Tuesday, April 14, 2009
Sports / Housekeeping We All Like Different Things: Unpacking the Soccer Comments
Posted by Christopher Frizzelle on Tue, Apr 14, 2009 at 7:03 AM
It is not "gay" to like soccer, in spite of what some Slog commenters will tell you, anymore than it's "gay" to be from England or like chicken noodle soup or have curly hair.
As if the Stranger wasn't gay enough we now get daily updates about the gayest sport of them all, soccer. Two sports posts today and not one involves real sports like basketball, football or baseball. The Masters were great yesterday, OKC is in Portland tonight, the NFL draft is right around the corner, the M's are off to a nice start and all we get is soccer.
That's from commenter Thought I Saw a Bum. Kind of a baffling comment—and there's no real reason, Slog staffers pretty much get to write about whatever they want. But when I said that Thought I Saw a Bum changed his/her tune instantly:
I come to slog everyday and the last thing I expect is sports. Just seems like a spike in sports posts recently and I enjoy it. I liked Shermans columns about the Sonics and I enjoy Jonahs posts and think a once or twice a day sports post might have some potential. The sports posts seem to get a lot of comments.
So you're not pissed off? You don't think I'm "gay"? OK, cool. But then Reader, possibly trying to start some shit, weighed in:
In the US, soccer is the sport for people who don't like sports, hence the saturation Slog coverage... I'm betting the percentage of people at Sounders games that actually follow other sports is pretty low.
To which fixo replied:
Reader, you are dead wrong, I'd wager. I bet the percentage is no different from the same metric at other sports. Most soccer people I know are sportsy people generally. And for the last many years, most American kids playing sports have played soccer. For old farts like me, while I didn't played as a kid, since it was a vaguely sinister refuge from baseball, basketball and football for "longhairs" and counterculturists, soccer makes sense because it is simply superior to the alternatives, and what they've become. 4 billion people can't be wrong.What's amazing to me is not how popular the Sounders deservedly are (take that, JT Cornball!), but how threatened by this popularity so many meathead Slog commenters seem to be. Like if they give into the beautiful game, they'll have to start holding hands with other men.......
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1
The kinds of conservative minds throwing out crap like "gay-ass Stranger won't stop posting about gay-ass sports like soccer instead of REAL MEN'S SPORTS LIKE BASEBALLANDFOOBAAAAAAAALLLL" can't really be broken down by logic. It doesn't just apply to religion and politics. (Which sports could be a combination of... oooh, zen moment)
3
I think we need to re-read Bum's original post as it has been misjudged. He didn't say soccer is gay, he simply said it is the gayest of the major sports played - which is 100% true. I like soccer and fully support the Sounders but that doesn't change the fact that they run around in short-shorts.
I would like to conclude with the thought that we should like all sports for their own reasons. It shouldn't be a pissing competition about why one is better than the other - they're just different. A good sports town should always show their support whether it's the Hawks or the Rat City Roller Girls.
I would like to conclude with the thought that we should like all sports for their own reasons. It shouldn't be a pissing competition about why one is better than the other - they're just different. A good sports town should always show their support whether it's the Hawks or the Rat City Roller Girls.
4
first and foremost, basketball and baseball are NOT real sports, baseball is a game and basketball is a circus act. football is ok, in fact i am a huge football fan, but it's increasingly becoming too much of a spectacle and thus losing it's soul somewhat.
soccer is a great sport, it's got inherent excitement and universal appeal. the only two downsides i see to it are that the players can be big babies, they get tripped, fall down, and then roll around for a few minutes and appeal to the ref. it gets a little embarrassing. secondly the game can't be broken down to a simple box score. this is where i think americans can't quite wrap their heads around the game. all american sports are highly statistical, you can literally read a football game through it's stats, hence the popularity of fantasy football. soccer doesn't have this aspect, the game is very fluid and the measurable stats are relatively few. i'm not sure what about american culture needs this definition in their sports, but it seems pretty consistent.
in any case, the greatest sport in the world is in fact rugby anyway. but soccer is cool too.
soccer is a great sport, it's got inherent excitement and universal appeal. the only two downsides i see to it are that the players can be big babies, they get tripped, fall down, and then roll around for a few minutes and appeal to the ref. it gets a little embarrassing. secondly the game can't be broken down to a simple box score. this is where i think americans can't quite wrap their heads around the game. all american sports are highly statistical, you can literally read a football game through it's stats, hence the popularity of fantasy football. soccer doesn't have this aspect, the game is very fluid and the measurable stats are relatively few. i'm not sure what about american culture needs this definition in their sports, but it seems pretty consistent.
in any case, the greatest sport in the world is in fact rugby anyway. but soccer is cool too.
5
And, in case I'm the only one to notice (not likely), the non-roster backup goalie is an ADORABLE HOTTIE
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@3 -- so Australian Rules football is, like, super-duper gay?
http://www.flickr.com/photos/25737152@N0…
http://www.flickr.com/photos/25737152@N0…
7
please post at least ten more gay-related posts on slog by the end of the day. there have not been enough gay-related posts lately
8
Why are you unpacking any comments onto the actual Slog content, never mind obvious and goofy trolls? Is the object to troll the trolls (and the idiots who get trolled in again and again by the same ones) into one thread for a day, to keep them occupied?
Here's an easier solution -- stop allowing comments on Slog
Here's an easier solution -- stop allowing comments on Slog
9
Baconcat loves basketball waaaaaaaaaaaay more than he loves soccer, especially now that there is no pesky "home team" to root for in Seattle so he can focus on his hometown's team.
Soccer, though, is totally awesome.
Soccer, though, is totally awesome.
10
@6 american rules football is pretty gay too. short shorts nothing, those guys are wearing tights, and the sport is often compared to ballet. there's also quite a bit of ball handling skills needed...
11
Soccer is no more "gay" than other sports. I like to watch footbal because I love those "manly" uniforms. Now that's gay!
12
Frankly, I'm surprised how attached I've become to the Sounders after just four matches. I've played soccer my whole life, even for a local university here in Seattle. You could make the argument that the players who make it to a higher level than rec are usually more snobbish about what teams they support and reserve their passion for the clubs overseas. I think the reason that I am so excited is how accessible and local this team has stayed. Perhaps this will change in the future, but right now our players haven't reached that "untouchable" status of our other sports' players, such as Griffey, Tatupu, Ichiro, etc.
My former coach was in the broadcast booth before the game. I've played against Dragovon, Jaqua, and Eylander in my career. I grew up watching Keller and admire him so much for fulfilling his promise to finish his career in Seattle if they landed an MLS franchise. These are regular, nice guys who are representing our city well, and I'm so proud of Seattle for getting behind them so early and fervently. I also appreciate the heavy slog coverage. Keep it up!
My former coach was in the broadcast booth before the game. I've played against Dragovon, Jaqua, and Eylander in my career. I grew up watching Keller and admire him so much for fulfilling his promise to finish his career in Seattle if they landed an MLS franchise. These are regular, nice guys who are representing our city well, and I'm so proud of Seattle for getting behind them so early and fervently. I also appreciate the heavy slog coverage. Keep it up!
13
You fool no one.
Men in short shorts is what gets soccer on slog.
(Black men in shorts is what keeps basketball off)
The only mystery is why no college wrestling on slog.
Men in short shorts is what gets soccer on slog.
(Black men in shorts is what keeps basketball off)
The only mystery is why no college wrestling on slog.
14
@12, "These are regular, nice guys who are representing our city well" -- well, except for the raping thing.
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@14 there's only one guy on the team accused of rape right? don't judge them all on the actions of one stupid asshole.
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@14, none of the Sounders has raped anyone. You must be thinking of something else.
@13, basketball players don't wear shorts, they wear -- what are those, anyways? Manpris? Gauchos? Whatever they are, they're below the knee, and baggier than the dress my great-great-grandma was buried in.
@13, basketball players don't wear shorts, they wear -- what are those, anyways? Manpris? Gauchos? Whatever they are, they're below the knee, and baggier than the dress my great-great-grandma was buried in.
17
To say one is a "real" sport and another is not is about as stupid as saying "real" men do not eat quiche. There are probably soccer fans in Europe who think American football is for wusses. It is all relative. For me watching football is like watching paint dry. One game looks pretty much like the other. A station could probably show a game from a few years ago and only real dedicated fans would notice that it was an old game.
18
@3 sports are competitive, so naturally people tend to pit different sports against one another. like when i say that basketball and baseball aren't 'real' sports, i don't necessarily believe that, it's just fun to vent a little competitive drive in a harmless arena. admiring different sports for different reasons is all well and good, but some sports are just plain better than others, and i for one like to point that out...
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@13 You must have missed the Slog posts about the champion college wrestler who appeared alone on a gay porn site and got kicked off the Nebraska team. He ended up at a new school this year and took second place at the NCAA championships.
Again, the operative factor: Sports generally appear on Slog only when there's a hot twink involved. (Not a complaint, BTW.)
Again, the operative factor: Sports generally appear on Slog only when there's a hot twink involved. (Not a complaint, BTW.)
20
@17: "There are probably soccer fans in Europe who think American football is for wusses." Absolutely they are. It's the dominant impression. Can't step on the field without all that armor, can't run more than a couple of yards without stopping for ten minutes.
Slog has also featured multiple baseball and football posts. It's the soccer that threatens the paradigm, though.
Slog has also featured multiple baseball and football posts. It's the soccer that threatens the paradigm, though.
21
More soccer posts please! As for the other sports -- get us a team or two that's actually worth following and I'll get interested. However, watching the overpaid local team lose every single game in a season tends to get a bit tiresome, y'know, over the years.
22
I see two good points made in this comment thread:
1. Soccer players do tend to really ham up their "injuries" on the field. I grew up watching grown men writhe on the ground after barely being touched in the World Cup. For some folks, esp. football fans, that can be a turn-off. I like watching soccer, but it still bothers me.
2. Pretty much every sports post not written by Jonah or Chicago Fan is about how attractive athletes look without shirts. Soccer in and of itself is not gay, but The Stranger is very, very gay.
Personally, I'm just happy to have a new pro team in town.
1. Soccer players do tend to really ham up their "injuries" on the field. I grew up watching grown men writhe on the ground after barely being touched in the World Cup. For some folks, esp. football fans, that can be a turn-off. I like watching soccer, but it still bothers me.
2. Pretty much every sports post not written by Jonah or Chicago Fan is about how attractive athletes look without shirts. Soccer in and of itself is not gay, but The Stranger is very, very gay.
Personally, I'm just happy to have a new pro team in town.
23
@4: I think you've got it right on the stats thing. I've often found Americans get confused by how much goes on that can't be quantified. You can't boil down what the best players do into numbers, although God knows that they're trying, these days (just get a group of Arsenal fans to try and discuss Denilson). There's a lot more variables.
24
@21 the seahawks have actually been pretty good this decade, other than last season of course. they did make it to the superbowl after all. the mariners and sonics on the other hand...
@17 i think most europeans and maybe everyone else in the world think american football is for wusses. it's the padding thing and the constant stoppage. they're wrong of course, the nature of the sport demands padding, but still, ask anyone who plays rugby and they'll gladly mock american football players.
@17 i think most europeans and maybe everyone else in the world think american football is for wusses. it's the padding thing and the constant stoppage. they're wrong of course, the nature of the sport demands padding, but still, ask anyone who plays rugby and they'll gladly mock american football players.
25
@22: I've seen it just as bad in basketball. But even lifelong, born-into-it soccer fans complain about the playacting. Especially English ones, who see it as an affront to their sensibilities.
26
the players can be big babies, they get tripped, fall down, and then roll around for a few minutes and appeal to the ref. it gets a little embarrassing (4)
Sorry for going off on a tangent, but this criticism makes my fucking blood boil. If doulas wants to sprint as fast as he can & let me kick him in the ankle with spikes, I would be happy to help him understand that it is not a pussy move to actually feel pain. If anything, it is impressive that they get up & resume sprinting after such a collision.
Also, LMAO @ fnarf's comments on basketball shorts.
Finally, I am sofa king jealous of Seattle having an MLS team I can't stand it!
Sorry for going off on a tangent, but this criticism makes my fucking blood boil. If doulas wants to sprint as fast as he can & let me kick him in the ankle with spikes, I would be happy to help him understand that it is not a pussy move to actually feel pain. If anything, it is impressive that they get up & resume sprinting after such a collision.
Also, LMAO @ fnarf's comments on basketball shorts.
Finally, I am sofa king jealous of Seattle having an MLS team I can't stand it!
28
@20 - And of course the irony in the Europeans making such statements lies in the fact that the vast majority soccer players couldn't take 65% of the hits laid out on the American Football Field. There's a reason they wear the armor: people would literally die playing football at the speed it's played today without it. That small fact has never, nor will it ever exist in the cross-country match with a ball that is soccer.
31
@26 hey mike, i've played rugby for years, part of my face is made out of metal, the woes of sprinting and having your nimble little ankles kicked is pretty fucking low grade if you ask me. that being said, i understand that there is very little stoppage time in soccer and as a result exhaustion causes players to be slow to get up sometimes, but you cannot tell me that players don't mug for the refs, you would be lying your ass off. there isn't a ton of stoppage time in rugby either, but players don't act like they just got hit with a bat when they get nudged.
@27 would you say the same thing about the preforming arts, like say, dance or theater? i have a feeling your world view is much shallower than you realize...
@27 would you say the same thing about the preforming arts, like say, dance or theater? i have a feeling your world view is much shallower than you realize...
32
It's the M's home opener today, but I guess that doesn't warrant any posts (or even any comments).
Oh, but silly me! There were a half-dozen Slog posts last summer involving how pretty the weather was from the Safeco bleachers. I guess I'm just imagining all the soccer bandwagon-hopping.
Oh, but silly me! There were a half-dozen Slog posts last summer involving how pretty the weather was from the Safeco bleachers. I guess I'm just imagining all the soccer bandwagon-hopping.
33
@25 The rise in flopping in basketball is DIRECTLY related to the influx of european/south american players into the NBA (ie Soccer cultures).
Manu Ginobili is the current champion of this activity (Vlade Divac before him). It is an affront to our sensibilities...meritocracy.
Basketball and soccer are the "games for the world" because it's cheap to play. Little equipment needed and it requires a constant combination of speed, agility, stamina, strategy, and coordination that most other sports don't demand.
I find that most soccer fanatics don't know shit about basketball nor can they play it very well. Soccer in the USA has historically attracted non-sports fans and to this day remains a secondary sport (it's climbing up).
Manu Ginobili is the current champion of this activity (Vlade Divac before him). It is an affront to our sensibilities...meritocracy.
Basketball and soccer are the "games for the world" because it's cheap to play. Little equipment needed and it requires a constant combination of speed, agility, stamina, strategy, and coordination that most other sports don't demand.
I find that most soccer fanatics don't know shit about basketball nor can they play it very well. Soccer in the USA has historically attracted non-sports fans and to this day remains a secondary sport (it's climbing up).
34
@26 No, no, no. I've literally seen someone not even be physically touched, then collapse and scream and spasm around until the little ambulance cart carried him off the field. It was so obvious that the guy was trying to goad the ref into handing out a card that it was comical.
Yes, there are real, serious injuries incurred while playing soccer - injuries that would rival Joe Theismann's. But there is a lot of playacting in soccer.
And Abby @25 is right, it happens a lot in basketball too. No matter which sport, that's just horrible sportmanship.
Yes, there are real, serious injuries incurred while playing soccer - injuries that would rival Joe Theismann's. But there is a lot of playacting in soccer.
And Abby @25 is right, it happens a lot in basketball too. No matter which sport, that's just horrible sportmanship.
35
@34 agreed, but i want to make clear that i'm not criticizing the sport of soccer for such poor sportsmanship, i think soccer is great, it's just an unfortunate loophole that some players exploit. i would say basketball is even worse considering how pathetically easy it is to foul someone.
36
I didn't say players never embellish (helloooo Cristiano Ronaldo!). I'm just bitchin about the perception that they are pussies because they get hurt when someone spikes them in the foot while running @ full speed. The perception is that they are bullshitting every time.
Ironically, I hear this mostly from American football fans, who couldn't run the width of the pitch without collapsing from a heart attack.
Ironically, I hear this mostly from American football fans, who couldn't run the width of the pitch without collapsing from a heart attack.
37
Rugby is the gayest sport. They stick their fingers up each other's asses.
Diving in soccer is no big deal. The refs aren't stupid. There are more fouls handed out for diving as their are for phantom hits. And, if done properly, it's a strategic advantage. Freddie Ljungberg goes down like a champion. And oftentimes, they're not looking for a call, they're just looking for a minute's breather.
Hernandez, I have no doubt you've seen many dives, but they don't bring the stretcher out except for real injuries. Not usually Theisman-type broken legs; soccer snaps groins and hamstrings. That can happen even if no one touched you.
Besides, one needs to keep in mind that soccer is as much about hating the other team as it is loving your own, and nothing gives a fan more pleasure than screaming at the pathetic Oscar-winners writhing around on the grass in the wrong jerseys. Someone like Cristiano Ronaldo is so much easier to hate -- and laugh at -- when he does one of his little step-overs and flops down.
Diving in soccer is no big deal. The refs aren't stupid. There are more fouls handed out for diving as their are for phantom hits. And, if done properly, it's a strategic advantage. Freddie Ljungberg goes down like a champion. And oftentimes, they're not looking for a call, they're just looking for a minute's breather.
Hernandez, I have no doubt you've seen many dives, but they don't bring the stretcher out except for real injuries. Not usually Theisman-type broken legs; soccer snaps groins and hamstrings. That can happen even if no one touched you.
Besides, one needs to keep in mind that soccer is as much about hating the other team as it is loving your own, and nothing gives a fan more pleasure than screaming at the pathetic Oscar-winners writhing around on the grass in the wrong jerseys. Someone like Cristiano Ronaldo is so much easier to hate -- and laugh at -- when he does one of his little step-overs and flops down.
38
Far more irritating than diving: players raising their hands when an opponent is offsides, or otherwise flagging or appealing to the ref. Worst of all: crowding around the ref arguing for a call.
39
@37 fnarf, are you suggesting that the homoerotic overtones in rugby is a bad thing? calling a sport gay doesn't dismantle the sport anymore. every sport in which men rub on each other has some gay in it, which is just about every sport. sports can be gay AND awesome now...
also, diving is done by a minority of players, but it still happens more in soccer than a lot of other sports. it's not the need for a breather that gets me, it's the theatrics that make me want to get all hooligan...
also, diving is done by a minority of players, but it still happens more in soccer than a lot of other sports. it's not the need for a breather that gets me, it's the theatrics that make me want to get all hooligan...
40
What the fuck is up with this "old fogies don't like soccer" shit? Hell, when I was growing up in the suburbs of Portland in the MID 1960's we had organized Pee-Wee and Youth League soccer, along with football and T-ball/baseball.
Soccer/football is a sport that I think a lot of marginal sports fans dislike, because it's "European" and therefore has a perception of being somehow effete. But, what other sport can one name where the players are actual ON THE MOVE (with occasional lulls for the backfielders) for the entirety of a 90 minute game/match? No time outs, no commercial breaks, no sitting on the bench, and no substitutions, except in the event of serious injury. That's why teh ladies (and yes, some of the guys too) go ga-ga over soccer players, 'cause these boys are FIT - and not in some Americanized Super-sized steroided-the-hell-out-of fashion.
And of course, many American sports fans simply cannot admit that soccer is THE #1 sport in terms of world-wide viewing audience & attendance. Those people, with their "we ALWAYS have to be #1!" attitude, have to compensate for their own favorite sports relative inferiority by getting all hyper-aggressive about their dislike of the one sport that puts all the rest of theirs to shame.
Although, to be honest, I wish soccer players didn't look quite so much like NASCAR drivers in skivvies, what with all the corporate logos plastered on their uni's. OTOH, it keeps ticket prices reasonable.
Soccer/football is a sport that I think a lot of marginal sports fans dislike, because it's "European" and therefore has a perception of being somehow effete. But, what other sport can one name where the players are actual ON THE MOVE (with occasional lulls for the backfielders) for the entirety of a 90 minute game/match? No time outs, no commercial breaks, no sitting on the bench, and no substitutions, except in the event of serious injury. That's why teh ladies (and yes, some of the guys too) go ga-ga over soccer players, 'cause these boys are FIT - and not in some Americanized Super-sized steroided-the-hell-out-of fashion.
And of course, many American sports fans simply cannot admit that soccer is THE #1 sport in terms of world-wide viewing audience & attendance. Those people, with their "we ALWAYS have to be #1!" attitude, have to compensate for their own favorite sports relative inferiority by getting all hyper-aggressive about their dislike of the one sport that puts all the rest of theirs to shame.
Although, to be honest, I wish soccer players didn't look quite so much like NASCAR drivers in skivvies, what with all the corporate logos plastered on their uni's. OTOH, it keeps ticket prices reasonable.
41
@37 Bringing it back to the gay, on hating the other guy, I once got to see a match at Maracana Stadium in Rio de Janeiro, the final of a tournament between the cities of Sao Paulo and Rio, SP v. Botafogo. A Paulista went down on a phantom foul and the stadium erupted into a two-word chant. I asked my friend what the fans were chanting, and he told me it was the player's name and "viralho" (I think)--the Portuguese for "faggot."
42
"And of course, many American sports fans simply cannot admit that soccer is THE #1 sport in terms of world-wide viewing audience & attendance."
Of course we can admit it - those are the facts. But just as with music sales, this doesn't prove the quality of the product, or lack thereof. Soccer is the world's most popular sport because the vast majority of the world is dirt-poor, and soccer is the easiest sport for dirt-poor people to play thanks to its minimal equipment requirements - it has nothing to do with any inherent advantage in entertainment value.
Of course we can admit it - those are the facts. But just as with music sales, this doesn't prove the quality of the product, or lack thereof. Soccer is the world's most popular sport because the vast majority of the world is dirt-poor, and soccer is the easiest sport for dirt-poor people to play thanks to its minimal equipment requirements - it has nothing to do with any inherent advantage in entertainment value.
44
Here is what's wrong with soccer....
the player is brushed on the shoulder by a 60-year-old man, the player naturally made it look like he'd been shot in the kneecaps.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PjdM5KIl1…
the player is brushed on the shoulder by a 60-year-old man, the player naturally made it look like he'd been shot in the kneecaps.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PjdM5KIl1…
45
@42, oh my god, that's a tired trope. Most of the world can afford sporting equipment, thank you very much -- priced cricket bats lately? -- and if you think soccer gear is cheap you haven't been to a shop in a while. You can spend $250 on a pair of boots if you want to.
Rugby, for instance, doesn't cost any more for gear -- all you need is a ball. And while rugby is played all over the world, it lags far behind association football in popularity. Basketball ditto; even in the poorest countries someone can put up a hoop.
You may have your mind full of kids in the favelas of Rio kicking a soccer ball barefoot, but most people in the world who play soccer -- 240 million of them PLAY -- can afford shoes.
Rugby, for instance, doesn't cost any more for gear -- all you need is a ball. And while rugby is played all over the world, it lags far behind association football in popularity. Basketball ditto; even in the poorest countries someone can put up a hoop.
You may have your mind full of kids in the favelas of Rio kicking a soccer ball barefoot, but most people in the world who play soccer -- 240 million of them PLAY -- can afford shoes.
47
#45 - just because you CAN spend a lot of money on something doesn't mean you MUST in order for it to be serviceable (see bikes, or pretty much anything else.)
48
American football is gayer than rugby, and rape-themed to boot. Go deep into the end zone? Find the hole? Penetrate? "Backs" and "ends" as positions?
49
@39, I didn't say it was a bad thing. Just a fact: rugby players stick their fingers up each others asses in the scrum. That's some overtone:
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=0b6_12080…
The real reason a lot of American sports fans don't like soccer is because they are insular. American sports until recently were hardly played anywhere else. American Exceptionalism and all that. Soccer, not being invented in America, is considered alien and even imposed by foreigners. Every other country in the world is used to accepting and acknowledging outside influences.
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=0b6_12080…
The real reason a lot of American sports fans don't like soccer is because they are insular. American sports until recently were hardly played anywhere else. American Exceptionalism and all that. Soccer, not being invented in America, is considered alien and even imposed by foreigners. Every other country in the world is used to accepting and acknowledging outside influences.
50
@47, how much does your average West 4th Street basketballer spend on gear, do you think? Sorry, the "cheap equipment" argument doesn't hold up. Otherwise, running would be the most popular sport.
52
@49 so the gayness of a sport can be measured as fact now? thanks for letting everyone know.
the instances of anal finger rape in rugby are about a million times fewer than the instances of players faking injuries in soccer. also players caught jamming their fingers up the ass of another player are usually banned from the sport, since it's, ya know, against the rules and all.
the instances of anal finger rape in rugby are about a million times fewer than the instances of players faking injuries in soccer. also players caught jamming their fingers up the ass of another player are usually banned from the sport, since it's, ya know, against the rules and all.
53
Being a sports fan my whole life, I've gotten used to guys saying the other guy's favorite sport is "gayer" than his. But still, how stupid. Not even homophobic, just stupid. (Men: can't live with 'em, can't live without 'em.)
Even saying your favorite sport is "better" than the other guy's is pretty dumb, too. As someone said earlier in the thread, they're just different, and each sport has its own remarkable aspects (you really see this during the Olympics). American Football is remarkable for the intensity of the impacts, soccer for the amount of running those guys do in the course of a 90+ minute match. I've lost pretty much all interest in baseball (blame the strike in '94 and all the steroid scandals more recently), but I still think infielders turning a double play is an amazing feat that I love to watch on highlight reels. It's all good, even if I may have little to no interest in a particular sport. I just wish other sports fans would adopt this attitutde.
It's unfortunate that, once again, we have the word "gay" used as a general perjorative. That's gonna be a tough nut to crack, as you see young people who seem to be generally more accepting of their GLBT peers than the previous generation still saying "That's so gay." Oh well, whatcha gonna do?
I vote for more sports coverage in The Stranger, and I vote for Christopher writing more sports posts in SLOG. That was a very well-told story about Dragavon.
I can understand those who are indifferent to sports in general, but to be hostile to it? C'mon, stop seeing sports as part of this supposedly oppressive paternalistic force in the world. It's just sports.
Even saying your favorite sport is "better" than the other guy's is pretty dumb, too. As someone said earlier in the thread, they're just different, and each sport has its own remarkable aspects (you really see this during the Olympics). American Football is remarkable for the intensity of the impacts, soccer for the amount of running those guys do in the course of a 90+ minute match. I've lost pretty much all interest in baseball (blame the strike in '94 and all the steroid scandals more recently), but I still think infielders turning a double play is an amazing feat that I love to watch on highlight reels. It's all good, even if I may have little to no interest in a particular sport. I just wish other sports fans would adopt this attitutde.
It's unfortunate that, once again, we have the word "gay" used as a general perjorative. That's gonna be a tough nut to crack, as you see young people who seem to be generally more accepting of their GLBT peers than the previous generation still saying "That's so gay." Oh well, whatcha gonna do?
I vote for more sports coverage in The Stranger, and I vote for Christopher writing more sports posts in SLOG. That was a very well-told story about Dragavon.
I can understand those who are indifferent to sports in general, but to be hostile to it? C'mon, stop seeing sports as part of this supposedly oppressive paternalistic force in the world. It's just sports.
56
@46: it stands worse than C. Ronaldo when he's been brushed and you know it. Germany, for example, doesn't love soccer because Germany is a poor country and they have no other sources of entertainment, they love soccer because they love soccer. I'm not sure how you don't comprehend the idea of other cultures liking things that are different.
57
Hockey's Canadian, but it's still a more exciting sport to watch. Not buying the argument that soccer's inherent "foreign-ness" is what turns people off.
(The foreign mannerisms affected by some fans, on the other hand, is just downright annoying.)
(The foreign mannerisms affected by some fans, on the other hand, is just downright annoying.)
58
gay sshhhmay way to play I say... what's the point?
slog on chris and keep up the good foot,
No, here's the point... if you don't listen to The Decemberist's and keep up with D.J. Fucking In The Streets... maybe you got a hankerin' for some verbal spankerin'.
Hey, it's not mean... just trying to BEEEEEEE FUNNNNNNEEEEE!!!!!!!
slog on chris and keep up the good foot,
No, here's the point... if you don't listen to The Decemberist's and keep up with D.J. Fucking In The Streets... maybe you got a hankerin' for some verbal spankerin'.
Hey, it's not mean... just trying to BEEEEEEE FUNNNNNNEEEEE!!!!!!!
59
@57: ever checked the US viewing figures for hockey? I think its inherent 'foreign-ness' turns off Americans, it's just that Canada's a little less foreign so it's a little less odd than soccer. But only a little.
61
@53 i agree with you on the whole 'such and such sport is gay' thing. mainly because that position is still mostly steeped in an archaic notion that gay=weak. it's interesting to see more gay people involved in sports, turning that bit on nonsense on it's head. but i think it's perfectly legit to claim one sport better than another. i see it as simply an extension of the inherent good natured competitiveness that sports embody. understanding the athleticism involved doesn't change anything for me. i mean, i appreciate the skill involved in basketball from an objective standpoint, but i still think it's kind of a lame duck sport.
62
Soccer is not gay.
But Seattle Football (aka soccer) is ok with whoever you are - just wear green and blue and ROAR!
But Seattle Football (aka soccer) is ok with whoever you are - just wear green and blue and ROAR!
63
@ 61 - I can understand where the "my favorite sport is better than the other guy's" sentiment comes from, but I still don't think it's valid to make the comparison. It's all so wrapped up in cultural bias that it's impossible to make an objective statement of one sport being "better" than another.
It even happens within the US. If you live in Indiana, you'd better damn well say that basketball is #1!
It even happens within the US. If you live in Indiana, you'd better damn well say that basketball is #1!
64
@59, hockey is foreign to some parts of the country but not others. It's a religion in places that freeze, like Boston and Minnesota. But, oddly, all the teams seem to be in the South now. I don't think there's any other sport with such a low percentage of natives of the country they're playing in; most of the Florida Panthers are Canadian.
Ultimately, of course, soccer, hockey, basketball, water polo, and lacrosse are all versions of the same game.
Ultimately, of course, soccer, hockey, basketball, water polo, and lacrosse are all versions of the same game.
65
running the most popular sport? we aren't arguing which is the most gay sport anymore? cause running shorts might just be shorter than soccer shorts, which, if i recall correctly, was one of the primary requirements (in addition to digital penetration of the anus) in order to be considered the gayest of sports.
but i don't know who to root for. usually i like the underdog, so i'm glad the "alternative" paper is covering soccer as well as the other local sports teams. but soccer/football certainly isn't the underdog sport in the world.... so it's like being glad the most popular kid in school is now liked by the knowledge bowl team.
but i don't know who to root for. usually i like the underdog, so i'm glad the "alternative" paper is covering soccer as well as the other local sports teams. but soccer/football certainly isn't the underdog sport in the world.... so it's like being glad the most popular kid in school is now liked by the knowledge bowl team.
66
@ 59, no, hockey's problem is that kids can only play it in their back yards in the Northeast, Great Lakes, and northern Great Plains regions. Anywhere else and you have to go to the ice rink.
67
@66: do people still like the Avalanche in Denver? I haven't lived there for many years, but I know my brother is still fanatically devoted to them.
68
@63 once again, i disagree. i'm from spokane and currently live in new york and rugby is my favorite sport. there isn't really any rugby culture dominating the places i'm from or i've been to, it's not cultural bias, i just think rugby is an inherently well designed sport. while, personally, i think that basketball is fundamentally flawed, ie, the game naturally caters to the freakishly tall. soccer, too, is a beautifully conceived sport. which is one of the main reasons it's so universally popular. it's this standard that i mostly judge by, well, that and my gut reaction/excitement, which might be influenced by my culture and such.
69
@37- I've seen teams work the stretcher (Jamaica v. USA, the Reggae Boy were hamming it up like mad trying to slow the game down). Like all soccer fans I'm annoyed by the play acting, and I think sometimes players default to diving when they'd be better served by keeping the momentum going. And it completely lacks dignity.
70
@ 67, yes they do, although the terrible season took its toll on attendance. Denver's never going to be Hockeytown but the sport itself and not just the Avs is well supported.
71
@ 70 - I remember wehen they won the Stanley Cup in '97. That town went NUTS!! It was Denver's 1st championship, before the Broncos won their first Super Bowl, and everyone was pretty jazzed about it.
72
@71: yeah, that was pretty soon after we as a family moved to Denver. I think that era clinched my brother's fandom, he was a pretty young kid and it just grabbed him.
73
@ 71, 72, I'll always remember that celebration for one other reason - When I walked to work the following morning I saw a tacky puddle of blood, maybe two feet in diameter, on the sidewalk. I looked in the news for reports, but found only a mention of two people going to the hospital without any further detail. But yeah, the whole city fell in love with 'em then.
77
Wow, I’m honored that two of my posts, one that was pretty much a joke, have started a thread with over 70 comments. How many comments does the “currently hanging” section get on a weekly basis?
My first post was a joke at best and trolling at worst. Why would anyone think I was pissed? I didn’t use caps or exclamation points and when Christopher responded my second post was simply clearing things up, I enjoy slog and had noticed an increase in posts about sports and it seemed like they got a fair amount of comments. Soccer is fine, it’s just the fans that are annoying. It isn’t that popular, they play in a stadium and they close seats off because they can’t sell the tickets, they haven’t had one sell out yet, so please stop saying that. The Sonics, who were about to leave and were awful, played the Suns last year and Key Arena was sold out. All seats were filled.
As for gayness, that’s just getting under the skin of people. You can bust the balls of anyone on slog, except gay people. That’s homophobic and never funny. All sports are gay. In one of my posts I mentioned golf, is that even a sport? It’s not really gay but it’s like most Sounders fans, snobby, rich, white people. I mentioned basketball, Dwight Howard is one of the 5 best players in the NBA. He orders his jersey a few sizes smaller then it should be so he can show of how fit he is. He plays center so he has sweaty dudes grinding on him 40 minutes a night, pretty gay. Baseball is all ass slapping and sack adjusting, pretty gay. Google gay football images and have a good laugh, unless that’s homophobic. And after every game in all sports they shower together! All sports are homoerotic and every professional sports team has a gay athlete in the locker room. Soccer just happens to have the most.
More...
My first post was a joke at best and trolling at worst. Why would anyone think I was pissed? I didn’t use caps or exclamation points and when Christopher responded my second post was simply clearing things up, I enjoy slog and had noticed an increase in posts about sports and it seemed like they got a fair amount of comments. Soccer is fine, it’s just the fans that are annoying. It isn’t that popular, they play in a stadium and they close seats off because they can’t sell the tickets, they haven’t had one sell out yet, so please stop saying that. The Sonics, who were about to leave and were awful, played the Suns last year and Key Arena was sold out. All seats were filled.
As for gayness, that’s just getting under the skin of people. You can bust the balls of anyone on slog, except gay people. That’s homophobic and never funny. All sports are gay. In one of my posts I mentioned golf, is that even a sport? It’s not really gay but it’s like most Sounders fans, snobby, rich, white people. I mentioned basketball, Dwight Howard is one of the 5 best players in the NBA. He orders his jersey a few sizes smaller then it should be so he can show of how fit he is. He plays center so he has sweaty dudes grinding on him 40 minutes a night, pretty gay. Baseball is all ass slapping and sack adjusting, pretty gay. Google gay football images and have a good laugh, unless that’s homophobic. And after every game in all sports they shower together! All sports are homoerotic and every professional sports team has a gay athlete in the locker room. Soccer just happens to have the most.
78
All professional sports have become niche marketing. It's no longer about the collective experience. I grew up watching all major sports, including pro soccer (Go LA Aztec's!). Now I probably don't know half the teams names because I just don't care about the teams anymore. Why, because the teams don't care about me. I find soccer in Seattle to be a very refreshing experience that harkens a forgone time. The Sounders games are fun AND they are winning (so far).
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