Tuesday, June 23, 2009
News Someone's Gotta Post It
Posted by Dan Savage on Tue, Jun 23, 2009 at 10:29 AM
Put down their parents first:
Four children between the ages of 11 and 15 used a pit bull to attack two women in SeaTac on Sunday evening.... A 63-year-old Seattle woman was driving in the 13300 block of Des Moines Memorial Drive when she saw the group of three boys and a girl repeatedly kicking the dog at about 6:30 p.m., according to Urquhart. She asked the children if they might need some help, but a 15-year-old girl told her to mind her own business. The woman told KING-TV the girl opened the passenger door of her car and attacked her.... Then, one of the boys allegedly ran toward her with the pit bull, which belongs to the girl's family."The dog started biting me on my wrist and my left leg," the woman told KING-TV....
A 41-year-old Seattle woman who saw the first attack followed the group to nearby North SeaTac Park. There, the girl realized the group was being followed and she head-butted the second woman before punching her in the head and body, Urquhart said. The three boys accompanying the girl provoked the dog to bite the woman on her head and face while the girl assaulted her, he said. The dog also bit the woman severely on both arms, leaving the flesh of her forearm flayed and the bone visible, Urquhart said.
Such nice dogs, so good with children.
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2
Seriously, I'm on the fence over this whole issue but your closing line is a bunch of bull! The occurance was straight up abuse of the dog by a group of children.
Should be a breed ban against humans if this is the argument used.
Should be a breed ban against humans if this is the argument used.
4
I know there's a lot of hate out there for Pitbulls and I would never let my dog go near one, but in this case, it seems that the "children" (if they can be called that) were beating the Pitbull, and I'd think that a dog, specially a pitbull, with a history of domestic violence would respond to such beatings with more violence, against anyone, even someone trying to help.
These "children" should be put down, their parents should be put down, and the poor dog, too scarred from what must have been a horrible life to be able to recover, should be put down as well.
These "children" should be put down, their parents should be put down, and the poor dog, too scarred from what must have been a horrible life to be able to recover, should be put down as well.
5
I agree with 2 to a point. After all, it's no surprise that the dog was a pit and not a poodle, pomeranian, or even a German shepherd.
6
I usually ignore Dan's pitbull posts, but this incident was all the about the rotten kids, not the dog, who was being abused. ITA with #4
7
Fuck, I actually feel bad for the dog. Those kids were basically using it as a weapon.
Your closing line is more than a little disingenuous. Yeah, if it was a different breed of dog it might not have been able to inflict so much damage, but it's the kids who are the monsters in this story.
Your closing line is more than a little disingenuous. Yeah, if it was a different breed of dog it might not have been able to inflict so much damage, but it's the kids who are the monsters in this story.
8
Not blaming the victim here, but it is a good time to remind everyone to keep your car doors locked while you're driving. The odds of someone opening a door and attacking you are low, but it's still a common sense safety measure that takes all of one second to implement.
10
Any animal, dog cat ferret cow horse, will snap if abused. Those inhuman spawn of some one abused that animal to the point where it did not know who to attack to save itself.
As some one who works with rescue dogs, not pitbulls, I have seen normally mild tempered breeds go after humans and other creatures due to the damage they have suffered at the hands of human beings.
The DOG was attacked by the CHILDREN who then used it to attack a couple of women.
As some one who works with rescue dogs, not pitbulls, I have seen normally mild tempered breeds go after humans and other creatures due to the damage they have suffered at the hands of human beings.
The DOG was attacked by the CHILDREN who then used it to attack a couple of women.
11
1 You've got it.
God, how I wish I had them in my custody! I might also add, that the unnamed monsters in all this are the parents of those juvenile criminals. If it were up to me I would hand them such a good ass whooping that they would end up being the city's ambassadors of manners and good social conduct. Afterwards I would have them do shores for the ladies they attacked if the women allowed it of course and furthermore, taking advantage of summer I would have them do some type of community service involving the elderly, because clearly these spawn of satan haven't had any contact with their grandparents. They're lacking that contact in their lives, and if they have parents they're probably drugged out hippy trash who let them roll freely without care jut as you would with a dog or a cat. Poster childs for Seattle's over-permissive lifestyle that's all they are.
God, how I wish I had them in my custody! I might also add, that the unnamed monsters in all this are the parents of those juvenile criminals. If it were up to me I would hand them such a good ass whooping that they would end up being the city's ambassadors of manners and good social conduct. Afterwards I would have them do shores for the ladies they attacked if the women allowed it of course and furthermore, taking advantage of summer I would have them do some type of community service involving the elderly, because clearly these spawn of satan haven't had any contact with their grandparents. They're lacking that contact in their lives, and if they have parents they're probably drugged out hippy trash who let them roll freely without care jut as you would with a dog or a cat. Poster childs for Seattle's over-permissive lifestyle that's all they are.
13
The children are not unnamed. The punk-ass dog owner did an interview for the news saying basically it was self defense because the dog was trying to protect his sister from the two woman. They have not been charged yet.
15
@11 Amazing you bigoted cunt that you are all for children having better families and contact in their lives yet you are dead set against gay people offering that same life.
Fuck you.
Fuck you.
16
I totally agree with 7, those kids and parents deserve to get punished o the max. Why the hell would you even allow your kids to be out walking a powerful dog like pit? I have two of them and I never even let my friends hold/walk them. Any owner of a bully breed or guard dog should know that the dogs can be overpowering to those who are not used to them or strong enough to control them, especially some punk ass kids.
18
12 I've meet some pretty dangerous individuals that would make both these teens and their pit soil themselves just with one look, in my relative short life in this here world of God. Most of whom would classify as being of the "shallow end of the genepool" if not of the subterranean bottom (if that's an accurate term) of the pool, but even the most cruel SOB I've known respects the elderly, especially women, ma'am and yes ma'am is all you hear commin out of their delinquent mouths even if they're not really paying attention to them.
19
a german shepherd, doberman, rotweiler, weimereiner, dalmation.....any number of other breeds would respond in exactly the same way if they'd lived a life of abuse at the hands of their owners. pit bulls, when raised lovingly, are wonderful animals. it just so happens that assholes fight them and turn them into monsters. you could turn a golden retreiver into a monster if you tried hard enough. i love pit bulls. it's not their fault. they are the real victims.
20
a german shepherd, doberman, rotweiler, weimereiner, dalmation.....any number of other breeds would respond in exactly the same way if they'd lived a life of abuse at the hands of their owners. pit bulls, when raised lovingly, are wonderful animals. it just so happens that assholes fight them and turn them into monsters. you could turn a golden retreiver into a monster if you tried hard enough. i love pit bulls. it's not their fault. they are the real victims.
22
This is the 4th attack (Tuba Man, James Paroline, can't remember the other guys name)in about a year on an older person by a gang of teenagers. The other 3 led to murder. Why are civil rights groups not enraged that are grandmothers and grandfathers are being targeted by thugs?
There is a pattern here of teenagers attacking older people.... are you going to tell me 4-6 teenagers ganging up on a 65 year old is not every bit as offensive as hate crimes based on race or sexual orientation?
There is a pattern here of teenagers attacking older people.... are you going to tell me 4-6 teenagers ganging up on a 65 year old is not every bit as offensive as hate crimes based on race or sexual orientation?
23
"drugged out hippy trash"
Well, if those "drugged out hippy trash" are black, then ok.
Video at King5 proves this "girl" is black.
Just sayin' n'shit.
Well, if those "drugged out hippy trash" are black, then ok.
Video at King5 proves this "girl" is black.
Just sayin' n'shit.
25
It's not pit bulls' fault, Dan. You can always look to a dog's owner to understand its behavior, and it doesn't matter if these dogs were pit bulls or golden retrievers; a dog that behaves that way is a product of its environment, as well as the terrible situation it was in at the time. Homework: watch Dog Whisperer; educate self about dog breeds and behavior.
26
best case study for the "it's the owners not the dog" argument i've ever read. thanks for sharing.
27
23 and 24. Of course lets not put 2+2 together. This couldn't be a race based hate crime. For instance if 4 white teenagers attacked a 60 year old black woman for no reason and encouraged their pit bull to maul her we wouldn't be hearing a word from the NAACP. They would not be pointing out maybe this is racist. They would remain silent, just like they are doing now. Yup.
28
So the sort of people who want to own a pit bull and train it to be violent and nasty are the sort of people who also teach their children to be violent and nasty? What a surprise!
29
15 I can almost picture you in that group of criminals attacking that 63 yr old lady Akbar. Pity for you that, 1 I'm not elderly, 2 I'm not above defending myself from the likes of you.
So, just know dear Akbar, if we ever crossed paths and you act out like your peers in this story you'll end up wearing your pit bull around your neck after I'm through with you, cause I wont let you or your dog maul me.
So, just know dear Akbar, if we ever crossed paths and you act out like your peers in this story you'll end up wearing your pit bull around your neck after I'm through with you, cause I wont let you or your dog maul me.
30
This story could be just as easily used to defend the "no bad dogs, only bad owners" idea. Seriously, those kids deserve the worst the juvenile justice system has to offer.
33
@22 - I wouldn't put James Paroline in that category. What happened to him was senseless and tragic, but I wouldn't lump it in with the incidents of roving 14 and 15 year olds just happening upon someone and deciding to beat the crap out of them or kill them.
35
@33 James WAS in the same category. He was watering his traffic circle garden when Ebony Sheppard was asked to go around due to a plastic traffic cone. She and companioon went ape shit on him. Then Ebony went to fetch her boyfriend and told him James had hit her (which she admitted was a lie). Ebony claimed that James had splashed her with water (good defense girlfriend!) but the video shows her and her nasty friend getting out of the car and going apeshit on this old war veteran. James Paroline is the Emit Till of our day. An old war veteran brutally murdered because a young welfare queen was enraged at being asked to go around a f-ing plastic cone. I am enraged that I live in a city that makes me pay for Ms Sheppard's food stamps, section 8 housing, etc. Ms Sheppard never worked a day in her life, she was supported by tax payers such as Mr Paroline who worked hard all their life so she wouldn't have to work at all.
36
And you can keep on picturing that Loveschild, because that is the only way it is ever going to happen...in your deluded head.
1. I don't own a dog..i'm a cat person.
2. I am really nice towards everyone who meets me on an equal human level (since you feel that gays are second class citizens and can't ever tread on your "black rights to bitch about oppression", you don't get to meet me on an equal level)
3. My peers? I'm 34, white and would probably be considered upper middle by most of society (although I wouldn't label myself as that.) How exactly can trash like this be my peer?
4. Why would I maul you? I pity you and your hate and wish you would open you mind and realize we are all human beings. Treat us all as equals and give us the same rights and respect and you will get that back. You threatening me with violence would more than likely result in police action after you raised your fist at me. You aint gonna see me swing first.
1. I don't own a dog..i'm a cat person.
2. I am really nice towards everyone who meets me on an equal human level (since you feel that gays are second class citizens and can't ever tread on your "black rights to bitch about oppression", you don't get to meet me on an equal level)
3. My peers? I'm 34, white and would probably be considered upper middle by most of society (although I wouldn't label myself as that.) How exactly can trash like this be my peer?
4. Why would I maul you? I pity you and your hate and wish you would open you mind and realize we are all human beings. Treat us all as equals and give us the same rights and respect and you will get that back. You threatening me with violence would more than likely result in police action after you raised your fist at me. You aint gonna see me swing first.
38
The closing line is correct. The dog was good with children, as he didn't attack them. The dog attacked the adults. So, I totally agree with the closing line, if I take any sarcasm or irony out of it.
Seriously, those kids need to be locked up for a good amount of time.
Seriously, those kids need to be locked up for a good amount of time.
41
Are people still wondering why there's a run on gun stores? Had that 63 year old woman whipped out a Glock 9mm. the outcome would have been a lot different. Then again, if she'd had a video-recorder in her car that could have made a difference too. Well...maybe.
42
You closing line sucks shit, Dan. This whole story is a prime example of what many of us here keep telling you: It's usually not the pit bull's fault; it's the fucking pit bull owners who mistreat them.
I know you think pit bulls are some kind of devil dog, with something deep in their souls that makes them violent and evil, but that's just bullshit. It's a nurture issue, not a nature one, just as it is with all intelligent creatures. Evil is unnatural, and has to be taught.
I know you think pit bulls are some kind of devil dog, with something deep in their souls that makes them violent and evil, but that's just bullshit. It's a nurture issue, not a nature one, just as it is with all intelligent creatures. Evil is unnatural, and has to be taught.
43
This whole American tendancy to have binary choices - e.g. either pitbull or parents are the problem - instead of the more European stance that there are many possible contributing factors, and that it's probable that among them both pitbulls and parents are major contributing factors ...
Well, it just goes to show why people get inflamed over it.
There aren't TWO choices. There are many. And both pitbulls and parents are part of the problem.
Well, it just goes to show why people get inflamed over it.
There aren't TWO choices. There are many. And both pitbulls and parents are part of the problem.
44
BIG surprise...ABUSED dog becomes aggressive.
What those kids did...kicking, beating, taunting the dog is what a-hole dog fighters do to elicit aggression from dogs(No, not just pit bulls...Actually fighters favor 2 other breeds above pits).
This story is sad on so many levels...for the poor woman who tried to help and became a victim...for the abused dog..
The fact that the dog was a pit bull means very little. Those kids would have turned a Lab, Rottweiler, Shar-Pei, Mastiff,Weimeraner or any other large breed dog into a weapon.
What those kids did...kicking, beating, taunting the dog is what a-hole dog fighters do to elicit aggression from dogs(No, not just pit bulls...Actually fighters favor 2 other breeds above pits).
This story is sad on so many levels...for the poor woman who tried to help and became a victim...for the abused dog..
The fact that the dog was a pit bull means very little. Those kids would have turned a Lab, Rottweiler, Shar-Pei, Mastiff,Weimeraner or any other large breed dog into a weapon.
45
This appears to be a case of bad owners, or bad caretakers, and less about the dog. I'm guessing that your last line is intended to be sarcastic, but the fact that the story indcates that the children were abusing the dog and the dog didn't retaliate at the children, does suggest that the dog was good with those children. And, that's a good quality in that dog. Unfortunately, we can't say the same for the children.
46
Er, from the one picture in the Times article, that dog looks more like a boxer than a pitbull. Just sayin'.
47
Another disturbing element is the phone conversation with the dog's owner(on kiro, maybe?)where he talks about the dog"accidetally" biting him during a physical altercation with his step-dad.
This whole situation (violent family...violent children...SURPRISE! Violent pet)screams of violence, instability and chaos...not a good enviro for children or dogs....or um...anyone.
This whole situation (violent family...violent children...SURPRISE! Violent pet)screams of violence, instability and chaos...not a good enviro for children or dogs....or um...anyone.
48
Wow, gee, a bunch of people provoked a dog and someone got bit. Shocker. Film at 11. Next up, water is wet and the Discovery Institute are stupid.
Newsflash: "Pit bull" is not a breed. It's a generic term incorrectly applied by people who don't know what they're talking about to any mid-sized short-haired dog.
Further newsflash: All dogs are capable of biting. Small dogs don't often do severe damage. Large dogs are scary enough that owners train them or give them up *before* they kill. Medium dogs are in that inconvenient sweet spot of being vulnerable to physical restraint by owners, without being vulnerable to physical restraint by *everyone* - meaning, if they are badly trained and flip out on someone who ISN'T physically capable of restraining them, they do real damage.
And, in the mean time, paranoid fuckwits panic over the scary "pit bulls" who will eat their children, *exactly* like the scary homosexuals who will rape their children- leaving aside, of course, the actual facts of the matter.
In short, you're an ignorant ass with the intellectual honestly of a creationist, and, fuck you, Dan Savage.
-John.
PS: Love your show and column, wish you'd apply half a thought once in a while to anything that wasn't sex-related. Ta.
Newsflash: "Pit bull" is not a breed. It's a generic term incorrectly applied by people who don't know what they're talking about to any mid-sized short-haired dog.
Further newsflash: All dogs are capable of biting. Small dogs don't often do severe damage. Large dogs are scary enough that owners train them or give them up *before* they kill. Medium dogs are in that inconvenient sweet spot of being vulnerable to physical restraint by owners, without being vulnerable to physical restraint by *everyone* - meaning, if they are badly trained and flip out on someone who ISN'T physically capable of restraining them, they do real damage.
And, in the mean time, paranoid fuckwits panic over the scary "pit bulls" who will eat their children, *exactly* like the scary homosexuals who will rape their children- leaving aside, of course, the actual facts of the matter.
In short, you're an ignorant ass with the intellectual honestly of a creationist, and, fuck you, Dan Savage.
-John.
PS: Love your show and column, wish you'd apply half a thought once in a while to anything that wasn't sex-related. Ta.
49
So Dan, if a person pistol-whips several people to near death, then we should have a handgun ban?
Glad they didn't get strangled, I like my right hand!
Glad they didn't get strangled, I like my right hand!
50
I'm reminded of a comment by Jacob Riis, when asked if the crime in slums was primarily a result of the conditions there or if he believed the people committing them were fundamentally evil.
His reply was that both were true. The crime was indeed a result of economic conditions, but that the people were also fundamentally evil and could no longer be salvaged. The only hope was for the unborn and children under 4 years old.
These children will bring far more misery into the world than anything else. Can they be helped? Probably. Is it worth the effort? Not likely.
His reply was that both were true. The crime was indeed a result of economic conditions, but that the people were also fundamentally evil and could no longer be salvaged. The only hope was for the unborn and children under 4 years old.
These children will bring far more misery into the world than anything else. Can they be helped? Probably. Is it worth the effort? Not likely.
51
I think believing anything, dogs or people, are inherently 'good' is a fatal flaw. There are good people and dogs, there are a lot of characteristically questionable people and dogs, and there are plenty of vicious people and dogs.
This is a case involving several pieces of shit and an old lady misguidedly trying to do the right thing in a situation that couldn't be fixed.
This is a case involving several pieces of shit and an old lady misguidedly trying to do the right thing in a situation that couldn't be fixed.
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