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Tuesday, March 3, 2009

About the Packers Model

Posted by on Tue, Mar 3, 2009 at 3:11 PM

Like Eli, I attended last week's "No News is Bad News" forum and listened to Seattle Post-Intelligencer columnist Art Thiel and others talk hopefully about the so-called "Packers Model," in which citizens would buy shares of the P-I and keep "traditional journalists," as they kept referring to themselves, in business. At that forum, Thiel proposed that the P-I would only have to sell 600,000 shares at $25 a share to raise $15 million—enough to employ 15 journalists at their previous salaries, plus benefits. (The proposal Eli talked about earlier assumes the P-I's 129,563 subscribers would each kick in $250 a year, which works out to about twice as much.)

I was, and am, skeptical about that model working—not because $25 is a lot of money (although—going with Thiel's suggestion that one entity might buy 200,000 shares—$5 million sure is). I'm skeptical because so many of the people who want to preserve the P-I online are so frequently arrogant about their role, so convinced that no one else can possibly learn to do what "real" journalists with real salaries and real unions do, that I think they fail to innovate in ways that could keep "real" journalists like themselves in work.

The scare quotes aren't meant to imply that I don't think there's a difference between journalism and what many folks do with their blogs. They're there because, at the three forums of this sort I've attended, journalists and public officials have consistently made a false distinction between real journalists—those who work at newspapers and produce a product on dead trees—and "bloggers," a chimerical group that trade in nothing more than "rampant rumors," as Nick Licata put it last week, and steal news from legitimate papers.

For example: Thiel made mocking reference to "folks under 40 and under 30" who "say, 'I don't get my news from a newspaper, I get it from the Internet.' Well, guess where the Internet gets its news from?" As if all those deluded 20- and 30-somethings don't realize that when they go to the Huffington Post, they're going to an aggregator, and that there's a difference between original news reporting and a link.

For example: Dave Ross, the KIRO radio personality, compared what Huffington Post does (aggregate news stories, with links to original sources) to outright theft. "If somebody taped my program and broadcasted it to a different station and sold ads around, they'd go to jail. So why is aggregation allowed?" Ross asked. To which the Seattle Times' executive editor, David Boardman, responded, "That's one of the great dilemmas." Really? If I was Boardman, I'd be thrilled that people were linking to my site—and I'd make an effort to link outside Times reporters' own content, like blogs like Slog, Publicola, and Horse's Ass—all of which also break news—already do.

For example: Cory Haik, content director for Seattletimes.com, said that although "young people are more engaged electronically," the information they read online would be unavailable without "traditional journalists providing the information that's being linked downstream." Although Haik didn't define "traditional journalists," she did say later that she could not "imagine a major metropolitan city without a [print] newspaper."

Again, I get the difference between a newspaper and LiveJournal. But what so many old-school journalists don't seem to understand is that blogging is just a delivery system—like the printing press, or television cameras, blogging software can be used to produce great journalism or garbage. News blogs aren't the enemy any more than aggregation blogs are—both can be good or unreliable, useful or a waste of time. But until newspaper writers and editors can be convinced that their medium (and reporters who came up in their medium) isn't the only one that can produce quality, informative, compelling journalism, I don't know how they'll convince readers that they're worth spending $250 to save.

 

Comments (26) RSS

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1
I'll give one good example where bloggers have the MSM beat hands down with respect to "original reporting": real estate and finance. While the MSM was parroting the National Assoc. of Realtors and other industry hacks - I'm looking at you, Aubrey Cohen - the local blogs were picking up the real story portending the end of the real estate bubble. Same goes on the national level, with blogs like Calculated Risk and Big Picture producing content the big boys totally miss. ...I owe these bloggers a debt of gratitude.
Posted by Flotown on March 3, 2009 at 3:24 PM
2
I totally agree with both you and Dan (whoa...) on this. It simply will not work; most of these "traditional journalists" do not seem to understand that to survive as online-only, you're going to need to get off your high horse, understand how other sites work and what makes them successful, and do something innovative. You can't just say "fuck all these other guys, we're the real journalists, give us money."
There is a role for traditional journalists, but things are changing and in order to stay alive they're going to have to learn how to change too.
Posted by N on March 3, 2009 at 3:28 PM
3
Doesn't HuffPo actually reprint the entire content of an article? Thus removing any reason for their readers to actually visit the sites they took the content from? If I'm wrong about that and they just post the first paragraph and then a link, so you have to go to the primary source to get the full story, please let me know. But if I'm right, then you really don't see the problem with that?

Also, I'm kind of saddened to hear a "reporter" say they think news blogs are just as reputable a source of information as a newspaper. So much for ethical standards and oversight. . .

Posted by Jane on March 3, 2009 at 3:28 PM
4
And you're miffed because none of the "traditional journalists" paid any attention to you. 10-4. Over.
Posted by And you would be . . .? With . . .? on March 3, 2009 at 3:34 PM
5
"As if all those deluded 20- and 30-somethings don't realize that when they go to the Huffington Post, they're going to an aggregator, and that there's a difference between original news reporting and a link.

For example: Dave Ross, the KIRO radio personality, compared what Huffington Post does (aggregate news stories, with links to original sources) to outright theft. 'If somebody taped my program and broadcasted it to a different station and sold ads around, they'd go to jail. So why is aggregation allowed?' Ross asked. To which the Seattle Times' executive editor, David Boardman, responded, 'That's one of the great dilemmas.' Really? If I was Boardman, I'd be thrilled that people were linking to my site ..."

You (and others) are conflating different kinds of aggregation. There's the kind of aggregation newspapers decry in blogs like Huffington Post, in which the blog copies the key or first several grafs of a story, gives some analysis (or not) and then offers a link to the rest of the story. That's not much of a viable business model for the source/linkee; click-through on something like that is pretty damn low, because a reader has gleaned the main point from the part of your story that was reposted. That's what seems -- legitimately, in my view -- like cannibalism to newspapers, and I doubt you'd be "thrilled" (at least not once you understood the difference between how much money the blog made off ads it sold around the first few grafs of your story and how much money you made off ads from people the blog sent to you through their post of those grafs).

Then there's the kind of aggregation the PI did the other day, where there's a headline that links directly off to another site. That's great for the source/linkee, not so good for the aggregator, since people immediately leave the aggregator page. The idea of the PI becoming some sort of successful portal with links like that is silly -- none of the successful portals (Yahoo, MSN, etc.) do anything like that, because they know there's no business model there unless you get paid for every click you send to someone else.

Yes, blogging is just a delivery system, and linking externally is all well and good. But aggregation blogs that copy and repost the essence of a story can rightfully be called to the carpet for doing something ethically questionable, something not at all dissimilar from what Ross is describing with his radio example.
More...
Posted by Superfurry Animal on March 3, 2009 at 3:42 PM
6
xpost w/No. 3
Posted by Superfurry Animal on March 3, 2009 at 3:43 PM
7
OK, I've tried to get the bird cage lined with this digital paper, but it just keeps getting electrocuted.

What am I doing wrong?
Posted by Will in Seattle on March 3, 2009 at 3:44 PM
8
@7: Caging an animal that was meant to fly.

Did I get it right? :-P
Posted by j.lee on March 3, 2009 at 3:51 PM
9
Isn't David Brewster trying to do this at crosscut.com? Why try to reinvent the wheel with an online P-I?
Posted by kk on March 3, 2009 at 3:53 PM
10
I don't think most of these "old-school journalists" care much about the medium beyond making sure that said medium can pay the bills. Huffington Post wouldn't exist without venture capital. Has it ever turned a profit?

I imagine Joel Connelly would chisel his curmudgeonly metaphors on Knute Berger's ample backside if there was a way to pay his mortgage by doing so.
Posted by DOUG. on March 3, 2009 at 3:59 PM
11
As soon as these "traditional journalists" can provide some sort of proof that they actually have special training in their field, there's little reason to pay much attention to them. Most of them were failed English majors, who could accomplish little else, and love to gossip. Not too many careers out there for that skill set.
Now those with degrees from real journalism schools, like the Edward R. Murrow School @ WSU, they can probably adapt their skills to a new delivery mechanism. Probably already have.

The poor print journalists that don't know what to do with themselves after 30 years of a 20hr/wk job? Maybe you can take some of the crappy advice you've been giving readers over the years, and actually go to school and learn something, like a trade.
Posted by Sir Vic on March 3, 2009 at 4:08 PM
12
@11, that comment about "real journalism schools" being the only source for good reporters just made all the good reporters in the world laugh out loud. Just thought you might want to know.
Posted by Jane on March 3, 2009 at 4:13 PM
13
@11, yeah, that's right, those cushy journalism jobs that pay outrageously well for no work at all and require no skills. Oh, wait.

Try knowing what you talk about before participating in a conversation--the vast majority of journalists, especially the good ones, are in it for the love of the job, and they've starved for years and worked endless hours to do it (and often continue to, though they could double their salaries and work half as much in another field).
Posted by Superfurry Animal on March 3, 2009 at 4:23 PM
14
@13, exactly. The reporters I know work more like 50-60 hours a week (or more, depending on what's going on) and haven't gotten a raise, not even cost-of-living, since the strike several years ago.

And yet, they keep going to work every day because they care about what they do and they believe it's important that they keep doing it.

Now that's cushy!
Posted by Jane on March 3, 2009 at 4:28 PM
15
The status quo advocates forgot to write, "You may not realize how you come across, but you sound really hostile toward newspapers."
Posted by Amelia on March 3, 2009 at 4:30 PM
16
I'm just curious if Erica has a LiveJournal now.

Y'know, I enjoy reading the Stranger's print product. It surprises me how much of it can sometimes be found here at the SLOG earlier, though.
Posted by Ben Rip on March 3, 2009 at 4:35 PM
17
Excellent post, erica. Thank you.
Posted by Mark Matassa on March 3, 2009 at 5:05 PM
18
I'll happily pay for actual journalism, but I sure as fuck am not going to pay for editorial or opinion work. I could care less what Joel Conneley or the Blethans think about shit.

So if those 15 are actual reporters count me in for many shares, if their columnists then I'll spend my money elsewhere.
Posted by sgiffy on March 3, 2009 at 7:01 PM
19
The math actually is $15 million = 150 reporters.

http://seattlepost.wetpaint.com/page/Gre…

Posted by SeattlePostGlobe on March 3, 2009 at 7:02 PM
20
Funny--the Stranger ran a poll asking readers if they'd support a post-P-I, possibly a la Green Bay Packers. More than 65 percent say yes:

http://slog.thestranger.com/slog/archive…

Here is the Stranger's earlier proposal of a Packers model:

http://slog.thestranger.com/slog/archive…

Posted by SDeneen on March 3, 2009 at 7:09 PM
21
I like Dave Ross' show. But he's full of shit on his point here. Ever listen to the news on his station? Or their main competitor? Most of the stories are directly lifted from the local morning papers!
Posted by Karlheinz Arschbomber on March 3, 2009 at 7:48 PM
22
If newspapers hadn't spent so much time on sports and "lifestyle" sections, maybe I'd be interested in reading a paper newspaper?

Well, probably not.

The idea of carrying around a big wad of paper that I discard every day full of car dealer ads and supermarket coupons doesn't appeal to me.
Posted by tiktok on March 3, 2009 at 7:56 PM
23
I think what's really dying here are the 18 daily pages of "human interest story" that was paying reporters' salaries all these years. That's half your fucking paper than no one ever wanted to read. Give us NEWS that only you can get, with all your connections and time and know-how and access. And leave the awshucks cute kitten stories to cuteoverload and icanhascheezburger. That's how you get by with only 20-30 journalists, you stop paying the ones you had turning out crap for so many years.
Posted by NaFun on March 3, 2009 at 9:03 PM
24
@23: Come to a newspaper's budget meeting. That's where they decide what stories go where. Most papers, especially in this town, allow citizens to sit in on these meetings. Most of these citizens are of the senior variety, and they do comprise a large chunk of newspapers' circulation.

And let me tell you, those citizens of the senior variety love those damn kitten stories. If you can find me one reporter who loves to write them, I will find you and pay you whatever is in my wallet. Serious.
Posted by horatiosanzserif at aim dot com on March 3, 2009 at 9:24 PM
25
@22 Well, local business-owners think otherwise. They'd much rather place their car and food ads near stories that Seahawks and Jonas Brothers fans will read vs. those stories more popular with perhaps more-discriminating consumers. And unfortunately, their dollars are what has driven newspapers up and now down.
Posted by horatiosanzserif at aim dot com on March 3, 2009 at 9:28 PM
26
@18: Ditto. I won't pay for the knee-jerk triangulation and fair-and-balanced argument stimulation either. ("I can churn this out with one hand tied behind my back...")

America's newspapers in the last 8 years, with some notable exceptions, made the case for pouring money into college scholarships. Both for journalists-in-training, and for all readers, since our current journalists think their readers are at 6th grade level.
Posted by Amelia on March 3, 2009 at 9:29 PM

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