Tuesday, May 19, 2009
News San Francisco Wages War on Butt Litter
Posted by David Schmader on Tue, May 19, 2009 at 9:45 AM
In his ongoing quest to win my heart, Gavin Newsom—San Francisco's ridiculously passionate pro-gay-marriage mayor, contender for America's handsomest elected official, and uncle of this amazing freak—has proposed a bill to make San Francisco smokers pay for the cost of cleaning up their discarded butts. As the New York Times reports:
The proposal, to be introduced next month to the San Francisco Board of Supervisors, would add 33 cents to the cost of a pack of cigarettes, to offset the estimated $10.7 million the city spends annually removing discarded butts from gutters, drainpipes and sidewalks.
Mr. Newsom said cigarette butts became a target after San Francisco’s annual “litter audit” found that cigarette detritus made up a quarter of all the trash in the city’s public spaces. With the city spending some $44 million a year on litter cleanup — and facing a $500 million deficit for the coming fiscal year — a fee was born.
For the record: I have no interest in legislating and taxing smokers out of existence—to each his own; if it feels good, do it; etc. But I fucking hate litterbugs, and smokers tossing their butts on the ground are the worst (i.e. the most bizarrely entitled/thick-skulled/presumptuous/oblivious).
Full NYT story here.
INSTANT UPDATE: Commenter spalding brings up a valuable point:
I'm an X-smoker who, when I did smoke, was fastidious about never throwing my butts on the ground. But I have to say that if I had been charged an extra $0.33 a pack anyways, I'd probably just toss them on the ground. I mean, since I'm paying for the clean-up anyways then why bother? But I'm petty and vindictive.
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1
I'm an X-smoker who, when I did smoke, was fastidious about never throwing my butts on the ground. But I have to say that if I had been charged an extra $0.33 a pack anyways, I'd probably just toss them on the ground. I mean, since I'm paying for the clean-up anyways then why bother? But I'm petty and vindictive.
2
Cigarettes should be taxed at extremely high levels to pay not only for litter but also for health care costs most smokers incur later in life. Marijuana should be legalized and taxed in the same way.
3
As a smoker who throws her butts on the ground, I think this is pretty reasonable.
Though, in our defense, where have all the ash trays gone?
Though, in our defense, where have all the ash trays gone?
5
Amen!
"smokers tossing their butts on the ground are the worst (i.e. the most bizarrely entitled/thick-skulled/presumptuous/oblivious)"
and add "assholes" to the list.
"smokers tossing their butts on the ground are the worst (i.e. the most bizarrely entitled/thick-skulled/presumptuous/oblivious)"
and add "assholes" to the list.
7
If I'm somewhere out in nature, like a park or on the water, I always hold onto my butts until I can dispose of them properly. When I'm walking down the street, I flick if there is no garbage can. I know, I'm a monster. I wouldn't mind the extra 30 cents if I knew it was truly going towards city cleanup.
@4 you should swallow my dick.
@4 you should swallow my dick.
8
@2, as you should know by now, smokers incur fewer health-care-related costs in life, due to the fact that they don't live as long as non-smokers. Fallacious argument.
Jocelyn, I agree: It's not "hip" to have ashtrays any more, so if that's the way they want to be, fuck 'em.
Jocelyn, I agree: It's not "hip" to have ashtrays any more, so if that's the way they want to be, fuck 'em.
9
Great idea. Perfect for the U.S. It was funny to be in Paris and see the butt-flicking by perfectly respectable Parisians. They pay high taxes and are justifiably proud of the civic amenities they get in return. No self-respecting citizen would dream of reducing the workload one bit of the excellent street cleaners - that would be taking bread from the mouths of their brothers' and sisters' children.
Here, our recession panic has led each mayor to find the easiest budget cuts, and it's tempting to decrease city workers' hours and pay however they can. Newsom is genius for using our cultural horror of smokers to trump resistance to reducing municipal labor hours. When will McGinn issue a rambly YouTube suggesting the same?
Here, our recession panic has led each mayor to find the easiest budget cuts, and it's tempting to decrease city workers' hours and pay however they can. Newsom is genius for using our cultural horror of smokers to trump resistance to reducing municipal labor hours. When will McGinn issue a rambly YouTube suggesting the same?
10
So are they spreading fees to whatever makes up the other 75% of trash gathered? Fast food restaurants for their wrappers, alcohol producers for beer cans and bottles, newspapers for, well, newspaper, etc. Fair is fair.
11
@1 nailed it really. I don't smoke and I don't like butts and litter around, but if I did smoke, I'd start throwing them on the ground too. If anyone complained, I'd tell them I paid for that priviledge, which would be true.
Bad idea, imo.
Bad idea, imo.
12
There's a simple solution to this litter problem--whatever litter you throw on the ground get shoved up your ass. Get caught throwing away a cigarette butt? Up it goes! Soda cans? Fast food wrappers?
This gets interesting when you catch people illegally dumping used furniture and appliances.
This gets interesting when you catch people illegally dumping used furniture and appliances.
14
They do need to put out ashtrays in likely smoking areas, but come on - people have just thrown out their butts forever. Cars still have ashtrays, but how many times do you see someone flick a butt out the window?
People used to throw out all kinds of trash from cars until the feds did a big PR campaign about it. They could do that again with regards to cigarette butts, as long as they don't give in to anti-smoking pressure to include their message which would make the smokers tune out.
People used to throw out all kinds of trash from cars until the feds did a big PR campaign about it. They could do that again with regards to cigarette butts, as long as they don't give in to anti-smoking pressure to include their message which would make the smokers tune out.
15
@8 Actually, no: a shorter life span spent treating emphysema, cancer, and other chronic conditions caused by tobacco smoke (and/or by the crap they mix in with the tobacco) still costs more in health care dollars than a longer life span not treating those same things. This is why health insurance and life insurance premiums are much higher for smokers; smokers tend also to miss work 33% more often than nonsmokers (a health care cost borne by employers). Obesity might also be targeted on similar grounds, but we're not talking about that here.
Now, if our health insurance model paid for preventative care on a standard basis (and, for instance, my plan does not--which sucks), the money spent on addiction recovery and smoking cessation would be well worth it--but actually this would still lower the overall cost of health insurance for everyone. This has been the experience in Sweden and Germany where preventative care is covered in full (and where "wellness" routines are also subsidized: gym memberships, etc.).
Now, if our health insurance model paid for preventative care on a standard basis (and, for instance, my plan does not--which sucks), the money spent on addiction recovery and smoking cessation would be well worth it--but actually this would still lower the overall cost of health insurance for everyone. This has been the experience in Sweden and Germany where preventative care is covered in full (and where "wellness" routines are also subsidized: gym memberships, etc.).
16
@10 Reading the full NYT article, I get the impression that Newsom is quite the nanny-stater (a soda tax? Really?), so it really wouldn't surprise me.
17
@13 and 15, my statement is based on a Dutch study released last year. I don't have the cite, but I remember there was a post about it on Slog at the time. I stand by my original post.
18
I have no interest in legislating and taxing smokers out of existence...But I fucking hate litterbugs, and smokers tossing their butts on the ground are the worst
What I fucking hate is people who pollute the air I'm trying to breathe. To each his own, sure - but if it's reasonable to complain about teeny tiny cigarette filters in the gutter, it's extremely reasonable to complain about people choosing to make me breathe toxic chemicals by spewing them in public.
What I fucking hate is people who pollute the air I'm trying to breathe. To each his own, sure - but if it's reasonable to complain about teeny tiny cigarette filters in the gutter, it's extremely reasonable to complain about people choosing to make me breathe toxic chemicals by spewing them in public.
21
@16, the soda tax is pretty ridiculous. I know HFCS isn't good for you but to choose soda and not candy bars, candy, snack foods, and other sugar and HFCS items is stupid. They should have a non-complex carbohydrate tax on foods like white rice and baguettes, since it is basically sugar.
Fuck, they might as well just tax fat people.
But to get back on topic, I personally hate people who leave their cigarette butts on the ground, so screw 'em. Almost all smokers litter their cigarette butts when they are outside anyway so I doubt it will change much if they started littering anyhow.
Fuck, they might as well just tax fat people.
But to get back on topic, I personally hate people who leave their cigarette butts on the ground, so screw 'em. Almost all smokers litter their cigarette butts when they are outside anyway so I doubt it will change much if they started littering anyhow.
22
Most radical anti-smokers are ex-smokers. But it would be nice if people picked up their cigarette and cigar butts, as well as the dog poo.
23
How about giving people an expensive littering ticket every time they toss any sort of trash on the ground?
24
#17. You stand by it, huh? Even though you can't be bothered to look for it? That's pretty convincing stuff.
Did this anonymous, uncited, unfindable Dutch study consider that maybe we ought to consider people dying young, you know, a kind of problem - a cost in a cost-benefit analysis, even if not a direct financial cost?
Did this anonymous, uncited, unfindable Dutch study consider that maybe we ought to consider people dying young, you know, a kind of problem - a cost in a cost-benefit analysis, even if not a direct financial cost?
25
Yes, 24, I have better things to do than spending half an hour trying to find an old Slog post. Like lunch, which I'm gonna do in about one minute. Sorry to disappoint you.
And no, the study was purely based on a financial analysis.
And no, the study was purely based on a financial analysis.
26
Some of the smokers I know are polite and fastidious people who wouldn't dream of throwing a butt on the ground. Then there are the people who live above me, who think nothing of throwing their butts over the balcony and into my container garden. It's part of a culture of assholishness they seem to buy into, which also includes shrieking 2 AM arguments and letting their bathtub run until it floods into my apartment. I'm hoping that one or both of them contract emphysema very, very soon so they have to move off the second floor and away.
27
@18 - Me too. Walking down the street, I smell lots of nauseating exhaust fumes. It's fucking gross. Don't know how anybody can smell a cigarette over that. I'd imagine the long-term damage is probably worse than a little passing second-hand smoke, as well.
29
@23 VBH = Winner. Why can't people who LITTER get fined? That way, no excessive taxes on the rare responsible smoker. The fine revenue would more than pay for enforcement. AND they are easy to find. Look outside any business park/office building (like mine, with ample ashtrays, btw) and it's like shooting fish in a barrel. Those junkies pack together and the butts accumulate.
30
@27,
Trust me. In downtown Chicago I can smell a cigarette a block away, even if I don't see anyone smoking. It happens every day. And anyway, the post really doesn't have to do with the smell, it's about littering and assholery, plain and simple.
Trust me. In downtown Chicago I can smell a cigarette a block away, even if I don't see anyone smoking. It happens every day. And anyway, the post really doesn't have to do with the smell, it's about littering and assholery, plain and simple.
31
I, on the other hand, am interested in taxing smokers out of existence. A pack of cigarettes should be federally taxed in way that brings the cost of the pack to $25. A pack of cigarettes or an equivalent amout of loose tobacco should cost a smoker $25. The proceeds from the tax would be split 70% towards general healthcare and 30% to enforcement of laws that prohibit people from bringing untaxed cigarettes in from out of the country.
32
@31 Sin taxes are always appealing until they start going after something you like. Careful with that line of thought, it's a slippery slope.
33
I'm a smoker and I fully support this idea. Tossing cigarette butts on the ground is disgusting, lazy, disrespectful and exactly the same thing as littering.
34
FUCK THIS FUCK THIS FUCK THIS.
NON SMOKIES NEED TO CHECK THEMSELVES FORST I GUT THEM AND ROAST THEM AND TURN THEM ALL INTO PUBLIC ASHTRAYS THAT I PURPOSELY MISS. YOU PPL ARE RUINING MY VICEZ AND I HATEZ U. AN FUK PPL WHO LET THER DAWGS SHIT PLACES. I WILL SHIT IN YO MOUFF OVAH AND POVAH BACK AND PORTH UNTIL YOU DIE AND DEN I WILL MAKE U INTO ANOTHRRR PUBLICK ASHTRAY TO MISS PURPOSELY.
IF U R GONNA MAKE ME PAY TO CLEAN UP, I HAV ZEE FOLLOWING REQUESTS:
1. DOGS OFF LEASHES, DOGS SHITTING, DOGS IN GENERAL CAN BE SHOT/STRANGLED/KICKED/MAULED ON SITE.
2. FREE HEALFTHCARRR
3. LEGALIZE MY 420
4. SMOKING INDOORS AGIN.
IT IS BAAD NEWS BADANOFF ENUFF THAT I HAVE TO DEAL WITH PRICKLY HIPPIES WHO TOOK AWAY THE GLORY OF SMOKING IN CAFES/RESTERRRRONTS/BAFFFROOMS/HOUSES/MUSEUMS/SKOOLS, BUT NOW YOU FORCEZ ME TO PAY EVEN MORE????
I WANT TO SIN TAX PRIUSES AND SHITTY BAND T-SHIRTS AND BAD ART AND DAVID SEDARIS AND ALL SORTS OF OTHER SHIT THAT IS AWFUL AND SINFUL AND GROSS.
NON SMOKIES NEED TO CHECK THEMSELVES FORST I GUT THEM AND ROAST THEM AND TURN THEM ALL INTO PUBLIC ASHTRAYS THAT I PURPOSELY MISS. YOU PPL ARE RUINING MY VICEZ AND I HATEZ U. AN FUK PPL WHO LET THER DAWGS SHIT PLACES. I WILL SHIT IN YO MOUFF OVAH AND POVAH BACK AND PORTH UNTIL YOU DIE AND DEN I WILL MAKE U INTO ANOTHRRR PUBLICK ASHTRAY TO MISS PURPOSELY.
IF U R GONNA MAKE ME PAY TO CLEAN UP, I HAV ZEE FOLLOWING REQUESTS:
1. DOGS OFF LEASHES, DOGS SHITTING, DOGS IN GENERAL CAN BE SHOT/STRANGLED/KICKED/MAULED ON SITE.
2. FREE HEALFTHCARRR
3. LEGALIZE MY 420
4. SMOKING INDOORS AGIN.
IT IS BAAD NEWS BADANOFF ENUFF THAT I HAVE TO DEAL WITH PRICKLY HIPPIES WHO TOOK AWAY THE GLORY OF SMOKING IN CAFES/RESTERRRRONTS/BAFFFROOMS/HOUSES/MUSEUMS/SKOOLS, BUT NOW YOU FORCEZ ME TO PAY EVEN MORE????
I WANT TO SIN TAX PRIUSES AND SHITTY BAND T-SHIRTS AND BAD ART AND DAVID SEDARIS AND ALL SORTS OF OTHER SHIT THAT IS AWFUL AND SINFUL AND GROSS.
36
OK, no "taxes," just raise smoker's health care premiums by 100%.
Okay, we must avoid horrors of the dreaded sintax slippery slopiness. Because anytime we do anything, we could over do it until it makes no sense!
So, simply raise smokers' health care premiums and require a $25 deposit on their butts.
Or better yet, deny them entry into our single payer health care plan (AND deny them any health care for smoking related disease (unless they can pony up)).
Whew. This way, we won't slip into taxing gasoline, or property, or sales, or wages, or income, or use of property, or capital gains, or local motels or restaurants to benefit stadiums.
That would be awful!
Okay, we must avoid horrors of the dreaded sintax slippery slopiness. Because anytime we do anything, we could over do it until it makes no sense!
So, simply raise smokers' health care premiums and require a $25 deposit on their butts.
Or better yet, deny them entry into our single payer health care plan (AND deny them any health care for smoking related disease (unless they can pony up)).
Whew. This way, we won't slip into taxing gasoline, or property, or sales, or wages, or income, or use of property, or capital gains, or local motels or restaurants to benefit stadiums.
That would be awful!
37
N THANK U MOTHERFUCKING TOOL BAG DOUCHERS WHO TINK LIVING IS IMPORTANT: NEWS FLASH, IT AIN'T.
ACTUAL QUOTES FROM PPL FROM LONG TIMEZ AGO THAT YOU OBVIOUSLY R IGNORRRING:
A. NEETZ: YO LOL LIFE IS LIKE ONLY ABOUT STRENGTH AND IZ MEANINGLESS.
B. HOOVER HOGG ::: EVRY BABY BORN IZ A MURDER WAITING TO HAPPEN, ONE HOLOCAUST NOW SAVES INFINITE HOLOCAUST
C. WAR MOVIE: WTF, U WANNA LIVE 4EVER LIKE SOME PANSY?
D. YAWN, LIFE IZ BORING N-E-WAY: ME ME ME!!!
ACTUAL QUOTES FROM PPL FROM LONG TIMEZ AGO THAT YOU OBVIOUSLY R IGNORRRING:
A. NEETZ: YO LOL LIFE IS LIKE ONLY ABOUT STRENGTH AND IZ MEANINGLESS.
B. HOOVER HOGG ::: EVRY BABY BORN IZ A MURDER WAITING TO HAPPEN, ONE HOLOCAUST NOW SAVES INFINITE HOLOCAUST
C. WAR MOVIE: WTF, U WANNA LIVE 4EVER LIKE SOME PANSY?
D. YAWN, LIFE IZ BORING N-E-WAY: ME ME ME!!!
38
I HAZ MOR CHEEZ TO SPEW.
I LUV JUDGING NON-SMOKERS. I YAM AN ASSHOLE. I LIKE MAKING DA WORLD A WORSE PLACE. BUT DESPITE ALL OF DAT I YAM USUALLY I VEWWY ACCOMODATING PERSONAGE. EXCEPT FOR 'SEA J' (NUMBA 31). I RESERVE MY MOST BILEY BILE VOMIT ACID 4 U. U R JUS' A HATER WIF NO CREATIVITY OR ANYTING. I HOPE A HOMELESS WOMAN DATE-RAPES U WIFFF A BLACK AND MILD.
I LUV JUDGING NON-SMOKERS. I YAM AN ASSHOLE. I LIKE MAKING DA WORLD A WORSE PLACE. BUT DESPITE ALL OF DAT I YAM USUALLY I VEWWY ACCOMODATING PERSONAGE. EXCEPT FOR 'SEA J' (NUMBA 31). I RESERVE MY MOST BILEY BILE VOMIT ACID 4 U. U R JUS' A HATER WIF NO CREATIVITY OR ANYTING. I HOPE A HOMELESS WOMAN DATE-RAPES U WIFFF A BLACK AND MILD.
42
And to the people who say "I don't toss my butts on the ground now but if I were paying 30 cents a pack, I would," screw you. Most people who don't already throw their garbage on the ground would continue to take the 2 seconds to throw their butts away. Assholes like you (most of whom already toss their butts on the ground) would litter. And to the people people who complain about a lack of ash trays? Their are trash cans of some kind outside of every bar. That doesn't seem to stop you from thinking you're entitled to toss your nasty butts all over the place. Screw you.
43
One of my brothers walked up behind a parked car whose owner tossed out a lit butt (I should point out this was in Eastern Washington in midsummer, and the fire danger was extremely high). He picked the butt up and tossed it back in the car's open back window. A few minutes later, leaving the store he'd been walking into, he saw smoke pouring out of the car's windows and the smoker frantically trying to locate the source of the fire.
44
Joceylyln,
If you wanna go off topic, that's cool. I don't set the rules of Slog, you can do anything you want, as proven by Kanye above. Off topic....I don't think Jesus would approve of littering. How's that?
If you wanna go off topic, that's cool. I don't set the rules of Slog, you can do anything you want, as proven by Kanye above. Off topic....I don't think Jesus would approve of littering. How's that?
45
Eh, as an ex smoker I got annoyed when they took smoking out of some places, so I was like fuck it. You want me to smoke outside? then you get my butts outside.
And even now, I don't think it's a huge deal. There are very few ashtrays around, even on busy streets. So whatevs. I don't really even see it as that big a problem. People spit gum on the street. Should we tax gum for street cleaning? WTF?
And even now, I don't think it's a huge deal. There are very few ashtrays around, even on busy streets. So whatevs. I don't really even see it as that big a problem. People spit gum on the street. Should we tax gum for street cleaning? WTF?
46
Well, OM, my business did smokers a favor and bought one of those extinguishing ashtrays with the long neck to put outside. Guess what we found lying next to it? Cigarette butts. Business owners are doing their part. Smokers can do their part and either a)look for an ashtray or b)snuff their cigarette and put it in a garbage can.
ps, Off topic, gun in the hands of law abiding resident prevents other law abiding residents from getting shot.
http://www.wsbtv.com/news/19365762/detai…
ps, Off topic, gun in the hands of law abiding resident prevents other law abiding residents from getting shot.
http://www.wsbtv.com/news/19365762/detai…
47
44 - Doesn't discussing whether or not things are off-topic count as being off-topic?
And really, is anyone actually arguing about littering? Nobody thinks littering is good. It's lazy and lame and totally douchy, and charging people what it costs to pick up after them is a completely acceptable response. That said, any discussion regarding smoking inevitably turns into a "smokers are assholes" fest.
And, in reality, everyone's assholes. Except Jesus. Amen.
And really, is anyone actually arguing about littering? Nobody thinks littering is good. It's lazy and lame and totally douchy, and charging people what it costs to pick up after them is a completely acceptable response. That said, any discussion regarding smoking inevitably turns into a "smokers are assholes" fest.
And, in reality, everyone's assholes. Except Jesus. Amen.
48
Was I the only one to not think that Mr Schmader's headline was leading to a post about discarded condoms and dildos littering the streets of San Francisco?
49
@Zoroastronomer: I know some places do, but the majority don't.
And even if you have trash cans, people still litter. It sucks, but I think singling out smokers is total BS.
And even if you have trash cans, people still litter. It sucks, but I think singling out smokers is total BS.
50
Jocelyn? ok, how's this: "PEOPLE WHO LITTER are assholes."
And you said you litter. You are an asshole.
And you said you litter. You are an asshole.
51
#23 and #29 - That makes the most sense if fairness was the only concern, but enforcement would not only be expensive and impractical, it'd be extremely unpopular. I'd support a tax on single serving cans and bottles as well, if the proceeds were used similarly.
52
My aunt, one of the coolest ladies ever until ALS took her life, carried a little snap-cap cloisonné box with her when out walking. Smoking done, butt went in the box and went home with her.
They need to make some kind of roundish, easily-pocketed, leakproof version of this. Then make it hip and trendy for guys and gals to have one (the smokers, anyway), and make not using it the social equivalent of shitting in the Trevi Fountain at high noon on Sunday.
They need to make some kind of roundish, easily-pocketed, leakproof version of this. Then make it hip and trendy for guys and gals to have one (the smokers, anyway), and make not using it the social equivalent of shitting in the Trevi Fountain at high noon on Sunday.
53
@50 - But aren't people who call people "assholes" assholes?
I think it's safe to say that everyone (at least everyone on slog) is an asshole. Except for Kim in Portland.
I think it's safe to say that everyone (at least everyone on slog) is an asshole. Except for Kim in Portland.
54
@8 You are wrong, I work for a tobacco cessation company and your facts are incorrect. Here is the truth as evidenced by scientific research:
"Each year U.S. employers spend over $196 billion per year in excess medical costs and lost productivity of those affected by tobacco use – on average an excess cost of $15 per smoker, per day, or $5,445 per year. With a national average tobacco-use prevalence of 20%, a company of 10,000 employees and their eligible dependents is incurring an estimated $14,188,840 per year in excess costs associated with smoking."
taken from my company's website @
http://www.freeclear.com/quit-for-life/w…
"Each year U.S. employers spend over $196 billion per year in excess medical costs and lost productivity of those affected by tobacco use – on average an excess cost of $15 per smoker, per day, or $5,445 per year. With a national average tobacco-use prevalence of 20%, a company of 10,000 employees and their eligible dependents is incurring an estimated $14,188,840 per year in excess costs associated with smoking."
taken from my company's website @
http://www.freeclear.com/quit-for-life/w…
55
@ 8 also from the same page I linked from
"Smokers have higher medical costs than non-smokers - an estimated $2,530 more per year—and are admitted to the hospital almost twice as often as nonsmokers."
THIS IS PROVEN FACT! See the citations at
http://www.freeclear.com/quit-for-life/w…
"Smokers have higher medical costs than non-smokers - an estimated $2,530 more per year—and are admitted to the hospital almost twice as often as nonsmokers."
THIS IS PROVEN FACT! See the citations at
http://www.freeclear.com/quit-for-life/w…
58
I'm always amazed at the selfishness displayed every day by smokers who toss their butts on the ground.
59
I misread this as "butt lint." Now that's a war for San Francisco to wage.
Yes I accompanied a class of third graders on a field trip today.
Yes I accompanied a class of third graders on a field trip today.
62
I'm always really careful to put my butts in the garbage... except at work. And the reason why is there is not a SINGLE GODDAMNED OUTDOOR TRASH CAN anywhere in the whole office park. If they had one I would go out of my way to use it.
63
I AM KANYE?!?!?!? SNAP, NEWS TO ME.
TOBACCO CESSATION IS A FANCY TERM FOR 'HERE IS YOUR DICK/VAGINA, WE ARE GOING TO CUT IT OFF/OUT, AND BTW U DON'T MIND IF WE TAKE YOUR TASTEBUDS TOO, U DON'T NEED TO TASTE ALL THE SALADS WE ARE GOING TO MAKE YOU TOSS NE WAY'
STOP HURTING MY VICES. I YAM AN ASSHOLE.
BUT YOU ARE AN ASSCLOWN.
TOBACCO CESSATION IS A FANCY TERM FOR 'HERE IS YOUR DICK/VAGINA, WE ARE GOING TO CUT IT OFF/OUT, AND BTW U DON'T MIND IF WE TAKE YOUR TASTEBUDS TOO, U DON'T NEED TO TASTE ALL THE SALADS WE ARE GOING TO MAKE YOU TOSS NE WAY'
STOP HURTING MY VICES. I YAM AN ASSHOLE.
BUT YOU ARE AN ASSCLOWN.
65
"Smoking-related diseases cost the United States more than $150 billion a year."
does the World Health Org fit your bill?
Smoking= High risk for Heath Issues
Health Issues= High Medical Costs
High Medical Costs= Higher price to pay than a non smoker w/out health issues.
Not to mention the fact that most insurance companies charge a higher premium for tobacco users (due to the increased health risks).
http://www.wpro.who.int/media_centre/fac…
does the World Health Org fit your bill?
Smoking= High risk for Heath Issues
Health Issues= High Medical Costs
High Medical Costs= Higher price to pay than a non smoker w/out health issues.
Not to mention the fact that most insurance companies charge a higher premium for tobacco users (due to the increased health risks).
http://www.wpro.who.int/media_centre/fac…
66
i remember the great joys of being a smoker. i have compassion for the souls that cannot give up. as policy i try not to unduly inflict my opinion on others.
some days it's hard not to get offended by smoke in my personal space. that person chooses to walk around in a little poison cloud, their choice. but it seems pretty rude to walk up to somebody at a corner and wait for the light inflicting that poison on others.
i actually regret my vote in favor of the bar smoking ban. turns out that all the smokers used to be nicely tucked away inside where i didn't have to smell them. i used to be able to choose to enter that environment. now i walk past bars with my children almost every day, breathing poison or just looking at the butts and i sadly regret.
some days it's hard not to get offended by smoke in my personal space. that person chooses to walk around in a little poison cloud, their choice. but it seems pretty rude to walk up to somebody at a corner and wait for the light inflicting that poison on others.
i actually regret my vote in favor of the bar smoking ban. turns out that all the smokers used to be nicely tucked away inside where i didn't have to smell them. i used to be able to choose to enter that environment. now i walk past bars with my children almost every day, breathing poison or just looking at the butts and i sadly regret.
67
(1) smokers die earlier so they ultimately get less payout from medicare and social security. but no one ever wants to talk about that.
(2) how about someone calculating the cost of "healthy" people who live long enough to end up with protracted diseases that required skilled nursing care for years and years and years to die from.
(3) first, it was go outside. then it was get away from the doors and windows of the buildings. then because someone complained about smokers congregating near a walk path (the acceptable distance from the building, where they had chained the butt disposal can, they took away the can. the result is, people throw them on the ground.
(4) how about the health costs of obesity? why aren't there huge taxes on unhealthy food - soda, chips, fast food, junk food? if you total it all up - diabetes, heart disease, etc. - you know those disease you can live with for a long time that cost a fortune in health care dollars? how about some substance abuse equity?
(5) spend money to put up butt disposals to cut down on the litter problem. the reason they end up on the ground is that there is no where to put them (except trash cans which would cause fires). the more rabid the anti-smoking lobby and initiatives become - the worse smokers will become in response.
grow up!
(2) how about someone calculating the cost of "healthy" people who live long enough to end up with protracted diseases that required skilled nursing care for years and years and years to die from.
(3) first, it was go outside. then it was get away from the doors and windows of the buildings. then because someone complained about smokers congregating near a walk path (the acceptable distance from the building, where they had chained the butt disposal can, they took away the can. the result is, people throw them on the ground.
(4) how about the health costs of obesity? why aren't there huge taxes on unhealthy food - soda, chips, fast food, junk food? if you total it all up - diabetes, heart disease, etc. - you know those disease you can live with for a long time that cost a fortune in health care dollars? how about some substance abuse equity?
(5) spend money to put up butt disposals to cut down on the litter problem. the reason they end up on the ground is that there is no where to put them (except trash cans which would cause fires). the more rabid the anti-smoking lobby and initiatives become - the worse smokers will become in response.
grow up!
69
San Francisco doesn't prosecute what it sees as "quality of life" issues. Public urination, littering, loitering, etc. This is just a work-around to mitigate some of the issues here, and raise some money. They've also gone after fast food chains for their litter.
70
First post still has the best point. Time in the Army has taught me to conscientiously take the time to throw out cigarette filters once I'm done, but, hey, if you're going to go ahead and punish me for something someone else has done, then why should I take that kind of time?
71
A few weeks back, I was at a stop light on Capital Hill, and happened to flick a butt out of my car window. Approximately 2 weeks later, I received a sternly worded letter from the Washington State Highway Patrol, stating that the car behind me had witnessed my tossing of said butt (my car license plate was used to identify me), and that any further complaints of such, by concerned citizens would result in my receiving a citation. This is true, I shit you not.
Yes, I admit, I needed the "finger wagging," for my indiscretion, but more concerning to me is there are people that wait, cell phone at the ready, to call in and report such a minor fraction, as mentioned. The person simply could have yelled out their window, which would have been "public" humiliation enough.
Personally, I found it very odd, that such a call was made, then later acted upon by the WSHP. How much did all of that just cost the tax payers of this state? Not to mention, now every person you pass, or those you don't even notice could be the eyes and ears for reporting you for tossing your gum out your car window, as well.
Yes, I admit, I needed the "finger wagging," for my indiscretion, but more concerning to me is there are people that wait, cell phone at the ready, to call in and report such a minor fraction, as mentioned. The person simply could have yelled out their window, which would have been "public" humiliation enough.
Personally, I found it very odd, that such a call was made, then later acted upon by the WSHP. How much did all of that just cost the tax payers of this state? Not to mention, now every person you pass, or those you don't even notice could be the eyes and ears for reporting you for tossing your gum out your car window, as well.
73
New idea..... Since they don't work anyway, get the cigarette companies to quit putting filters on cigs. Then, since there are no undecomposable filters, the paper and tobacco degrade, and no harm, no foul. Agreed?
76
I can't help but be annoyed by people who whine, "Well, THEY took away all the ashtrays, so I HAVE to throw my butts on the ground! It's THEIR fault!"
Clean. Up. After. Your. Own. Fucking. Self.
It's not that hard. Look, take a Zip-Loc sandwich bag with you when you go out. When you're done smoking, scrub the cherry out on a curb or your shoe sole, then pop the butt in the bag. Take it home and dump it out or throw the whole stinking mess in your own garbage can. If you melt a hole in the bag or your pants, well, you'll be more careful next time, won't you?
Clean. Up. After. Your. Own. Fucking. Self.
It's not that hard. Look, take a Zip-Loc sandwich bag with you when you go out. When you're done smoking, scrub the cherry out on a curb or your shoe sole, then pop the butt in the bag. Take it home and dump it out or throw the whole stinking mess in your own garbage can. If you melt a hole in the bag or your pants, well, you'll be more careful next time, won't you?
77
I live in SF and I am a smoker. I have been obsessive about not throwing my butts on the ground my whole life. Now I am paying for someone else to clean up after me, so they might as well fucking do it.
Butts in the street, money to the gov't...lose/lose.
Butts in the street, money to the gov't...lose/lose.
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