Slog
News & ArtsMonday, February 9, 2009
Chow Foie Gras Protest at Lark: NARN Reponds to Sundstrom’s Response
Posted by Bethany Jean Clement on Mon, Feb 9, 2009 at 3:54 PM
Jenn Kaplan, Northwest Animal Rights Network board officer, is questioning the veracity of Lark chef/owner John Sundstrom’s claim that foie gras sales at his Capitol Hill restaurant have increased during NARN’s sidewalk protests.
The organization has protested outside Lark every Friday for the past month and has pledged to keep doing so until the restaurant stops serving foie gras. “We see foie gras sales go up on Friday nights,” Sundstrom said on Saturday. Some people order it to "spite the protesters" chanting outside, he said, while others want to see “what the fuss is about.”
“We wouldn’t be surprised if that was something he was just saying so as to dissuade us from protesting against him,” Kaplan said today. “Obviously, that’s difficult for us to falsify, because we don’t have access to his business records,” she said.
Is NARN calling Sundstrom a liar? “I’m not going to call him a liar absent evidence that he’s a liar,” said Kaplan. But: “I think it’s unlikely that his claims are true. Even if they are true, it won’t remain the case that sales increase in the long term.” Kaplan said that in other cities “it has not been the case that there have been increases in foie gras sales after protests.”
Kaplan said that the selection of Lark for protests was somewhat “arbitrary.” (The group’s website also lists Crush and 35th Street Bistro as foie-gras sellers; the former lists foie gras on its current menu online, the latter does not.) “Lark purports to be an ethical restaurant, one that takes the issues of sustainability and local very seriously,” she said. “Foie gras from a factory farm in California is not local and not sustainable, and making claims that it is is deceptive and disingenuous.” Lark’s menu lists the source of its foie gras (seared, with caramelized pear and pain d’epice) as Sonoma; the company, Sonoma Artisan Foie Gras, says it is “committed to the highest standards of animal welfare.”
NARN has “chosen to protest [foie gras] because the cruelty of the product is inherent in the design,” but the group is vegan and is opposed to all meat-eating. Regarding NARN’s overall purpose, Kaplan said, “NARN’s belief is that raising and killing of animals for food is inherently cruel, and while we would love to see Seattle become a vegan city, we realize that that’s probably not going to happen anytime soon, and we’re going to take pragmatic steps along the road to decrease cruelty as much as possible.”
To those that take issue with the group targeting a small, locally owned business for protests, Kaplan offered a challenge of logic: “I would ask whether they would apply that principle consistently. If you’re against targeting a small, locally owned business for cruelty to animals, would you be against targeting a small, locally owned business selling child pornography or discriminating against gays and lesbians?”
Kaplan said that NARN will be protesting at other local restaurants.
Sundstrom said Saturday he would not stop serving foie gras: “They say they’re not giving up, and we’re not going to cave in to them.”
Photo from cornichon.org, which also weighs in on the controversy.
2
I posted this deep in a previous comment thread, but here's a list of restaurants in Seattle that serve foie gras. Use this list as you will -- people who care about animal cruelty, you may want to stay away from these restaurants. People who are really into spite and excessive cruelty, you might want to make dinner reservations.
This list probably isn't complete, and please leave a comment if any of these restaurants have stopped serving foie gras.
Seattle Restaurants That Serve Foie Gras:
Downtown
Campagne
Matt's in the Market
Maximillen in the Market
Le Pichet
Capitol Hill/Central District
Lark
Quinn's Pub
Crush
Licorous
Belltown
Restaurant Zoe
Lampreia
Ballard
Le Gourmand
Wallingford/Fremont
Art of the Table
Queen Anne
Opal
Canlis
Portage
Madison Park
Nishino
Columbia City
Verve Wine Bar
Laurelhurst
Enotria
West Seattle
Ama Ama Oyster Bar
This list probably isn't complete, and please leave a comment if any of these restaurants have stopped serving foie gras.
Seattle Restaurants That Serve Foie Gras:
Downtown
Campagne
Matt's in the Market
Maximillen in the Market
Le Pichet
Capitol Hill/Central District
Lark
Quinn's Pub
Crush
Licorous
Belltown
Restaurant Zoe
Lampreia
Ballard
Le Gourmand
Wallingford/Fremont
Art of the Table
Queen Anne
Opal
Canlis
Portage
Madison Park
Nishino
Columbia City
Verve Wine Bar
Laurelhurst
Enotria
West Seattle
Ama Ama Oyster Bar
4
HOW local &/or sustainable is close enough for NARN? is oregon too far? eastern warshington?
i would agree, Seattle is "probably" not going to be a vegan city anytime soon. understatement of the new millenium.
i would agree, Seattle is "probably" not going to be a vegan city anytime soon. understatement of the new millenium.
6
Planning on making some reservations for Friday night for a big group at Lark. Should definitely ask Chef Sundstrum to order extra foie!
8
No, Sven, they would like to see you not eat the steak, but they realize that's probably not going to happen. Which is a totally reasonable stance to take, I think.
9
A puritan is someone who suspects that “somewhere someone is having a good time.” H.L. Mencken.
These people will not stop until we are all dressed in brown homespun and are living on a diet beans.
These people will not stop until we are all dressed in brown homespun and are living on a diet beans.
10
Jen Kaplan sounds like a real brain trust.
Hey Lizzie -- what the fuck is "excessive cruelty"?? I would think something is either cruel or not?
Of all the self-righteous "progressive" groups out there, vegans have got to be the biggest jackasses of all.
Hey Lizzie -- what the fuck is "excessive cruelty"?? I would think something is either cruel or not?
Of all the self-righteous "progressive" groups out there, vegans have got to be the biggest jackasses of all.
11
My first and only time eating Foie Gras was at Lark. It was amazingly delicious, melted on the tongue, and had nice spikes of salt and butter and richness. I think, now that these protests are going on, I will stop by and have it again with a glass of wine. Just to show my support for a small business, and against the fucking idiots who think it is there duty to make moral decisions for me.
13
Hey NARN, you want a real atrocity? Try this on for size, a story from the BBC on those who clean the sewers of New Delhi:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/fr…
Picketing one local chef is the singularly least effective way you can come up with to achieve your goal - in fact, your tactics have increased consumption at Lark.
There are atrocities occurring on an unimaginable scale around the globe - foie gras production doesn't even rate.
How about helping to unionize slaughterhouse workers in the deep south, who are injured and maimed at an alarming rate, while working for minimum wage? Successfully unionizing those workers would do far more to slow industrial farming practices than your little self indulgent snit in front of Lark.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/fr…
Picketing one local chef is the singularly least effective way you can come up with to achieve your goal - in fact, your tactics have increased consumption at Lark.
There are atrocities occurring on an unimaginable scale around the globe - foie gras production doesn't even rate.
How about helping to unionize slaughterhouse workers in the deep south, who are injured and maimed at an alarming rate, while working for minimum wage? Successfully unionizing those workers would do far more to slow industrial farming practices than your little self indulgent snit in front of Lark.
14
Anyone want to stage a pro-Lark rally outside the homes and workplaces of NARN members?
I'm sure their neighbors and bosses would be just as wecloming as LARK has been.
I'm sure their neighbors and bosses would be just as wecloming as LARK has been.
15
They would love to see Seattle become a vegan city and I would love to see Seattle become a city that had a more useful lunatic fringe. Next thing you know these people are going to be blowing the place up like an abortion clinic in Alabama.
17
Well, I for one am now CRAVING foie gras in the worst way, and if I were in Seattle right now I would head for Lark and order some up.
18
Wow, these people need a life. how about protesting something that actually matters, like say the stimulus bill combined with the last stimulus bill which is the equivalent of a person with a 25K Income with $150,000 in credit card debt, stating "I think I'll just keep on chargin it up, something will turn around soon, I just know it.."
Worrying about what people eat will soon be the least of your worries. Trust me.
Worrying about what people eat will soon be the least of your worries. Trust me.
19
Some cruelty is necessary in society. We're not all going to be vegan or vegetarian, so we need some chicken and dairy and whatnot out there as long as it's raised in a reasonable manner. That's acceptable cruelty. Nobody in the world needs to eat a duck that was locked in a cage where it couldn't move and then forcefed until it died of organ failure, so that's excessive cruelty. It's pretty easy to figure out what's excessively cruel.
And yes -- ha ha, you're all going to eat foie gras for every meal and then throw rocks at gays and spit on black people and shoot pit bulls in the eyes. Haha, you are all so witty and contrary and you don't care about morals, we get it.
Hey Lizzie -- what the fuck is "excessive cruelty"??
Some cruelty is necessary in society. We're not all going to be vegan or vegetarian, so we need some chicken and dairy and whatnot out there as long as it's raised in a reasonable manner. That's acceptable cruelty. Nobody in the world needs to eat a duck that was locked in a cage where it couldn't move and then forcefed until it died of organ failure, so that's excessive cruelty. It's pretty easy to figure out what's excessively cruel.
And yes -- ha ha, you're all going to eat foie gras for every meal and then throw rocks at gays and spit on black people and shoot pit bulls in the eyes. Haha, you are all so witty and contrary and you don't care about morals, we get it.
20
Hey Lizzie, next time you update your list could you please include URLs to the restaurants website so it easier for me to make a excessively cruel reservation out of spite? Thanks!
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@ Lizzie RE: 19 PS Please leave us gays out of your self-righteous and hyperbolic comparisons. Thanks again!
23
Again and again, it boils down to the fact that some people in this city have been born into and reared with the luxury of being able to care this much about a gourmet delicacy that a small percentage of this city's population has probably eaten.
24
I don't know why every slog post isn't about vegans and pitbulls and bicycles; you guys would be the most commented-upon blog EVER!
25
@15 - Let me just say that I would also love to see Seattle become a city that had a more useful lunatic fringe.
26
Lizzie, your description of excessive cruelty sounds just like the treatment of animals in factory farms--chickens debeaked and kept in cages stacked upon one another, cows being slaughtered right before dying of organ failure from all the corn they're fed...
Having been to Hudson Valley's foie gras operation, I can tell you that the animals run around free, have plenty of room, and actually do come running for feeding time. Since that's house a lot of birds of fed by their mothers (having food stuck into their mouths), they don't mind it at all.
Having been to Hudson Valley's foie gras operation, I can tell you that the animals run around free, have plenty of room, and actually do come running for feeding time. Since that's house a lot of birds of fed by their mothers (having food stuck into their mouths), they don't mind it at all.
28
I am utterly at a loss to comprehend the humungous freak-out over goose liver treats. If NARN wants to start a national movement to boycott KFC for animal cruelty, gastronmic atrocities, and essentially poisoning the lower classes, tell me where to sign up. Until them, mheh.
29
Thanks LIzzie, good to know where you can get fois gras.
BTW I had some last month at Canlis, so better add them to the list.
BTW I had some last month at Canlis, so better add them to the list.
31
@ 23 exactly. It is the height of bourgeois privilege to stand in front of Lark in a petulant, pedantic, juvenile snit, protesting foie for fucks sake, when there are a million things vastly more important, more damaging and more evil occurring every second of every fucking day. NARN has apparently not heard of global warming, Gaza, extraordinary rendition, East Timor, Columbian president Uribe killing union activists, economic collapse, the great drifting whirlpool of plastic in the Pacific ocean,etc. ad naseum. Or perhaps they have heard of those things, but are simply too fucking cowardly or lazy to do something about them, because it would involve more than sacrificing an hour every Friday to harass a small, local business.
32
I don't really think serving foie gras and selling child porn are comparable. If you are really passionate about animals, then yes, maybe. but most people hold humans in a higher regard than animals. I'm not saying that's okay, but comparing the food people are eating to child porn is not going to get them on your side.
33
Sonoma Foie Gras, which provides Lark with foie gras, is actually one of the reaons for a statewide California ban on production and sale of force-fed foie gras by 2012.
Here's the bill: http://www.indybay.org/newsitems/2004/09…
Investigations of foie gras production facilities provide a rare glimpse into this ugly world. In 1992 a police raid on a New York state foie gras producer resulted in cruelty charges. Necropsies taken of the dead birds revealed many painful conditions: The force-fed birds had chronic heart disorders, ruptured liver cell membranes, cirrhosis, traumatic esophagitis, and lesions in their gizzards and intestines. Dead birds were found with food filling their throats and spilling out of their nostrils.
Eleven years later, in 2003, Farm Sanctuary, an animal advocacy organization, requested that the San Joaquin County California District Attorney investigate Sonoma Foie Gras for alleged violations of the state's animal cruelty statute. Farm Sanctuary provided the attorney with evidence that showed filthy ducks, bloodied ducks, ducks unable to stand or walk, ducks having difficulty breathing, and dead ducks lying in cages among those still clinging to life. This evidence added to the pressure that finally led to the bill being passed.
Here's the bill: http://www.indybay.org/newsitems/2004/09…
34
What an asshat! Comparing a menu item they do not like to the damage done to children by child porn. What do you expect from a mindset that equates chicken farms to nazi death camps. These people devalue human beings in order to promote their worthless cause. No wonder people respond by wanting to patronize the very business they target. I know I will now make the Lark a place I visit at least once a month.
35
"some people in this city have been born into and reared with the luxury of being able to care this much about a gourmet delicacy that a small percentage of this city's population has probably eaten."
Exactly. How many folks from Rainier Valley were at the protest? Would even care?
Stupid white people.
Exactly. How many folks from Rainier Valley were at the protest? Would even care?
Stupid white people.
36
@10: clearly we all suck. Thank you for letting me know. I'd also like to know how frequently my personal choice, which you've never known about until this moment since you've never met me and I never go to protests, has negatively impacted you.
37
@31: I'm trying to ask you this in a nice way - what do you do for global warming, gaza, etc? at least these people are doing something, even though perhaps poorly planned out. what do you do to try to better the world? I'm being serious.
38
@2 Where did you get that list? Not all of those places even serve foie gras. Foie without the gras is just plain old liver, don't confuse the two.
39
Lizzie's list left off Brooklyn Seafood, Steak & Oyster House on 2nd Avenue. They do an appetizer of day boat sea scallop served with foie gras, over a vanilla bean scented carrot puree and marscarpone filled mission figs.
I swear that was the best single thing I have ever eaten. EVER.
I swear that was the best single thing I have ever eaten. EVER.
40
@33 - So... Sonoma will be out of the foie business in 2012, when it becomes illegal to produce the product in California... you won. Leave small, local businesses alone and go try to change something that matters.
41
"comparing the food people are eating to child porn is not going to get them on your side."
So please keep doing it!
Also, keep comparing geese with blacks, Asians, Jews, Indians and homosexuals. THis way, only stupid white people will be at your protests.
So please keep doing it!
Also, keep comparing geese with blacks, Asians, Jews, Indians and homosexuals. THis way, only stupid white people will be at your protests.
43
A small, locally owned business selling child pornography or discriminating against gays and lesbians would never need to be protested in the state of Washington, because both child pornography and such discrimination are AGAINST THE LAW here (unlike the production and consumption of liver pate). What a specious argument to make.
44
Sorry: "only stupid, straight white people will be at your protests."
My apologies to the Queer Nation.
My apologies to the Queer Nation.
45
Julie@8:
But if I let them take the foie gras, won't they be a step closer to taking my steak? I really don't want them to take my steak. If I agree that foie gras is cruel and unusual, won't they just say that my steak is also cruel and unusual, and that I'm a hypocritical bastard by agreeing on foie gras and not on steak?
My steak!
But if I let them take the foie gras, won't they be a step closer to taking my steak? I really don't want them to take my steak. If I agree that foie gras is cruel and unusual, won't they just say that my steak is also cruel and unusual, and that I'm a hypocritical bastard by agreeing on foie gras and not on steak?
My steak!
46
Hudson Valley has a guided tour for public relations, but they don't show nearly everything there.
http://www.gourmetcruelty.com/inv.php
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XBBFtDEs-…
No, I compared a lack of morality when it comes to animals with a lack of morality when it comes to people, which is a pretty strong scientific correlation. It's really frustrating when people don't understand comparisons and analogies. The NARN lady mentioned child pornography because they were being unfairly criticized for targeting a local business; obviously, there are lots of local businesses people shouldn't support, whether it be a nightclub with shootings or an unethical porn business that exploits children.
PS I am a gay, and I'm not a vegan.
Having been to Hudson Valley's foie gras operation, I can tell you that the animals run around free, have plenty of room, and actually do come running for feeding time.
Hudson Valley has a guided tour for public relations, but they don't show nearly everything there.
http://www.gourmetcruelty.com/inv.php
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XBBFtDEs-…
Lizzie just compared black people and homosexuals to geese and ducks.
No, I compared a lack of morality when it comes to animals with a lack of morality when it comes to people, which is a pretty strong scientific correlation. It's really frustrating when people don't understand comparisons and analogies. The NARN lady mentioned child pornography because they were being unfairly criticized for targeting a local business; obviously, there are lots of local businesses people shouldn't support, whether it be a nightclub with shootings or an unethical porn business that exploits children.
PS I am a gay, and I'm not a vegan.
47
I wonder if Sarah Palin could help out here. you guys need someone to class up your opposition to narn. you need a spokesman who shares your values and can talk about what it's like to enjoy dead animals and how they got that way. she's already the face of helicopter hunting and this foie gras thing is just the sort of thing to round out her resume.
48
These animal rights activists don't seem to understand that their views are not absolute. Food lovers can enjoy the foods they enjoy without shoving their beliefs down the throats of others. Why can't vegans do the same? Why do vegans want everyone to believe as they believe?
49
Bethany, I just LOVE the whiff of bias in all of your posts regarding the Lark protests...can't wait till you land that job with Fox News which you are most certainly suited to and the fuck out of Seattle. ...
50
Man, the "I'm going to just go right out and eat even more foie gras" response is getting pretty old. You are not new, original, or witty, so please stop.
And @34, I am not against foie gras (non-factory farmed), but even I see the relevance of the child porn and discrimination point. NARN see foie gras as a social injustice (not just something "they don't like") and sees protesting this business as a method to go about making a change. If the social injustice were discrimination against gays, most people here would have no problem with protesting a small business...
And @34, I am not against foie gras (non-factory farmed), but even I see the relevance of the child porn and discrimination point. NARN see foie gras as a social injustice (not just something "they don't like") and sees protesting this business as a method to go about making a change. If the social injustice were discrimination against gays, most people here would have no problem with protesting a small business...
52
@37 I try to tread as lightly on the earth as possible. I rarely eat meat, and when I do I shop carefully for meat that is not part of the factory farming chain. (I do the same due diligence for my vegetables, incidentally). I routinely join protests, and have even planned a few myself, as well as acting as police - protester liaison on some marches. I give money when I can, (much less nowadays). I call the powers that be on issues I care about. Which all probably amounts to a hill of beans, I know. But at least I'm not harassing a local business over bullshit that won't do a damn thing to make the world a better place.
54
@ 46 RE: "strong scientific correlation." A correlation does not prove a cause and effect relationship, not even in "science." Just thought you should know.
Also, just because you are gay doesn't mean you have a right to include "the gays" in your hyperbolic and inappropriate comparisons. Thanks!
Also, just because you are gay doesn't mean you have a right to include "the gays" in your hyperbolic and inappropriate comparisons. Thanks!
56
FYI anyone want to come to my counter protest Friday? I plan on eating three meat meals a day and holding my sh*t til Friday. Then we all find our fav Capital Hill vegan spots and go take the meatiest sh*ts you can in their toilets. Real noisy, grunting, cheek flappers that will would offend the nostrils of a mule. Be sure to spray some outside the bowl for the vegans to wipe up.
57
Well, obviously once our small, committed group of activists is finished ridding the world of this particular gourmet food, one high-end restaurant at a time, we'll turn our efforts to other targets, like things regular people eat. I dunno. Burgers or something. One restaurant at a time!
Who's with me? Who's free every Friday for the rest of their lives to march for The Cause? What do we want? A sustainable diet free from cruelty and exploitation of sentient beings! When do we want it? Now!
Who's with me? Who's free every Friday for the rest of their lives to march for The Cause? What do we want? A sustainable diet free from cruelty and exploitation of sentient beings! When do we want it? Now!
58
"Why do vegans want everyone to believe as they believe?"
Because fundamentalists are the same the world over.
Because fundamentalists are the same the world over.
59
@48 I JUST SAID that I wasn't interested in converting people to my lifestyle as long as you don't slap a steak in my face or sneak meat into my curry (well..it was implied anyways). Stop generalizing all vegans. We're not all gigantic jackasses.
60
@j.lee,
I apologize to you for lumping you in with the brethren you choose to associate with. However, even YOU must admit that you are the exception and not the rule. Correction, the MAJORITY of vegans are gigantic jackasses.
I apologize to you for lumping you in with the brethren you choose to associate with. However, even YOU must admit that you are the exception and not the rule. Correction, the MAJORITY of vegans are gigantic jackasses.
62
Tasty Tasty Tasty Foie Gras. More on my plate please. Lobes of seared gras..i will eat it naked and let it dribble down to my cock and you can lick it slowly so slowly. Oh dear god the tasty gras will ignite our love...
63
Vegans like Lizzie are modified anorexics ... they have an eating disorder caused by deep psychological issues and can't see the damage their thinking does. If decreasing farm/food animal cruelty (we'll never fully remove it) and increasing food quality (yes, even as vegans and veggies, we should care about carnivore health and food supply sustainability) are your goal, you can't operate like a crazed 13 year old anorexic, convinced the adults around you are full of lies and your diet lifestyle choice is THE ONLY SANE THING AROUND YOU.
It's time to appeal to people's better nature, get in their face about foie gras if that's your style, then move on down the road. If your argument is that eating at Lark is a classist, yuppie animal-cruelty act then you're mistaken. Protesting like a crazed abortion clinic pawn in front of a local-owned, sustainability focused restaurant makes you the elitist Evergreen freak, working AGAINST the issues you (and I) hold dear.
Now, read these words ... you won't actually see how nuts they make you sound, but the rest of us vegans, veggies and carnivores that have to live with and persuade one another certainly will ...
“I’m not going to call him a liar absent evidence that he’s a liar,” said Kaplan. But: “I think it’s unlikely that his claims are true.”
"we would love to see Seattle become a vegan city, we realize that that’s probably not going to happen anytime soon"
"If you’re against targeting a small, locally owned business for cruelty to animals, would you be against targeting a small, locally owned business selling child pornography or discriminating against gays and lesbians?”
Anorexics and extremist abortion clinic protesters similarly can never understand how others don't see their own crazy logic.
More...
It's time to appeal to people's better nature, get in their face about foie gras if that's your style, then move on down the road. If your argument is that eating at Lark is a classist, yuppie animal-cruelty act then you're mistaken. Protesting like a crazed abortion clinic pawn in front of a local-owned, sustainability focused restaurant makes you the elitist Evergreen freak, working AGAINST the issues you (and I) hold dear.
Now, read these words ... you won't actually see how nuts they make you sound, but the rest of us vegans, veggies and carnivores that have to live with and persuade one another certainly will ...
“I’m not going to call him a liar absent evidence that he’s a liar,” said Kaplan. But: “I think it’s unlikely that his claims are true.”
"we would love to see Seattle become a vegan city, we realize that that’s probably not going to happen anytime soon"
"If you’re against targeting a small, locally owned business for cruelty to animals, would you be against targeting a small, locally owned business selling child pornography or discriminating against gays and lesbians?”
Anorexics and extremist abortion clinic protesters similarly can never understand how others don't see their own crazy logic.
64
In 2005, Washington state made fighting animals for sport a felony. In 2006, Washington state made having sex with an animal a felony.
Extremist fundamentalist vegan fascism? Discuss.
Extremist fundamentalist vegan fascism? Discuss.
65
One simple way to counter these dietary control freaks is to make little signs or buttons that simply say "Dietary Choice"
Omnivoreism,vegetarianism and veganism are all nothing more than dietary choices. The more often we freedom of food choice supporters frame it that way the eaisier it will be to protect that choice and keep the control freaks at bay.
Omnivoreism,vegetarianism and veganism are all nothing more than dietary choices. The more often we freedom of food choice supporters frame it that way the eaisier it will be to protect that choice and keep the control freaks at bay.
66
Again, allowing comments on Slog posts adds no value (see above, below, everything other Slog archive post, etc).
Look at Line Out -- that blog doesn't have comments, and it's better off for it.
Look at Line Out -- that blog doesn't have comments, and it's better off for it.
67
#63, Um, I'm not vegan, I'm not anorexic, and the only protest I've been to in the past year was the anti-Prop 8 protest.
* Foie gras is the most cruel form of legal farm animal abuse.
* We already have many laws, many of them decades old, protecting against severe and extreme animal cruelty.
* Foie gras, as the most extreme form of farm animal cruelty, should be added to our moderate, bipartisan animal cruelty laws.
* Since it likely won't be banned during this economic disaster, we should use the libertarian approach and inform as many people as possible about the cruelty of foie gras.
* California passed a foie gras ban and also passed an anti-animal cruelty initiative last year with 62% of the vote, mandating that animals can move around their cages freely amongst other things. Protecting against animal cruelty is a moderate, mainstream issue with majority support.
* People who eat foie gras are being extremists, by supporting the cruelest food available.
Which part of that argument has my wacko crazeeeee anorexic vegan logic?
* Foie gras is the most cruel form of legal farm animal abuse.
* We already have many laws, many of them decades old, protecting against severe and extreme animal cruelty.
* Foie gras, as the most extreme form of farm animal cruelty, should be added to our moderate, bipartisan animal cruelty laws.
* Since it likely won't be banned during this economic disaster, we should use the libertarian approach and inform as many people as possible about the cruelty of foie gras.
* California passed a foie gras ban and also passed an anti-animal cruelty initiative last year with 62% of the vote, mandating that animals can move around their cages freely amongst other things. Protecting against animal cruelty is a moderate, mainstream issue with majority support.
* People who eat foie gras are being extremists, by supporting the cruelest food available.
Which part of that argument has my wacko crazeeeee anorexic vegan logic?
69
Using arguments is not the libertarian method it's the democratic method. Banning fois gras and imprisoning those of us who choose to eat, buy or sell it is the fascist approach.
But don't worry, this won't succeed. It failed in Chicago and you can still buy, sell and eat fois gras in every state.
But don't worry, this won't succeed. It failed in Chicago and you can still buy, sell and eat fois gras in every state.
70
Correlation is not causation. Bad science is bad.
No, I compared a lack of morality when it comes to animals with a lack of morality when it comes to people, which is a pretty strong scientific correlation. It's really frustrating when people don't understand
Correlation is not causation. Bad science is bad.
73
* Foie gras is the most cruel form of legal farm animal abuse.
An unsustainable argument - I could just as easily argue that the gestation crates used in modern Piggeries is more cruel.(I believe that they are) But setting that aside for the moment, which practice has the most wide spread, damaging effects - production of foie gras, which is a highly specialized, artisan product, involving very few humans and animals, or modern Confined Animal Feeding Operations (CAFOs)? Which causes massive groundwater contamination? Which one contributes to global warming? Which practice causes poor communities located near the facilities to suffer statistically higher rates of respiratory illness? Which practice leads to massive corporate slaughterhouses tucked away in rural communities where tens of thousands of humans work at breakneck speed for pennies, resulting in a tremendous amount of severe injuries, including amputations and death? Hmmm? I don't see your fat, lazy, bourgeois ass doing anything to solve that problem, because it would involve more than turning off your x-box for an hour every Friday.
An unsustainable argument - I could just as easily argue that the gestation crates used in modern Piggeries is more cruel.(I believe that they are) But setting that aside for the moment, which practice has the most wide spread, damaging effects - production of foie gras, which is a highly specialized, artisan product, involving very few humans and animals, or modern Confined Animal Feeding Operations (CAFOs)? Which causes massive groundwater contamination? Which one contributes to global warming? Which practice causes poor communities located near the facilities to suffer statistically higher rates of respiratory illness? Which practice leads to massive corporate slaughterhouses tucked away in rural communities where tens of thousands of humans work at breakneck speed for pennies, resulting in a tremendous amount of severe injuries, including amputations and death? Hmmm? I don't see your fat, lazy, bourgeois ass doing anything to solve that problem, because it would involve more than turning off your x-box for an hour every Friday.
74
We will keep shaking our signs and chanting our slogans until the foie gras runs out! Fear us, artisan goose merchants! Fear us!
75
Hey lizzie, If you think foie gras is cruel; don't eat it. No one is forcing it down your throat with a funnel. However, whether the practice of gavage is cruel or not is an opinion, not an absolute. Clearly our opinions differ. I give you the respect of having you own opinion on this issue and ask that you afford me the same luxury.
76
I never said or implied correlation was causation.
Foie gras, by definition, is produced in CAFO's.
Yes, I'm a lazy bitch for not dedicating my entire life to singlehandedly ending all animal cruelty.
Okay, I'll concede my point and let you say foie gras is only the 2nd cruelest form of farm animal abuse. Does that change anything?
Foie gras, by definition, is produced in CAFO's.
Yes, I'm a lazy bitch for not dedicating my entire life to singlehandedly ending all animal cruelty.
Okay, I'll concede my point and let you say foie gras is only the 2nd cruelest form of farm animal abuse. Does that change anything?
77
If you want to go after animal cruelty, take after the chicken farms in Arkansas. For that matter, why don't you all just move to Arkansas? How dare you try to tell me what I can eat? Am I trying to force you to eat as God intended us to, seeing as she designed us as omnivores? If you consider it, you and your vegan compatriots are aberrations of nature.
78
As someone who is not even close to Seattle, and who has no feelings for or against foie gras, I find all of this fuss entertaining. I hope this continues for a long while. Perhaps the NARN activists and the restaurateur will get in to a routine like Sam Sheepdog, and Raph Wolf.
"Mornin' John." She will say.
"Morning Jenn. Have a good day." He will reply.
"Mornin' John." She will say.
"Morning Jenn. Have a good day." He will reply.
79
An example of closed community thinking from NARN's website:
http://www.narn.org/about.php
"The NARN community is comprised of many compassionate people from all walks of life ... we all have in common: a conviction to compassionate lifestyles. In the social atmosphere of today's modern world, taking such a stance can often be a daunting task.
One of the greatest resources to any one of us is any other one of us. Our strength, individually, aids others with similar beliefs when we come together communally ..."
Translated: the world is against us, it will never understand what we understand, the best way to survive is to isolate our thinking with others that think only like us. It's no wonder these kids are protesting like abortion clinic radicals.
http://www.narn.org/about.php
"The NARN community is comprised of many compassionate people from all walks of life ... we all have in common: a conviction to compassionate lifestyles. In the social atmosphere of today's modern world, taking such a stance can often be a daunting task.
One of the greatest resources to any one of us is any other one of us. Our strength, individually, aids others with similar beliefs when we come together communally ..."
Translated: the world is against us, it will never understand what we understand, the best way to survive is to isolate our thinking with others that think only like us. It's no wonder these kids are protesting like abortion clinic radicals.
80
Cornichon is right about the anonymous trolling, though. I didn't care either way before, but in the past month or so I'm seriously in favor of registered commenting. It's getting ridiculous over here.
81
We hopefully they'll get the Briana Waters treatment. 10 yrs in the slammer. I hear every one eats meat in the women's wing.
82
@80, why do you think they post this ridiculous shit? It gets people all in a huff and makes them comment and comment and comment, which drives up site hits and ad loads and justifies costs to their advertisers. The Stranger *needs* trolls. Without them, they'd be out of business in a month. Haven't you noticed how thin the print edition is getting, and that when writers leave, they don't get replaced? The number of names I see posting and writing in Slog keeps getting smaller. Dan, et al know exactly what they are doing when they toss up a half-assed, arrogant, incendiary post. They're throwing bloody chicken bits to the alligators in a desperate bid for site attention. This is The New Media, and trolls are the Stranger's bread and butter.
83
@82: if that's the case, I guess I'd rather have the trolls than no Stranger at all. The writers can't pay rent on my goodwill.
84
In Seattle troll = anyone I disagree with.
I've lived in 9 cities, Seattle is the most intolerant yet. The vegans make it even less tolerant.
I've lived in 9 cities, Seattle is the most intolerant yet. The vegans make it even less tolerant.
85
@76
Of course, you fail to answer any of the questions raised, so here they are again:
Which causes massive groundwater contamination?
Which one contributes to global warming? Which practice causes poor communities located near the facilities to suffer statistically higher rates of respiratory illness?
Which practice leads to massive corporate slaughterhouses tucked away in rural communities where tens of thousands of humans work at breakneck speed for pennies, resulting in a tremendous amount of severe injuries, including amputations and death?
You avoid the questions because they lead to an inescapable conclusion, namely that your indignation is out of proportion to the act.
I actually agree that the production of foie gras is cruel. I don't, however, allow a stunted, juvenile sense of bourgeois entitlement to cloud my judgement as to what is really important in the bigger scheme of things. Modern production methods as applied to pork, beef and poultry production are environmentally damaging and unsustainable. They lead to the dehumanization of the workers involved in addition to the cruelty to the animals. Those are relatively easy and successful talking points to make. Changing diets requires people to accept a different cultural paradigm, which happens over time.
I doubt you became a vegan one Wednesday because of some annoying external stimuli.
You choice to focus on this one minor issue illustrates how truly out of touch you are with the suffering on a planet where much of the populace is forced to live on less than $1.00 per day.
Do something meaningful with your anger - the world needs you. The geese? Not so much.
Of course, you fail to answer any of the questions raised, so here they are again:
Which causes massive groundwater contamination?
Which one contributes to global warming? Which practice causes poor communities located near the facilities to suffer statistically higher rates of respiratory illness?
Which practice leads to massive corporate slaughterhouses tucked away in rural communities where tens of thousands of humans work at breakneck speed for pennies, resulting in a tremendous amount of severe injuries, including amputations and death?
You avoid the questions because they lead to an inescapable conclusion, namely that your indignation is out of proportion to the act.
I actually agree that the production of foie gras is cruel. I don't, however, allow a stunted, juvenile sense of bourgeois entitlement to cloud my judgement as to what is really important in the bigger scheme of things. Modern production methods as applied to pork, beef and poultry production are environmentally damaging and unsustainable. They lead to the dehumanization of the workers involved in addition to the cruelty to the animals. Those are relatively easy and successful talking points to make. Changing diets requires people to accept a different cultural paradigm, which happens over time.
I doubt you became a vegan one Wednesday because of some annoying external stimuli.
You choice to focus on this one minor issue illustrates how truly out of touch you are with the suffering on a planet where much of the populace is forced to live on less than $1.00 per day.
Do something meaningful with your anger - the world needs you. The geese? Not so much.
87
"Our strength, individually, aids others with similar beliefs when we come together communally ."
Shit, you could read that on a Taliban website.
Maybe these Northwestern, all white, vegan goat fuckers should just move caves in the North Cascades and leave the rest of us alone?
Shit, you could read that on a Taliban website.
Maybe these Northwestern, all white, vegan goat fuckers should just move caves in the North Cascades and leave the rest of us alone?
88
What is with folks who want to limit or control comments here? If you disagree with a post then make a counter point to it. This place is interesting because it is a free speech zone for or against foie gras. Even if in your opinion someone is trolling you have no right to silence them.
89
Listen up, Narnians:
There are two kinds of animals on this Earth: Those with binocular vision, which need depth perception so that they can stalk and kill their prey, and those with eyes on the sides of their heads, which need a tremendous field of vision in order to avoid becoming food for the animals with binocular vision.
Like it or not, that's just the way it is. You're not gonna change that.
There are two kinds of animals on this Earth: Those with binocular vision, which need depth perception so that they can stalk and kill their prey, and those with eyes on the sides of their heads, which need a tremendous field of vision in order to avoid becoming food for the animals with binocular vision.
Like it or not, that's just the way it is. You're not gonna change that.
90
What is with trolls who want to limit or control comments here? If you disagree with a post then make a counter point to it. This place is interesting because it is a free speech zone for or against trolls. Even if in your opinion someone is trolling you have no right to silence them.
91
One question for the NARNians: if the foie at Lark was produced from a farm that didn't force-feed the ducks, would you still be protesting at Lark?
92
@90 Go back to your dope and your photos of Amanda Knox, Charles. You're not making any more sense than usual.
93
To the NARN people here, who on the city council supports the arrest and imprisonment of people who will defy the fois gras ban and fines? Do you have a single politician in Seattle or Washington State who supports this? Please let me know.
94
"Our strength, individually, aids others with similar beliefs when we come together communally ."
Shit, you could read that on a John McCain website.
Maybe these suburban, pasty, meat eating trolls should just move caves in the North Cascades and leave the rest of us alone?
Shit, you could read that on a John McCain website.
Maybe these suburban, pasty, meat eating trolls should just move caves in the North Cascades and leave the rest of us alone?
95
@90 Go back to your dope and your photos of trolls, Dickus Maximus. You're not making any more sense than usual.
96
To the troll people here, who on the city council supports the arrest and imprisonment of people who will defy the troll ban and fines? Do you have a single politician in Seattle or Washington State who supports this? Please let me know.
97
"Shit, you could read that on a John McCain website."
You're right which is why I voted for Obama. These vegans are like Republican fundamentalists so your comparison is apt. Thanks for your support.
You're right which is why I voted for Obama. These vegans are like Republican fundamentalists so your comparison is apt. Thanks for your support.
98
"Shit, you could read that on a John McCain website."
You're right which is why I voted for Obama. These trolls are like Republican fundamentalists so your comparison is apt. Thanks for your support.
You're right which is why I voted for Obama. These trolls are like Republican fundamentalists so your comparison is apt. Thanks for your support.
99
Homegirl, sweetie... Is there a treatment of animals that would give you some pause? Any? Or do you only hate people?
100
I, for one, and tired of the assertions that we as NARN aren't involved in more "worthy" issues. Who's for you to decide what's worthy or not? And who's to say we're not involved in the more "big-picture" issues? If you ever bothered to even click on our site, you'll see, as an example, that we've introduced a lawsuit against the state of Washington and King County to declare as unconstitutional certain exemptions in the animal cruelty laws in the state regarding the treatment of farm animals. We work with organizations to reduce and mitigate the amount of unnecessary cruelty that occurs in factory farms.
And we as the board of directors at NARN work in day jobs involving social justice issues, everything from providing legal assistance to the indigent, social work for the persistently and severely mentally ill, working with children with severe language delays, providing health care, etc. So we don't "care about animals more than humans." Nothing could be further from the truth. We are are all compassionate people, helping out people *and* animals. To us, any form of cruelty, either to humans *or* animals is unacceptable. We take the stands we do do because animals can't defend themselves. We provide the voice for the voiceless. And we encourage others to do so because as we can see from some of these callous posts, it's unfortunate that some people don't have any room in their hearts for the plight of the animals.
And we as the board of directors at NARN work in day jobs involving social justice issues, everything from providing legal assistance to the indigent, social work for the persistently and severely mentally ill, working with children with severe language delays, providing health care, etc. So we don't "care about animals more than humans." Nothing could be further from the truth. We are are all compassionate people, helping out people *and* animals. To us, any form of cruelty, either to humans *or* animals is unacceptable. We take the stands we do do because animals can't defend themselves. We provide the voice for the voiceless. And we encourage others to do so because as we can see from some of these callous posts, it's unfortunate that some people don't have any room in their hearts for the plight of the animals.
101
@100, please clear all social protest movements through Bethany Jean Clement, Dan Savage's brother and Jonathan Golob. They are going to determine for the rest of us what we should care about and when, and how we should act on those concerns.
102
May I remind everyone that Sonoma Artisan Foie Gras, a Californian company that supplies Lark (so much for being local) has as of two weeks ago, been found guilty in the California court system of animal cruelty (so much for humane and ethical).
I think Bethany should stop cut-and-pasting the company's talking points and get the real facts. But that entails work. But we know that the Stranger writers don't like work (so much for journalism).
I think Bethany should stop cut-and-pasting the company's talking points and get the real facts. But that entails work. But we know that the Stranger writers don't like work (so much for journalism).
104
A lot of anger in this post. No one and I mean no one ever comes to your side let a lone truly listens to what you have to say when you shout and reduce everything to name calling.
I think the posters need a time out - you are losing fast.
That said, I am sure no one here gives a shit about what I said, soooo, let the troll-fest continue!
I think the posters need a time out - you are losing fast.
That said, I am sure no one here gives a shit about what I said, soooo, let the troll-fest continue!
105
To Worf: we do deal with the major issues of factory farming and the environmental impact they have. Just because we're protesting something that has cruelty designed in the product instead of cruelty based on economics doesn't make us any less hypocritical. We do indeed protest against any other form of cruelty against animals no matter the kind of cruelty. But Lark claims to be ethical, humane, organic and sustainable. And we're calling them out on that. Because the foie gras that they get from Sonoma is not local, nor humane, or ethical. They were found guilty of animal cruelty not more than two weeks ago in California.
106
#102 & 105
It is funny I keep hearing you guys say that "Sonoma Artisan was found guilty two weeks ago of cruelty" but in all of my web searches I find absolutely ZERO references to your claim.
So, either list a link to a reputable source (ie not your site or any other site with your agenda) or admit that you made this one up (ie that your are full of goose shit).
It is funny I keep hearing you guys say that "Sonoma Artisan was found guilty two weeks ago of cruelty" but in all of my web searches I find absolutely ZERO references to your claim.
So, either list a link to a reputable source (ie not your site or any other site with your agenda) or admit that you made this one up (ie that your are full of goose shit).
108
"This person has never been in contact with any live animal. "
This person has never been in contact with any caged animal.
This person has never been in contact with any caged animal.
109
@106 That's because it's a recent ruling that hasn't made its way to the "internets" yet. The Better Business Bureau will make a listing against Sonoma soon, and there will be other posts soon from other sources. Let's say that we're doing more journalistic one-upsmanship than the Stranger is capable of.
110
@33:
If this is as you claim, then why weren't the owners of Sonoma Artisan charged with Animal Cruelty back in 2003? Why have they been allowed to stay in business all these years? Why were they given an EIGHT YEAR window in which to continue to operate?
Something stinks here - and it's not the goose shit...
If this is as you claim, then why weren't the owners of Sonoma Artisan charged with Animal Cruelty back in 2003? Why have they been allowed to stay in business all these years? Why were they given an EIGHT YEAR window in which to continue to operate?
Something stinks here - and it's not the goose shit...
111
What Peter fails to realize is that we are all adults here, capable of making our own informed decisions. If Peter doesn't like the way foie gras is produced, don't eat. But DO NOT tell me what I can and cannot eat; and do not tell Jon Sundstrom what he can and cannot serve. Foie gras is legal to serve in this state and Peter's group has every right to tell us why we shouldn't eat it; and let us make up our own minds. But not the right to disrupt Jon's business, when Jon is doing nothing wrong!
112
Boy, I had to check out of these threads for a day or so because the level of discourse on here is pathetic. It's just the same rabid angry low comments over and over. I don't see any animal rights activists on here getting ugly, but being rational and trying to respond to these poorly cobbled together biased Slog posts by Bethany and all the reactionary hate spewing by anti-protestors.
You all mock us protestors and NARN and animal rights people, but in the end you are the ones looking extreme and extremely fucked up. If a small group of dedicated animal rights activists are so laughable, stupid and misguided...why are you all so defensive and upset by them? If we aren't having any impact with this foie gras issue, why are there so many comments about it? Why are there so many threads if this is just a little misguided bunch of wackos that aren't going to change anything?
I'm not sorry to say that this is making an impact, however the progress goes at the Lark protests. Many people that didn't know about foie gras formerly now know about it and have said they won't choose it anymore. Several people that still eat meat and will never be a vegetarian, let alone a vegan, have told me that they will never eat foie gras because they agree that it is a cruel product.
All your childish redundant irrational comments carry no weight.
Foie gras is cruel period. How animals are treated is important.
You all mock us protestors and NARN and animal rights people, but in the end you are the ones looking extreme and extremely fucked up. If a small group of dedicated animal rights activists are so laughable, stupid and misguided...why are you all so defensive and upset by them? If we aren't having any impact with this foie gras issue, why are there so many comments about it? Why are there so many threads if this is just a little misguided bunch of wackos that aren't going to change anything?
I'm not sorry to say that this is making an impact, however the progress goes at the Lark protests. Many people that didn't know about foie gras formerly now know about it and have said they won't choose it anymore. Several people that still eat meat and will never be a vegetarian, let alone a vegan, have told me that they will never eat foie gras because they agree that it is a cruel product.
All your childish redundant irrational comments carry no weight.
Foie gras is cruel period. How animals are treated is important.
113
@82/84: YES
@88: It's called accountability. It means an end to sock-puppets and people taking responsibility for what they say -- people tend to think more about what they say when they can't hide behind a million fake identities.
@88: It's called accountability. It means an end to sock-puppets and people taking responsibility for what they say -- people tend to think more about what they say when they can't hide behind a million fake identities.
114
@109:
But you can't cite a specific instance of a court decision on-file through - one would presume - Sonoma County Superior Court? Where BTW, no record exists of a tentative ruling against either the owners or the entity in question?
Uh-huh. Sounds like someone believes their own hype a little too much.
But you can't cite a specific instance of a court decision on-file through - one would presume - Sonoma County Superior Court? Where BTW, no record exists of a tentative ruling against either the owners or the entity in question?
Uh-huh. Sounds like someone believes their own hype a little too much.
115
Yes, I haven't found any information saying that Sonoma Artisan Foie Gras being charged with anything. It seems like a made up internet myth to me.
A couple of questions I'd like answered from the anti-meat crowd:
If you had to choose between a child, or a cat, which one would you rescue from a burning building?
What would be the reasoning behind your prioritizing one over the other?
A couple of questions I'd like answered from the anti-meat crowd:
If you had to choose between a child, or a cat, which one would you rescue from a burning building?
What would be the reasoning behind your prioritizing one over the other?
116
To Peter from NARN.
Veganism is a dietary choice. So is eating foie gras.
I think I get why they have decided to go after foie gras. The dish is somewhat exotic and has snob appeal and is therefore not eaten by a large part of the population. They figure it would be a eaiser to start by forcing a ban on a product that only a few people actually enjoy or perhaps even know about. It is a gateway issue. This is why even though most of us never eat the stuff we should none-the-less speak out on behalf of those who want to eat it and those who choose to prepare and sell it. Let us keep their dream of vegan city an unobtainable goal.
Veganism is a dietary choice. So is eating foie gras.
I think I get why they have decided to go after foie gras. The dish is somewhat exotic and has snob appeal and is therefore not eaten by a large part of the population. They figure it would be a eaiser to start by forcing a ban on a product that only a few people actually enjoy or perhaps even know about. It is a gateway issue. This is why even though most of us never eat the stuff we should none-the-less speak out on behalf of those who want to eat it and those who choose to prepare and sell it. Let us keep their dream of vegan city an unobtainable goal.
117
Gander, it's a class attack too. You think they're going go protest at halal butchers? This is easy because [they think] it's acceptable to go after what rich white people eat. You know, because we're such oppressors, even the geese get it from us.
Funny, since all these kids are so f*cking bourgeois themselves.
Funny, since all these kids are so f*cking bourgeois themselves.
118
They do come from privileged backrounds and have the luxury of being picky about their diets. Some of these same food police go so far as to try to prevent GMO grains from being exported to countries whose population may be near starvation. It seems that if you merely inconvenience or jostle a goose these people go nuts, but if people are starving they really don't give a shit.
119
To understand NARN's sense of victimhood, watch their executive committee's most recent meeting:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o76WQzVJ4…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o76WQzVJ4…
120
Peter Keller - My point isn't that NARN, as an organization, isn't involved in some "big picture" issues, but rather that harassing a local small business over a rather insignificant issue is
A) counter productive and
b) displays a stunning sense of bourgeois entitlement
My point that there are really vile, despicable, evil things happening, and that those things need the attention of activists such as your self is valid. Every moment wasted by pedantic, juvenile children of privilege protesting in front of Lark is another moment lost in the struggle against far more pressing and, yes, IMPORTANT, things. All NARN has accomplished with this sad stunt is to make yourselves look shallow and I think you and your members are probably better than that.
A) counter productive and
b) displays a stunning sense of bourgeois entitlement
My point that there are really vile, despicable, evil things happening, and that those things need the attention of activists such as your self is valid. Every moment wasted by pedantic, juvenile children of privilege protesting in front of Lark is another moment lost in the struggle against far more pressing and, yes, IMPORTANT, things. All NARN has accomplished with this sad stunt is to make yourselves look shallow and I think you and your members are probably better than that.
121
"the board of directors at NARN work in day jobs involving social justice issues"
Great, professional busy bodies. ANyone there have a real job, you know, on that employs people and gives them work like, say, a restaurant like Lark?
Great, professional busy bodies. ANyone there have a real job, you know, on that employs people and gives them work like, say, a restaurant like Lark?
123
Should motorized vehicles, cars, buses, trains, planes, scooters, etc, be banned because they have created a holocaust for insects?
124
Rob, that reminds me of that great joke:
What's the last thing that goes through a fly's brain when it hits your windshield?
Its a**hole.
What's the last thing that goes through a fly's brain when it hits your windshield?
Its a**hole.
125
YUMMM just last night my boyfriend and I each stuck a raw lobe of foie gras up our asses, squeezed it back out, and pan seared it with a nice apricot relish. GOD was that good. A bit nutty tasting...
126
@116:
There's another psychological element at work here as well. By selecting a food source most people don't care that much about, and targeting a small, local establishment, NARN believed they could score an easy victory (although, not so easy as they envisioned, apparently), one they could tout in their press releases, and one that would make the do-gooders feel they'd accomplished something of significance.
After that, they most likely planned to target yet another equally small, local purveyor of the dreaded foie gras in an attempt to repeat the cycle. This would give them the self-perception of forward motion, and allow them to continue to puff themselves up for their stalwart support to the cause.
Of course, in the larger scheme of things these "victories" are Pyrrhic at best, because they don't do anything to address larger, more pressing, and unquestionably more difficult-to-surmount obstacles, but that's not the point. The point is to make them feel that their Lilliputian caterwauling is truly world-shattering, that their defeat of the dreaded goose-stuffing is just the first step toward their ultimate goal of eradicating meat consumption entirely (a goal they know deep-down is completely unrealistic and unattainable) but still these tiny, insignificant victories will continue to fire their fervor.
It will be interesting to see what happens when they finally come to the realization their actions have in fact not only NOT curtailed the consumption of foie gras, but rather have (at least in the short-term) increased it dramatically. How many more poor, defenseless geese are they willing to see die before they realize it's all been for naught? Because, if they REALLY cared about the welfare of the animals, as they so sanctimoniously claim, they'd be forced to confront the reality that their actions are killing more of them and at a faster rate than would be the case had they not engaged in this short-sighted, effete protest in the first place.
Even the most ardent True Believer has a breaking point. I wonder how many happy, satisfied Lark patrons (the last moist morsels of fatted goose liver still clinging to their glistening lips) walking out the door it will take before they begin to become completely demoralized at their useless, pathetic impotency?
More...
There's another psychological element at work here as well. By selecting a food source most people don't care that much about, and targeting a small, local establishment, NARN believed they could score an easy victory (although, not so easy as they envisioned, apparently), one they could tout in their press releases, and one that would make the do-gooders feel they'd accomplished something of significance.
After that, they most likely planned to target yet another equally small, local purveyor of the dreaded foie gras in an attempt to repeat the cycle. This would give them the self-perception of forward motion, and allow them to continue to puff themselves up for their stalwart support to the cause.
Of course, in the larger scheme of things these "victories" are Pyrrhic at best, because they don't do anything to address larger, more pressing, and unquestionably more difficult-to-surmount obstacles, but that's not the point. The point is to make them feel that their Lilliputian caterwauling is truly world-shattering, that their defeat of the dreaded goose-stuffing is just the first step toward their ultimate goal of eradicating meat consumption entirely (a goal they know deep-down is completely unrealistic and unattainable) but still these tiny, insignificant victories will continue to fire their fervor.
It will be interesting to see what happens when they finally come to the realization their actions have in fact not only NOT curtailed the consumption of foie gras, but rather have (at least in the short-term) increased it dramatically. How many more poor, defenseless geese are they willing to see die before they realize it's all been for naught? Because, if they REALLY cared about the welfare of the animals, as they so sanctimoniously claim, they'd be forced to confront the reality that their actions are killing more of them and at a faster rate than would be the case had they not engaged in this short-sighted, effete protest in the first place.
Even the most ardent True Believer has a breaking point. I wonder how many happy, satisfied Lark patrons (the last moist morsels of fatted goose liver still clinging to their glistening lips) walking out the door it will take before they begin to become completely demoralized at their useless, pathetic impotency?
127
Aurgh. . . this is so depressing.
Just goes to show that ethics, in practice, is all mob mentality. If enough people agree that you don't WANT it to be wrong, and you refuse to ACT like it's wrong, then it's not wrong. Morality = group consensus.
Thus, people who object to cruelty to animals (which, you know, out of this context, most of you would probably object to as well) become the unethical ones. The bad guys. The assholes. They offend the mob. Their moral stand is false because it goes against the group consensus.
I accept that this is the reality of things, but it does make me sad. Humanity, that is.
Just goes to show that ethics, in practice, is all mob mentality. If enough people agree that you don't WANT it to be wrong, and you refuse to ACT like it's wrong, then it's not wrong. Morality = group consensus.
Thus, people who object to cruelty to animals (which, you know, out of this context, most of you would probably object to as well) become the unethical ones. The bad guys. The assholes. They offend the mob. Their moral stand is false because it goes against the group consensus.
I accept that this is the reality of things, but it does make me sad. Humanity, that is.
128
@ 126. My experience with them makes me wonder about the motives of some of them. (yes I accept most are sincere even if I disagree with them)
The ones I sometimes saw years ago protesting fur at the opera or symphony will never acknowledge to themselves how futile their efforts are. Some seem to enjoy trying to bully little old laides in fur coats. Others seem driven by some narcissistic impulse. For some of them it seems to be a pathological need to be seen.
The ones I sometimes saw years ago protesting fur at the opera or symphony will never acknowledge to themselves how futile their efforts are. Some seem to enjoy trying to bully little old laides in fur coats. Others seem driven by some narcissistic impulse. For some of them it seems to be a pathological need to be seen.
129
I'd never heard of NARN before this week, nor have I ever eaten at Lark or ever eaten foie gras. And yet, despite having no stake in this issue I suddenly want nothing more than to see NARN driven out of town.
There's something just so unbelievably infuriating about such aggressive, in your face stupidity.
There's something just so unbelievably infuriating about such aggressive, in your face stupidity.
130
@127" They offend the mob. "
I'm sorry, we're not the ones calling for the imprisonment of people who buy, sell and consume foie gras. That's the angry mob on the street called NARN. We're just trying to enjoy a nice quiet meal, sip a sauterne.
And yes, NARN wants those of us who refuse to comply with their dream ban to be jailed. Because that's what will happen if we resist.
I'm sorry, we're not the ones calling for the imprisonment of people who buy, sell and consume foie gras. That's the angry mob on the street called NARN. We're just trying to enjoy a nice quiet meal, sip a sauterne.
And yes, NARN wants those of us who refuse to comply with their dream ban to be jailed. Because that's what will happen if we resist.
131
where does gay marriage fit? is it okay for gays to protest 8 when there are so many more important things?
It is the height of bourgeois privilege to stand in front of Lark in a petulant, pedantic, juvenile snit, protesting foie for fucks sake, when there are a million things vastly more important, more damaging and more evil occurring every second of every fucking day. NARN has apparently not heard of global warming, Gaza, extraordinary rendition, East Timor, Columbian president Uribe killing union activists, economic collapse, the great drifting whirlpool of plastic in the Pacific ocean,etc. ad naseum.
where does gay marriage fit? is it okay for gays to protest 8 when there are so many more important things?
132
I do have to say, that foie gras wasn't on my radar. I've heard of it in passing, but never really thought about trying it. Now I feel like I've got to give it a try. I just read a review of a local restaurant that serves it (There are several that are easy to find thanks to the protesters websites.) When I read reviews that say things like "I know, I know, Foie Gras is so un-PC, I get that. But Salt serves these Foie Gras Kobe Sliders that will make you want to force feed Donald Duck your own damn self." It now on my top things to do this weekend.
133
And you'll notice how none of them can admit that maybe late term abortions are just as nasty, violent and cruel as fattening up geese for dinner. God forbid their vaginas be inconvenienced.
F*cking hypocrites. They want to allow people to be able to suck out their 7 month old babies, crush their skulls, suck out their brains and throw the mess in the trash but I want some foie gras and suddenly I'm a Nazi.
FYI I'm 100% pro-choice. In fact, I'd allow for retroactive abortions in the case of NARN members to save their parents any further embarrassment.
F*cking hypocrites. They want to allow people to be able to suck out their 7 month old babies, crush their skulls, suck out their brains and throw the mess in the trash but I want some foie gras and suddenly I'm a Nazi.
FYI I'm 100% pro-choice. In fact, I'd allow for retroactive abortions in the case of NARN members to save their parents any further embarrassment.
134
131, I'll ask you. If you had to choose between saving a child, or a cat from a burning building which would you choose?
Would you prioritize one over the other?
If so, why?
Would you prioritize one over the other?
If so, why?
135
@130
I'm not saying that animal rights activists are any less human. Any less prone to human stupidity. Plenty of group-think, and absolutely self-important, narcissistic bullshit.
Still. I favor the stupid humans who are putting their lot behind "compassion" over "but, it's so tasty!". I prefer the fumbling idealism to the heartless selfishness. But that's just me.
I'm not saying that animal rights activists are any less human. Any less prone to human stupidity. Plenty of group-think, and absolutely self-important, narcissistic bullshit.
Still. I favor the stupid humans who are putting their lot behind "compassion" over "but, it's so tasty!". I prefer the fumbling idealism to the heartless selfishness. But that's just me.
136
I'd say the selfish people are the ones who want to close down businesses, throw people out of work and force everyone to eat and think like them.
The foie gras eaters here aren't the ones forcing our choices on other people. We're pro-choice.
The foie gras eaters here aren't the ones forcing our choices on other people. We're pro-choice.
137
The activists are saying look: foie gras is cruel. That is the basis of their campaign. So... running out to scarf some foie gras, listing other "more important" causes, insulting them and/or criticizing their methods or the way they transmit their message is not a valid counter argument. Just so you know. It doesn't make their claims wrong and to someone with a brain, it doesn't make the activists look bad. It just makes you look like a fucking asshole. An asshole who can't argue properly.
Sure, activism is fucked up sometimes. But I think the biggest problem with it is that it draws attention (and ire!) to the activists rather than what they are very sincerely trying to talk about. What kind of person posts mean, anonymous comments to put themselves on the pro-suffering side of a debate on a stupid ass blog anyway? What the fuck?
Sure, activism is fucked up sometimes. But I think the biggest problem with it is that it draws attention (and ire!) to the activists rather than what they are very sincerely trying to talk about. What kind of person posts mean, anonymous comments to put themselves on the pro-suffering side of a debate on a stupid ass blog anyway? What the fuck?
138
"pro-suffering side of a debate"
OK, if I'm pro-suffering, show me one vegan who opposes late term abortion.
OK, if I'm pro-suffering, show me one vegan who opposes late term abortion.
139
@136
Protesting isn't "forcing" anybody to do anything. It's trying to draw attention to an issue in what is actually a very peaceful, socially legitimate way. They're ASKING people to make a different choice. There's nothing wrong with that.
@137
Well said.
Protesting isn't "forcing" anybody to do anything. It's trying to draw attention to an issue in what is actually a very peaceful, socially legitimate way. They're ASKING people to make a different choice. There's nothing wrong with that.
@137
Well said.
140
@138
I don't think you can neatly equate foie gras consumption and late-term abortion. The abortion issue is a bit more complicated and nuanced.
OBVIOUSLY. Fer fuck's sake.
I don't think you can neatly equate foie gras consumption and late-term abortion. The abortion issue is a bit more complicated and nuanced.
OBVIOUSLY. Fer fuck's sake.
141
"Pro-suffering"? First you have to prove that their is suffering beyond that of any other animal that raised for food.
We live in a world with ecosystems where animals eat one another.
We live in a world with ecosystems where animals eat one another.
142
140, In late term abortion, a fetus that could survive outside the womb is killed.
Why is aborting and killing a fetus okay, while killing a duck for food is not?
Why is aborting and killing a fetus okay, while killing a duck for food is not?
143
"Protesting isn't "forcing" anybody to do anything."
Excuse me? NARN wants the city and state to BAN and OUTLAW foie gras. If we defy it, we will be jailed. That's what happens when the government bans something. They are not asking, they're demanding, with state intervention, that we live like them.
"The abortion issue is a bit more complicated and nuanced. "
Yes, because banning it AFFECTS YOU. Suddenly things get complicated when it comes to your freedoms. MY freedoms? Oh that's fucking simple.
Excuse me? NARN wants the city and state to BAN and OUTLAW foie gras. If we defy it, we will be jailed. That's what happens when the government bans something. They are not asking, they're demanding, with state intervention, that we live like them.
"The abortion issue is a bit more complicated and nuanced. "
Yes, because banning it AFFECTS YOU. Suddenly things get complicated when it comes to your freedoms. MY freedoms? Oh that's fucking simple.
144
@141
Rob. In Baltimore. Having a tube pushed into your stomach and having it pumped over-full with food is a bad experience. Now, granted, there's PLENTY of misery in modern agriculture. While I object to that as well, it is actually done for a reason: to make a cheap product at maximum profit. To feed people at minimal cost. Foie gras is a luxury item. I think it gets special attention because it is inherently cruel (well, almost; foie gras can be produced without gavage, but almost nobody does it because it is SO resource-intensive) and basically frivolous. Raising cows for beef? Not inherently cruel. In practice, it almost always is. But it doesn't have to be.
Let me tell you, I have no problem with people eating animals. I have no problem with people who hunt wild animals for food. I have a problem with factory farming. Foie gras production is a particularly appalling part of that. Sort of like veal. It's inhumane.
Inhumane. Below us as a species. Or, below what I wish we were. Not below what we actually are, clearly.
Rob. In Baltimore. Having a tube pushed into your stomach and having it pumped over-full with food is a bad experience. Now, granted, there's PLENTY of misery in modern agriculture. While I object to that as well, it is actually done for a reason: to make a cheap product at maximum profit. To feed people at minimal cost. Foie gras is a luxury item. I think it gets special attention because it is inherently cruel (well, almost; foie gras can be produced without gavage, but almost nobody does it because it is SO resource-intensive) and basically frivolous. Raising cows for beef? Not inherently cruel. In practice, it almost always is. But it doesn't have to be.
Let me tell you, I have no problem with people eating animals. I have no problem with people who hunt wild animals for food. I have a problem with factory farming. Foie gras production is a particularly appalling part of that. Sort of like veal. It's inhumane.
Inhumane. Below us as a species. Or, below what I wish we were. Not below what we actually are, clearly.
145
@143
NARN can't make laws. Legislators make laws. Their protest is not forcing anybody to do anything. People can decide, based on what they hear, what they think and what they want to do about it. Calm the fuck down.
@142/143
I would be perfectly happy to come and debate late-term abortion with you, and even discuss how the ethical issues relate to animal rights issues, if you want to start a thread elsewhere. This isn't the place. I will say that I think killing a duck for food is perfectly fine. Torturing it first is not.
Except,well, it is, because majority rules, and if the majority cares more about being able to eat whatever the hell they want, more than they care about who gets hurt in the process. . . then anything we want to do is totally acceptable. Human morality in action. :w00t:
NARN can't make laws. Legislators make laws. Their protest is not forcing anybody to do anything. People can decide, based on what they hear, what they think and what they want to do about it. Calm the fuck down.
@142/143
I would be perfectly happy to come and debate late-term abortion with you, and even discuss how the ethical issues relate to animal rights issues, if you want to start a thread elsewhere. This isn't the place. I will say that I think killing a duck for food is perfectly fine. Torturing it first is not.
Except,well, it is, because majority rules, and if the majority cares more about being able to eat whatever the hell they want, more than they care about who gets hurt in the process. . . then anything we want to do is totally acceptable. Human morality in action. :w00t:
146
I suggest that those of us who support freedom of dietary choice begin calling, writing and emailing the city council and legislature. Simply tell them that the issue is freedom of choice and that you oppose any proposed ban on foi gras. Elected politicans on the local level do pay attention when voters take the time to contact them. There are enough of us dietary choice advocates who can eaisly undo any efforts that NARN has already tried. They see the issue as a starting point and getting a foot in the door of choice so this is the time to nip it in the budd.
They may attempt to place the issue on the ballot. I think if dietary choice supporters can counter with a clear message that it is all about choice that we can win at the ballot box. I can picture a campaign advertisement where an armed SWAT team breaks down your door and seizes your refrigerator.
They may attempt to place the issue on the ballot. I think if dietary choice supporters can counter with a clear message that it is all about choice that we can win at the ballot box. I can picture a campaign advertisement where an armed SWAT team breaks down your door and seizes your refrigerator.
147
Ducks are not people. Birds are not physically like people. They do not have a gag reflex. The entire process takes about 3-5 seconds, and in the case of artisan farms, it's not particularly traumatic to the animals. In the wild, ducks to gorge themselves before migration, and their livers become fatty. (This is why, and how the ancient Egyptians got the idea to force feed fowl in the first place.) The force feeding takes place for about 2-3 weeks before the slaughter.
Again, you have yet to prove that there is anything inherently inhumane with raising geese for foie gras than for any other food type.
Again, you have yet to prove that there is anything inherently inhumane with raising geese for foie gras than for any other food type.
148
"Their protest is not forcing anybody to do anything. "
Nice red herring. NARN is actively pushing our legislators to change the laws. Would you say the same thing about abortion clinic protestors, that they are harmless and have no intention or effect on our freedom to choose? So we should simply stand back and not fight back?
"This isn't the place."
Uh huh, right, too inconvenient at the moment.
"I will say that I think killing a duck for food is perfectly fine. Torturing it first is not."
So you think a 7 month old fetus enjoys being extracted, having it's skull cracked open and brains extracted?
Again, I'm 100% pro choice. NARN is not.
Nice red herring. NARN is actively pushing our legislators to change the laws. Would you say the same thing about abortion clinic protestors, that they are harmless and have no intention or effect on our freedom to choose? So we should simply stand back and not fight back?
"This isn't the place."
Uh huh, right, too inconvenient at the moment.
"I will say that I think killing a duck for food is perfectly fine. Torturing it first is not."
So you think a 7 month old fetus enjoys being extracted, having it's skull cracked open and brains extracted?
Again, I'm 100% pro choice. NARN is not.
150
@147
Not having a gag reflex doesn't make it a comfortable experience. As I said, it's not exactly inherently humane, but the way that the VAST majority of it is produced is not ok. Did you watch the video on the original thread? I think it was @11. That's the norm. Happy geese are the exception. Because happy geese are more expensive. And we, the good, brave, free, God-fearing folks of these United States of America, consider maximum profit and minimum price to be more important than damn near anything.
If you are going to the trouble to humanely source your animal products, I applaud you. You're unusual.
Not having a gag reflex doesn't make it a comfortable experience. As I said, it's not exactly inherently humane, but the way that the VAST majority of it is produced is not ok. Did you watch the video on the original thread? I think it was @11. That's the norm. Happy geese are the exception. Because happy geese are more expensive. And we, the good, brave, free, God-fearing folks of these United States of America, consider maximum profit and minimum price to be more important than damn near anything.
If you are going to the trouble to humanely source your animal products, I applaud you. You're unusual.
151
145, I'll ask again, and again you'll avoid answering.
Why is okay to abort and kill a late term fetus that could survive outside the womb, (which involves getting the fetus's head outside the womb, and sucking out the brain.) but force feeding a duck is wrong. My guess is that as another person put it, abortion affects YOUR rights, so we can't discuss it.
Why is okay to abort and kill a late term fetus that could survive outside the womb, (which involves getting the fetus's head outside the womb, and sucking out the brain.) but force feeding a duck is wrong. My guess is that as another person put it, abortion affects YOUR rights, so we can't discuss it.
152
@148
Hey, we can do it right now, just not on this already-lengthy thread. Dude, you need to let it go. I know you've got it in your head that this abortion point is somehow relevant. That you are somehow exposing AR folks as hypocrites. I can beat that argument into a bloody pulp that would make your average half-dead crushed gosling look like a Norman Rockwell print. I'd enjoy it. But I'm not gonna derail this thread for it.
M'kay?
I support abortion protesters as well, as long as they aren't violent. I don't support the laws they advocate. I think they're wrong. I'll continue to vote accordingly. But I understand where they're coming from.
Hey, we can do it right now, just not on this already-lengthy thread. Dude, you need to let it go. I know you've got it in your head that this abortion point is somehow relevant. That you are somehow exposing AR folks as hypocrites. I can beat that argument into a bloody pulp that would make your average half-dead crushed gosling look like a Norman Rockwell print. I'd enjoy it. But I'm not gonna derail this thread for it.
M'kay?
I support abortion protesters as well, as long as they aren't violent. I don't support the laws they advocate. I think they're wrong. I'll continue to vote accordingly. But I understand where they're coming from.
153
@151: see @152.
Really, nothing would make me happier. Abortion debates are like batting practice for ethics students. Nice warm-up for real intellectual work.
Really, nothing would make me happier. Abortion debates are like batting practice for ethics students. Nice warm-up for real intellectual work.
154
150, Yes, there are videos of places where they don't treat the animals humanely. (The same could be said about any animal raised for food and pets. NARN is picketing a establishment that gets it's foie gras from an artisan farm that humanly produces their foods. If I posted some gruesome videos and images from late term abortions, would that make you think that all abortions are wrong?
155
153, as predicted, you avoided answering again. So I'll ask again. Notice I didn't ask about abortion protesters. (You are good at diversion, but not so much actually debating.)
Why is aborting and killing a late term fetus okay, while force feeding a duck for food is not.
Why is aborting and killing a late term fetus okay, while force feeding a duck for food is not.
156
@154
If Lark is humanely sourcing its foie gras, good for them. I'm skeptical, but, hey. Good. And if you honestly believe that cruelty is the exception and not the rule in animal agriculture. . . ehm. . .rational debate probably isn't worth my time.
And: not gonna do the abortion smack-down here! Already said that about a half-dozen times! :D
I actually do have other stuff I should be doing, but if somebody gets around to starting up an abortion debate in a more appropriate forum, drop me a line and I'll jump in: spamspamspamspam@fastmail.fm . :wave:
If Lark is humanely sourcing its foie gras, good for them. I'm skeptical, but, hey. Good. And if you honestly believe that cruelty is the exception and not the rule in animal agriculture. . . ehm. . .rational debate probably isn't worth my time.
And: not gonna do the abortion smack-down here! Already said that about a half-dozen times! :D
I actually do have other stuff I should be doing, but if somebody gets around to starting up an abortion debate in a more appropriate forum, drop me a line and I'll jump in: spamspamspamspam@fastmail.fm . :wave:
157
"minimum price"
Clearly you've never eaten artisan made foe gras. ‘Cheap price’ aren't words that come to mind when you eat it.
"I know you've got it in your head that this abortion point is somehow relevant."
Right, you want to talk about rights, ethics, morality of our fellow beings, EXCEPT 7 month old babies because....well, because that's inconvenient for you.
No one listens to a hypocrite. That's why I respect but disagree with the Dalai Lamai who is vegetarian AND pro-life.
"a bloody pulp that would make your average half-dead crushed gosling look like a Norman Rockwell print"
Show me. And I'll show you a photo of a late term abortion that will make your photo look decidedly edible.
"Nice warm-up for real intellectual work."
Yes, dead babies are just warm up for the big act, overfed geese. Jeez, can you look more ridiculous?
But thanks Violet, you've basically said it's ok to eat well treated geese, like the ones I saw in France in 2006 in Perigord. Happy as campers, came running across the field to be fed.
"minimum price"
Clearly you've never eaten artisan made foe gras. ‘Cheap price’ aren't words that come to mind when you eat it.
"I know you've got it in your head that this abortion point is somehow relevant."
Right, you want to talk about rights, ethics, morality of our fellow beings, EXCEPT 7 month old babies because....well, because that's inconvenient for you.
No one listens to a hypocrite. That's why I respect but disagree with the Dalai Lamai who is vegetarian AND pro-life.
"a bloody pulp that would make your average half-dead crushed gosling look like a Norman Rockwell print"
Show me. And I'll show you a photo of a late term abortion that will make your photo look decidedly edible.
"Nice warm-up for real intellectual work."
Yes, dead babies are just warm up for the big act, overfed geese. Jeez, can you look more ridiculous?
But thanks Violet, you've basically said it's ok to eat well treated geese, like the ones I saw in France in 2006 in Perigord. Happy as campers, came running across the field to be fed.
158
"I actually do have other stuff I should be doing"
yes, run along. Seems all the NARNits have run off when challenged.
yes, run along. Seems all the NARNits have run off when challenged.
159
156, I knew you would refuse to address your stance on abortion versus animal rights because would show the tremendous flaw in your arguments. Buh bye.
160
Thanks for tag teaming Rob, Violet's off to be with her community where everyone thinks the same and acts the same and busy trying to make us be like them:
NARN: "One of the greatest resources to any one of us is any other one of us. Our strength, individually, aids others with similar beliefs when we come together communally"
Welcome to America's Taliban.
NARN: "One of the greatest resources to any one of us is any other one of us. Our strength, individually, aids others with similar beliefs when we come together communally"
Welcome to America's Taliban.
161
OH you have to try this. Take 2 fat lobes of goose liver, put your cock inbetween them, work yourself into a spoot, take newly seasoned lobes and pan sear with a demiglace. HOLY shit is it tasty. I FUCKING LOVE FOIE GRAS AND YOU CAN TAKE IT OUT OF MY COLD DEAD HANDS (or anus depending on method of seasoning).
162
Sauteed Duck Foie Gras
yield: Makes 4 servings
Sautéeing duck foie gras is not hard to do, but be careful; otherwise, you'll end up with a puddle of very expensive melted fat.
subscribe to Gourmet
Ingredients
* 1/2 lb piece raw Grade A duck foie gras at room temperature, cleaned and deveined
* Salt and pepper to taste
* 2 tsp canola oil
* 2 tbsp balsamic vinegar
* Special equipment: a 10-inch heavy skillet
Preparation
After deveining, cut the foie gras crosswise into 1/2-inch-thick pieces, then season with salt and pepper.
Heat 1 teaspoon of the canola oil in a 10-inch heavy skillet over moderately high heat until hot but not smoking.
Sauté half the foie gras until golden, 45 to 60 seconds on each side (it will be pink inside). Quickly transfer to a paper towel to drain and discard fat in skillet.
Sauté the rest of the foie gras the same way, then discard all all but 1 tablespoon of remaining fat in skillet. Add 2 tablespoons balsamic vinegar and bring to a boil. Serve foie gras with sauce.
yield: Makes 4 servings
Sautéeing duck foie gras is not hard to do, but be careful; otherwise, you'll end up with a puddle of very expensive melted fat.
subscribe to Gourmet
Ingredients
* 1/2 lb piece raw Grade A duck foie gras at room temperature, cleaned and deveined
* Salt and pepper to taste
* 2 tsp canola oil
* 2 tbsp balsamic vinegar
* Special equipment: a 10-inch heavy skillet
Preparation
After deveining, cut the foie gras crosswise into 1/2-inch-thick pieces, then season with salt and pepper.
Heat 1 teaspoon of the canola oil in a 10-inch heavy skillet over moderately high heat until hot but not smoking.
Sauté half the foie gras until golden, 45 to 60 seconds on each side (it will be pink inside). Quickly transfer to a paper towel to drain and discard fat in skillet.
Sauté the rest of the foie gras the same way, then discard all all but 1 tablespoon of remaining fat in skillet. Add 2 tablespoons balsamic vinegar and bring to a boil. Serve foie gras with sauce.
163
Well this could be a whole other tactic. Make Foie Gras so popular and it's consumption so widespread that politicans would not dare outlaw it.
"That's like attacking motherhood, apple pie and Foi Gras!"
"That's like attacking motherhood, apple pie and Foi Gras!"
164
Wow. From Foie Gras to Childporn in one breath?
Consumers of animal products and bigots are the same?
Apparently Godwin's law needs to be updated. This person's cause and convictions are admirable but I tried Foie Gras finally and I sort of feel like I owe it to NARN.
Consumers of animal products and bigots are the same?
Apparently Godwin's law needs to be updated. This person's cause and convictions are admirable but I tried Foie Gras finally and I sort of feel like I owe it to NARN.
165
"If I offer a child the choice between a pear and a piece of meat, he'll quickly choose the pear. That's his atavistic instinct speaking."
- Adolf Hitler. December 28, 1941. Section 81, HITLER'S TABLE TALK
"The only thing of which I shall be incapable is to share the sheiks' mutton with them. I'm a vegetarian, and they must spare me from their meat." - Adolf Hitler. January 12, 1942. Section 105, HITLER'S TABLE TALK
38
"One may regret living at a period when it's impossible to form an idea of the shape the world of the future will assume. But there's one thing I can predict to eaters of meat: the world of the future will be vegetarian."
Adolf Hitler
1941
"At the time when I ate meat, I used to sweat a lot. I used to drink four pots of beer and six bottles of water during a meeting. … When I became a vegetarian, a mouthful of water was enough." - Adolf Hitler. January 22, 1942. Section 117, HITLER'S TABLE TALK
"When you offer a child the choice of a piece of meat, an apple, or a cake, it's never the meat that he chooses. There's an ancestral instinct there." - Adolf Hitler. January 22, 1942. Section 117, HITLER'S TABLE TALK
"One has only to keep one's eyes open to notice what an extraordinary antipathy young children have to meat." - Adolf Hitler. April 25, 1942. Section 198, HITLER'S TABLE TALK
"When I later gave up eating meat, I immediately began to perspire much less, and within a fortnight to perspire hardly at all. My thirst, too, decreased considerably, and an occasional sip of water was all I required. Vegetarian diet, therefore, has some obvious advantages." - Adolf Hitler. July 8, 1942. Section 256, HITLER'S TABLE TALK
"I am no admirer of the poacher, particularly as I am a vegetarian." - Adolf Hitler. August 20, 1942. Section 293, HITLER'S TABLE TALK
"An extended chapter of our talk was devoted by the Führer to the vegetarian question. He believes more than ever that meat-eating is harmful to humanity. Of course he knows that during the war we cannot completely upset our food system. After the war, however, he intends to tackle this problem also. Maybe he is right. Certainly the arguments that he adduces in favor of his standpoint are very compelling."
Joseph Goebbels
1942
More...
"The only thing of which I shall be incapable is to share the sheiks' mutton with them. I'm a vegetarian, and they must spare me from their meat." - Adolf Hitler. January 12, 1942. Section 105, HITLER'S TABLE TALK
38
"One may regret living at a period when it's impossible to form an idea of the shape the world of the future will assume. But there's one thing I can predict to eaters of meat: the world of the future will be vegetarian."
Adolf Hitler
1941
"At the time when I ate meat, I used to sweat a lot. I used to drink four pots of beer and six bottles of water during a meeting. … When I became a vegetarian, a mouthful of water was enough." - Adolf Hitler. January 22, 1942. Section 117, HITLER'S TABLE TALK
"When you offer a child the choice of a piece of meat, an apple, or a cake, it's never the meat that he chooses. There's an ancestral instinct there." - Adolf Hitler. January 22, 1942. Section 117, HITLER'S TABLE TALK
"One has only to keep one's eyes open to notice what an extraordinary antipathy young children have to meat." - Adolf Hitler. April 25, 1942. Section 198, HITLER'S TABLE TALK
"When I later gave up eating meat, I immediately began to perspire much less, and within a fortnight to perspire hardly at all. My thirst, too, decreased considerably, and an occasional sip of water was all I required. Vegetarian diet, therefore, has some obvious advantages." - Adolf Hitler. July 8, 1942. Section 256, HITLER'S TABLE TALK
"I am no admirer of the poacher, particularly as I am a vegetarian." - Adolf Hitler. August 20, 1942. Section 293, HITLER'S TABLE TALK
"An extended chapter of our talk was devoted by the Führer to the vegetarian question. He believes more than ever that meat-eating is harmful to humanity. Of course he knows that during the war we cannot completely upset our food system. After the war, however, he intends to tackle this problem also. Maybe he is right. Certainly the arguments that he adduces in favor of his standpoint are very compelling."
Joseph Goebbels
1942
166
I get the feeling that rather than gently persuading people to become vegetarian that some in the "go vegan" crowd might welcome it being imposed on us by a dictator. Especially those who are hostile to the concept of choice.
167
Wow, amazing that a bunch of anonymous people that criticize protesters for "having no life" and wasting an hour of their life are spending what looks to be a great deal of time and energy posting on Slog. Hmm.
Also, these idiotic Hitler was a vegetarian posts....from what I've read he was a vegetarian that also ate fish and meat as well..as in...not really a vegetarian. It's a myth and completely irrelevant and stupid. I can't believe I even bothered to read that. Jesus, there's some stupid people on Slog. Wow.
Those wackos over at The Humane Society of the United States, maybe you've heard of them, have free postcards for those that would like to order them, that you can send to restaurants that serve foie gras and ask the manager to stop serving it.
Order them here: http://www.hsus.org/forms/foie_gras_card…
Also, these idiotic Hitler was a vegetarian posts....from what I've read he was a vegetarian that also ate fish and meat as well..as in...not really a vegetarian. It's a myth and completely irrelevant and stupid. I can't believe I even bothered to read that. Jesus, there's some stupid people on Slog. Wow.
Those wackos over at The Humane Society of the United States, maybe you've heard of them, have free postcards for those that would like to order them, that you can send to restaurants that serve foie gras and ask the manager to stop serving it.
Order them here: http://www.hsus.org/forms/foie_gras_card…
168
or you can make your own post card to send the the restaurant manager to remind him or her that people appreciate having the option of ordering foie gras. Or even request that they start to include it on the menu.
169
I get the feeling that rather than gently persuading people to become trolls that some in the "go troll" crowd might welcome it being imposed on us by a dictator. Especially those who are hostile to the concept of choice.
170
I get the feeling that rather than write anything original all #169 has the mental power to do is to parrot other posts.
171
I get the feeling that rather than write anything original all #170 has the mental power to do is to troll other posts.
172
@46:
"No, I compared a lack of morality when it comes to animals with a lack of morality when it comes to people, which is a pretty strong scientific correlation."
Can you show me the research that backs this up? I'm genuinely curious.
"No, I compared a lack of morality when it comes to animals with a lack of morality when it comes to people, which is a pretty strong scientific correlation."
Can you show me the research that backs this up? I'm genuinely curious.
173
"which is a pretty strong scientific correlation"
Really? Japanese love to eat whales, horse, you name it, if it can run from them, the Japanese will eat it. Animal welfare in Japan? Unheard of. Everyone ties up there dogs outside, abusive moneky and bear shows all over the countryside and 70% support rates for the annual whaling trips to Antarctica.
Yet, you can walk down any street in Japan at 2am drunk as a skunk with your wallet hanging out your back pocket, and not worry about a thing.
Really? Japanese love to eat whales, horse, you name it, if it can run from them, the Japanese will eat it. Animal welfare in Japan? Unheard of. Everyone ties up there dogs outside, abusive moneky and bear shows all over the countryside and 70% support rates for the annual whaling trips to Antarctica.
Yet, you can walk down any street in Japan at 2am drunk as a skunk with your wallet hanging out your back pocket, and not worry about a thing.
174
NARN- why don't you pull your canine teeth out as the ultimate protest? Someone or something gave all humans these tools to eat (or not)to eat meat- so let us decide INDIVIDUALLY whether to exercise the option- plus, my hope is that you won't be able to talk for a while should you choose to heed my request.
176
@ 175 Absolutely, how DARE they publish something you do not agree with. What kind of society do we live in, that people can publish articles someone else might disagree with.
177
ok, fuck reading all this bullshit... i just wanna know if you support my right to marry a goose,,, and then eat it's liver... because any thing else makes you an islamo- fascist and Dan Savage knows how to take care of you...
178
@#175. Yes how dare they! Lets add and amendment any proposed law against foi gras that allows for suspending freedom of the press rights for those who question the goals of the animal rights movement. We all must accept that anything animal rights people believe is sacrosanct.
Hey Stranger what this world needs is another Meat Issue of your paper. After the first one a narnish co coworker of mine said he would keep a copy to bring out if he needed to refresh is anger or have a good cry.
Hey Stranger what this world needs is another Meat Issue of your paper. After the first one a narnish co coworker of mine said he would keep a copy to bring out if he needed to refresh is anger or have a good cry.
179
And to help the cause of supporting the vital research that has saved so many lives and can save more in the future: www.amprogress.org/
182
Had the fois gras on Valentine's Day @ Lark. While I admire people with passion, humane treatment of animals, and the entertainment provided by the protesters, Lark is a wonderful local restaurant and I ordered the fois because of the protesters (and it's delicious). I could've had the oysters or the sunchoke soup instead, but what if the oysters didn't live a full and happy life or the sunchokes didn't get enough sun? I will be back to Lark even on a Friday night.
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