Tuesday, March 17, 2009
Sex / Religion Pope to Africans: Drop Dead
Posted by Dan Savage on Tue, Mar 17, 2009 at 7:49 AM
Remember, kids, there is no morality without religion—and what could be more moral than traveling to the continent hardest hit by AIDS and encouraging your followers to regard condoms as a threat.
The Pope courted further controversy on his first trip to Africa today by declaring that condoms were not a solution to the Aids epidemic — but were instead part of the problem.In his first public comments on condom use, the pontiff told reporters en route to Cameroon that Aids "is a tragedy that cannot be overcome by money alone, and that cannot be overcome through the distribution of condoms, which even aggravates the problems".
Pope Benedict has previously stressed that the Roman Catholic Church is in the forefront of the battle against Aids. The Vatican encourages sexual abstinence to fight the spread of the disease.
And who can forget this gem...
In 2003 a senior Vatican official claimed condoms had tiny holes in them through which HIV can pass, exposing thousands of people to risk.The then head of the Vatican Pontifical Council for the Family, Cardinal Alfonso Lopez Trujillo, said: "The Aids virus is roughly 450 times smaller than the spermatozoon. The spermatozoon can easily pass through the 'net' that is formed by the condom."
Spermatozoon can not pass through the "net" that is formed by the average altar boy's rectum, added Cardinal Alfonso Lopez Trujillo, citing a successful HIV-prevention strategy widely employed by Catholic prelates.
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1
The Catholic clergy can't keep it in their pants, yet they still pretend that abstinence is a solution for everyone else.
2
we all know about the racist leanings of this pope. hiv has been so very effective in thinning the african population and leaving orphaned children to fend for themselves. what better way to continue this good trend than to spread disinformation about condoms. you go, ratzinger!
4
It's time everyone cut the church some slack – people don't seem to understand what they're about. The goal is to spew out as many Christian babies as possible, kill them off as fast as possible in order to fill up "heaven" with more of their ilk – this is the Jesus freaks' mission statement.
9
Nice to have a job where you can state demonstrably wrong, made-up "facts" like "condoms make the problem worse" and the global press faithfully reports your statements without bothering to fact-check them. I guess holding religious figures to any kind of standards for accuracy is disrespectful?
11
Pope Ratzi and his ilk will not listen to reason so maybe we should do something he does understand on his own terms. To show my disdain for for the pope I have just recited "The Lords Prayer" backwards with the intent of summoning Satan to confront Ratzi himself. I reccomend that others recite the lords prayer backwards just in the off chance that it will bring trouble to the Catholic Church.
12
9, By "worse", I think the pope means people having sex should get sick and die, and if they wear condoms, they are much less likely to get their deserved death sentence from God.
14
I'm praying for the day for the Catholic Church to go the way of the Victrola, butter churn and print newspapers...
15
I've asked this before, Dan, but why are you still friends with Andrew Sullivan? By remaining publicly identified as a Catholic, he necessarily and implicitly supports this kind of bullshit. So why are you friends with someone who supports this kind of murderous ignorance?
16
what's a decent catholic to do in the face of this pope, anyway? my catholic nun aunt-in-law hates the guy, but it hasn't changed anything about her faith, or her activities within the hierarchy. i need to ask her about that the next time i talk to her. anybody got any ideas?
19
Thankfully President Obama has reversed the U.S. family planning /AIDS prevention policies and funding for Africa that the son of a Bush put into place. I think people in the motherland will be more inclined to listen to one of their own than to old Ratz boy.
21
The Church cannot on one hand say that pre-marital and extra-marital sex is a sin, and then turn around and tell you how to sin safely. It would be like your parents how to survive sticking a fork in the electrical socket. You know, since you're going to do it anyway. No. They tell you in no uncertain terms to not stick a fork in the socket.
There are plenty people, governments, and agencies to say "put on a condom", but to expect that it will ever come from the Church is naive and infantile. You want people to have safe sex and use condoms, then do something about it. Sitting around waiting for it to come from the Pope is just lazy.
And don't kid yourself about his influence. If his influence mattered as much as you would like to pin on it, then abstinence would be common and the conversation would be mute.
As much as you hate it, the only sure way to avoid sexually transmitted HIV is abstinence, or fidelity. Those are the only options the Church is ever going to preach. You want a different message to get out there, then do the work and stop blaming others.
There are plenty people, governments, and agencies to say "put on a condom", but to expect that it will ever come from the Church is naive and infantile. You want people to have safe sex and use condoms, then do something about it. Sitting around waiting for it to come from the Pope is just lazy.
And don't kid yourself about his influence. If his influence mattered as much as you would like to pin on it, then abstinence would be common and the conversation would be mute.
As much as you hate it, the only sure way to avoid sexually transmitted HIV is abstinence, or fidelity. Those are the only options the Church is ever going to preach. You want a different message to get out there, then do the work and stop blaming others.
22
21, I don't think anyone is expecting the Catholic church to condone premarital sex. It's about the pope outright lying to people about condom use. I guess bearing false witness is less of sin than premarital sex?
23
21, we don't expect the pope to promote condom use. we do reasonably expect him to not outright lie about them.
yes, and luckily there are other organizations and individuals promoting them and educating about them around the world.
p.s. it's moot, not mute.
yes, and luckily there are other organizations and individuals promoting them and educating about them around the world.
p.s. it's moot, not mute.
24
@11,
Maybe you should say the words backwards as well. That'll make it sound more Satanic and shit:
Nema, live morf su reviled, tub noitatpmet otni ton su dael...
Maybe you should say the words backwards as well. That'll make it sound more Satanic and shit:
Nema, live morf su reviled, tub noitatpmet otni ton su dael...
25
@21: I don't expect the Pope or any other professional witch-doctor to tell the truth if the truth doesn't suit his institution's interests. I do expect the press to report facts, but when it comes to the Pope they often neglect this basic duty for fear of offending people.
26
American Catholics need to break away from the Vatican. It's irresponsible to keep supporting their centuries-old teachings given our current problems. And seriously, what the hell kinda of constituency can ignore the whole "was a Nazi" thing? Shouldn't that be a PR death sentence for any sane group of people?
Plus, the Vatican would probably crumble without tithes from the US.
Plus, the Vatican would probably crumble without tithes from the US.
27
@22,23 re:21
It's not a lie if you really believe it... kinda. Look, I heard the whole "HIV can pass through a condom" line when I was in high school. (A while ago, but not THAT long ago.) If this guy, who is (obviously) not versed in sexual or scientific matters, has been told that condoms don’t prevent HIV, then he’s going to spread the word/myth/lie. I completely agree with 21’s comment. The pope is a religious leader, nothing more. Of course he’s going to spout his beliefs; it’s his job, people.
And I know I’m a little late to the game (different thread/topic), but it’s like the woman and doctors who were excommunicated for the little girl’s abortion of twins: so the fuck what? It’s good that they’re free from the lies and rigidity of the Catholic Church. Good for them all that they can now find a place to worship that won’t condemn them for doing what they believe to be right, responsible and kind; because the Catholic Church has many attributes, but “right, responsible and kind” are not among them.
It is sad that this Nazi has that much power and sway over so many. But judging from the rampant spread of HIV/AIDS in Africa, his message of one or none hasn’t had much power or sway there…
It's not a lie if you really believe it... kinda. Look, I heard the whole "HIV can pass through a condom" line when I was in high school. (A while ago, but not THAT long ago.) If this guy, who is (obviously) not versed in sexual or scientific matters, has been told that condoms don’t prevent HIV, then he’s going to spread the word/myth/lie. I completely agree with 21’s comment. The pope is a religious leader, nothing more. Of course he’s going to spout his beliefs; it’s his job, people.
And I know I’m a little late to the game (different thread/topic), but it’s like the woman and doctors who were excommunicated for the little girl’s abortion of twins: so the fuck what? It’s good that they’re free from the lies and rigidity of the Catholic Church. Good for them all that they can now find a place to worship that won’t condemn them for doing what they believe to be right, responsible and kind; because the Catholic Church has many attributes, but “right, responsible and kind” are not among them.
It is sad that this Nazi has that much power and sway over so many. But judging from the rampant spread of HIV/AIDS in Africa, his message of one or none hasn’t had much power or sway there…
28
The only absolute way to prevent car accidents is to stop driving entirely. And yet, as a culture, we endorse risk lessening behaviors like seat belts and driving only whilst sober, instead of collectively going Amish.
It is unrealistic for the car to be uninvented and forgotten, in the absence of new technology that makes a decent substitution. Even still, the replacement would also have some danger associated. (Trains sometimes wreck, too, after all)
It is likewise unrealistic for human beings to give up sex, even if they're giving up their natural sexual behaviors in favor of only a single lifetime partner, rather than giving up sex entirely. We are not, by nature, terribly gifted at monogamy, nor at picking good partners for ourselves. There are costs to this.
It is unrealistic for the car to be uninvented and forgotten, in the absence of new technology that makes a decent substitution. Even still, the replacement would also have some danger associated. (Trains sometimes wreck, too, after all)
It is likewise unrealistic for human beings to give up sex, even if they're giving up their natural sexual behaviors in favor of only a single lifetime partner, rather than giving up sex entirely. We are not, by nature, terribly gifted at monogamy, nor at picking good partners for ourselves. There are costs to this.
33
@32 My Catholic friend and his fiance had to go to a pre-wedding retreat before they could get married in the church. It was run by priests and nuns.
The idea still makes me chuckle.
The idea still makes me chuckle.
34
Dan - you forgot to add in this part of the same article, which is completely bat sh*t crazy:
- "Cardinal Javier Lozano Barragan of Mexico, the Vatican Health Minister, also said condoms could sometimes be exceptionally condoned, for example when a married woman was unable to refuse her HIV-positive husband's sexual advances.
"You can defend yourself with any means," he said. A subsequent Vatican study of the issue reiterated the blanket ban on condoms, however." -
because everyone knows that a woman in Africa with an HIV positive husband can completely expect to "defend" herself by secretly slipping a condom on him and not expect him to notice. geez - you would think these people had never had sex before. oh...wait...
- "Cardinal Javier Lozano Barragan of Mexico, the Vatican Health Minister, also said condoms could sometimes be exceptionally condoned, for example when a married woman was unable to refuse her HIV-positive husband's sexual advances.
"You can defend yourself with any means," he said. A subsequent Vatican study of the issue reiterated the blanket ban on condoms, however." -
because everyone knows that a woman in Africa with an HIV positive husband can completely expect to "defend" herself by secretly slipping a condom on him and not expect him to notice. geez - you would think these people had never had sex before. oh...wait...
35
(26) American Catholics need to break with the Vatican - um... then they would be protestant.
(25) Then perhaps the problem is the press and not the Pope
(25) Then perhaps the problem is the press and not the Pope
36
The Catholic model is the only one which works.
An article at the National Catholic Register [http://www.ncregister.com/daily/condoms_…] gives hard, rational, cause and effect support to the wisdom of our Pope, who has the courage to stand up in the face of the world’s hatred of all things Catholic and tell the truth, no matter how difficult the press and various Culture of Death institutions find it. Hard scientific evidence proves that condom promotion in Africa simply increases the incidences of AIDS.
The Pope understands, as do all rational humans, that AIDS is a behavioral disease stemming from widespread fornication. The Roman Catholic Church says that sexual relations are to be reserved for husbands and wives within a monogamous marriage, following the pattern God set out in the 2nd chapter of Genesis. It is therefore the sole behavioral antidote to the behavioral epidemic which is the cause of AIDS.
If condoms are widespread, then fornication will also be widespread and the abuse of or non-use of condoms in ever-expanding fornications will statistically raise the incidence of HIV infection and resultant AIDS pandemics. This is true not only for HIV/AIDS, but also such other widespread diseases such as warts, herpes, gonorrhea, Epstein Barr Syndrome, Chlamydia, syphilis, crabs, etc., and the unavoidable medical crises which can result, if not properly treated, such as birth defects blindness, bone deformities, cancer, heart disease, infertility, mental retardation, and death.
Clearly, Pope Benedict, as always, makes complete sense. If you wish to avoid the above disease filled results, pick a better life model than what's spewing out of your MP3's. God bless you!
More...
An article at the National Catholic Register [http://www.ncregister.com/daily/condoms_…] gives hard, rational, cause and effect support to the wisdom of our Pope, who has the courage to stand up in the face of the world’s hatred of all things Catholic and tell the truth, no matter how difficult the press and various Culture of Death institutions find it. Hard scientific evidence proves that condom promotion in Africa simply increases the incidences of AIDS.
The Pope understands, as do all rational humans, that AIDS is a behavioral disease stemming from widespread fornication. The Roman Catholic Church says that sexual relations are to be reserved for husbands and wives within a monogamous marriage, following the pattern God set out in the 2nd chapter of Genesis. It is therefore the sole behavioral antidote to the behavioral epidemic which is the cause of AIDS.
If condoms are widespread, then fornication will also be widespread and the abuse of or non-use of condoms in ever-expanding fornications will statistically raise the incidence of HIV infection and resultant AIDS pandemics. This is true not only for HIV/AIDS, but also such other widespread diseases such as warts, herpes, gonorrhea, Epstein Barr Syndrome, Chlamydia, syphilis, crabs, etc., and the unavoidable medical crises which can result, if not properly treated, such as birth defects blindness, bone deformities, cancer, heart disease, infertility, mental retardation, and death.
Clearly, Pope Benedict, as always, makes complete sense. If you wish to avoid the above disease filled results, pick a better life model than what's spewing out of your MP3's. God bless you!
37
Of course, the Catholic model is for Catholis only. If you don't like it, then go right ahead and live with a lifetime, however short, of penetential diseases. Just hope that you've made the correct decisions for an eternity in Heaven. A little punishment here, a little suffering here, no matter how egregious, is nothing compared to the tortures of the damned, I assure you.
38
Surprise, Surprise. Catholics telling people what to do, passing judgement, making up "knowledge", and making decisions that will negatively affect the lives of millions of people. Didn't see that one coming. *laugh*
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