Tuesday, June 30, 2009
Politics / Homo What He Said
Posted by Dan Savage on Tue, Jun 30, 2009 at 10:07 AM
Waymon Hudson at Pam's House Blend:
The speech wasn't anything really different from his campaign promises: repeal DADT and DOMA (legislatively), we need respect for each other, we're all equal, etc. It was more words with very little action to back it up.Yet part of me was moved by the President speaking these words from the White House, acknowledging us and our struggles. That's when I realized this reaction was part of what has given cover to our political leaders for years now, allowing them to lag behind the general public in regards to our rights and equality.
There was time when that speech might have been enough, but that time was years ago—before out elected officials, marriage equality in some states, employment protections from top companies, and a general trend towards inclusion.
It was a speech for 1999, not 2009.
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2
I would like to go to Washington and kick somebody's ass but instead I think I'll just sit here in Seattle on mine bitching....
3
Now if you could just get 265 former service members to show up each and every day for 265 days .... or even 26 each day for 265 days ... they might change DADT.
But at least there's ACTION.
But at least there's ACTION.
5
If he continues on and does something, that would be great. I really liked the speech when my BF read it to me and I am ready for actions. His silence has been worse than doing nothing and at least he is back speaking about it. Right?
6
On one hand, I want to commend the president for not legislating from the executive (except that he has on other things…). On the other hand it’s frustrating that he’s not pushing harder for the legislature to act. And maybe it’s better that he’s not using the bully-pulpit (even though he promised to do so…). Yes, we all need to be contacting our reps and making sure they understand that they need to act to repeal DOMA or they will not get our votes.
However, as all slog readers are aware, the hemorrhaging in our military could be stopped immediately with a stroke of the pen and then let the legislature catch up at a later date.
However, as all slog readers are aware, the hemorrhaging in our military could be stopped immediately with a stroke of the pen and then let the legislature catch up at a later date.
7
Is he commander in chief? Or just a big pussy? If he wants to halt discharges, he can and should. Because he hasn't, I must assume he's been lying to us about his intentions.
10
I already read the transcript, so my only new reaction after watching the first few minutes was.... damn. Michelle is so pretty!
Oops, shallow.
Oops, shallow.
11
It was sad watching Lt. Col. Victor Fahrenbach on Rachel Maddow last night as he was recounting his meeting with Obama and the realization that it is highly unlikely that DADT will be repealed or any progressive action taken that would help his case.
12
"It was a speech for 1999, not 2009."
Only that such a speech has never been given before by a sitting president, heck, by any president. I hope the President now with hindsight can see what a waste of time trying to please some gays is, nothing he does short of costing him the White House will please, why endanger his job like that on a group that in the end have little vote power? If he's wise he'll distance himself from this. I believe he has said and done quite enough (more than any other president) when it comes to this issue.
Only that such a speech has never been given before by a sitting president, heck, by any president. I hope the President now with hindsight can see what a waste of time trying to please some gays is, nothing he does short of costing him the White House will please, why endanger his job like that on a group that in the end have little vote power? If he's wise he'll distance himself from this. I believe he has said and done quite enough (more than any other president) when it comes to this issue.
14
@Dan, when you posted on this subject yesterday and included the entire transcript of Obama's speech at the White House reception, I got the sense that in spite of your (and our) frustration and anger over the President's failure to act decisively, you did appreciate his words, as did Waymon Hudson. They were sweet, sweet words and it was worth taking some time to enjoy them. There is a HUGE gulf between Obama and the former squatter in that office; I can conceive of Bush being eventually shamed into supporting something like the hate-crimes bill and pimping it in the Rose Garden with a stilted one-paragraph statement for whatever political gain it might bring, but not taking the opportunity Obama did to reiterate all his campaign promises in an articulate extended speech.
Two thoughts: It seems he does expect and welcome agitation, statements of outrage, and pressure on all branches of government from supporters of equal rights as part of a strategy to move these issues forward in the American consciousness without his being the tip of the spear--so let's keep doing our part. I also know it would be different if he were gay himself or had close family members who were gay; he is sympathetic but not empathetic--he just does not feel the damage from the current situation quite as personally and so it's easier to say "Be patient, we'll get there."
Two thoughts: It seems he does expect and welcome agitation, statements of outrage, and pressure on all branches of government from supporters of equal rights as part of a strategy to move these issues forward in the American consciousness without his being the tip of the spear--so let's keep doing our part. I also know it would be different if he were gay himself or had close family members who were gay; he is sympathetic but not empathetic--he just does not feel the damage from the current situation quite as personally and so it's easier to say "Be patient, we'll get there."
15
Obama's own words in that speech give him everything he needs to suspend DADT now. He's "Commander-in-Chief, in a time of war," who believes that reversing the policy is "essential for our national security." If that's what he believes, he should feel obligated to suspend DADT now.
Given that DADT is wildly unpopular, Congress is bound to make its repeal permanent once gays have served openly for 3+ years.
I really don't understand the "practical" hang-up. Just don't kick them out.
Obama:
"... as Commander-in-Chief, in a time of war, I do have a responsibility to see that this change is administered in a practical way and a way that takes over the long term.
"...what I hope is that these [gay discharges] underscore the urgency of reversing this policy not just because it's the right thing to do, but because it is essential for our national security."
Given that DADT is wildly unpopular, Congress is bound to make its repeal permanent once gays have served openly for 3+ years.
I really don't understand the "practical" hang-up. Just don't kick them out.
Obama:
"... as Commander-in-Chief, in a time of war, I do have a responsibility to see that this change is administered in a practical way and a way that takes over the long term.
"...what I hope is that these [gay discharges] underscore the urgency of reversing this policy not just because it's the right thing to do, but because it is essential for our national security."
16
So, at this point is seems that anything any politician does in support of gay rights is too little and too late, right? Damn, that's negative.
17
Yeah. Bush, Clinton, Bush, Reagan, Carter, Ford, and Nixon all gave MUCH better Stonewall Riot Day speeches!
I don't think you realize how many feathers are getting ruffled by the fact that Obama gave a speech to commemorate this event.
By the way, it's not the President's job to define the laws of the land by royal decree. Quit bitching at him and go write your fucking congresspeople.
I don't think you realize how many feathers are getting ruffled by the fact that Obama gave a speech to commemorate this event.
By the way, it's not the President's job to define the laws of the land by royal decree. Quit bitching at him and go write your fucking congresspeople.
18
@17 is right. You non-mil types have no idea how much controversy this is causing.
Which it should, mind you.
Which it should, mind you.
19
Plus, it's only been SIX MONTHS. Six months, come on! There's oh I don't know FIFTY FOUR more months to go in his first term, at least, not accounting for a second one. Why don't you wait until the end of his first year to start bitching on how he's not 'acting fast enough'. It's an issue of civil rights, but gosh it's not as encompassing or important as the economy or health-care reform. Who cares about those people who are tens of thousands of dollars in crippling medical debt because they had the -gall- to get sick, or people who are still out of jobs and homes, these things that the president is ACTIVELY ADDRESSING.
You know, he is WORKING and not just taking week-long vacations to his ranch, remember that with Bush? Do you think you could oh I don't know, tackle healthcare, economy, the war, foreign affairs, etc. all at once? Let the man work, he didn't take office with as prosperous circumstances as Mr. Clinton did (Who still blew out his political capital by pushing for gays in the military, failed MISERABLY, and then was unable to get healthcare through.)
You know, he is WORKING and not just taking week-long vacations to his ranch, remember that with Bush? Do you think you could oh I don't know, tackle healthcare, economy, the war, foreign affairs, etc. all at once? Let the man work, he didn't take office with as prosperous circumstances as Mr. Clinton did (Who still blew out his political capital by pushing for gays in the military, failed MISERABLY, and then was unable to get healthcare through.)
20
#19 = RIGHT ON!
Give President Obama some time, trust in our leader.
Dan - where would we be right now if McBush & Palin were elected?
Let's end our WARS, repair our int'l reputation/role and work together to FIX our broken country [education! health care! infrastructure! poverty!], including our human rights laws & policies.
Give President Obama some time, trust in our leader.
Dan - where would we be right now if McBush & Palin were elected?
Let's end our WARS, repair our int'l reputation/role and work together to FIX our broken country [education! health care! infrastructure! poverty!], including our human rights laws & policies.
21
Days left till Obama's term expires:
1,299 days
Plenty of time
But do keep freaking out and saying that he has broken promises, even though he hasn't, you lying asshole.
How are you any better than the likes of Rush Limbaugh's sensationalist half-truths?
1,299 days
Plenty of time
But do keep freaking out and saying that he has broken promises, even though he hasn't, you lying asshole.
How are you any better than the likes of Rush Limbaugh's sensationalist half-truths?
22
I can understand the urgency, and the immediacy that these issues have on the lives of gay men and women. Every day that this legislation goes without passing, is a day that they can't get legally wed in most of the country, that they can't join the military without fear of being ousted and dishonorably discharged, denied benefits, denied the power of attorney and hipaa authorization recognized with straight couples.
But every day without healthcare legislation is a day another american, a common american, devoid of ethnicity, sexuality, or gender consideration, is either denied preventive care, or sent spiraling into debt. Every day without economic reform is more jobs lost, more money lost, more debt accrued, and more damage done, sometimes irreparably, to people's lives.
Not to mention how we have to contend with our foreign policy, the aggressive settlement policies of Israel, the aggressive theocracy in Iran, the tumultous instability through the rest of the world, the emerging nuclear threat of North Korea. Barack Obama is one man and a cabinet.
You can't expect him to handle all these issues at once. I'd love to give gay rights a precedent, like we did other civil rights in the 50's and 60's and 70's. But while the black civil rights movement was about jobs, forced segregation, education, and opportunity, most of the issues faced by gay individuals are domestic, such as marriage and membership in the military. Obama pushed through the hate crimes legislation, and has afforded some more protections to gay individuals, besides the various housing rights they've gained over the years.
We're not asking the gay community to yield their rights, we're asking them for patience for these issues that affect THEM as much as anybody else. There are gay men and women without healthcare, without jobs, and who are scared for the future, as there are straight men and women in the same situation. There are 3 and a half years left, we are only SIX MONTHS in. Have some patience, and be grateful for the diligence Mr. Obama has shown in addressing the issues that face all of us, and acknowledging that you are out there, and that he has not forgotten. Sometimes that's all you can ask for.
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But every day without healthcare legislation is a day another american, a common american, devoid of ethnicity, sexuality, or gender consideration, is either denied preventive care, or sent spiraling into debt. Every day without economic reform is more jobs lost, more money lost, more debt accrued, and more damage done, sometimes irreparably, to people's lives.
Not to mention how we have to contend with our foreign policy, the aggressive settlement policies of Israel, the aggressive theocracy in Iran, the tumultous instability through the rest of the world, the emerging nuclear threat of North Korea. Barack Obama is one man and a cabinet.
You can't expect him to handle all these issues at once. I'd love to give gay rights a precedent, like we did other civil rights in the 50's and 60's and 70's. But while the black civil rights movement was about jobs, forced segregation, education, and opportunity, most of the issues faced by gay individuals are domestic, such as marriage and membership in the military. Obama pushed through the hate crimes legislation, and has afforded some more protections to gay individuals, besides the various housing rights they've gained over the years.
We're not asking the gay community to yield their rights, we're asking them for patience for these issues that affect THEM as much as anybody else. There are gay men and women without healthcare, without jobs, and who are scared for the future, as there are straight men and women in the same situation. There are 3 and a half years left, we are only SIX MONTHS in. Have some patience, and be grateful for the diligence Mr. Obama has shown in addressing the issues that face all of us, and acknowledging that you are out there, and that he has not forgotten. Sometimes that's all you can ask for.
24
@ 22
I agree. There can be no question that we have an ally in the White House. No other mainstream (you can't *get* more mainstream than the President of the USA) politician would dare talk about GLBT rights so openly and humanely. No Canadian leader has *ever* dared, and gay marriage is legal here.
I disagree about being patient. It is clear that President Obama needs the continued pushing of the GLBT rights movement to ensure that he can garner in-government support for reform.
Just make sure that you push the people that have power and genuinely oppose reform, and those that are waffling.
I agree. There can be no question that we have an ally in the White House. No other mainstream (you can't *get* more mainstream than the President of the USA) politician would dare talk about GLBT rights so openly and humanely. No Canadian leader has *ever* dared, and gay marriage is legal here.
I disagree about being patient. It is clear that President Obama needs the continued pushing of the GLBT rights movement to ensure that he can garner in-government support for reform.
Just make sure that you push the people that have power and genuinely oppose reform, and those that are waffling.
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