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News & ArtsThursday, December 11, 2008
Boom The Tallest Building in Seattle
Posted by Dominic Holden on Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 1:27 PM
I'll believe this when I see it:
A developer who said he hopes to partner with the Trump Organization of New York on a strikingly tall marquee two-tower condo project in downtown Seattle said he's in serious negotiations to purchase a site for it.
Spencer Alpert of Alpert International said the project would be built in phases, possibly starting in three to five years.
The first tower may rise to 82 stories, higher than Seattle's tallest building, the 76-story Columbia Center, and would include upscale offices and condos, retail and a private club, he said.
“We're able to build a real marquee (project) that would change the Seattle skyline — something that would stand out in the Seattle skyline, but improve on what exists today,” Alpert said.
In this economy, four-to-six story residential construction is barely inching forward; condo towers, the ones that haven't broken ground, are on hold; and new office buildings, depending on how many hundreds of thousands of square feet are freed by Washington Mutual's evacuation, aren't getting built any time soon. So this Trump building—tall, ambitious, and office oriented—is banana-dream pie in the sky.
Via the DJC. Image is of the Burj Dubai Tower.
2
In THIS economy "If you build it, he will come" refers only to the ejaculating architect, and not the overmortgaged tenant.
5
Now we're talking.
So, if they can just zone it to have mixed income levels of rentals instead of condos, and put a mini-park or greenspace accessible to the public, it will be a step forward.
But it's not as cool as some of the buildings in Dubai.
So, if they can just zone it to have mixed income levels of rentals instead of condos, and put a mini-park or greenspace accessible to the public, it will be a step forward.
But it's not as cool as some of the buildings in Dubai.
7
No Trump in Seattle, I don't think anyone in the city wants a gold plated Toilet-in-the-sky daring God to take a dump all over us
8
"In this economy"?... I thought Obama was going to change all that... that prosperity is just around the corner... Are you saying we'll still be fucked (or more fucked) after 4 years of Obama?
9
Funny. Alpert and Trump (who would have no financial stake, and has been paid a name-licensing fee by Alpert) have been bandying about the idea in Seattle since early 2007. Now Trump's in enough trouble with Deutsche Bank over the one Chicago tower he's actually got his own money in.
And cute pic of the Burj Dubai. Trump recently had to halt a nearby 62-story manmade floating island tower when financing fell apart. The Burj's builder was in talks with the Clises here over their parcel, but bid so low the Clises refused. Now Dubai's real estate market is starting to tank, which seemed unheard of last year, so they couldn't buy the Clise piece even if they wanted to. Sweet. The great unwinding continues.
And cute pic of the Burj Dubai. Trump recently had to halt a nearby 62-story manmade floating island tower when financing fell apart. The Burj's builder was in talks with the Clises here over their parcel, but bid so low the Clises refused. Now Dubai's real estate market is starting to tank, which seemed unheard of last year, so they couldn't buy the Clise piece even if they wanted to. Sweet. The great unwinding continues.
10
@7
I want a gold plated toilet in the sky. What's more, God wants me to have a gold plated toilet in the sky. He told me so last night. He also asked me to tell you that he's "not happy" with you...
I want a gold plated toilet in the sky. What's more, God wants me to have a gold plated toilet in the sky. He told me so last night. He also asked me to tell you that he's "not happy" with you...
11
They just need it to be surrounded by a big open plain of greenspace, and it will be the most godawful piece of shit in the entire city bar none.
12
why the hell would you use a crazy image of a ginormous tower that's 10 times as tall as anything around it? geez.
13
I like the Columbia Tower, but its so large and dark relative to everything else in the skyline that it would be nice to have another tall building with a light colored curtain wall to play off of it
14
@5, I think everyone here would look forward to you taking a ten-year research trip to Dubai to check out all of those "cool buildings" and report back to us. It really is your kind of town.
15
shit, serious? who does this guy think he is? and @ 8, regardless of obama taking office, that doesn't mean that somehow the american economy is just going to make an instant turnaround. there is a lot of work to be done. obama will restore the trust in government, but it will take a while before people all have jobs again, and before people can afford pie-in-the-sky condos and office buildings in downtown areas.
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@8 I suspect the country will be in much better shape in four years. You, on the other hand, will still be shitting on Obama. That much will not change.
17
@16
If he gets me my golden toilet in the sky I'll vote to reelect him and start the push to eliminate term limits.
If he gets me my golden toilet in the sky I'll vote to reelect him and start the push to eliminate term limits.
19
76-story Columbia Center was at the very upper height limit set by the FAA for flightpath to Boeing Field. Unless they've changed those limits, such a building as this would have to be built a good bit north of Columbia Center where the cone-shaped height limits would be somewhat higher.
20
Nah, I'll just visit one of my high school classmates who lives there sometime, Fnarf.
Change - it's a comin.
Change - it's a comin.
21
Actually, if you have the capital, building right now is a good idea for two reasons. First, labor and materials are cheaper, or can be negotiated cheaper, so the actual construction costs will be lower. Second, by the time the building is ready for tenants to move in, the recession will be over, so it's not necessarily a bad business move.
That said, it's hideous and I don't want a building that looks like that here.
That said, it's hideous and I don't want a building that looks like that here.
24
This won't happen, but I do have a question: Some offices in tall downtown Seattle buildings will occasionally actually close because of the sway during wind storms - I've been in some buildings here in SF that sway and creak and give you the feeling of being on a ship, but never experienced a closure because of it - has anyone lived, or know someone that does, in a highrise apartment that experiences that kind of violent turbulence? It'd be an interesting scenario to experience in your own home.
26
Isn't that the Trump business model in a nutshell?
So this Trump building—tall, ambitious, and office oriented—is banana-dream pie in the sky.
Isn't that the Trump business model in a nutshell?
27
Ah yes, towers in the park. Towers surrounded by greenspace. Which reminds me, I should watch season 1 of The Wire again. That shit is a good show.
28
I'll just point out that the Empire State Building was constructed in the midst of the Great Depression.
29
I more or less agree with Simac.
It's not as crazy as it sounds. Yes, right now the economy is going into the shitter, and we are facing a glut of office space downtown. But a construction project like this will not get built in six months. They'll be lucky if they get it done in 5 years. Even a small building downtown takes a year or more for permits and another year+ to build. A skyscraper of this magnitude would easily double that timeline. The quote itself states they hope to start construction in 3-5 years.
So they'd get the advantages of cheaper construction costs during a down economy, and with any luck, by the time it is actually finished, the economy will have turned around, and demand for downtown space will have improved.
My only question is how the hell do they expect to get construction financing with the credit markets all locked up? Good luck with that.
It's not as crazy as it sounds. Yes, right now the economy is going into the shitter, and we are facing a glut of office space downtown. But a construction project like this will not get built in six months. They'll be lucky if they get it done in 5 years. Even a small building downtown takes a year or more for permits and another year+ to build. A skyscraper of this magnitude would easily double that timeline. The quote itself states they hope to start construction in 3-5 years.
So they'd get the advantages of cheaper construction costs during a down economy, and with any luck, by the time it is actually finished, the economy will have turned around, and demand for downtown space will have improved.
My only question is how the hell do they expect to get construction financing with the credit markets all locked up? Good luck with that.
31
Will, if you are under the impression that the change that's "comin" to Seattle is going to resemble the shithole that is Dubai in any way shape or form, you are going to have an even more disappointing rest of your life than previously imagined. The rest of us, however, will be quite pleased.
33
burj in arabic means tower, so saying burj dubai tower is like saying Rio Grande River... it's redundant
35
I thought Nickels wanted to raise the height limit of buildings in Seattle to be just shy the height of the Columbia Tower. The Columbia Tower would always be the tallest building in the city, but the other buildings would be so close you would hardly know it.
36
I love listening to my fellow Seattlites scream in horror when anything new comes their way.
Sorry but this is how skyscrapers are built these days. Move to Renton.
Sorry but this is how skyscrapers are built these days. Move to Renton.
37
Good. I'm sick of Seattle's boring chock-a-block truncated high-rises. It's about time we had a building with some panache.
38
are you kidding me? we complain when a developer wants to tear down a craptacular dennys. there's no way backwater seattle would ever go for something so flamboyant.
39
I bet ECB will demand a special bank of elevators for the sole convenience of bicycle riders like herself.
41
Such whining!By the time this project is even started the business cycle ought to have improved. If it does and it might be a big if, this building would be a great addition. 85 stories which is very tall but by today's standards is not that tall will add the density that is desired. You can't have it both ways, no sprawl and no height. People are moving here nothing you can do about so what is your poison? Deforestation or taller buildings that is your choice. The fact that it has Trumps name to it is irrelevant. If it isn't him it will be someone else. Seattle is one of those cities that will continue grow for the foreseeable future.
44
Well the picture is misleading. That's the Burj Dubai.
Here's the Seattle one: http://www.djc.com/news/re/12001060.html
Something like the Burj would look like shit here. The Trump tower looks way better. A mix of our Two Union Square and Columbia Center and the proposed Civic Square all in one but with a shite-load of modernity.
Here's the Seattle one: http://www.djc.com/news/re/12001060.html
Something like the Burj would look like shit here. The Trump tower looks way better. A mix of our Two Union Square and Columbia Center and the proposed Civic Square all in one but with a shite-load of modernity.
45
This proposed building is only 6 stories taller than the Columbia tower. I don't know where it is planned to be located, but if it is a block or two downhill from where the Columbia tower is, it will actually appear shorter on the Seattle skyline. And Columbia tower is on a relatively high point in downtown. Most of the rest of down town is lower elevation.
46
AWESOME!!!!!!! Finally some developer has balls to build something amazing and push Seattle forward for once. (RIP Heron/Pagoda). I think all you poor, latte-sipping, goatee-wearing, capitol hill "keep seattle small" hillbillies need to STFU and let Seattle shine for once.
Please move to Shoreline or somewhere far far away that won't inhibit Seattle's future potential please. THANK YOU.
Please move to Shoreline or somewhere far far away that won't inhibit Seattle's future potential please. THANK YOU.
47
Well, all I can say is that they'd better build a new electrical substation for downtown, or that thing will take the whole network down. It's pretty sketchy as it is.
Now, if you will excuse me, I will return to sipping my latte and trimming my Goatee.
Now, if you will excuse me, I will return to sipping my latte and trimming my Goatee.
49
Gital @ 28 stated...
"I'll just point out that the Empire State Building was constructed in the midst of the Great Depression."
Actually that's not true.
The groundbreaking started on Jan 1930. Plans, material acquisition etc. were already well underway before then. There were already a ton of sunk costs.
The DJIA first crashed in Oct. 29 1929. The market was on it's way back up when construction commenced just over two months later. The market bottomed more than a year after the buildings completion.
here's the chart.
http://stockcharts.com/charts/historical…
The depression officially lasted from the end of 1929 to the early 40's. However, it probably was hindsight that put the dates at that time. On Oct 28th, plans were well underway for the groundbreaking and I doubt anyone was saying that they were in the midst of the depression at that time.
So, in reality, the Empire State building was not decided upon during the Great Depression nor was it constructed in the middle of it.
"I'll just point out that the Empire State Building was constructed in the midst of the Great Depression."
Actually that's not true.
The groundbreaking started on Jan 1930. Plans, material acquisition etc. were already well underway before then. There were already a ton of sunk costs.
The DJIA first crashed in Oct. 29 1929. The market was on it's way back up when construction commenced just over two months later. The market bottomed more than a year after the buildings completion.
here's the chart.
http://stockcharts.com/charts/historical…
The depression officially lasted from the end of 1929 to the early 40's. However, it probably was hindsight that put the dates at that time. On Oct 28th, plans were well underway for the groundbreaking and I doubt anyone was saying that they were in the midst of the depression at that time.
So, in reality, the Empire State building was not decided upon during the Great Depression nor was it constructed in the middle of it.
50
I say do it! Environmentally building up is always better than the sprawl. Financially it makes a lot of sense with materials being cheaper. It will provide lots of jobs for labor, especially high paying steal jobs. It will improve the standard of living for blue colar Seattle.
Yet of course the issue is going to be financing.
Maybe Seattle will get some of its labor identity back and be so much the town of artsy fartsy whining wusses that most of the nation seems think of Seattle. AND by the time it will be finished, the recession will most likely be over. Of all the markets in the US, especially as far as real estate goes. It's not THAT bad here. I hear horrible horrible things about the tri-state New York area and it will be interesting when I go back home for Christmas. EVERYONE (and I mean EVERYONE it seems) I grew up with in the Northeast who just entered the labor market (college degree in hand) is unemployed, hell even several friends I knew working at the casinos. And they are all busting their ass trying to get back into school it seems. Because student loan debt will at least put grocerries on the table.
And as far as everyone whining on the board about another high rise, would it make you feel better if we dressed the building in flannel? Or we can expand out like Pheonix.
Does anything make Seattlites happy?
Yet of course the issue is going to be financing.
Maybe Seattle will get some of its labor identity back and be so much the town of artsy fartsy whining wusses that most of the nation seems think of Seattle. AND by the time it will be finished, the recession will most likely be over. Of all the markets in the US, especially as far as real estate goes. It's not THAT bad here. I hear horrible horrible things about the tri-state New York area and it will be interesting when I go back home for Christmas. EVERYONE (and I mean EVERYONE it seems) I grew up with in the Northeast who just entered the labor market (college degree in hand) is unemployed, hell even several friends I knew working at the casinos. And they are all busting their ass trying to get back into school it seems. Because student loan debt will at least put grocerries on the table.
And as far as everyone whining on the board about another high rise, would it make you feel better if we dressed the building in flannel? Or we can expand out like Pheonix.
Does anything make Seattlites happy?
52
More details in the blog I posted a couple of days ago, if anyone is interested.
http://www.theseattlespecialist.com/seat…
http://www.theseattlespecialist.com/seat…
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