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News & ArtsMonday, March 30, 2009
Tech This Changes Everything (Eventually)
Posted by Paul Constant on Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 4:59 PM
Every time I write about something technological, commenters inform me that I should die because I am so completely behind the times. But this news, about Skype applications for iPhones and Blackberries, deserves the attention of even people who never pay attention to tech news. Especially the first paragraph:
The arrival of Skype on iPhone and BlackBerry will force the carriers to confront a painful reality: Telephone calls aren't special. They are just data crossing the network that happens to end up on a handset someplace. And that data shouldn't be priced differently than any other data the network carries.
There's also some talk about what Apple is trying to do to retard the process:
Apple, in its usual anti-consumer way, is limiting what Skype will be able to do on iPhones in order to protect AT&T's business. iPhone users will be able to use Skype when connected to a Wi-Fi network, but not when using AT&T's 3G or EDGE data networks.That protects AT&T's voice revenue from calls moving to Skype and the avalanche of data Skype caller might create.
I'm not much of a cell phone guy—I've got the most basic cell imaginable and pretty much only use it for texting—but the implications of this story are still pretty huge.
1
Wait until Clearwire rolls out true Wimax this year in Seattle. 4G service and wireless broadband all for the same price.
So, you're right...you pay forty a month for a 4Mbps connection for "data" but seventy dollars a month for a 40mbps channel for voice!
So, you're right...you pay forty a month for a 4Mbps connection for "data" but seventy dollars a month for a 40mbps channel for voice!
2
You can get better service in Japan with more bandwidth and more data amounts ... or practically any other country.
Wimax is just a way to force us to pay more for less.
Wimax is just a way to force us to pay more for less.
3
better service in germany as well, where t-mobile carries the iphone, not that shit company that f*cking sucks, at&t.
4
Actually Will, if you had a brain, you'd be able to understand the shit you hear from other peoples mouths that you repeat.
Clearly Wimax would be giving us, American consumers (we live in America), more data for less $.
I could go further, but what's the point? You are the stupidest motherfucker I know of who knows how to use spell-check.
Clearly Wimax would be giving us, American consumers (we live in America), more data for less $.
I could go further, but what's the point? You are the stupidest motherfucker I know of who knows how to use spell-check.
5
I presume some bored 14 year-old in Cleveland has already hacked this feature, and that several thousand people are even now using a full version of Skype on their iPhones (which themselves have probably been hacked to work around any AT&T blocks), so really Paul, it's probably all good out there.
8
The irony of texting is that is uses far less data than a call, yet somehow if you send too many your carrier gets to FLOOD you with extra charges.
Frickin' Racket.
Frickin' Racket.
9
Paul C -
You are, unfortunately, relying on a poor source on this particular topic.
Voice and data packets are treated differently across most wireless networks. They require different treatment for latency, error correction, and session persistence. VOIP apps work fairly well across robust landline techs (DSL, etc.) Wireless has an error prone and contentious path to the network. Unless hooks (think QoS) are put in to protect low bandwidth apps like Skype, those users will get screwed by the scheduler at the serving site fairly often.
My current employer supports a VOIP application on our data network, and the implementation required a huge amount of engineering to hit our internal benchmarks. The requirements are different if you want a high quality experience. If you just want cheap and flakey, go for it.
And, as usual, WiS is comically wrong, wrong, wrong.
You are, unfortunately, relying on a poor source on this particular topic.
Voice and data packets are treated differently across most wireless networks. They require different treatment for latency, error correction, and session persistence. VOIP apps work fairly well across robust landline techs (DSL, etc.) Wireless has an error prone and contentious path to the network. Unless hooks (think QoS) are put in to protect low bandwidth apps like Skype, those users will get screwed by the scheduler at the serving site fairly often.
My current employer supports a VOIP application on our data network, and the implementation required a huge amount of engineering to hit our internal benchmarks. The requirements are different if you want a high quality experience. If you just want cheap and flakey, go for it.
And, as usual, WiS is comically wrong, wrong, wrong.
10
It's not just for the Iphone. Since it uses the WiFi Connection it can be used for the Ipod Touch, which the 2nd gen Touch allows you to use the Iphone's headphone/mic. So basically, you have a phone with you as long as you can jump onto a WiFi connection.
11
bah. windows mobile (which sold 16 million to iphone's 11 million last year) has had a skype client for a couple years now, and it's not forced to use wifi.
12
Where's LL Cool J's unexpectedly timid large animal pet when Michael Douglas comes hard-leaning around the corner?
13
Will's statement about broadband being faster in other countries is true: http://www.worldpoliticsreview.com/Image…
http://arstechnica.com/old/content/2008/…
and here is an indepth comparison between broadband (wired and wireless) in the US and Japan....The US is more expensive and slower, and our infrastructure is growing at a slower rate. Not really sure how Will said anything outrageous (this time)
http://www.scribd.com/doc/8801402/Cell-P…
http://arstechnica.com/old/content/2008/…
and here is an indepth comparison between broadband (wired and wireless) in the US and Japan....The US is more expensive and slower, and our infrastructure is growing at a slower rate. Not really sure how Will said anything outrageous (this time)
http://www.scribd.com/doc/8801402/Cell-P…
16
@13 - Paul's post refers to wireless.
Your first two links reference 'broadband' - ie landline.
Your 3rd link is some kid's college paper, and contradicts what Will said. See page 13, "The United States has more competitive wireless access. US wireless costs consumers less, and there is less market concentration and more competitors." Your reference sort of contradicts Will's statement, no?
And WiS statement about WiMax being some sort of conspiracy to 'pay more for less' is laughable on many levels. Please.
Your first two links reference 'broadband' - ie landline.
Your 3rd link is some kid's college paper, and contradicts what Will said. See page 13, "The United States has more competitive wireless access. US wireless costs consumers less, and there is less market concentration and more competitors." Your reference sort of contradicts Will's statement, no?
And WiS statement about WiMax being some sort of conspiracy to 'pay more for less' is laughable on many levels. Please.
17
I just finished watching Wall Street for the first time 10 minutes ago. Just in time to get the Michael Douglas giant cell phone reference. Whew.
19
Here's a burning question: What movie is that picture of Michael Douglas from? I can't place it!!
20
...will force the carriers to confront a painful reality: Telephone calls aren't special. They are just data crossing the network ..
Yeah, but who owns/leases that spectrum? They can sure as fuck ensure that your data crossing the network is 'special'
Yeah, but who owns/leases that spectrum? They can sure as fuck ensure that your data crossing the network is 'special'
21
First of all most telephony is internet based packet switched once it gets to the CO (central office). That's the big joke -- it's only the last mile of phones that aren't.
Hooking up voice across the Internet is no big.
As far as the US behind on infrastructure. If you define infrastruct as a tangle of wires and cables going to the home, sure, but we are way ahead on WiMax which can do it all. Again, check out Portland and Baltimore where Clear is operating true Wimax. Seattle has "baby Wimax" but Clear is converting us this year.
As far as QoS -- check out all the streaming video from hulu, netflix and others. We're streaming 1Mbs and higher quality video all the time already. Two way voice should and is a breeze...
Hooking up voice across the Internet is no big.
As far as the US behind on infrastructure. If you define infrastruct as a tangle of wires and cables going to the home, sure, but we are way ahead on WiMax which can do it all. Again, check out Portland and Baltimore where Clear is operating true Wimax. Seattle has "baby Wimax" but Clear is converting us this year.
As far as QoS -- check out all the streaming video from hulu, netflix and others. We're streaming 1Mbs and higher quality video all the time already. Two way voice should and is a breeze...
22
Last time I checked the American Government OWNS the spectrum.
Including the other airwaves on the TV spectra.
But, then, it's not like I used to do GIS software and Net servers for any wireless firms ... oh, wait, yeah, I did that.
Again, my point is, other countries get cheaper bandwidth and higher data caps.
(and if you're techy, go check out any of hundreds of news articles on slashdot or any decent computer or network or wireless news source)
Including the other airwaves on the TV spectra.
But, then, it's not like I used to do GIS software and Net servers for any wireless firms ... oh, wait, yeah, I did that.
Again, my point is, other countries get cheaper bandwidth and higher data caps.
(and if you're techy, go check out any of hundreds of news articles on slashdot or any decent computer or network or wireless news source)
23
That article is really silly. Calling Apple "anti-consumer" in this case is naive and immature. Apparently the author actually expects Apple to stab AT&T in the back, when the reality is that the entire iPhone platform could not have reached its current success without AT&T's partnership. Apple would never have rolled their own 3G network. So if you want your beloved iPhone, AT&T is the reason Apple could make a go of it. Which means the concept of them turning around and letting Skype on there is just ludicrous. I know techies want their beloved Free Wireless Forever but stomping their foot about this particular scenario is just ignorant.
24
And speaking of "retard the process", the Apple-bashing retards who wrote this piece know perfectly well that it is AT&T and NOT Apple that is doing the blocking, just like various other carriers/ISPs (**cough Comcast cough**) who have tried to block VOIP that they aren't making their nickel on.
The most interesting use for this technology is, as usual, for international calls, especially when traveling out of the country.
The most interesting use for this technology is, as usual, for international calls, especially when traveling out of the country.
29
Oh P.C., don't feel bad: I still have an address book with entries such as "Chris - CAR PHONE" yes, car phone...
31
i have questions, and i'll work them from the bottom (up):
@23 j tynes, how do you explain the success of open-sourced MOS's like android (or even closed-sources MOS's like WinMo)? was t-mob counting on the backlash of disgruntled ipone consumers to roll out their own 3/3.5g service?
@22 will seattle, the fcc sold sold public spectrum to the highest bidders. the whole dtv fiasco was a ploy by DHS to privatize/sell public goods for more money, duh. aww, don't worry, your precious obama will reverse it (hah!).
@9 mr horse, you are right on. too bad the current slog generation can't read-up more than 2 posts.
@23 j tynes, how do you explain the success of open-sourced MOS's like android (or even closed-sources MOS's like WinMo)? was t-mob counting on the backlash of disgruntled ipone consumers to roll out their own 3/3.5g service?
@22 will seattle, the fcc sold sold public spectrum to the highest bidders. the whole dtv fiasco was a ploy by DHS to privatize/sell public goods for more money, duh. aww, don't worry, your precious obama will reverse it (hah!).
@9 mr horse, you are right on. too bad the current slog generation can't read-up more than 2 posts.
32
Carriers can and DO block apps like skype since it eats away at their bottom line.
Don't think this move will change things.
Money, power, control - what it's all about
Don't think this move will change things.
Money, power, control - what it's all about
33
@30 - GIS is used to map cell phone tower signal strength in map overlays.
Just as most of the spectrum in the wireless sphere is owned by the military.
As I said, I know a lot more about this. A LOT.
Just as most of the spectrum in the wireless sphere is owned by the military.
As I said, I know a lot more about this. A LOT.
34
THANKS FOR TELLING US ABOUT YOUR BASIC CELL PHONE AND YOUR USE OF TEXTS. YOU SELF-ABSORBED DORK. NOBODY CARES. MEMEMEMEMEMEMEMEMEME. SHUT UP PAUL CONSTANT!
35
Skype makes no money on skype->skype calls. All its profits come from the fees it charges for skype->phone calls.
The biggest loser in this development, as it turns out, is Skype.
The biggest loser in this development, as it turns out, is Skype.
36
Last time I checked the American Government OWNS the spectrum
Right, but its 'leased' or whatever to the carriers right? Plus who owns all the other layers (the physical fiber, etc) that make up the stack?
Data caps..coming to a phone near you pretty soon? :)
Right, but its 'leased' or whatever to the carriers right? Plus who owns all the other layers (the physical fiber, etc) that make up the stack?
Data caps..coming to a phone near you pretty soon? :)
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