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News & ArtsMonday, April 20, 2009
Crime Two Men Shot in South Seattle
Posted by Jonah Spangenthal-Lee on Mon, Apr 20, 2009 at 5:43 PM
Seattle Police are investigating a possible gang shooting in South Seattle.
At about 3:50pm, officers were called to the 5600 block of South Avon Street after two young men were shot near the Rainier View Elementary School.
The men were transported to Harborview with non-life-threatening injuries. Police say one of the men was shot in the hand while the other was hit in the buttocks.
Police say they have a description of the shooter's vehicle, but are not releasing information.
SPD gang detectives are investigating
1
Argh. There was also a shooting (no one hit) in Pratt Park this afternoon. Reports say it was the escalation of a fistfight, and unrelated to the south end incident.
Slightly more here:
http://www.centraldistrictnews.com/2009/…
Slightly more here:
http://www.centraldistrictnews.com/2009/…
2
Any more of an accurate description Jonah?
Curious to see if we have a continuing pattern in these gang incidents.
Curious to see if we have a continuing pattern in these gang incidents.
4
Times like this call for crimefighters.
I, for one, am looking forward to the YouTube video sightings.
I, for one, am looking forward to the YouTube video sightings.
5
@1 Thanks for that website. Interesting to read.
I'd hate to draw conclusions based on the similarities we can find in these two logs entries, and that from Jonah's post:
4:01PM - 5600 S. Avon St. - Shooting - Drive-by shooting way down in south Seattle. Man down, medics on the scene. Witnesses describe the suspect vehicle as a silver white Toyota Scion with 3 black males and 1 black female occupants in their teens, last seen southbound. Similar vehicle reported flashing a handgun earlier in Renton.
Update: New suspect descriptions: Black male, 23, long braids, hispanic female, and black male, 17 in the back seat
-----
4:42PM - Pratt Park - Shots Fired - Shots fired, man seen running, black male, teens, black jacket over shoulder, white t-shirt with something in his hand, heading SW. Stemmed from a fist fight, gun was was discharged, but no one hit. Eight people involved in the fight Update: Suspect reported seen running with handgun westbound from 18th & S. Washington
How long shall we remain being PC? Can we start making demands of decency from certain races? Is that not PC?
At what point will you sheeple admit that a certain small segment of the CD population is causing a majority of the violent assault offenses and especially the majority of those done with weapons that have the greater potential of harming innocent bystanders?
Can the citizens of the Central District demand greater profiling of young black men crusing the 'hood? I for one am DAMN tired of hearing the same story over and over and over again, with a description that is always the same.
How many incidents involving shootings do we need to have before the readership here starts agreeing with me?
More...
I'd hate to draw conclusions based on the similarities we can find in these two logs entries, and that from Jonah's post:
4:01PM - 5600 S. Avon St. - Shooting - Drive-by shooting way down in south Seattle. Man down, medics on the scene. Witnesses describe the suspect vehicle as a silver white Toyota Scion with 3 black males and 1 black female occupants in their teens, last seen southbound. Similar vehicle reported flashing a handgun earlier in Renton.
Update: New suspect descriptions: Black male, 23, long braids, hispanic female, and black male, 17 in the back seat
-----
4:42PM - Pratt Park - Shots Fired - Shots fired, man seen running, black male, teens, black jacket over shoulder, white t-shirt with something in his hand, heading SW. Stemmed from a fist fight, gun was was discharged, but no one hit. Eight people involved in the fight Update: Suspect reported seen running with handgun westbound from 18th & S. Washington
How long shall we remain being PC? Can we start making demands of decency from certain races? Is that not PC?
At what point will you sheeple admit that a certain small segment of the CD population is causing a majority of the violent assault offenses and especially the majority of those done with weapons that have the greater potential of harming innocent bystanders?
Can the citizens of the Central District demand greater profiling of young black men crusing the 'hood? I for one am DAMN tired of hearing the same story over and over and over again, with a description that is always the same.
How many incidents involving shootings do we need to have before the readership here starts agreeing with me?
6
@5 Yes. You again. Where are you going with this?
You're wrong. It's a stupid way to look at the world.
I have a statistic for you.
100% of crime is caused by... (wait for it)... CRIMINALS.
Your issue is not even relevant. It's stupid.
If you care so deeply about this, shut up and start fighting crime already.
You're wrong. It's a stupid way to look at the world.
I have a statistic for you.
100% of crime is caused by... (wait for it)... CRIMINALS.
Your issue is not even relevant. It's stupid.
If you care so deeply about this, shut up and start fighting crime already.
7
@6 Yes me again.
Tell me Ackham. How many Chinese folks live in the CD? Ever hear of them running around gang bangin'? Why not?
Hey you know... we have alot of them Indian folks running around the county. EVER hear of them involved in any crime with a weapon? Ever?
It would seem that the "problem" we have can be narrowed down to a particular set of identifiable characteristics. Since statisticians and criminal profilers use these characteristics to make likely inferences on who committed a crime, should by extension we as amateur pundits be able to infer those same probabilities in our wild ass guesses?
I'd like to see the community, and especially Seattle civic leaders to publically make a call to the leaders of that community and demand that they start speaking out against their own community for allowing the thuggery to continue and perpetuate.
I'm frankly fucking sick and tired of folks here tip toeing through the Bullshit that passes as discourse while politely ignoring obvious common denominators that the gang bangers are almost always young black men. That isn't racist. That's a fact.
Until such time as we have an honest discussion about facts, and hold the black community responsible for it's problems, we will simply continue to be PC and not address the issue head on.
The black community as a whole continues to deflect the blame and refuses to take responsibility for its community's shortcomings. Until that day, white folks will continue to believe that there is a difference in those who live in this community. Some want to be civil, law abiding trustworthy decent folks. (Read: Chinese, Indian, Caucasian) Some insist on allowing themselves to be continuous societal victims or downright violent thugs.
Call it racist or any other bullshit you want. The fact remains that the statistics are on my side.
More...
Tell me Ackham. How many Chinese folks live in the CD? Ever hear of them running around gang bangin'? Why not?
Hey you know... we have alot of them Indian folks running around the county. EVER hear of them involved in any crime with a weapon? Ever?
It would seem that the "problem" we have can be narrowed down to a particular set of identifiable characteristics. Since statisticians and criminal profilers use these characteristics to make likely inferences on who committed a crime, should by extension we as amateur pundits be able to infer those same probabilities in our wild ass guesses?
I'd like to see the community, and especially Seattle civic leaders to publically make a call to the leaders of that community and demand that they start speaking out against their own community for allowing the thuggery to continue and perpetuate.
I'm frankly fucking sick and tired of folks here tip toeing through the Bullshit that passes as discourse while politely ignoring obvious common denominators that the gang bangers are almost always young black men. That isn't racist. That's a fact.
Until such time as we have an honest discussion about facts, and hold the black community responsible for it's problems, we will simply continue to be PC and not address the issue head on.
The black community as a whole continues to deflect the blame and refuses to take responsibility for its community's shortcomings. Until that day, white folks will continue to believe that there is a difference in those who live in this community. Some want to be civil, law abiding trustworthy decent folks. (Read: Chinese, Indian, Caucasian) Some insist on allowing themselves to be continuous societal victims or downright violent thugs.
Call it racist or any other bullshit you want. The fact remains that the statistics are on my side.
8
I'm thinking... something troll. Troll... hmmm...
The Indignant Troll!!! Mmm... needs work.
How about... White Pride!!!
Armed with his... keyboard? In a backwater comments section of an online alternative local rag.
No. Your crimefighting style DEFINITELY needs work. It's really quite useless.
There's a lot of smart people here. I'm sure we can come up with something.
The fashion fags here can probably REALLY give you some tips on a costume.
The Indignant Troll!!! Mmm... needs work.
How about... White Pride!!!
Armed with his... keyboard? In a backwater comments section of an online alternative local rag.
No. Your crimefighting style DEFINITELY needs work. It's really quite useless.
There's a lot of smart people here. I'm sure we can come up with something.
The fashion fags here can probably REALLY give you some tips on a costume.
9
Umm... Actually, unless Seattle has changed a lot recently there are some very violent Asian and Latin gangs there. So NOT just a black problem.
10
@9 Ummm incorrect. Remember we don't care about Asian or Latin gangs at the moment. They haven't been violent with guns. Guns have the possibility of hurting innocent random bystanders.
Seattle has changed a lot in that regards. Most of the Asian and Latin communities have been priced out of Seattle and moved down to Kent, Tacoma, Burien etc. Only the blacks have a stronghold in the CD until gentrification takes hold, rents/mortgages go up, and effectively black folks can't afford their (former) 'hood.
It will happen within 10 years. I'd just like to see the process sped up.
And a LOT of other law abiding folks of all races agree with me in that sentiment.
Seattle has changed a lot in that regards. Most of the Asian and Latin communities have been priced out of Seattle and moved down to Kent, Tacoma, Burien etc. Only the blacks have a stronghold in the CD until gentrification takes hold, rents/mortgages go up, and effectively black folks can't afford their (former) 'hood.
It will happen within 10 years. I'd just like to see the process sped up.
And a LOT of other law abiding folks of all races agree with me in that sentiment.
11
Seattle's worst bangin' ever was the 1983 Wah Mee massacre: Chinese gang bangers and the entourage and wannabes of the gang culture making the streets run red with blood; 14 dead in one night.
The problem with racists is they are so damn ignorant. If they weren't so ignorant they wouldn't be so racist.
The problem with racists is they are so damn ignorant. If they weren't so ignorant they wouldn't be so racist.
12
@11 Come on Elenchos you can do better than that!
So we are supposed to draw some statistical significance in the fact you can dredge up one non black shooting that happened over 25 years ago? Really?
Wow and to think Ackham believes there are some pretty smart Sloggers who frequent these boards. Right.
No Elenchos I am talking about current events. Currently we have a scourge of lawless young black punks running the streets of Cap Hill and the greater CD with guns trying to act tough. If we had weekly shootings being conducted by old white bandana wearin' thugz with canes and Glocks, I'd be the first to be back here bitching about them, and demanding that the Police profile anyone with a bottle of Cialis, grey hair and a lump in their pants as being suspect. I realize this profile might include you, but that was intentional.
Seriously though. Let's start by beefing up enforcement and profiling the current crime wave that has the potential of injuring an innocent bystander.
I think you can understand the difference.
Maybe.
So we are supposed to draw some statistical significance in the fact you can dredge up one non black shooting that happened over 25 years ago? Really?
Wow and to think Ackham believes there are some pretty smart Sloggers who frequent these boards. Right.
No Elenchos I am talking about current events. Currently we have a scourge of lawless young black punks running the streets of Cap Hill and the greater CD with guns trying to act tough. If we had weekly shootings being conducted by old white bandana wearin' thugz with canes and Glocks, I'd be the first to be back here bitching about them, and demanding that the Police profile anyone with a bottle of Cialis, grey hair and a lump in their pants as being suspect. I realize this profile might include you, but that was intentional.
Seriously though. Let's start by beefing up enforcement and profiling the current crime wave that has the potential of injuring an innocent bystander.
I think you can understand the difference.
Maybe.
13
Ohhh, shootings in SE Seattle so Mayor Dickles will direct the cops to go raid the gay bars for porn and chase down illegal parking on Queen Anne.
15
In a related story Mayor Nickels light rail open for service in mid July!
Kevlar vests will be on sale at the Metro ticket booth just outside Nordstrom!
Kevlar vests will be on sale at the Metro ticket booth just outside Nordstrom!
17
@12
No. Your definition of "current" is specious and self-serving. First you say "Ever hear of them running around gang bangin'?" then when your rank ignorance is exploded with news of a very recent case, one that still burns in living memory, you all of a sudden pretend that what you meant when you said "ever" was "currently."
Are you sure that you want to redefine "ever" to include only the last 25 years? I picked Wah Mee because it is the worst incident, not because it is unique. If I start beating you about the head and neck with more examples of Chinese gang bangers, will you go on shrinking the size of the time window until it only goes back to last week?
Or will you spuriously rejigger your racist categories to throw the Chinese in with the blacks, and then be bludgeoned again with examples of the other races you think will serve your rapidly deflating argument?
Perhaps you should research what the fuck you are talking about, and once armed with at least a half-assed excuse for an education, come back and try again.
No. Your definition of "current" is specious and self-serving. First you say "Ever hear of them running around gang bangin'?" then when your rank ignorance is exploded with news of a very recent case, one that still burns in living memory, you all of a sudden pretend that what you meant when you said "ever" was "currently."
Are you sure that you want to redefine "ever" to include only the last 25 years? I picked Wah Mee because it is the worst incident, not because it is unique. If I start beating you about the head and neck with more examples of Chinese gang bangers, will you go on shrinking the size of the time window until it only goes back to last week?
Or will you spuriously rejigger your racist categories to throw the Chinese in with the blacks, and then be bludgeoned again with examples of the other races you think will serve your rapidly deflating argument?
Perhaps you should research what the fuck you are talking about, and once armed with at least a half-assed excuse for an education, come back and try again.
19
@17 Bullshit Elenchos.
I caught you with your pants down (again).
Notice everyone that Elenchos said alot of words but really didn't tell us anything, nor did he address my counterpoint. Face it buddy, you are past your prime.
Current means current. Let's play with the timeframe of within the last year to date, April 08 to April 09. How's that? Show me your glaring statistics of the rampant Chinese violence with guns!
*waiting..........*
I will not spuriously rejigger my categories asshole. I've already clearly stated how I based my earlier premise, try keeping up.
Basically you've done nothing but prove yourself a fool. Like a typical touchy feely liberal hack, you try focusing the attack on me instead of the points I've outlined. If you can't attack the message attack the messenger right?
So tell me O Great Elenchos. Prove to me and everyone else here how I've erroneously blamed the young black man for being the primary perpetrator of the majority of violent assualts committed with a gun in the past year here in Seattle. Show me and the other lemmings that we have been completely misled by a biased media thanks to their one sided reporting of only violent black thug crime, and completely ignored all other ethnicities in their persecution of the black man. Bigotry!
Yeah right. Show us fool.
You have the balls to come back at me and try puffing up your importance to call me a fool for being naieve to the reality of the Seattle world. Enlighten me and the rest of the viewers the error in my ways.
I await with bated breath to tremble at the weight of the words within your profound response.
Please be gentle to my fragile ego mmmk?
More...
I caught you with your pants down (again).
Notice everyone that Elenchos said alot of words but really didn't tell us anything, nor did he address my counterpoint. Face it buddy, you are past your prime.
Current means current. Let's play with the timeframe of within the last year to date, April 08 to April 09. How's that? Show me your glaring statistics of the rampant Chinese violence with guns!
*waiting..........*
I will not spuriously rejigger my categories asshole. I've already clearly stated how I based my earlier premise, try keeping up.
Basically you've done nothing but prove yourself a fool. Like a typical touchy feely liberal hack, you try focusing the attack on me instead of the points I've outlined. If you can't attack the message attack the messenger right?
So tell me O Great Elenchos. Prove to me and everyone else here how I've erroneously blamed the young black man for being the primary perpetrator of the majority of violent assualts committed with a gun in the past year here in Seattle. Show me and the other lemmings that we have been completely misled by a biased media thanks to their one sided reporting of only violent black thug crime, and completely ignored all other ethnicities in their persecution of the black man. Bigotry!
Yeah right. Show us fool.
You have the balls to come back at me and try puffing up your importance to call me a fool for being naieve to the reality of the Seattle world. Enlighten me and the rest of the viewers the error in my ways.
I await with bated breath to tremble at the weight of the words within your profound response.
Please be gentle to my fragile ego mmmk?
20
Oh my god... you'd make a crappy crimefighter.
So much for trying to be a part of the solution...
But what a MONOLOGUE!!! Holy SHIT, dude.
Have you ever considered a career in villainy?
So much for trying to be a part of the solution...
But what a MONOLOGUE!!! Holy SHIT, dude.
Have you ever considered a career in villainy?
21
Wait... scratch that. That wasn't a proper villain monologue.
Those usually reveal the great master plan.
Do YOU have a great master plan?
Friendly Neighborhood Troll? Do you know how to rid the streets of crime?
Those usually reveal the great master plan.
Do YOU have a great master plan?
Friendly Neighborhood Troll? Do you know how to rid the streets of crime?
22
@21: I'm sure his plan starts with, "kick out all the black people."
@19: Watch Better Luck Tomorrow, it'll blow your fucking mind.
@19: Watch Better Luck Tomorrow, it'll blow your fucking mind.
23
What 22 said.
As I told him before, it's not the facts that are racist, just his implications. (I would say "conclusions" but he is too afraid to actually state them, obvious as they are.)
As I told him before, it's not the facts that are racist, just his implications. (I would say "conclusions" but he is too afraid to actually state them, obvious as they are.)
27
94% of all blacks murdered in the USA are murdered by other blacks, but somehow white people are "keeping them down".
28
Anyone else here live in CD or South Seattle? Troll, you live here, or... oh... Shoreline?
Yes, there are black people in South Seattle (not many compared to a real city, but compared to the rest of Seattle), and 99.5% of them don't shoot at each other. What we got here is a handful of teenagers with guns and poor judgment, yet some people use it to pre-judge anyone and everyone darker than themselves.
That said, YES, GIVE US MORE ENFORCEMENT DOWN HERE! BEEF UP THE GANG UNIT! I fear we'll get no support until a white person gets in the way of a gang bullet.
The phrase "containment" is bandied about on the CD news blogs. As long as the violence stays in our part of town (and stays among black teenagers), no one outside the neighborhood gives two shits. The racists enjoy a good wank in the comments... but nothing changes. Remember the outrage at the gang shooting at Southcenter? Now THAT'S a call to action! Heh.
Hey check me out! I'm getting cynical just living here! Comes with the territory.
P.S. One more shooting in our neighborhood last night:
http://www.centraldistrictnews.com/2009/…
Yes, there are black people in South Seattle (not many compared to a real city, but compared to the rest of Seattle), and 99.5% of them don't shoot at each other. What we got here is a handful of teenagers with guns and poor judgment, yet some people use it to pre-judge anyone and everyone darker than themselves.
That said, YES, GIVE US MORE ENFORCEMENT DOWN HERE! BEEF UP THE GANG UNIT! I fear we'll get no support until a white person gets in the way of a gang bullet.
The phrase "containment" is bandied about on the CD news blogs. As long as the violence stays in our part of town (and stays among black teenagers), no one outside the neighborhood gives two shits. The racists enjoy a good wank in the comments... but nothing changes. Remember the outrage at the gang shooting at Southcenter? Now THAT'S a call to action! Heh.
Hey check me out! I'm getting cynical just living here! Comes with the territory.
P.S. One more shooting in our neighborhood last night:
http://www.centraldistrictnews.com/2009/…
29
" YES, GIVE US MORE ENFORCEMENT DOWN HERE! BEEF UP THE GANG UNIT! "
I can just hear the whiney shrieks from James Bible and his fellow travelers now...
I can just hear the whiney shrieks from James Bible and his fellow travelers now...
30
@19
Stopped reading when I saw you were changing the subject. If you're going to do that, just admit you lost.
Stopped reading when I saw you were changing the subject. If you're going to do that, just admit you lost.
31
newsflash - black males commit the most violent crime in Seattle - or anywhere else in the world wherever they are found - end newsflash
32
When we have 15-year-old kids murdering each other with guns, there is something seriously fucked up with our society. Everybody needs to step up and take a piece of the blame.
@28: I live in north Seattle, and I want to see more enforcement, intervention, mentoring programs, etc. in the CD and Rainier Valley. And hey, while we're at it, maybe some of the same programs for schools around Northgate? Gang involvement and drug dealing are going up in the north end too.
@28: I live in north Seattle, and I want to see more enforcement, intervention, mentoring programs, etc. in the CD and Rainier Valley. And hey, while we're at it, maybe some of the same programs for schools around Northgate? Gang involvement and drug dealing are going up in the north end too.
33
@30 Don't worry Elenchos
We knew you couldn't do it. Great excuse though. Not sure where I changed the subject, but even at that, you and everyone else reading understood the basic premise of my points.
But go with that pathetic excuse. If it provides you cover to not have to prove you are completely full of shit, so be it. We all know the reality of the situation.
I find it highly amusing and ironic that the deafening silence of the masses lends credence to my assumption that many here believe as I do deep down.
@28 Your neighbor what you are failing to realize or intentionally ignoring, is that there are many different colors of folks living in the CD. How come we don't hear about all the violent assaults with weapons? Are they not reported in the news or are they JUST NOT OCCURRING!
I have no problems with any person based on the color of their skin. I have many friends and coworkers of different ethnicities. However amongst those ethnicities several sub groups within them have decided to seperate themselves, behave recklessly without regard to human decency and not participate in the community fabric. There are definitely white collar black folks out there. But sadly they are the vast minority and you and I both know it.
Until such time as the black community and it's leaders decide to get public and shame the thugz within their ranks, the majority of us Chinese, Indian and Caucasian folks will continue to treat the entire community as second classes citizens when we encounter them trying to promote the 'hood lifestyle.
Enough with excuses. Raise yourself up or get the fuck out of this country.
We have no more time or patience for your ilk.
We knew you couldn't do it. Great excuse though. Not sure where I changed the subject, but even at that, you and everyone else reading understood the basic premise of my points.
But go with that pathetic excuse. If it provides you cover to not have to prove you are completely full of shit, so be it. We all know the reality of the situation.
I find it highly amusing and ironic that the deafening silence of the masses lends credence to my assumption that many here believe as I do deep down.
@28 Your neighbor what you are failing to realize or intentionally ignoring, is that there are many different colors of folks living in the CD. How come we don't hear about all the violent assaults with weapons? Are they not reported in the news or are they JUST NOT OCCURRING!
I have no problems with any person based on the color of their skin. I have many friends and coworkers of different ethnicities. However amongst those ethnicities several sub groups within them have decided to seperate themselves, behave recklessly without regard to human decency and not participate in the community fabric. There are definitely white collar black folks out there. But sadly they are the vast minority and you and I both know it.
Until such time as the black community and it's leaders decide to get public and shame the thugz within their ranks, the majority of us Chinese, Indian and Caucasian folks will continue to treat the entire community as second classes citizens when we encounter them trying to promote the 'hood lifestyle.
Enough with excuses. Raise yourself up or get the fuck out of this country.
We have no more time or patience for your ilk.
35
@33
You clearly have the time and patience to write hundreds and hundreds of words for my ilk, and I don't even read them.
You clearly have the time and patience to write hundreds and hundreds of words for my ilk, and I don't even read them.
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