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News & ArtsTuesday, August 25, 2009
Politics Those Were The Days
Posted by Dan Savage on Tue, Aug 25, 2009 at 8:44 AM
Remember when you could get arrested for wearing a t-shirt that insulted the president? Times have changed. Now you can threaten the president's life in front of a sitting U.S. Senator. Good times. Hey, you can even pray for the president's death from the pulpit...
They're trying to get him killed. Let's pause to contemplate the riots that will break out all across the country if these hateful douchebags succeed in getting the president killed. Most of the riots will take place in urban areas—in areas that support the president—and most of the people who get hurt or killed are going to be liberals and Democrats and progressives and people of color. That's probably part of the plan. None of the suburban mega-churches or shithole exurbs from which most of this dangerous rhetoric emanates will be put to the torch. But if the can-no-longer-be-described-as-unthinkable actually happens—if they succeed in getting the president killed—rioters in New York City will find that Fox News HQ is rather conveniently located. Please make a note of it.
1
Threatening the life of the president is, and always has been, a federal crime. I don't understand why they're letting these asswipes get away with this. Though, on the plus side, it does help tar all Obama critics with the crazy brush.
But it's only a matter of time before one of these freaks starts shooting.
But it's only a matter of time before one of these freaks starts shooting.
2
don't pretend that we never threatened Bush's life in front of every god damned person we came across.....not for a second.....we hated that man!
3
Andy-
Although we (and I do speak for everyone on the left) hated that man with a deep and abiding passion. Even as I hoped that he would exploded from all the pure distilled evil he held inside.
I cannot think of a single time that lefties brought a gun to one of his speeches or told a US Senator that we were going to take a gun to Washington.
Although we (and I do speak for everyone on the left) hated that man with a deep and abiding passion. Even as I hoped that he would exploded from all the pure distilled evil he held inside.
I cannot think of a single time that lefties brought a gun to one of his speeches or told a US Senator that we were going to take a gun to Washington.
4
Personally, I'm hoping that Obama will have the last laugh and have a long and distinguished career as an active Former President (regardless of if he serves only one term or two).
This is truly a case where LIVING well is the best revenge.
This is truly a case where LIVING well is the best revenge.
5
REWRITE DESK!!
"Let's pause to contemplate the rioting that ensue if they succeed in getting the president killed."
take your pick:
a. ...rioting that WOULD ensue ...
b. ...rioting that MIGHT ensue ...
c. ...rioting that COULD ensue ...
d. ...rioting that SHOULD ensue ...
e. ...REJOICING that WOULD ensue ...
"Let's pause to contemplate the rioting that ensue if they succeed in getting the president killed."
take your pick:
a. ...rioting that WOULD ensue ...
b. ...rioting that MIGHT ensue ...
c. ...rioting that COULD ensue ...
d. ...rioting that SHOULD ensue ...
e. ...REJOICING that WOULD ensue ...
8
Obama won't be killed, he'll realize he was way in over is head and resign so that Joe will finish the term.
9
Leave it to American Christian sects to subvert and pervert every one of Christ's teachings, and call for death becaus (gasp! horror!) progressive Christianity is being practiced. In at ;east one civilized, industrialized Christian nations, Obama enjoys 75% popularity.
10
@8 It's odd that you mention that, because I had a dream where that very thing occurred. Although, in it, Obama resigned to me. I don't know why. I just remember thinking, "oh, wow".
12
Can't one just make a quick call to the secret service and point out what was said? Even if legal action isn't taken against the person, the secret service can certainly make life difficult for the person who makes such threats. (kind of like reporting someone to the IRS for a good old-fashioned audit as a form of revenge.)
13
Dan, don't give me a scare like that so early in the morning. I never thought I'd be glad that I'm moving FURTHER away from the Capitol in a few weeks.
Perhaps, if this does happen, we should head off the riots by TAKING them to the mega-churches. Suburbanites DEFINITELY won't enter the cities if we go after them, they already think that urban = dangerous ghetto in all circumstances, let's give 'em one more reason to be scared to enter our city limits. Just one problem...ummm...can I get a GPS for this plan? I get lost when I leave the city...
Perhaps, if this does happen, we should head off the riots by TAKING them to the mega-churches. Suburbanites DEFINITELY won't enter the cities if we go after them, they already think that urban = dangerous ghetto in all circumstances, let's give 'em one more reason to be scared to enter our city limits. Just one problem...ummm...can I get a GPS for this plan? I get lost when I leave the city...
14
@5
Sorry Girls-
you're all wrong...
the corrected answer is WILL!!
(Dan has been fingering his Ouija Board again, evidently...)
Sorry Girls-
you're all wrong...
the corrected answer is WILL!!
(Dan has been fingering his Ouija Board again, evidently...)
17
First of all to think that rioting will ensue is pretty much a streatch. We stood by and did nothing when Bush was appointed President in 2000 and frankly that was the point when armed rebellion against the US Government was required by our founders. Yes boys and girls, it was game over when we all collectively rolled over and took it up the ass.
To think that we'll riot if something happens to Obama is laughable at this point. We've been bitched slapped a thousand ways to Sunday.
To think that we'll riot if something happens to Obama is laughable at this point. We've been bitched slapped a thousand ways to Sunday.
18
Fox News's HQ in New York would be a target if something ever happens to Obama or some Timothy McVie type does a domestic mass murder. They promote those, & covet as viewers, those who would support murdering the president, Jews, gays, illegals, anyone they consider a threat to the USA they think we should return to.
19
Thanks for the helpful hint, Danno
but that is a pretty far hike from
the Central District-
how about one for the home town Brothas:
http://maps.google.com/maps?q=the%20stra…
but that is a pretty far hike from
the Central District-
how about one for the home town Brothas:
http://maps.google.com/maps?q=the%20stra…
20
Holy crap, that's the same Steven Anderson who got his ass (illegally) beaten by a bunch of thug cops during a suspicionless traffic stop earlier this year.
21
so.. lets meet at the park and we can all car pool out to the suburbs for the riots. I have a van, I can take about 10.
22
Anderson is crazy, but I admire some of his antics. He's the guy who would go to Homeland Security checkpoints and fuck with the people by refusing to answer their questions on the basis that the checkpoints violate the 4th Amendment (and I agree that they are in violation). Once he got tasered and his head got busted open. Funny that the news doesn't mention any of this, considering they carried that story three months ago and gave him oodles of sympathy then.
I guess this sermon shows the downside of being a crazy fucking Libertarian.
I guess this sermon shows the downside of being a crazy fucking Libertarian.
23
so basically this guy is promoting Manson's Helter Skelter? Can't that be a talking point? "Sir, do you realize you are PROMOTING Charles Manson?"
24
@ 13 - Don't you mean "urban = godless, hellbound liberals"? Oh and, we're not the Real America, either.
25
Hey, with any luck it'll be a near miss and he'll instantly become politically bulletproof, a la Reagan/Hinckly.
27
If a liberal had gone on television during the Bush years and said the exact same things about Bush, all HELL would break loose, or if hippies started showing up at Bush rallies with guns...
28
At this point there are no sane people left who self identify as "Republican". The sane ones left the party long ago and now self identify as "Blue Dog Democrats".
Which is why the left needs a new party - The repugs took ours over.
Which is why the left needs a new party - The repugs took ours over.
29
I have a sincere belief that better judgement will prevail in the U.S. After all, we just elected our first African American president. That showed a definite improvement over what we have elected in the past.
31
Vince, you are asking for something that is not common in modern America- better judgment. I hope you're right, but just the fact that so many people- & not all of them uneducated too- are so easily manipulated as has been shown at many town hall meetings- makes me have serious doubt about the future of this nation, & whether it can remain one.
32
It's times like these that call to mind Elton John's song "Burn Down the Mission." Anyway what part of THAT SHALT NOT KILL DON'T these so called Christians understand?
35
I'm totally shocked and sickened by how bigoted and hateful people in this country are and I am appalled that republican leaders do not try to distance themselves from this malarky.
On a side note - Contessa is very hot!
On a side note - Contessa is very hot!
36
The best part is that the Secret Service was moved under DHS during the Bush Administration and is now underfunded and understaffed.
Yeah. Just in time for the first black president and all the wingnut insanity to follow, they fucking FEMA-ized the Secret Service. Fucking great.
Yeah. Just in time for the first black president and all the wingnut insanity to follow, they fucking FEMA-ized the Secret Service. Fucking great.
37
25
yeah
and the first thing a politically bulletproof Obama could do tell the gays to fuck off and not pester him anymore...
yeah
and the first thing a politically bulletproof Obama could do tell the gays to fuck off and not pester him anymore...
38
Much as I hated Bush's policies and despised the smarmy little fuck personally, I never once, not in speech nor in writing, wished him dead. It drives me nuts when people claim the right-wing loonies are "just doing what the left-wing loonies have been doing for the last eight years." Um, no. There's a ugly racist undertone to a lot of this that was definitely not present with Bush, little though I liked that nasty little man.
39
If things continue going this way, unchecked, Obama will be killed or seriously maimed while in office. I really do believe this and I am not at all a dramatic person.
40
So if anything happens to our president, we shouldn't riot locally. We should go out to the suburbs and exurbs and set fire to mega-churches. I'd be down with that.
43
I'm still taken aback, this completely flies in the face of scripture, we are called to bless our enemies and to ask that they be blessed in our prayers, not to pray for their death. He sounds like a Westboro nut.
46
That guy is anything but a preacher. Nothing in Christianity condones violence and wishin death upon heads of state, nothing. In this political climate there are nut jobs out there waitn for anything to set them off and commit stupid sht, so the words coming out of this man are irresponsible and should be looked at very carefully by those who oversee the protection of our President. May the Lord send his angels to guard, surround and protect our President against the corrosive hate comin out of white supremacists hiding behind religion, besmirchin it with their racism, and some intellectual groups doing the same under the guise of sexual libertinism.
47
Largely because roughly %25 of this country, on the right, has GONE CRAZY. To believe that a supposedly muslim Kenyan metrosexual elitist manchurian candidate (of Satan) is subverting America into a fascist-communist secular humanist country that yearns for more terrorist attacks from muslim extremists. Where the old, where baby rednecks, and maybe one day pure white bred folks will be killed off or aborted by "Obamacare", part of an agenda to make everyone here a mixed-race brainwashed demonoid liberal.
That is no exaggeration on what many of these Palin lovers believe. That is roughly what the history books would have to say. And that is some heavy, strange shit that deserves more investigation. That this is why America has gotten to this point. I still want to know, HOW?? It can't be as simple as propaganda from right wing talk shows, can it?
That is no exaggeration on what many of these Palin lovers believe. That is roughly what the history books would have to say. And that is some heavy, strange shit that deserves more investigation. That this is why America has gotten to this point. I still want to know, HOW?? It can't be as simple as propaganda from right wing talk shows, can it?
48
Dan-Be fair, the couple was not arrested for wearing an anti-Bush shirt. They were arrested for trespassing, but happened to be wearing an anti-Bush t-shirt. A slightly different matter. Just read the article which you linked to.
49
46, Like you, these hateful folks are cherry picking scriptures to fit their hate filled agenda. You're the same as them, only the target of your hate is different.
50
49, Well that that different. This guy hates gays too. Just like you! So other than his wishing the president dead, you are much the same. You'd be cheering him on otherwise.
51
#47. I don't think it's as simple as that. Look at the kids in the documentary Jesus Camp. They grow up indoctrinated in that type of "worship" setting. They're immersed in books like Left Behind.
Those kids in that film? Those still likable, kind of endearing-breaks-your-heart kids? They're going to grow up, but their IQ, their ability to discern fact from fiction, their critical thinking skills will remain the same and eventually become stunted. They will grow up to become like those at the town hall meetings.
Those kids in that film? Those still likable, kind of endearing-breaks-your-heart kids? They're going to grow up, but their IQ, their ability to discern fact from fiction, their critical thinking skills will remain the same and eventually become stunted. They will grow up to become like those at the town hall meetings.
53
Oh, Dan.
Do you care about the fact that by continually peddling the idea of an Obama assassination you are making it more likely? Would you like it to happen because of his sins against the gay community? Catholics do find it easier to love people when they are dead.
You go out of your way to antagonize the right wing crazies in your audience, then tell them how to really hurt you, and all the other people out there they think are just like you. You explain to them just how devastating it would be: compare what you wrote here to the dialogue used in the musical ASSASSINS to encourage Oswald to shoot Kennedy: "The world will weep. Grief, grief beyond imagining."
Crazy people get their ideas from crazy places. You are not careful enough with your own rhetoric to reasonably criticize others. Your intention is not the only relevant thing.
Do you care about the fact that by continually peddling the idea of an Obama assassination you are making it more likely? Would you like it to happen because of his sins against the gay community? Catholics do find it easier to love people when they are dead.
You go out of your way to antagonize the right wing crazies in your audience, then tell them how to really hurt you, and all the other people out there they think are just like you. You explain to them just how devastating it would be: compare what you wrote here to the dialogue used in the musical ASSASSINS to encourage Oswald to shoot Kennedy: "The world will weep. Grief, grief beyond imagining."
Crazy people get their ideas from crazy places. You are not careful enough with your own rhetoric to reasonably criticize others. Your intention is not the only relevant thing.
55
You speak, Stace @53 as if Dan could predict how his words could affect the completely irrational. Even the behavioral specialists of the FBI cannot do that.
There are more dangerous things out there relentless spouting off in hope that others will be inspired to trade their pathetic lives for some violent change. Dan is merely pointing them out.
There are more dangerous things out there relentless spouting off in hope that others will be inspired to trade their pathetic lives for some violent change. Dan is merely pointing them out.
56
You speak, Uriel, as though it were not reasonable to consider the impact of one's words before writing.
Dan is being irresponsible in an effort to draw attention to himself.
Again.
Dan is being irresponsible in an effort to draw attention to himself.
Again.
58
Gee, Jade. What a compelling defense you offer. Of course, no more reasonable or nuanced defense of your hero is possible, is it?
59
Ahh, I was right.
My disagreeing with you = Dan's my hero. That's how your mind works.
Now, see, that's why I didn't offer a more "reasonable or nuanced" answer. I guessed, from reading your two posts, how your reasoning faculties probably work, and that it would be a waste of time to discuss this with you. And I was right.
I was actually interested in what your follow-up to Uriel would be. I thought there might be room for discussion (which I love) rather than debate (not interested), but the sentence I quoted proved that there's no room for discussion because of your certainty that you're right. So I threw a "bullshit" post out there. Sure, it's not my finest moment, but it was at least succinct.
My disagreeing with you = Dan's my hero. That's how your mind works.
Now, see, that's why I didn't offer a more "reasonable or nuanced" answer. I guessed, from reading your two posts, how your reasoning faculties probably work, and that it would be a waste of time to discuss this with you. And I was right.
I was actually interested in what your follow-up to Uriel would be. I thought there might be room for discussion (which I love) rather than debate (not interested), but the sentence I quoted proved that there's no room for discussion because of your certainty that you're right. So I threw a "bullshit" post out there. Sure, it's not my finest moment, but it was at least succinct.
60
Saying my words are bullshit just because they say thing you find unkind about Dan makes my hero comment completely fair. But, again, Dan has taught you to behave exactly as you did. It is his fault.
You can still find no way to criticize the content of what I wrote, just the "certainty" with which I expressed it. So you scream obscenities and praise yourself for your brevity.
You can still find no way to criticize the content of what I wrote, just the "certainty" with which I expressed it. So you scream obscenities and praise yourself for your brevity.
61
I didn't find your statement "unkind"'; I found it wrong, ignorant, irrational, and petty.
But the fact that you've scolded me for using "obscenities" pretty much tells me the kind of person I'm wasting my time with.
Carry on, Stace. You righteously indignant Madonna, you.
But the fact that you've scolded me for using "obscenities" pretty much tells me the kind of person I'm wasting my time with.
Carry on, Stace. You righteously indignant Madonna, you.
62
You are free to use as many obscenities as you like. I curse like a sailor and this is certainly an appropriate venue for words like "bullshit." It is the fact that you offer nothing to back it up that is problematic. Here, at least, you manage some adjectives.
Point of reference: the article I responded to included this sentence, with no qualifiers:
"They're trying to get him killed."
I called that irresponsible, and I absolutely stand by that. Please compare it to what I wrote, Jade. Then reread your criticism of me. Personally, I find Dan's words infinitely more "ignorant, irrational, and petty" than mine. If you disagree, please explain why.
Point of reference: the article I responded to included this sentence, with no qualifiers:
"They're trying to get him killed."
I called that irresponsible, and I absolutely stand by that. Please compare it to what I wrote, Jade. Then reread your criticism of me. Personally, I find Dan's words infinitely more "ignorant, irrational, and petty" than mine. If you disagree, please explain why.
63
Hugs to you, Stace.
Bummer your having such a bad day, spending your time here constantly criticizing. We get it, you've made numerous posts complaining about Savage. In your stated position, the man can't say or write anything right, and he's to blame for everything that ever goes wrong, be it past, present, or future. Although, it is impossible in this world for one person to shoulder 100% of the blame, we don't exists in a vacuum. Your intelligent enough to realize this. So, if you don't like the man's blog, column, and pod casts, then, save yourself some unhappiness and stop reading/listening to him. It obviously makes you unhappy. Why else would you spend your day judging and criticizing another, and trolling others by claiming you have the omniscient authority to understand the reasoning behind every comment made? Most people understand that the need to criticize doesn't come from a pure motive, it comes from a deep seated dissatisfaction from within. A need to put another down, so as to build oneself up. So, here's an Internet HUG, that way you won't need to continue patting yourself on the back and claiming everyone who disagrees with you, or jokes with you, is a simpleton who only speaks what Dan has given them permission to say. And, an acknowledgement that your comments have been indeed been read.
In the future if you need to get something off your chest, you could just email Savage directly. That's how I choose to communicate my disagreements with his position on a subject, it's much less passive-aggressive than posting it on his blog. You might feel better knowing you've be heard if you comment to him directly, then to hope he takes the time to read a thread.
Here's to a better tomorrow.
Take care.
More...
Bummer your having such a bad day, spending your time here constantly criticizing. We get it, you've made numerous posts complaining about Savage. In your stated position, the man can't say or write anything right, and he's to blame for everything that ever goes wrong, be it past, present, or future. Although, it is impossible in this world for one person to shoulder 100% of the blame, we don't exists in a vacuum. Your intelligent enough to realize this. So, if you don't like the man's blog, column, and pod casts, then, save yourself some unhappiness and stop reading/listening to him. It obviously makes you unhappy. Why else would you spend your day judging and criticizing another, and trolling others by claiming you have the omniscient authority to understand the reasoning behind every comment made? Most people understand that the need to criticize doesn't come from a pure motive, it comes from a deep seated dissatisfaction from within. A need to put another down, so as to build oneself up. So, here's an Internet HUG, that way you won't need to continue patting yourself on the back and claiming everyone who disagrees with you, or jokes with you, is a simpleton who only speaks what Dan has given them permission to say. And, an acknowledgement that your comments have been indeed been read.
In the future if you need to get something off your chest, you could just email Savage directly. That's how I choose to communicate my disagreements with his position on a subject, it's much less passive-aggressive than posting it on his blog. You might feel better knowing you've be heard if you comment to him directly, then to hope he takes the time to read a thread.
Here's to a better tomorrow.
Take care.
64
Stace, no. I won't explain anything to you. Not after this:
Or this:
Or this:
No fucking way.
Would you like it to happen because of his sins against the gay community?
Or this:
Catholics do find it easier to love people when they are dead.
Or this:
Dan is being irresponsible in an effort to draw attention to himself.
No fucking way.
65
Also, a follow-up to this story:
Chris Broughton, the man who brought an assault rifle and a handgun to the Obama event in Arizona last week, attended a fiery anti-Obama sermon the day before the event, in which Pastor Steven Anderson said he was going to "pray for Barack Obama to die and go to hell", Anderson confirmed to TPMmuckraker today.
66
Thanks, Kim.
Hugs back at you. I am indeed having a very bad day and am deliberately venting spleen. I'm also taking a little time to into this record legitimate criticisms of Dan that need to be considered. It should be obvious that I am a big fan of Dan since I know his work so well. However, he continues to act irresponsibly. It's not enough he helped cause the rise in HIV infections, he had to help cause the Iraq War? And the Prop 8 rant proved he learned nothing from any of that.
I was drawn into this not by Dan himself but by extent to which Dominic Holden has modeled his very effective publicity campaign of abuse against the well-meaning but addled organizers of Hempfest on his editor and mentor. Dan is a bully. Young people are taking on this trait in addition to his positive ones. I felt a need to point this out and felt this was an appropriate way to do it.
If I ever put people any one down to the extent that Dan puts down fat people (announcing he will leave his husband Terry Miller if Terry ever gains weight, for example), please make sure to let me know. Otherwise, you will understand that I have a hard time feeling bad for writing true things about him.
Hugs back at you. I am indeed having a very bad day and am deliberately venting spleen. I'm also taking a little time to into this record legitimate criticisms of Dan that need to be considered. It should be obvious that I am a big fan of Dan since I know his work so well. However, he continues to act irresponsibly. It's not enough he helped cause the rise in HIV infections, he had to help cause the Iraq War? And the Prop 8 rant proved he learned nothing from any of that.
I was drawn into this not by Dan himself but by extent to which Dominic Holden has modeled his very effective publicity campaign of abuse against the well-meaning but addled organizers of Hempfest on his editor and mentor. Dan is a bully. Young people are taking on this trait in addition to his positive ones. I felt a need to point this out and felt this was an appropriate way to do it.
If I ever put people any one down to the extent that Dan puts down fat people (announcing he will leave his husband Terry Miller if Terry ever gains weight, for example), please make sure to let me know. Otherwise, you will understand that I have a hard time feeling bad for writing true things about him.
67
The reason you will not, Jade, is because none of those comments is as incendiary as flatly stating, "They're trying to get him killed." Because of that, you are unable to mount any sort of coherent defense. Frustrated, you claim that I am unworthy of one.
Pretend I was, Jade.
What would you say?
Pretend I was, Jade.
What would you say?
68
Thanks, Stace.
I appreciate the background. And, I do hope your day gets better. Question, when you say your a fan does that refer to reading his books, columns, and listening to his pod cast? Or, have you actually spoken to the man?
The suggestion to email him directly was sincerely made. I've found that he will dialog respectfully, and he has yet to bully me (and being a breeder of faith, I could be considered and easy target).
I don't find any purpose in being unkind, either. I am often frustrated by the lack of grace found here on SLOG. And, you are most welcome to your own feelings. I don't doubt the accuracy of your quoting him, because I'm very familiar with his body of work, I just choose to keep them in context with the entirety of his person and within the greater context of where the statement was made. Dan Savage, the man I've interacted with personally, is surprisingly humble, gentle, kind, very shy/introverted at least initially, it seems to me that he wears his heart on his sleeve, is sincerely devoted to his family, and is not a bully. Although, I can see why and how he comes across bullish to many, passionate people often can come off asshole-ish especially when they are upset. Something, that I have been found guilty of on occasion, and am in need of grace for.
Best wishes.
I appreciate the background. And, I do hope your day gets better. Question, when you say your a fan does that refer to reading his books, columns, and listening to his pod cast? Or, have you actually spoken to the man?
The suggestion to email him directly was sincerely made. I've found that he will dialog respectfully, and he has yet to bully me (and being a breeder of faith, I could be considered and easy target).
I don't find any purpose in being unkind, either. I am often frustrated by the lack of grace found here on SLOG. And, you are most welcome to your own feelings. I don't doubt the accuracy of your quoting him, because I'm very familiar with his body of work, I just choose to keep them in context with the entirety of his person and within the greater context of where the statement was made. Dan Savage, the man I've interacted with personally, is surprisingly humble, gentle, kind, very shy/introverted at least initially, it seems to me that he wears his heart on his sleeve, is sincerely devoted to his family, and is not a bully. Although, I can see why and how he comes across bullish to many, passionate people often can come off asshole-ish especially when they are upset. Something, that I have been found guilty of on occasion, and am in need of grace for.
Best wishes.
69
Kim:
I have emailed Savage, gotten a reasonable response a couple of years ago, been ignored this year. That's not a complaint-- his profile has risen considerably in that time and I'm sure I was merely one of dozens who wrote very similar letters.
I guess I'm not a true fan by your definition-- do you realize how odd it sounds that you think having ONLY read his books and columns and listened to his podcast is somehow not an adequate Dan Savage experience? I've also heard him speak in person. My boyfriend went to meet him but I didn't. Does that count?
I believe that the private Dan Savage is a decent guy. That makes his willingness to publicly encourage the abuse of others less powerful than himself even worse. The whole "brazen fag" shtick got him noticed-- good for him. It's wrong of him not to be working harder to get past it now that he is no longer a struggling kid. He encourages people to be cruel. He writes recklessly about politics with a track record that proves he has little if any understanding of it.
And someone thinks it's a good idea to give him a TV show.
I have emailed Savage, gotten a reasonable response a couple of years ago, been ignored this year. That's not a complaint-- his profile has risen considerably in that time and I'm sure I was merely one of dozens who wrote very similar letters.
I guess I'm not a true fan by your definition-- do you realize how odd it sounds that you think having ONLY read his books and columns and listened to his podcast is somehow not an adequate Dan Savage experience? I've also heard him speak in person. My boyfriend went to meet him but I didn't. Does that count?
I believe that the private Dan Savage is a decent guy. That makes his willingness to publicly encourage the abuse of others less powerful than himself even worse. The whole "brazen fag" shtick got him noticed-- good for him. It's wrong of him not to be working harder to get past it now that he is no longer a struggling kid. He encourages people to be cruel. He writes recklessly about politics with a track record that proves he has little if any understanding of it.
And someone thinks it's a good idea to give him a TV show.
70
Hey, Jade:
Thanks! That's relevant and makes the point that Savage is in fact talking about genuine threats. And I agree that the threats are genuine. I think for someone as deliberately divisive as Dan Savage to write about this issue as vehemently as he did is irresponsible _because_ those threats are real. Lots of right wing crazies love to hate Dan. I do think it makes sense to factor them in when reporting on an issue as dangerous as this one. Did you know that most major news organizations avoid reporting on the possibility of assassination because it is a widely held belief that those reports increase the likelihood of actual attempts? If Dan didn't make a point of antagonizing dangerous people, I would not complain about his reporting on this issue, but most print editors would kill this, not write it themselves. It's basic journalistic ethics.
Thanks! That's relevant and makes the point that Savage is in fact talking about genuine threats. And I agree that the threats are genuine. I think for someone as deliberately divisive as Dan Savage to write about this issue as vehemently as he did is irresponsible _because_ those threats are real. Lots of right wing crazies love to hate Dan. I do think it makes sense to factor them in when reporting on an issue as dangerous as this one. Did you know that most major news organizations avoid reporting on the possibility of assassination because it is a widely held belief that those reports increase the likelihood of actual attempts? If Dan didn't make a point of antagonizing dangerous people, I would not complain about his reporting on this issue, but most print editors would kill this, not write it themselves. It's basic journalistic ethics.
71
Stace,
Sorry, I was looking for clarification. It wasn't a statement about who's a better fan, or who's a true fan. I was just curious if you had met him or spoken directly to him. Because, I found that actually interacting with a person, changes how I see them, even when they piss me off and I think they are out of line. It challenges me, to look beyond their words to their heart, and to ask them about the intent of their words. That's the only reason I asked, just in case you had found him to be a different person in real life than I have. Truly, I'm sorry that it troubled you. I didn't want to make your day worse.
You're welcome to your opinion, and your feelings.
As to the TV show, time will tell.
I wish you peace.
Sorry, I was looking for clarification. It wasn't a statement about who's a better fan, or who's a true fan. I was just curious if you had met him or spoken directly to him. Because, I found that actually interacting with a person, changes how I see them, even when they piss me off and I think they are out of line. It challenges me, to look beyond their words to their heart, and to ask them about the intent of their words. That's the only reason I asked, just in case you had found him to be a different person in real life than I have. Truly, I'm sorry that it troubled you. I didn't want to make your day worse.
You're welcome to your opinion, and your feelings.
As to the TV show, time will tell.
I wish you peace.
72
Kim:
Sorry-- you did not offend me or make my day worse. I just found the way you phrased that odd in a way that was worth pointing out. I did not mean to sound as hostile or defensive as I obviously did, or to sound as though I questioned the sincerity of your good intent. I was just trying not to be judgmental and failing. I wish you peace as well and thank you for the dialogue.
Sorry-- you did not offend me or make my day worse. I just found the way you phrased that odd in a way that was worth pointing out. I did not mean to sound as hostile or defensive as I obviously did, or to sound as though I questioned the sincerity of your good intent. I was just trying not to be judgmental and failing. I wish you peace as well and thank you for the dialogue.
73
just admit it Kim,
you have one of Savage's chest hairs in a locket and curse the god who did not make you a gay male that Dan might take notice of...
you have one of Savage's chest hairs in a locket and curse the god who did not make you a gay male that Dan might take notice of...
75
Dear Smiling Happy People:
Thanks for the advice. I remember when you used to be shiny! I'll call you when the acid kicks in.
Thanks for the advice. I remember when you used to be shiny! I'll call you when the acid kicks in.
76
73:
No worries. I'm following all the Sea Witch's advice. I have my limited addition gilded chest hair, in a gold lame lined velvet box in front of the alter of equality. Where I burn incense, place offerings of 12 year old single malt scotch, and sprinkle glitter daily while I sing show tunes.
No worries. I'm following all the Sea Witch's advice. I have my limited addition gilded chest hair, in a gold lame lined velvet box in front of the alter of equality. Where I burn incense, place offerings of 12 year old single malt scotch, and sprinkle glitter daily while I sing show tunes.
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