Slog
News & ArtsTuesday, February 24, 2009
City Bag It
Posted by Dan Savage on Tue, Feb 24, 2009 at 10:49 AM
The NYT weighs in today on Seattle's Plastic Bag Wars. The rap on the plastic bag fee now: we're in a receeeeeeeeeeession! We can't impose a 20-cent fee for plastic bags! People are hurting! The makers of plastic bags who funded the drive to put the ban before the voters this August—an effort launched long before the economy tanked—were only thinking of the poooooooooor!
Okay, so let's not impose a 20-cent fee on plastic bags. Let's just ban 'em.
4
Yes! Ban them, ban them, ban them! That has always been my problem with the fee- the bags are still there! Bio-degradable bags are available. Many stores around the country have switched to the corn spun bags already. No one has to invent anything, just go online and buy them.
BAN THEM!
BAN THEM!
7
While we're at it, let's ban newsprint. Failing that, let's add a tax of twenty cents on each printed newspaper and weekly. Ever seen what a pulp mill does to the environment?
9
Kill the tax and leave them alone.
I use them to carry home the Foie Gras I feed to my Pit Bull (he's a very picky eater) and to scoop up his poop (his all Foie Gras diet goes through him like grass through a goose!)
They should be passed out free from corner kiosks all over town.
I use them to carry home the Foie Gras I feed to my Pit Bull (he's a very picky eater) and to scoop up his poop (his all Foie Gras diet goes through him like grass through a goose!)
They should be passed out free from corner kiosks all over town.
10
Ban gangster negroes. They cause way more problems, cost more $, and kill tons more people than any plastic bags ever did.
11
I have more plastic bags stashed in odd places around my house than I know what to do with, and I don't even get them from the store anymore, so anyone who has a problem with the 20 cent fee or banning them all together can come take them off my hands for free.
12
If we're going to ban plastic bags, lets go all the way and completely ban plastic outright. If its bad for carrying groceries home, how is it less bad for storing plasma or weatherstripping windows. Ban it. Ban it all. Ban it all now!!!!
13
whatever happened to the ban on styrofoam (or whatever the proper term is) food take-out/take-home containers that i thought passed through while the bags got saved by the chemical-plastic-lobbyists??? i swear since the beginning of the year (when i thought the styrofoam ban was going to kick in) 1 out of every 3 take-out containers i've been given is that horrid white clamshell!
i need to start bringing my own damn take-out containers. beats the hell outta anything the restaurants here can give me. i might just start using the wonderful take-out box i brought back from australia. rectangular, see-through plastic (not of the cheap clamshell variety though) with a very tight fitting lid. and good for many dozens if not hundreds of uses.
i need to start bringing my own damn take-out containers. beats the hell outta anything the restaurants here can give me. i might just start using the wonderful take-out box i brought back from australia. rectangular, see-through plastic (not of the cheap clamshell variety though) with a very tight fitting lid. and good for many dozens if not hundreds of uses.
14
@12. There's this concept called "harm reduction." It's a great concept, part of the whole idea of "moderation." You should look into it.
15
They're banned here in SF. It's awesome, Walgreens gives you little paper bags if you forget to bring one.
17
More evil than plastic bags: Trader Joe's double-bagging everything with paper. Add that to the large number of it's customers who drive there and you've got a lot of evil concentrated in one place.
18
Dan, it's not a "receeeeeeeeeeession", it's a fucking actual recession. I know you have a great career going, but please understand that reality. Not in a "I know about it because I read the NY Times" sense, but in a "my neighbor's job is hanging by a thread, so maybe now is not the time to nickel and dime him" sense.
I do agree fully with your last sentence: bags are an environmental menace, so let's indeed ban them.
I do agree fully with your last sentence: bags are an environmental menace, so let's indeed ban them.
19
#17
Ah yes, the evil shoppers. I think you believe it.
The council needs to take the coming defeat on the bag thing with grace, it WILL be repealed, and start over.
Bad legislation in the start go.
Ah yes, the evil shoppers. I think you believe it.
The council needs to take the coming defeat on the bag thing with grace, it WILL be repealed, and start over.
Bad legislation in the start go.
20
I think we should impose a tax on people who try to steal the plastic bags I use for trash can liners and for cleaning up the dog poop on my front lawn from my neighbors dogs.
How's that sound, Dan?
Seriously, give up before we start leaving filled bags on your front door.
How's that sound, Dan?
Seriously, give up before we start leaving filled bags on your front door.
22
I no longer cut up my 6 pack plastic ring holders. I ask for extra plastic bags at safeway. I dump my used motor oil in the garbage cans at gas stations. And it feels ohhh so fucking good.
23
Why a ban or fee instead of a deposit?
Make the stores give you a nickel for bringing the bag back for them to dispose of. Do that and you'll have small children and hobos earning their keep by making sure bags stay out of the trash. The problem with a fee is that is annoying to pay extra at the source (when the cashier charges you you for the bag) but not worth anything once you've used it. Stuff that is worthless still goes in the trash! If it has deposit value, then it won't go in the trash - and that is the problem we are trying to solve.
If you want nannyish social resconstruction you'll get further with thought out alternatives than screaming BAN BAN BAN.
Make the stores give you a nickel for bringing the bag back for them to dispose of. Do that and you'll have small children and hobos earning their keep by making sure bags stay out of the trash. The problem with a fee is that is annoying to pay extra at the source (when the cashier charges you you for the bag) but not worth anything once you've used it. Stuff that is worthless still goes in the trash! If it has deposit value, then it won't go in the trash - and that is the problem we are trying to solve.
If you want nannyish social resconstruction you'll get further with thought out alternatives than screaming BAN BAN BAN.
24
Nanny state my ass. Nobody screams nanny state when the government forks over billions to banks and car manufacturers.
25
I have enjoyed being able to have my 3 cent refund for each bag I bring to the QFC routed to the charity of the month. If a huge corporation like Kroger can see savings and value in cutting down on bag usage (costs), let's face it, the only really concerned parties are the American Chimical Council and people who can't be bothered to carry a little bag.
27
@25: I've been using my own tote bags to shop at QFC for ten years, and they forget the three cents most of the time. The bag refund started up again this month but appears to be over again. Part of the problem must be because I don't get to say "no bags, please" until they're done ringing me up and say, "paper or plastic?"
28
@20: Stick little flags in each pile of dog poop with the address and/or photo of the dog's owner.
29
@23 Is right. If the actual intention is to ensure that the bags are properly disposed of, then a deposit is the way to go... and make it meaningful. Say 50 cents per bag. I'd get right behind that.
But here's the thing... that was never the intention. The intention was for greenies to get great big hard-ons over certain politicians. (And the only thing that would make their cocks harder than the current tax would be an all out ban.)
But here's the thing... that was never the intention. The intention was for greenies to get great big hard-ons over certain politicians. (And the only thing that would make their cocks harder than the current tax would be an all out ban.)
31
HEY! They are recyclable! Plastic bags are recyclable! Pick them up and put them in recycling bins! Those cheap thin grocery store bags? They're recyclable! Pick them up! And GUESS WHAT?
32
or we could devise a citywide system in which a public service could come to every single household and pick up everybody's recycling curbside... we could even require participation. Oh wait,
33
Do I live in the only place in the world where plastic bags can just be recycled? Is that so freakin' hard to figure out?
36
How stupid do you have to be to not see that everyone (including the poor) is already pays for the plastic bags. And Aldi's, which undeniably targets the poor, of course makes you pay for any bags you use (so everyone brings bags, since its a bunch of us poor people there). And the more richy-richy HyVee gives you a 5 cent credit for every reusable bag that you bring.
For people calling for recycling: you apparently missed the "reduce, reuse, recycle" slogan. They come in that order for a reason. Plastic bags can be reused, but not for long since they're so cheaply made. Recycling is last on the list since it takes energy to recycle. Recycling isn't free.
For people calling for recycling: you apparently missed the "reduce, reuse, recycle" slogan. They come in that order for a reason. Plastic bags can be reused, but not for long since they're so cheaply made. Recycling is last on the list since it takes energy to recycle. Recycling isn't free.
37
if i'm going to have to pay extra for something to drink my beer out of while i walk home from work i shouldn't have to worry about getting po'd any more.
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