Monday, April 13, 2009
Books Re: Amazon Stripping Rank Data from Books for "Adult" Reasons, Customers and Authors Accuse Store of Anti-Gay Bias
Posted by Paul Constant on Mon, Apr 13, 2009 at 11:00 AM
If you haven't read Sam Machkovech's original post on Sunday about Amazon pulling gay- and lesbian-themed books from sales rankings and other lists on the site, you really should take the time to read it. And, of course, there's Dan's response (via Anthony Hecht) and the unintentionally hilarious Amazon customer service e-mail here.
It's been covered pretty well by these previous posters—I'll keep you posted on updates, of course—but I did want to say that this is a fucking great reason why you should shop at local booksellers even though Amazon discounts books like crazy.
Could you imagine Elliott Bay Book Company requiring you to have to go to some dark, locked room in the back of the store to browse the gay books so that they don't contaminate the children? Or Bailey/Coy not using any gay/lesbian themed books in their window displays because they might offend somebody? Or University Book Store not allowing its booksellers to put gay-themed books on their recommended titles walls?
I'm sure Amazon will blame the whole thing on some sort of computer burp, but this is why it's frightening to have one major online bookseller for the entire country: If Amazon suddenly decides that a book they don't like doesn't exist, that book comes very close to disappearing from the face of the earth. When you put this much power into one retailer's hands, bad shit will always happen.
Share via
1
The "glitch" isn't all fixed yet. Go to amazon.com, type "christian " (no quotes) into the search blank, but don't hit enter, wait for the search suggestions. Now try the same thing with "gay ". Amazon will happily suggest you might want to search for "christian marriage", but it won't suggest "gay marriage", or anything else "gay".
2
Mike Daisey posted what sounded like a very reasonable sort of explanation for the whole thing in an earlier post.
My guess is that this will turn out to be a tempest in a teapot.
My guess is that this will turn out to be a tempest in a teapot.
3
No, the gay and adult books should be prominently displayed. The comic books should be in a dark back room so you nerds will feel at home.
6
hacker: http://gawker.com/5210142/why-it-makes-s…
Do we really think Bezos - not precisely Christian or right-wing - would suddenly want to alienate a huge portion of Amazon's customer base? (As you can note in the piece, they've removed the "flag as inappropriate" option that allowed for this "glitch"/hack)
Do we really think Bezos - not precisely Christian or right-wing - would suddenly want to alienate a huge portion of Amazon's customer base? (As you can note in the piece, they've removed the "flag as inappropriate" option that allowed for this "glitch"/hack)
7
I'll be going down to Elliott Bay on my lunch hour to buy some books! I'm on the hunt for material about photographic technique, a new before-bed trashy page-turner and I almost always spot something I didn't know I wanted. To honor Amazon's crass move and blundered back-pedal I'll also select and purchase at least on LGBT book. Please join me!
9
So in less than 24 hours we go from
AMAZON IS A BUNCH OF HOMOPHOBIC ASSHOLES!!!
to...
SUPPORT YOUR LOCAL BOOKSTORES!!!
Well played, Stranger. Well played.
Internet rage is such an amorphous ephemeral thing.
I'm still not jumping to conclusions.
I'll leave that to the journalists.
AMAZON IS A BUNCH OF HOMOPHOBIC ASSHOLES!!!
to...
SUPPORT YOUR LOCAL BOOKSTORES!!!
Well played, Stranger. Well played.
Internet rage is such an amorphous ephemeral thing.
I'm still not jumping to conclusions.
I'll leave that to the journalists.
10
Amazon is actually a very progressive company corporate-culture-wise, and management and staff are totally LGBT-friendly. I think some kind of "troll" theory from #5's post best explains this, since Amazon's technology is way more automated than people realize and it can therefore be taken advantage of and leveraged. This is why, for instance, anonymous reviews were done away with, because trolls could change the star-ranking of a book by posting endless anonymous negative (or positive) reviews.
All this is no excuse, of course, because the company needs to have enough handle on its automated processes to prevent disasters like this, and obviously Amazon does NOT have enough handle on things.
Also, the customer relations people seem to be snoozing and drooling at the wheel. Here is the response to my complaint e-mail--I mean, this is all they could muster with a whole weekend to think about what's going on?
>Hello,
>
>Thanks for contacting us. We recently discovered a
>glitch in our systems and it's being fixed.
>
>Thanks again for contacting us. We hope to see you
>again soon.
>
>Please let us know if this e-mail resolved your question:
>
>Best regards,
>
>Rajeshkumar P R
>Amazon.com
>We're Building Earth's Most Customer-Centric Company >http://www.amazon.com/your-account
The "Most Customer-Centric" tag here at the end is funny/sad, isn't it...
All this is no excuse, of course, because the company needs to have enough handle on its automated processes to prevent disasters like this, and obviously Amazon does NOT have enough handle on things.
Also, the customer relations people seem to be snoozing and drooling at the wheel. Here is the response to my complaint e-mail--I mean, this is all they could muster with a whole weekend to think about what's going on?
>Hello,
>
>Thanks for contacting us. We recently discovered a
>glitch in our systems and it's being fixed.
>
>Thanks again for contacting us. We hope to see you
>again soon.
>
>Please let us know if this e-mail resolved your question:
>
>Best regards,
>
>Rajeshkumar P R
>Amazon.com
>We're Building Earth's Most Customer-Centric Company >http://www.amazon.com/your-account
The "Most Customer-Centric" tag here at the end is funny/sad, isn't it...
11
Ah, I just noticed Anthony Hecht posted that e-mail already earlier this morning. Sorry for posting it again!
12
Paul, it's not really that simple. We're in a city, and known for our book-reading - we can support several bookstores, and I'll be really ashamed of us if we let Elliott Bay or Bailey Coy or the U.Bookstore go under because of this recession. But a lot of towns can't support a decent bookstore, and places like Amazon give people in those towns access to books that they wouldn't have otherwise. I support local businesses, will go out of my way to do so, even if things are more expensive, but companies like Amazon have their place, too. It's a balance, I think.
Plus, the Internet is a great networking system, and this situation gave us a demonstration of that. If other companies are considering enacting policies like what we thought Amazon just did, the amount of outcry might make them think twice.
Plus, the Internet is a great networking system, and this situation gave us a demonstration of that. If other companies are considering enacting policies like what we thought Amazon just did, the amount of outcry might make them think twice.
13
You know, if we flagged as inappropriate any book that contained war, sex, genocide, intolerance, hatred, murder, racism or anti-semitism, the bible and any book that quotes the bible at length would have been banned long ago.
14
So, um, dumb question - but why aren't you getting your books from gay-friendly independent bookstores and video stores instead?
Well?
Well?
18
Sigh. No it fucking wasn't.
After hearing from people on the inside at Amazon, I am convinced it was in fact, a "glitch."
Well, more like user error--some idiot editing code for one of the many international versions of Amazon mixed up the difference between "adult" and "erotic" and "sexuality". All the sites are tied together, so editing one affected all for blacklisting, and ta-da, you get this situation.
The CS rep who responded that this was Amazon policy was just confused about what they were talking about, and gave standard boilerplate about porn.
The dumbest part is saying it was a "glitch". A "glitch"? Just say that it was one of your workers making an editing error. Really dumb PR move, that one.
Let me know if you actually want more details on how it went down, but it's pretty boring and technical.
md
After hearing from people on the inside at Amazon, I am convinced it was in fact, a "glitch."
Well, more like user error--some idiot editing code for one of the many international versions of Amazon mixed up the difference between "adult" and "erotic" and "sexuality". All the sites are tied together, so editing one affected all for blacklisting, and ta-da, you get this situation.
The CS rep who responded that this was Amazon policy was just confused about what they were talking about, and gave standard boilerplate about porn.
The dumbest part is saying it was a "glitch". A "glitch"? Just say that it was one of your workers making an editing error. Really dumb PR move, that one.
Let me know if you actually want more details on how it went down, but it's pretty boring and technical.
md
19
My GOD -- this story is so overblown and tedious it makes me long for the days of that kid who blackmailed all the jocks into blowing him....
21
Never attribute to malice what can better be explained by stupidity.
Nothing in Amazon's history, or its internal practices, suggests it would intentionally enact such a policy. I'm positive we'll find out someone screwed up. The haters here are truly going overboard.
That said, the "glitch" response is remarkably weak.
Nothing in Amazon's history, or its internal practices, suggests it would intentionally enact such a policy. I'm positive we'll find out someone screwed up. The haters here are truly going overboard.
That said, the "glitch" response is remarkably weak.
22
I like the fact that people would think that Amazon did this on purpose. Amazon has a huge GLBT community. HUGE! This was not on purpose whatsoever. A glitch is more understandable than Amazon going after the GLBT. The GLBT board at Amazon is trying to get answers from PR to get a better understanding of what happened. Once that is completed, Amazon will more than likely release a proper statement.
Also, Ackham (9) was right. How is it that these are the times we hear about "supporting local business"?
"Now, let's just put ourselves in Amazon's shoes. Keep in mind that Amazon is a smug, fairly liberal company headquartered in fucking Seattle of all places and, last I checked, Jeff Bezos is not exactly a Christian fundamentalist.
Why on earth would they suddenly censor only a specific group of content that deals with a marginalized and politically active community? Why would this policy change not take the form of a specific policy, but rather of very discriminatory flagging only certain titles as "adult" content? Why would this happen over a weekend?"
Also, Ackham (9) was right. How is it that these are the times we hear about "supporting local business"?
"Now, let's just put ourselves in Amazon's shoes. Keep in mind that Amazon is a smug, fairly liberal company headquartered in fucking Seattle of all places and, last I checked, Jeff Bezos is not exactly a Christian fundamentalist.
Why on earth would they suddenly censor only a specific group of content that deals with a marginalized and politically active community? Why would this policy change not take the form of a specific policy, but rather of very discriminatory flagging only certain titles as "adult" content? Why would this happen over a weekend?"
23
It's not just the gay, it's also a war on feminism (in print), progressive values, and reproductive freedom:
"So far, Jessica Valenti’s seen a couple of books get deranked (you can’t even pull up Full Frontal Feminism on a search for exactly that term), and Heather Corinna’s inclusive approach to adolescent sexuality has been deranked, while more homophobic titles on the same subject are up. Trish Wilson has also been a casualty of the censorship. Anti-rape book Yes Means Yes is gone, and there’s even a book about preventing teen suicide that’s been de-listed. Here’s a list of the books. Playboy centerfolds and Girls Gone Wild are safe, even if depressed teens are less so. "
from pandagon
"So far, Jessica Valenti’s seen a couple of books get deranked (you can’t even pull up Full Frontal Feminism on a search for exactly that term), and Heather Corinna’s inclusive approach to adolescent sexuality has been deranked, while more homophobic titles on the same subject are up. Trish Wilson has also been a casualty of the censorship. Anti-rape book Yes Means Yes is gone, and there’s even a book about preventing teen suicide that’s been de-listed. Here’s a list of the books. Playboy centerfolds and Girls Gone Wild are safe, even if depressed teens are less so. "
from pandagon
24
ZOMG ZOMG!!!!!11111 Amazon hates gay people (and puppies)!!!1111
1) everyone needs to calm the fuck down, this is clearly human error - computer systems are highly complex, error prone systems; there are many ways someone could have fat-fingered / brain-typo'd the categorization of these books, thus mangling the sales rankings.
2) Please don't give me your Elliot Bay Books is more local than Amazon BS. Do you know how many Seattlites work for Amazon? (A company, moreover, who has not laid of a single employee during the economic downturn.)
3) Admittedly, Amazon has done a very poor job explaining the root cause of this error... Engineers are not necessarily the best PR representatives.
1) everyone needs to calm the fuck down, this is clearly human error - computer systems are highly complex, error prone systems; there are many ways someone could have fat-fingered / brain-typo'd the categorization of these books, thus mangling the sales rankings.
2) Please don't give me your Elliot Bay Books is more local than Amazon BS. Do you know how many Seattlites work for Amazon? (A company, moreover, who has not laid of a single employee during the economic downturn.)
3) Admittedly, Amazon has done a very poor job explaining the root cause of this error... Engineers are not necessarily the best PR representatives.
25
And, of course, by "Disappearing from the face of the earth", we mean "Readily searchable and available to anybody with the slightest interest from anywhere with an internet connection".
Hyperbole much?
Hyperbole much?
Most Commented on Slog
-
Life and Death in a Recliner in South Carolina by Dan Savage
-
Pit Bulls! by Dan Savage
-
Becoming a Man by Dan Savage
-
SL Letter of the Day: Hot & Drunk by Dan Savage
-
Your Wife Died Alone... by Dan Savage
-
Meanwhile in Vancouver by Dan Savage
-
Precious: Brutal New Classic or African-American Bruno? by David Schmader
-
WTF? by Dan Savage
-
The Democrats Have 60 Votes in the Senate for Health Care Reform by Jonathan Golob
-
Health at Every Size by Dan Savage
RSS
Facebook
Twitter
Comments (25) RSS