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News & ArtsWednesday, August 12, 2009
City Jaywalk this.
Posted by Chicago Fan on Wed, Aug 12, 2009 at 10:28 AM
Jaywalking continues to be a hot topic, at least for White Sox manager Ozzie Guillen, known throughout the sports world for being more than a bit crazy.
Guillen continued to crack up about Williams getting the ticket and admitted he purposely jaywalked Tuesday morning just to see if he could get a citation.''The police here don't have anything better to do?'' Guillen said, laughing. ''OK, if that costs you 60 bucks, how much does a drinking and driving cost here? Life in jail?
''But that's the rules here. I think it's protecting a lot of people. It's something you have to be aware of.''
Guillen was told that Manny Ramirez also got caught jaywalking in Seattle and got a warning.
''Manny should get a ticket. He has a lot more money than Kenny,'' Guillen said. ''My question to the city is, if you keep walking, what do they do? They shoot you? They chase you? It's funny. That's a lot of money. That's a day of work for someone else. Maybe for Kenny, too.''
As far as trying to match what happened to his GM, Guillen said he couldn't help but try to get caught.
''This morning I tried to get one on purpose,'' Guillen said. ''I want to frame that thing.''
But his question is legit: if you don't stop when a cop tries to give you a ticket for acting like someone who lives in a city, what do they do? Any of you slog-commenters just keep going when Officer Friendly tried to ticket you for jaywalkiing?
2
WA actually has a statute for just such a situation, which reads in part:
A person who is unable or unwilling to reasonably identify himself or herself to an enforcement officer may be detained for a period of time not longer than is reasonably necessary to identify the person for purposes of issuing a civil infraction.
So at the very least, if you refuse to stop and be cited, you're starting a contest of wills with the cop, who can detain you until you acquiesce and allow yourself to be cited.
More likely, the cop will just arrest you for obstructing. Although the state supreme court has ruled that "a detainee's refusal to disclose his name, address, and other information cannot be the basis of an arrest," I wouldn't expect the SPD or the city attorney's office to abide by the court's ruling.
A person who is unable or unwilling to reasonably identify himself or herself to an enforcement officer may be detained for a period of time not longer than is reasonably necessary to identify the person for purposes of issuing a civil infraction.
So at the very least, if you refuse to stop and be cited, you're starting a contest of wills with the cop, who can detain you until you acquiesce and allow yourself to be cited.
More likely, the cop will just arrest you for obstructing. Although the state supreme court has ruled that "a detainee's refusal to disclose his name, address, and other information cannot be the basis of an arrest," I wouldn't expect the SPD or the city attorney's office to abide by the court's ruling.
3
I would venture to guess that if you did not stop or otherwise displayed a bad attitude that you would be tased.
5
2 and 3 both have it right. Seriously, what's the worst that can happen if a cop breaks the law? The bust gets thrown out. That's it. Every cop knows it too.
6
Busting jaywalkers, busting people for marijuana possession, making Seattle a national laughingstock -- is the SPD begging to get their budget cut?
7
I concur with 3. These days, in this country, you will surely be detained/arrested for contempt of cop, and if you're extra lucky it'll be by a lazy officer who is perfectly happy to use the taser for compliance.
Tasers are fucked up. Just because you *can* safely (well, mostly safely) cause a person intense pain without leaving any incriminating bruises, doesn't mean it should be allowed. Yeah, they're only supposed to use them if there's a threat, but we all know there are lazy assholes out there who use them without hesitation for compliance. Perhaps someone should try a police taser ban citizen initiative here in WA?
Tasers are fucked up. Just because you *can* safely (well, mostly safely) cause a person intense pain without leaving any incriminating bruises, doesn't mean it should be allowed. Yeah, they're only supposed to use them if there's a threat, but we all know there are lazy assholes out there who use them without hesitation for compliance. Perhaps someone should try a police taser ban citizen initiative here in WA?
10
My close friend and former co-worker Matthew tried to walk away from a cop who was issuing him a ticket for jaywalking on 4th and Blanchard. My friend was on lunch and was trying to get back to our office. We all ("we" being three former co-workers, a few strangers, and myself) watched it happen. He basically told the cop he couldn't believe he was being singled out for jaywalking when there were at least 6-8 other folks who were with him. Cop arrested him for "resisting an officer" and took him to jail. Of course, my friend is black, so that might have had something to do with it. He ended up having to go to court and fight trumped up charges of "assaulting a PO" and "resisting arrest". Bullshit. If you ever get stopped for jaywalking, just go along with it and fight it in court.
11
I've been hit by a moving car while walking once in my life: In a crosswalk and with the green light. Jaywalking in the middle of the street is much safer than crossing at a crosswalk.
13
I saw this happen once @ 2nd and Pike. A guy just ignored a bike cop who was trying to hassle him over jaywalking. Within seconds the dude was surrounded by 8 other bike cops and very forcefully restrained. Nine bike cops spent close to 20 minutes with this guy.
For jaywalking.
At Second and Pike.
For jaywalking.
At Second and Pike.
14
They do occasional busts downtown by city hall. A cop will be hiding around the corner on his motorcycle waiting to pounce. I know because it happened to me. I was at a crosswalk and no traffic coming (save for the cop who roared around the corner when I was almost across). It's embarrassing enough to stand there getting a ticket but it wasn't even for anything cool. Jaywalking does not make you a sexy bad boy with the ladies. I may as well go to jail for ripping the tag off of my mattress.
15
What is difficult about this? Don't jaywalk. If you must jaywalk, then pay the $56 fine. Life is simple.
16
I did this on my first visit to Seattle 20 years ago. The cop yelled from half a block away on the other side of the street; I pretended not to hear. As I anticipated, he was not interested in hustling across the street to chase me down.
17
@16:
I did this, sort of.
Apparently crossing when the light is counting down is illegal and jaywalking if you enter the intersection during the countdown. I had just done this right before a M's game, in probably the same intersection the Sox guy crossed. The cop was apparently yelling at me to come to him while I was waiting at the corner for the next walk sign on the perpendicular crosswalk. I didn't hear him, given there were hundreds of people and cars going by.
Halfway through that intersection, this cop comes flying up to me and demands my driver's license. I tell him no way, as I have no idea wtf is going on, and I'm walking not driving. He demands it again. I tell him my name and address is fine, but he's not getting my license. He grabs and twists my arm, drags me to the corner, and tells me I'm in deep shit for jaywayking. I tell him the sign says walk, he tells me the previous intersection was when I had done it.
I ask him what would happen if I didn't have a license. He tells me I would be booked and taken to jail. He calls for backup, 2 squad cars show up. He forces me onto the hood of one and searches me without my consent. They run my driver's license for a background check, and he's telling me I could have just gotten a ticket if I haden't been so "disrespectful." I'm sorry preserving my rights isn't disrespectful.
I got cited for a misdemeanor, failure to produce a valid drivers license when pulled over by a cop. Obviously, this charge was later altered to the standard "disorderly conduct" bullshit, since I was not driving at the time. The charges were dropped at my arraignment, but I did have to hire a lawyer.
This should unite the whole "disorderly conduct" bullcrap and the jaywalking story pretty nicely.
Remember, cops can do whatever they want, and you've got to pay a lawyer to deal with sorting out your life because of it.
More...
I did this, sort of.
Apparently crossing when the light is counting down is illegal and jaywalking if you enter the intersection during the countdown. I had just done this right before a M's game, in probably the same intersection the Sox guy crossed. The cop was apparently yelling at me to come to him while I was waiting at the corner for the next walk sign on the perpendicular crosswalk. I didn't hear him, given there were hundreds of people and cars going by.
Halfway through that intersection, this cop comes flying up to me and demands my driver's license. I tell him no way, as I have no idea wtf is going on, and I'm walking not driving. He demands it again. I tell him my name and address is fine, but he's not getting my license. He grabs and twists my arm, drags me to the corner, and tells me I'm in deep shit for jaywayking. I tell him the sign says walk, he tells me the previous intersection was when I had done it.
I ask him what would happen if I didn't have a license. He tells me I would be booked and taken to jail. He calls for backup, 2 squad cars show up. He forces me onto the hood of one and searches me without my consent. They run my driver's license for a background check, and he's telling me I could have just gotten a ticket if I haden't been so "disrespectful." I'm sorry preserving my rights isn't disrespectful.
I got cited for a misdemeanor, failure to produce a valid drivers license when pulled over by a cop. Obviously, this charge was later altered to the standard "disorderly conduct" bullshit, since I was not driving at the time. The charges were dropped at my arraignment, but I did have to hire a lawyer.
This should unite the whole "disorderly conduct" bullcrap and the jaywalking story pretty nicely.
Remember, cops can do whatever they want, and you've got to pay a lawyer to deal with sorting out your life because of it.
18
The cop will likely confront you head-on, and won't have to chase you.
But more importantly, Ozzie Guillen is a loudmouthed lying chicken. He promised that if any pitcher hit one of his players, he'd hit two back. Last night, Doug Fister hit Gordon Beckham in the 3rd inning, with no repercussions. Baawwwwk! Bawk-bawk-baaaaaawwwwk!
But more importantly, Ozzie Guillen is a loudmouthed lying chicken. He promised that if any pitcher hit one of his players, he'd hit two back. Last night, Doug Fister hit Gordon Beckham in the 3rd inning, with no repercussions. Baawwwwk! Bawk-bawk-baaaaaawwwwk!
19
@17 Crossing when the signal is flashing "don't walk" is illegal in Seattle. The SPD has made people very aware of this and a few years ago they said they would be aggressively enforcing it. The problem is that when the light flashes "don't walk" that is your time to clear the intersection but not to enter it and for cars to make left and right turns once you clear the crosswalk. Because, guess what?, it is illegal to turn your vehicle into a crosswalk then someone is in it. I know people that have gotten tickets for making right turns when the pedestrian was nowhere near the car but still in the crosswalk.
But I suppose you are saying that the problem was them asking for ID when issuing a valid citation. I am not sure the legality of that but it sounds like from @2 they can at least detain you.
But I suppose you are saying that the problem was them asking for ID when issuing a valid citation. I am not sure the legality of that but it sounds like from @2 they can at least detain you.
24
When the light starts counting down, you shouldn't enter the crosswalk. It's that simple.
A big reason for this is that there are usuallly cars and buses waiting to turn right while the light is green. If people keep walking while the light is counting down, those drivers never get to turn. Maybe one car or bus gets through just as the light turns red, at most. because someone couldn't understand that Don't Walk means Don't Fucking Walk.
A big reason for this is that there are usuallly cars and buses waiting to turn right while the light is green. If people keep walking while the light is counting down, those drivers never get to turn. Maybe one car or bus gets through just as the light turns red, at most. because someone couldn't understand that Don't Walk means Don't Fucking Walk.
26
I agree that the SPD can and WILL do whatever the %$&* they want.
I was walking across Jackson to 1st today and got stung by a seriously disgruntled motorcycle cop. I was trying to make it across to avoid a loud drunk who was following me asking for change and generally creeping me out. I crossed at the crosswalk and I checked to make sure the road was clear, which it was, but the bike cop didn't care much about any of that.
He pulled up and asked me for my license and proceeded to ignore me. He didn't identify himself. He didn't tell me why he wanted my license or what I was getting a ticket for. He didn't ask me if I knew I jaywalked...nothing. He just scratched away at the ticket while I asked him what I was getting a ticket for, etc. I got a few snappy, dickhead responses and that's it.
The SDOT site suggests that "Progressive Ticketing" be reserved for serious offenses. It's really comforting to know that Seattle considers "jaywalking" a serious offense. I mistakenly thought serious offenses were things like rape, murder, dealing crack...
Since I'm already in line with other serious offenders, maybe I should just get a gig selling meth to pay for my jaywalking ticket. Apparently it's a fine line, eh Seattle?
If you are unfortunate enough to get caught crossing the street in a fashion deemed unacceptable by the Seattle Police Department, I suggest taking the ticket and fighting it in court. Don't forget WTO- the SPD hasn't and is clearly still riding high on the wave of adrenalin fueled harassment.
Good night and good luck.
I was walking across Jackson to 1st today and got stung by a seriously disgruntled motorcycle cop. I was trying to make it across to avoid a loud drunk who was following me asking for change and generally creeping me out. I crossed at the crosswalk and I checked to make sure the road was clear, which it was, but the bike cop didn't care much about any of that.
He pulled up and asked me for my license and proceeded to ignore me. He didn't identify himself. He didn't tell me why he wanted my license or what I was getting a ticket for. He didn't ask me if I knew I jaywalked...nothing. He just scratched away at the ticket while I asked him what I was getting a ticket for, etc. I got a few snappy, dickhead responses and that's it.
The SDOT site suggests that "Progressive Ticketing" be reserved for serious offenses. It's really comforting to know that Seattle considers "jaywalking" a serious offense. I mistakenly thought serious offenses were things like rape, murder, dealing crack...
Since I'm already in line with other serious offenders, maybe I should just get a gig selling meth to pay for my jaywalking ticket. Apparently it's a fine line, eh Seattle?
If you are unfortunate enough to get caught crossing the street in a fashion deemed unacceptable by the Seattle Police Department, I suggest taking the ticket and fighting it in court. Don't forget WTO- the SPD hasn't and is clearly still riding high on the wave of adrenalin fueled harassment.
Good night and good luck.
27
Did you ever think the police don't want to write stupid jaywalking tickets ?
It's the politicians that created the stupid law to keep the stupid people of Seattle
safe from themslves. Seattle is the Suicide capital of the country.
The police are required to inforce it. That's their job.
It's the politicians that created the stupid law to keep the stupid people of Seattle
safe from themslves. Seattle is the Suicide capital of the country.
The police are required to inforce it. That's their job.
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