demise. If you do then "you have forsaken your first Love" Revelation 2:4. God urges us to take action in the face of falsehood, not to be wishy washy and certainly not to take his word in vain and misinterpret to confuse others Kim. Otherwise for trying to be everything to everyone even at the cost of truth and whats right you know what our Creator has said, "So, because you are lukewarm—neither hot nor cold—I am about to spit you out of my mouth." Revelation 3:16 In God's Love.
70
Loveschild - I've been wondering how you reconcile your intellect to your faith. Will you answer that for me, please?
71
Loveschild,
You're welcome to think I'm lying, it's your opinion. I do not agree that seeking equality for every American under the laws of this country, is lying. I do not agree that treating people with respect, is lying. I do not agree that allowing others their opinions, is lying. I do not think maintaining separation between church and state, is lying. I don't agree that treating people as equals, with both compassion and respect, is lying.
My opinion that marriage equality is not harmful to the family, and provides legal protection to all families, is not lying, it's my opinion.
It's my opinion that certain passages of the Bible are poorly translated in English. Are they poorly translated due to the bias of the translator, or because those translating did not have the amount of concrete physical evidence we have today, I can only guess. It's my opinion, it isn't lying.
You can scream to your blue in the face, that to be gay is a moral violation, a moral sin, "zimah" in Hebrew, because your Bible written in English has the word abomination. But, the bottom line is that is not the word found in either the Hebrew Scriptures or The Greek Septuagint, which was translated circa 3rd century BCE. The ancient Hebrew Scriptures has the word "to'evah", which means "ritually unclean", In transliterated Hebrew, "V'et zachar lo tishkav mishk'vey eeshah toeyvah hee." and "V'ish asher yishkav et zachar mishk'vei ishah to'evah asu shneihem mot yumatu d'meihem bam." The ancient Greeks, translated "to'evah" into "bdelygma" in the Greek Septuagint, using the Greek word for "ritually unclean".
So, continue to scream away that while Moses was getting instructions from God he made a typo, that God was too busy to correct him on it. Continue to claim that the Holy Spirit gave Moses the wrong word, Moses was supposed to write down "zimah" and accidentally wrote down "to'evah". And those silly ancient Greeks, back in 3rd century BCE, they misheard the Holy Spirit, too, and failed to realize that God said "zimah" to Moses, and they translated "to'evah" to "bdelygma". And, again God was to busy to correct them. So scream away.
It's my opinion that if God wanted the word "zimah", and he wanted us to think that being gay was a moral violation and a moral sin, then he would have made damn sure that Moses didn't screw up. God would have made damn sure that those ancient Greeks, didn't screw up either. After all, He is God. Therefore, I believe that God, being perfect, holy, omnipotent, omniscient, and omnipresent, wanted the word "to'evah". God said, anal sex was "ritually impure", just like menstruation is for women. God himself, chose the words "to'evah" and 'bdelygma", Moses didn't make some error, the Holy Spirit didn't screw up, the error is our English translation. If you want to call that lying, then have at it.
So, please continue your claims about me. I don't care. Loveschild, you and your opinion about me and my faith are irrelevant. I know what I believe, and I know who I trust.
I forgive you your presumptions and I pity you your poverty.
More...
You're welcome to think I'm lying, it's your opinion. I do not agree that seeking equality for every American under the laws of this country, is lying. I do not agree that treating people with respect, is lying. I do not agree that allowing others their opinions, is lying. I do not think maintaining separation between church and state, is lying. I don't agree that treating people as equals, with both compassion and respect, is lying.
My opinion that marriage equality is not harmful to the family, and provides legal protection to all families, is not lying, it's my opinion.
It's my opinion that certain passages of the Bible are poorly translated in English. Are they poorly translated due to the bias of the translator, or because those translating did not have the amount of concrete physical evidence we have today, I can only guess. It's my opinion, it isn't lying.
You can scream to your blue in the face, that to be gay is a moral violation, a moral sin, "zimah" in Hebrew, because your Bible written in English has the word abomination. But, the bottom line is that is not the word found in either the Hebrew Scriptures or The Greek Septuagint, which was translated circa 3rd century BCE. The ancient Hebrew Scriptures has the word "to'evah", which means "ritually unclean", In transliterated Hebrew, "V'et zachar lo tishkav mishk'vey eeshah toeyvah hee." and "V'ish asher yishkav et zachar mishk'vei ishah to'evah asu shneihem mot yumatu d'meihem bam." The ancient Greeks, translated "to'evah" into "bdelygma" in the Greek Septuagint, using the Greek word for "ritually unclean".
So, continue to scream away that while Moses was getting instructions from God he made a typo, that God was too busy to correct him on it. Continue to claim that the Holy Spirit gave Moses the wrong word, Moses was supposed to write down "zimah" and accidentally wrote down "to'evah". And those silly ancient Greeks, back in 3rd century BCE, they misheard the Holy Spirit, too, and failed to realize that God said "zimah" to Moses, and they translated "to'evah" to "bdelygma". And, again God was to busy to correct them. So scream away.
It's my opinion that if God wanted the word "zimah", and he wanted us to think that being gay was a moral violation and a moral sin, then he would have made damn sure that Moses didn't screw up. God would have made damn sure that those ancient Greeks, didn't screw up either. After all, He is God. Therefore, I believe that God, being perfect, holy, omnipotent, omniscient, and omnipresent, wanted the word "to'evah". God said, anal sex was "ritually impure", just like menstruation is for women. God himself, chose the words "to'evah" and 'bdelygma", Moses didn't make some error, the Holy Spirit didn't screw up, the error is our English translation. If you want to call that lying, then have at it.
So, please continue your claims about me. I don't care. Loveschild, you and your opinion about me and my faith are irrelevant. I know what I believe, and I know who I trust.
I forgive you your presumptions and I pity you your poverty.
72
69 Theo, I wish you had expanded more on that question but nevertheless i'll try to answer it as best as i can. My intellect doesn't need to "reconcile" with my faith because it is in part inform by it. The Bible is a great source of knowledge for me particularly as it relates to this subject, the other source of course being science which in turn influences social policies that serve to keep us in the general population healthy and aware of the risk of certain diseases, which in turns influences my view on this. Case in point the FDA, in case you have no knowledge of it Theo, here in the U.S we an agency called the the Food and Drug Administration, which regulates and set the guidelines for proper actions in terms of food and medicine. The FDA, has ruled based on science and not religious beliefs that bans on certain risk groups (among those men who engage in sex with other men) must remain in term of blood donations to ensure that viruses like HIV which are not always 100 percent detected and other STDs which due to the nature of gay sex are always evolving and mutating are not spread out massively thru blood donations ]unto the general population. So i base my understanding on this subject on both the scientific, social and lastly religious knowledge that has been accumulated thru time.
73
@72, LC, science has also shown that homosexuality is decided in the womb (nature) and not created during adolencence (nurture). So how can you say that my God would make a mistake by creating people to be "unatural" and then sentencing them to hell based on how He created them? And after reading the gospels, how can you say Jesus would not support equality? The Jesus I've read about seemed to support equality in every way. And after reading the New Testament, how can you justify making laws against a group, when we are told ratter specifically to NOT get involved in 1. politics 2. forcing non-Christians to abide by our rules?
And, BTW, the FDA also approved Vioxx. They may not be the best resource for what's good or bad for us.
And, BTW, the FDA also approved Vioxx. They may not be the best resource for what's good or bad for us.
75
73 No, no, you're misinterpreting what i have said here. By no means have I ever implied that any person is unnatural or undeserving of being treated equally cause as you well stated we are all God's children. Therefor people like Theo or Savage are deserving of love and compassion cause in the end we're all brothers and sisters in Christ. What's unnatural is the acts which are conducive to physical detriment. Jesus for example saved the adulterous woman from death because he knew that she was a precious life unto the Father but at the same time at the end of the episode what did he said to her? Go and keep committing adultery? No. He said "Go now and sin no more." John 8:11 Compassion without the knowledge of whats right and life affirming is meaningless Allyn. Our heavenly Father commands us to love those struggling with homosexuality, and any ill treatment of them as any ill treatment of anyone struggling with other issues is an affront to God, by the same token any lack of help provided to them so that they're able to overcome those actions that can be harmful to them is also an affront to God. We must love be compassionate to them, but also minister (help them) cause "faith by itself, if it does not have works, is dead" James 2:17 Therefor faith (like Kim proclaims to have) without works is not faith. It is just intellectual acknowledgement. If it keeps you in chains and acting out the same errors then it is not faith. Faith cannot exist without being expressed, in works (as the Bible says) that transforms the actions (keyword, actions) of others. And if we have come to know Christ we cannot promote or allow death to be the only thing that others have to look forward to.
76
74 I'm not perfect, no one is, only Christ, when in his human form here on Earth. I have let anger take over me those times that you and Cracker have tried to make that idiotic comparison. I have apologized to you, but it seems you have not known Christ yet cause you still are unable to accept it. I don't apologize however for setting you straight on you attempt at taking lightly or even mocking the suffering that many family members of mine went thru during the post slavery and Jim Crow era. I can love you as my Lord has commanded us to do and still correct you. Love has to be accompanied by correction in some cases otherwise it can't be called love, it would be called permissiveness, appeasement and condoning of wrong behavior or ideas but not love cause love has to always be accompanied by the truth.
77
@75 But how do you justify supporting laws against equality when we are told in the Bible not to get involved in law making and that we cannot expect others to live by our rules? Jesus showed more contempt for the Sadducees and Pharisees (the lawmakers who were forcing their views of sin onto others) than the adulteresses' sins.
78
LC, you have to stop condemning Kim and Dan. It is not appropriate, it is not Biblical. We are instructed: if you have a problem with another believer, you are to take that believer aside in private and discuss the problem with them. An open forum such as this is not an acceptable place to carry on as you’ve been. You doubt her faith, but if she claims the name of Christ (as she does), it is not for you to call her hypocrite. That she chooses to interpret her faith differently than you does not make her a liar and you cannot call her such. Also, condemning people as you’ve done here on this web site is not appropriate either. If you feel attacked, we’re instructed, you are to turn the other cheek, allow the attack and not respond in kind. And yet you have used a pretense of Godliness akin to haughtiness to put others down and to act as if you are better than the others here. If your first response is to say that Kim and Dan or any others have picked this fight, I suggest you contemplate your response first. If you feel that you are throwing pearls of wisdom and education out to us pigs on this site, I remind you that that is not okay either (do not cast pearls before swine). LC, you need to stop trying to pick fights here (and elsewhere in your life?) in the name of God. He does not need defending. If you feel you have standing to correct another Christian, pull them aside in private. This public forum is not an acceptable place.
79
77 78 You depart from the premise that people of faith have no place
in the realm of public policy as if we did not live in the same society you do. People of faith are not exempt due to their faith in taking part in government or in the law making of the communities they live in Allyn.
Because While here on Earth we (people of faith) are called to follow the law and help establish it just as any other person is called to serve.
Therefor silence is not an option we just need to balance God's call with the institutions of man. Following your logic none of the great americans revolutions including the abolitionist movement and the Civil Rights Era would've taken place since they were brought about people of faith.
Christ told us that we should be concerned for our neighbors eternal destiny
"All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. 19Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in[a] the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age."Matthew 28:18-20
That includes their physical and emotional needs Allyn.
The Bible teaches us that we as followers of Christ are born a new and
"created in Christ Jesus for good works which GOD prepared beforehand that we should walk in them" Ephesians 2:10
that includes the fight for the family Allyn.
Therefor works and involvement are indispensable and go alongside faith for salvation.
One of the most misinterpreted Bible passages is “Render unto Caesar what is Caesar’s, and to God what is God’s.” Some especially those who want to silence people of faith use it to confuse and keep us from exactly the opposite that this Bible teaches us to do. That passage carries a sense of duty on our part, a command by Christ to his followers to duty to civil government and to actively participate in the political process while here on Earth.
Finally do yo know Allyn that God as the mighty Creator that he is has enable us to established things like government? and service and involvement to government is part of our debt of gratitude to Him.
More...
in the realm of public policy as if we did not live in the same society you do. People of faith are not exempt due to their faith in taking part in government or in the law making of the communities they live in Allyn.
Because While here on Earth we (people of faith) are called to follow the law and help establish it just as any other person is called to serve.
Therefor silence is not an option we just need to balance God's call with the institutions of man. Following your logic none of the great americans revolutions including the abolitionist movement and the Civil Rights Era would've taken place since they were brought about people of faith.
Christ told us that we should be concerned for our neighbors eternal destiny
"All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. 19Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in[a] the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age."Matthew 28:18-20
That includes their physical and emotional needs Allyn.
The Bible teaches us that we as followers of Christ are born a new and
"created in Christ Jesus for good works which GOD prepared beforehand that we should walk in them" Ephesians 2:10
that includes the fight for the family Allyn.
Therefor works and involvement are indispensable and go alongside faith for salvation.
One of the most misinterpreted Bible passages is “Render unto Caesar what is Caesar’s, and to God what is God’s.” Some especially those who want to silence people of faith use it to confuse and keep us from exactly the opposite that this Bible teaches us to do. That passage carries a sense of duty on our part, a command by Christ to his followers to duty to civil government and to actively participate in the political process while here on Earth.
Finally do yo know Allyn that God as the mighty Creator that he is has enable us to established things like government? and service and involvement to government is part of our debt of gratitude to Him.
80
LC, show me where Christians are encouraged to make laws. Not the Israelites, mind you, but Christians.
One of my biggest frustrations with others who claim to be Christian is the misunderstanding of how to speak the words of Christ to people’s hearts. Is it our job to force others to our faith? Convince and condemn them of their sins? No, we are to share God’s love, Jesus’ compassion and the Holy Spirit’s comfort. The Holy Spirit will convince someone of his or her sins, when that person is ready to hear and to heed.
When you yell at your children, do they hear you? Or have you found, like me, that to get my kids to hear me, I should speak quietly and when they’re ready to hear, they will and they learn? It is the same with the Good News. Yell and scream and condemn “you’re all sinners! you’re all going to hell! you homosexuals are diseased filthy animals!” will not show God’s love, Jesus’ compassion or the Holy Spirit’s comfort; instead it will close people’s ears and their hearts.
Your faith and mine differ on many theological points, I know. I am from the holiness movement, which focuses on a personal relationship with Christ and a focus within on self-improvement and without on compassion. I cannot believe that homosexuality is sinful, any more than shellfish (yum!) and tattoos, but even if it were, I have no place to condemn others. Also, I cannot abide by people abusing the name of Christ in hate and fear, using a comment from a book of law long ignored to force inequality onto others. You don’t want to be married to someone of your gender? Then don’t be, but do you really believe Christ, the man who scorned the Sadducees and the Pharisees, would approve of the current-day Sadducees and Pharisees, the hypocrites keeping special privileges for themselves and preventing others from enjoying the same benefits?
And what is so wrong with Mr. Savage pointing out the hypocrisy in the current-day church? Hypocrisy is far more damaging than if the hypocrite instead simply denounced their faith; at least then they would be honest.
More...
One of my biggest frustrations with others who claim to be Christian is the misunderstanding of how to speak the words of Christ to people’s hearts. Is it our job to force others to our faith? Convince and condemn them of their sins? No, we are to share God’s love, Jesus’ compassion and the Holy Spirit’s comfort. The Holy Spirit will convince someone of his or her sins, when that person is ready to hear and to heed.
When you yell at your children, do they hear you? Or have you found, like me, that to get my kids to hear me, I should speak quietly and when they’re ready to hear, they will and they learn? It is the same with the Good News. Yell and scream and condemn “you’re all sinners! you’re all going to hell! you homosexuals are diseased filthy animals!” will not show God’s love, Jesus’ compassion or the Holy Spirit’s comfort; instead it will close people’s ears and their hearts.
Your faith and mine differ on many theological points, I know. I am from the holiness movement, which focuses on a personal relationship with Christ and a focus within on self-improvement and without on compassion. I cannot believe that homosexuality is sinful, any more than shellfish (yum!) and tattoos, but even if it were, I have no place to condemn others. Also, I cannot abide by people abusing the name of Christ in hate and fear, using a comment from a book of law long ignored to force inequality onto others. You don’t want to be married to someone of your gender? Then don’t be, but do you really believe Christ, the man who scorned the Sadducees and the Pharisees, would approve of the current-day Sadducees and Pharisees, the hypocrites keeping special privileges for themselves and preventing others from enjoying the same benefits?
And what is so wrong with Mr. Savage pointing out the hypocrisy in the current-day church? Hypocrisy is far more damaging than if the hypocrite instead simply denounced their faith; at least then they would be honest.
81
@ 76, if you've apologized to me, then you must have said it out loud or in your head because I've never read an apology - and believe me, I've kept my eyes open for one. I will accept it now. Thank you.
Unfortunately, your lashing out (at the 100% valid comparison of the struggles of two peoples who suffered discrimination because of something they were born with) is symptomatic of the fact that I'm right. When someone says something you don't like to hear, lashing out is a sign that you can't answer it with the truth.
Unfortunately, your lashing out (at the 100% valid comparison of the struggles of two peoples who suffered discrimination because of something they were born with) is symptomatic of the fact that I'm right. When someone says something you don't like to hear, lashing out is a sign that you can't answer it with the truth.
82
Wait, you mean they didn't have any RC cola machines? Aren't those the Jesus sodas of the South?
But still, 10 frikkin' Pepsi machines. Damn. I don't think a single church I ever went to had even one drink machine.
And shouldn't those drink machines dispense wine or something? That seemed to be the Biblically approved drink as far as I remember.
But still, 10 frikkin' Pepsi machines. Damn. I don't think a single church I ever went to had even one drink machine.
And shouldn't those drink machines dispense wine or something? That seemed to be the Biblically approved drink as far as I remember.
83
@ 82, we're probably talking about Baptists or some similar denomination. They're very thumbs-down on anything alcoholic.
@ LC, if truth is on your side, you'll be able to answer me @ 81 - calmly and rationally, not angrily. Care to try?
@ LC, if truth is on your side, you'll be able to answer me @ 81 - calmly and rationally, not angrily. Care to try?
84
83: She did, and you apologized for calling her a bitch, it was last spring. It's Cracker Jack and Akbar who haven't received apologies for the violence she threatened them with.
85
@ 84, I'd forgotten about the apology. Thank you, and sorry to you LC.
However, what I'm trying to talk about now (and can now see that I wasn't clear about) is this: I say that gay rights is, in every respect, a legitimate struggle for rights on par with the Civil Rights movement of the 50s and 60s. LC, in her answer to me, calls this idiotic and uses this notion to explain (or even justify?) her anger toward myself and others who make this claim.
Now, what I'm trying to get LC to answer is this: Why is gay rights NOT the same as Civil Rights? We're talking about two groups discriminated against because of who they are. Both people who had no choice in being who they are, which is the essence of why discriminating against them is wrong.
If truth is on LC's side, she'll explain why this is wrong. She'll SHOW that it's a choice to be gay; she SHOW that it's simply behavior and kink, and not the way a person is hardwired. She'll do this because the TRUTH is something that ALWAYS stands apart from religion. For example, you don't need God telling you that stealing and murder are wrong; you know they'd still be wrong even if God never said anything about them. Similarly, if being gay is wrong, this can be shown using empirical evidence; that is, Proof, not Faith.
That's where I was at @ 83.
However, what I'm trying to talk about now (and can now see that I wasn't clear about) is this: I say that gay rights is, in every respect, a legitimate struggle for rights on par with the Civil Rights movement of the 50s and 60s. LC, in her answer to me, calls this idiotic and uses this notion to explain (or even justify?) her anger toward myself and others who make this claim.
Now, what I'm trying to get LC to answer is this: Why is gay rights NOT the same as Civil Rights? We're talking about two groups discriminated against because of who they are. Both people who had no choice in being who they are, which is the essence of why discriminating against them is wrong.
If truth is on LC's side, she'll explain why this is wrong. She'll SHOW that it's a choice to be gay; she SHOW that it's simply behavior and kink, and not the way a person is hardwired. She'll do this because the TRUTH is something that ALWAYS stands apart from religion. For example, you don't need God telling you that stealing and murder are wrong; you know they'd still be wrong even if God never said anything about them. Similarly, if being gay is wrong, this can be shown using empirical evidence; that is, Proof, not Faith.
That's where I was at @ 83.
87
85 Choice or not, when you say enter a store do people identify you as gay from first sight? Forget the store, when you walk down the street are others able to identify you as gay at first sight? If so how. Let me tell you when i walk down the street others are able to see my skin color immediately, I don't need to tell them i am, they see it.
88
Loveschild:
I did not choose to be a bisexual: the darling of my heart did not choose to be gay.
The darling of my heart was raised by adherents of a horrible homophobic religion that preached being gay was sick and evil and a sin. He tried DESPERATELY not to be gay .... without any success, of course.
Being a member of the LGBT community is NOT a choice!
I did not choose to be a bisexual: the darling of my heart did not choose to be gay.
The darling of my heart was raised by adherents of a horrible homophobic religion that preached being gay was sick and evil and a sin. He tried DESPERATELY not to be gay .... without any success, of course.
Being a member of the LGBT community is NOT a choice!
89
I don't remember what this thread is about anymore. Thanks, LC, for another mind-numbing jerkoff session.
90
@87 How does it matter if you're more easily identified as black than I am as gay? Matt is talking about bigotry (the kind that you advance) -- not physical appearance. The Jews in Nazi Germany were not always easily identifiable as being Jews (hence the patches). Does that make the Holocaust any less important? Bigotry against Christians in early A.D. is another example. It doesn't matter how "detectable" is the victim of your bigotry.
91
Bigots don't discriminate. They'll hate blacks, gays, Jews, Arabs, women, and pretty much anyone equally. Hooray bigotry? And please, let's not feed the troll. This one (LC) is boring.
92
Please people help gay people realize that this is the most degrading act of humanity for a man to sex another man in the ANUS meant for human daily waste.
Why would a man deep in a stinking shit hole?
If after evaluating yourself you chose to sleep with a fellow man leaving the heavenly created female then keep it to yourself.
Being gay (LGBT) is an awful life you cannot take home. Your parents and family are heart broken and devastated for NO PARENT, BROTHER OR SISTER CAN WISH HIS SON TO BE GAY. What a confusing lifestyle.
Being gay is like eating shit while there’re abundant of body nourishing food to eat.
Being gay is like drinking urine while there’re nourishing clear water to drink.
Being gay is being something your not and will NEVER BE.
Being gay is an addiction just like drugs, cigarette etc. No one is created to smoke or do drugs. You try it, learn it and you might get hooked.
All you gay people if you can’t snap out of it just because then keep it to yourself and leave on. Don’t try to change the fundamental structure of man and woman with you pitiful excuses.
For a lot of you who likes to try new things,
DO NOT TRY GAY LIFESTYLE. !!RUN!!
CUT-OFF THAT FRIEND. !!RUN!!
Why would a man deep in a stinking shit hole?
If after evaluating yourself you chose to sleep with a fellow man leaving the heavenly created female then keep it to yourself.
Being gay (LGBT) is an awful life you cannot take home. Your parents and family are heart broken and devastated for NO PARENT, BROTHER OR SISTER CAN WISH HIS SON TO BE GAY. What a confusing lifestyle.
Being gay is like eating shit while there’re abundant of body nourishing food to eat.
Being gay is like drinking urine while there’re nourishing clear water to drink.
Being gay is being something your not and will NEVER BE.
Being gay is an addiction just like drugs, cigarette etc. No one is created to smoke or do drugs. You try it, learn it and you might get hooked.
All you gay people if you can’t snap out of it just because then keep it to yourself and leave on. Don’t try to change the fundamental structure of man and woman with you pitiful excuses.
For a lot of you who likes to try new things,
DO NOT TRY GAY LIFESTYLE. !!RUN!!
CUT-OFF THAT FRIEND. !!RUN!!
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