Thursday, December 4, 2008
Theater / City Cracked Nuts
Posted by David Schmader on Thu, Dec 4, 2008 at 3:53 PM
This just in to I, Anonymous:
If you don't understand what is going on during a ballet, here's a hint: READ THE PROGRAM! It's pretty damn rude to have your daughter say "What the heck?!" loudly throughout the entire performance because you didn't bother to show up early, read through the story, and explain that there wouldn't be any dialogue through the whole damn ballet. I can understand not being able to identify the dancing peacock... but if your daughter can't recognize a GIANT FREAKING RAT... then you've clearly got other issues. Also, if you're trying to shut your daughter up, passing out gum to everyone in the family is not the best way to do it. Try duct tape next time, instead of "I really don't know what to tell you, honey!"
I've previously addressed both the mind-fucking weirdness of The Nutcracker and a prior instance of Nutcracker-based aggression at PNB, so now I turn to you, dear readers.
Who's more annoying?
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1
More annoying are the parents who are either so retarded they don't realize they're disturbing everyone else or so selfish that they know they're disturbing everyone but don't care.
2
#1 is right. The parents are the worst for their ignorance of their child's behavior. The child is faultless.
Oh, I'd probably also say that the _parents_ of the adult who grew up to complain about children are also to blame.
Oh, I'd probably also say that the _parents_ of the adult who grew up to complain about children are also to blame.
3
the nutcracker is for kids, you retards. kids are loud, annoying, and weird. chill out.
happy holidays.
happy holidays.
6
Jesus fucking christ. Another year of Nutcracker. There are so many other performances going on in Seattle at hundreds of other venues. Could we just have a year without revivals of anything? Please?
8
Hey that wamu notice looks familiar...like when when you post youtube or anything else fun to watch while i am at my desk doing nothing... i mean on breaks...
10
I think you can't go to the Nutcracker without expecting annoying kids (BTW, "annoying kids" is redundant, methinks). But, the parents of the annoying kid are the ones that would have actually irritated me in this instance, so I'm with @1.
12
The Nutcracker is largely for children, but that's no fucking excuse. The ballet is for people (young and old) who know how to fucking behave in public. If you or your child is not ready to sit quietly for a while, don't go. Prepare your children for what's going to happen. What, precisely, is the age at which one can be expected to be quiet, if not whatever age is required to understand "Shh"?
13
Well I may sound like a grown-up with a stick up my ass for this, however, taking your child(ren) to a show like this is the perfect opportunity to teach them manners.
It's not your fucking living room where you can bleat out every single thought in your brain at top volume, whether you are 2 or 82.
I have a child, I know it is possible to instill proper behavior in a public setting to a young one. And, if my son couldn't for whatever reason sit through a performance I'd remove him instead of making life unpleasant for everyone around us (though when he was really young I wouldn't have forced him to endure the Nutcrakcer anyway, I can barely make it through parts of it).
It's not your fucking living room where you can bleat out every single thought in your brain at top volume, whether you are 2 or 82.
I have a child, I know it is possible to instill proper behavior in a public setting to a young one. And, if my son couldn't for whatever reason sit through a performance I'd remove him instead of making life unpleasant for everyone around us (though when he was really young I wouldn't have forced him to endure the Nutcrakcer anyway, I can barely make it through parts of it).
15
what the fuck is up the ass of this anonymous, chromosomally-challenged mutant?
a kid in the audience of a production of the fucking NUTCRACKER dares to speak or chew gum in this shitheel's presence and the whole precious atmosphere of this theater experience is ruined?
here's an idea: how about renting a dvd of a Nutcracker performance and watching it alone with headphones, in order to block out all evidence of the outside world at large?
a kid in the audience of a production of the fucking NUTCRACKER dares to speak or chew gum in this shitheel's presence and the whole precious atmosphere of this theater experience is ruined?
here's an idea: how about renting a dvd of a Nutcracker performance and watching it alone with headphones, in order to block out all evidence of the outside world at large?
16
@1 FTW. Also, blame the current state of the education system because when I was 9, back in 1988, our school took us to see the Nutcracker during the day when the ballet opened their doors to schools as long as the administrators, teachers, and students were fine with hearing a tape of Tchaikovsky's score. Basically we were seeing a practice performance of the Nutcracker for free. I also remember being told about the Nutcracker by our music teachers at the time during the X-mas season. Hell, I remember watching it with my parents on TV when I was a kid.
Oh I also saw a Midsummer's Night Dream when I was in middle school as part of a field trip.
So back to what I was saying, blame the current state of our education system because schools should have music and art teachers that teach kids what ballets are. Blame the parents as well because starting at age 4 or 5, parents should start showing things like the Nutcracker and Peter and the Wolf on DVD or change the channel to PBS to watch it.
ok. i'm done ranting for now.
Oh I also saw a Midsummer's Night Dream when I was in middle school as part of a field trip.
So back to what I was saying, blame the current state of our education system because schools should have music and art teachers that teach kids what ballets are. Blame the parents as well because starting at age 4 or 5, parents should start showing things like the Nutcracker and Peter and the Wolf on DVD or change the channel to PBS to watch it.
ok. i'm done ranting for now.
17
You think that's bad? Wait till you're in line for a cup of coffee behind them in the intermission and little girl stares blankly from just above the counter at the poor schmoe trying to get her a cookie all the while listening to parents asking "what kind would you like? Chocolate chip? Peanut butter? Tell the nice man" until the lights flicker and you have to go back in, caffeine-less and even more pissed off.
19
Most kids are wild and noisy (unless their parents beat the spirit out of them) . . . that's why I usually take my kids to places that are intended for children . . . LIKE THE FUCKING NUTCRACKER!
If you hate kids so much, maybe you should go to somewhere for that's only for adults, like the Lusty Lady or a local prison.
If you hate kids so much, maybe you should go to somewhere for that's only for adults, like the Lusty Lady or a local prison.
20
A good way to solve it is to have a kid friendly showing and a kids-not-welcome showing.
Although some dumbasses might bring their spawn anyway.
Although some dumbasses might bring their spawn anyway.
21
@19: Really? Kids who actually behave in public only do so because their parents beat the spirit out of them? Wow.
22
@19
No dipshit it is up to parents to control the behavior of their little brats. They aren't at the fucking playground they are at the theatre. These are the same children that grow up to be loud obnoxious adults... kind of like you.
No dipshit it is up to parents to control the behavior of their little brats. They aren't at the fucking playground they are at the theatre. These are the same children that grow up to be loud obnoxious adults... kind of like you.
23
Now do you see why I keep saying there needs to be a US Department of Giving A Shit About What Annoys Childless Twentysomethings With No Money To Speak Of Who Never Vote?
I simply can't understand why some politician hasn't risen to the heights of power catering to this constituency. Somebody help me out...
I simply can't understand why some politician hasn't risen to the heights of power catering to this constituency. Somebody help me out...
24
Look I have a kid, sure he's wild and noisy but you know what, he also knows the places where it is appropriate to be wild and noisy and the places where it is not. And I accomplished that without "beating the spirit out of him" thank you very much.
I don't give a FUCK if it is the Nutcracker and it is some sort of trumped up cherished holiday tradition marketed to parents as the ultimate magical holiday experience for kids. It's ridiculous on the part of any parent to expect a child younger than 3 (I'm tempted to say 5 but know I will be smacked down for that) to sit through two hours of that shit--no matter how fucking magical and awesome it is.
But, if you must dress the little dolls up and terrify them with a giant rat, then it is the PERFECT opportunity to teach your child some guidelines for behavior. You may think your little mini-me's constant prattle at full volume is A-fucking-dorable but I guarantee you that the rest of us don't.
Goddammit, I'm so sick of this new attitude toward parenting, you know what, keeping your voice down, sitting quietly, and not kicking the seat in front of you endlessly isn't that much to expect from your kid, and if your kid can't handle it then maybe they shouldn't be there in the first place.
Just because it is theoretically a "children's" show doesn't mean it devolves into everyone talking loudly, crinkling paper, and running back and forth in the aisles.
I don't give a FUCK if it is the Nutcracker and it is some sort of trumped up cherished holiday tradition marketed to parents as the ultimate magical holiday experience for kids. It's ridiculous on the part of any parent to expect a child younger than 3 (I'm tempted to say 5 but know I will be smacked down for that) to sit through two hours of that shit--no matter how fucking magical and awesome it is.
But, if you must dress the little dolls up and terrify them with a giant rat, then it is the PERFECT opportunity to teach your child some guidelines for behavior. You may think your little mini-me's constant prattle at full volume is A-fucking-dorable but I guarantee you that the rest of us don't.
Goddammit, I'm so sick of this new attitude toward parenting, you know what, keeping your voice down, sitting quietly, and not kicking the seat in front of you endlessly isn't that much to expect from your kid, and if your kid can't handle it then maybe they shouldn't be there in the first place.
Just because it is theoretically a "children's" show doesn't mean it devolves into everyone talking loudly, crinkling paper, and running back and forth in the aisles.
26
@19 The Nutcracker is not "for kids," well maybe the afternoon matinee, and the idea that kids will only behave if they are physically abused would be offensive if it wasn’t so laughably pathetic in it’s attempt to inflame. The larger issue in my mind is why the PNB refuses to update the stultifying choreography that the city of Seattle has been subjected to for the last 25 years. Misbehaving children and negligent parents wouldn't grate on the nerves so much if PNB would actually perform something interesting in the place of Kent Stowell's tired choreography that can be summed up by "back and forth, back and forth, jump, charge, now snowflakes, now the mice fall on their backs, now they are on the boat, etc., etc...." BORING! I have been boycotting the Nutcracker for that reason if no other reason for the last 5 years. 20 years of the same was enough for this Seattle native. I won’t be attending until the choreography is changed (and hopefully the sets). TIRED!
27
If I was an evil gypsy I would curse @1, 2, 5, 7, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 16, 17, 21, 22 to each have several kids with severe ADHD/autism spectrum disorders, were it not for the fact that it would be more of a curse for the poor kids to have such shitty excuses for human beings for parents.
28
I fail to see how wanting to enjoy a performance, probably WITH ONE'S OWN well-behaved children, without having clueless Neanderthals flapping their pieholes, is somehow conflated to hating children. Most of us don't hate children. Some do, sure, but they're probably in the minority. Most of us even HAVE children. That we take to the Nutcracker. Where we teach them how to behave in that kind of public setting. That isn't some form of child abuse, to ask them to sit quietly so others may enjoy the show as well, it's called TEACHING and SOCIALIZING them. Children don't know what's appropriate unless we teach them.
Gawd, I get so sick of people who assume instantly that one is a child-hater if one dislikes ill-behaved children and their oblivious moron parents. That's just stupid.
Gawd, I get so sick of people who assume instantly that one is a child-hater if one dislikes ill-behaved children and their oblivious moron parents. That's just stupid.
29
I, not so anonymous, would like to confess (but not apologize) for some Nutcracker-based aggression at PNB. I encountered a situation similar to this, only it wasn't the kids who were being obnoxious, disruptive, and loudly talking...It was the father. He was yakking at the top of his lungs (okay, maybe it just seemed that way to me, but still he was a loud jerk) to both the other adults in his party and on the phone. I started off with a polite, "excuse, me I'm trying to watch the show", to a more aggressive (yet, gentle) poke to the back of the neck, and then finally just hauled off and thwacked him on the back of the head with some programs and other folder-y type stuff. He turned around in shock and I hissed "SHUT.THE.FUCK.UP...I came to see this! NOT.LISTEN.TO.YOU!". The psychotic glint in my eye must have convinced him because I didn't hear a peep out of him for the rest of the night.
30
@29, you sure showed that would-be asshole how to be truly rude and obnoxious. hooray for you for striking a blow for self-righteousness and instilling the holiday spirit in all who are inflicted with your presence in their vicinity
thanks for acknowledging your own psychosis.
thanks for acknowledging your own psychosis.
31
Ocsasional comments by a kid during "Nutcracker" (or any other family-related theatre fare) are to be expected and should be tolerated...usually. It only becomes a problem when they begin REGULARLY distracting the other audience members - young and old - around them, they haven't been taught how to lower their voices, and their parents don't remove them from the auditorium.
I'm with #16 ftw. Parents and educators need to prep kids so they know what they're in for before going to a play, movie, ballet, etc. When I was in elementary school (admittedly, almost 100 years ago), we were taken to shows on a regular basis and beforehand the teachers not only gave us an intro to the production, but also taught us how to behave, both in the theatre, in the lobby...and even ON THE BUS going to the show!
I'm with #16 ftw. Parents and educators need to prep kids so they know what they're in for before going to a play, movie, ballet, etc. When I was in elementary school (admittedly, almost 100 years ago), we were taken to shows on a regular basis and beforehand the teachers not only gave us an intro to the production, but also taught us how to behave, both in the theatre, in the lobby...and even ON THE BUS going to the show!
32
@27: What the fuck? Did you actually mean to address that to me (@21)? So you agree that the only way to get kids in general to behave in public is to "beat the spirit out of them"? And I would make a shitty parent? Huh.
33
unfortunately in seattle this behavior is not limited to children. i'm losing count of the number of times i've had to verbally bitchslap an 'alleged' adult who insists carring on a running commentary durning a movie, concert/musical performance, or even a kirtan (yes i'm talking to the rude couple at jai uttal's first performance in 20 years earlier this month). this behavior is not tolerated past about the age of 5 in the mid(dle)west - we give the offender one courtesy warning and when they don't get the hint those of us nearest them turn as a group and stomp them into the floor and quietly use our feet to scrape their remains under their seat for the ushers to clean up after the show ends. problem solved. (wow, venting feels great!)
34
@27 -- What, because we find ineffectual parents to be annoying, we're horrible people and can't possibly be parents ourselves? Interesting.
For all you know, I or my fellow "shitty excuses for human beings" might have children with severe ADHD/autism spectrum disorders. For all you know, we were raised with a sibling who has Asperger's, and grew up understanding the difficulty of moderating that child's behavior. Forget controlling said behavior.
But it comes down to the parenting, and it's part of a parent's job to keep public disruption to a minimum. That means they need to be taught basic manners and common courtesies. Even kids with ASD can be taught. And until they can learn those basic manners and common courtesies, they should not be taken to events like the Nutcracker, where the point is to be quiet and watch what's going on onstage.
For all you know, I or my fellow "shitty excuses for human beings" might have children with severe ADHD/autism spectrum disorders. For all you know, we were raised with a sibling who has Asperger's, and grew up understanding the difficulty of moderating that child's behavior. Forget controlling said behavior.
But it comes down to the parenting, and it's part of a parent's job to keep public disruption to a minimum. That means they need to be taught basic manners and common courtesies. Even kids with ASD can be taught. And until they can learn those basic manners and common courtesies, they should not be taken to events like the Nutcracker, where the point is to be quiet and watch what's going on onstage.
35
I vote for the adult only because The Nutcracker is geared for kids. Check out the late show, if their is one (that's what I do when going to see PG movies).
37
This was just discussed (briefly) on KUOW's "Sound Focus" today when they were talking about Nutcracker. The dance critic was saying that it really is important to PREPARE kids before taking them to the show: Have them listen to music, know the story, teach them about what to expect. Oh, and just because it's a "family-friendly show" does not mean that it's meant for toddlers, or infants, or hyper-active kids. Seattle Children's Theatre has "children" in their name, for gosh-sake, but that doesn't mean EVERY show they do is appropriate for EVERY age. Parents: Get a clue.
38
@27 - fuck you and go to hell. My brother, who's 24, has asperger's symdrome and i'm fully aware of behavioral issues as being the older brother who helped control them when we were kids. If I was the parent of a child with ADHD/austism spectrum, I'd show my child the Nutcracker Suite on TV and let him/her listen to it on CD/mp3 many times before taking him/her to the actual performance. I'd pick a daytime children's showing so that 1. they're not tired and 2. it'll keep their attention focused on it because of the friendly nonthreatening environment. I'd also tell him beforehand that it's a ballet and being quiet and well behaved makes it fun for everyone who's there to watch it. Hell even bribe my child with some ice cream from cold stone's if he/she behaved.
So again, I blame the parents because they weren't doing their jobs as parents by neither teaching the kids what the Nutcracker or what a ballet is beforehand.
So again, I blame the parents because they weren't doing their jobs as parents by neither teaching the kids what the Nutcracker or what a ballet is beforehand.
40
That's like going to Disney on Ice and bitching about all the kids. Seriously... The Nutcracker is live performance training wheels. If the writer of this letter didn't know that before they bought a ticket, then maybe THEY'RE the ones who need some things explain to them.
Ever be around a kid before? They ask question and then they ask the same question over and over again. It's what they do, and it's probably what the writer of this letter did if their parents ever took them to the ballet when they were little.
I will take my kid to the ballet or theater or art museum or where ever. They will learn to value art, and in twenty years you can thank me for helping to groom the next generation of patrons. I will also duct tape your ass together, you loud sighing son of a bitch, if you so much as point your hairy eyeball at us.
Ever be around a kid before? They ask question and then they ask the same question over and over again. It's what they do, and it's probably what the writer of this letter did if their parents ever took them to the ballet when they were little.
I will take my kid to the ballet or theater or art museum or where ever. They will learn to value art, and in twenty years you can thank me for helping to groom the next generation of patrons. I will also duct tape your ass together, you loud sighing son of a bitch, if you so much as point your hairy eyeball at us.
41
It's totally Seattle to hate on a kid rather than a snobby ballet-watching adult. Go Capitol Hill!
43
I went to the nutcracker every year with my mom when i was little, and i'm only 22 now so it wasn't that long ago. i was fully raised in new school, hippie love and acceptance-instead-of-punishment parenting. and as PART of this parenting, i was taught that other people like to watch the ballet and i should be quiet and respectful even when it didn't quite make sense. i'm sure i squirmed a little, but i didn't talk out loud (and if i had to, i whispered) during the performance because my parents taught me that part of being a good person is not being an asshole.
and @27? I HAVE ADHD. LOTS OF IT. REAL BAD. when i couldn't handle sitting still and being quiet in the theater we would quietly excuse ourselves and giggle and run laps in the atrium for a few minutes while the show was going on until i was ready to go back. it was a special, fun time with my mom and we managed to complete the whole transaction without ruining the show for everyone around us.
there's plenty of fun holiday stuff to do where you can be loud and squirmy as you want. if your kid can't handle being quiet, then either wait a couple years or go to a matinee. it's really not that big of a deal.
and @27? I HAVE ADHD. LOTS OF IT. REAL BAD. when i couldn't handle sitting still and being quiet in the theater we would quietly excuse ourselves and giggle and run laps in the atrium for a few minutes while the show was going on until i was ready to go back. it was a special, fun time with my mom and we managed to complete the whole transaction without ruining the show for everyone around us.
there's plenty of fun holiday stuff to do where you can be loud and squirmy as you want. if your kid can't handle being quiet, then either wait a couple years or go to a matinee. it's really not that big of a deal.
44
Not to beat on the brats, as the Ramones would say, but if you are a parent, keep your little kids home when you go see an R Rated movie. I actually had to endure a couple of bratty kids and babies crying at Boogie Nights. Fucking Boogie Nights!
45
Little kids are always more annoying, it doesn't matter what the other option is. Unless the other option is little kids with clueless parents.
46
Children do not learn how to behave in public by sitting at home. If you expect children to learn how to behave in public then they have to go out into public spaces.
47
Wow, it is amazing that a mere 100 or so years ago, children were still to be "seen and not heard".
I'm not saying I agree with THAT entirely, but man, how things have changed.
Manners begin in the home. I taught my son how to behave in public before we ventured out into public places, and then we began with places where lessons in manners would not be a nuisance.
By the time we went to see The Nutcracker with his 3rd grade class, he was perfectly behaved.
Even before that, he was just as annoyed with ill behaved kids or adults as any of you, whether we were in a family movie or at a family restaurant or the grocery store. Yes, sometimes he forgets how he is supposed to be acting, but it all it takes is a subtle reminder and we're back on track.
I'm not saying I agree with THAT entirely, but man, how things have changed.
Manners begin in the home. I taught my son how to behave in public before we ventured out into public places, and then we began with places where lessons in manners would not be a nuisance.
By the time we went to see The Nutcracker with his 3rd grade class, he was perfectly behaved.
Even before that, he was just as annoyed with ill behaved kids or adults as any of you, whether we were in a family movie or at a family restaurant or the grocery store. Yes, sometimes he forgets how he is supposed to be acting, but it all it takes is a subtle reminder and we're back on track.
48
It's the fucking Nutcracker. Who doesn't know the story of the Nutcracker?! There's a Barbie video version, give your kid that before taking them to the ballet. Regardless of the plot, a show in a theatre in which there are live performers demands a certain level of respect for said performers. Tell your kid beforehand to shut up and they can ask questions at intermission.
49
My precious offspring can only learn in an environment where their every whim and momentary impulse is patiently indulged by everybody in the vicinity at all times. I will gladly commit grievous bodily harm against anybody who so much looks at my little jewel of extra-special entitlement askance, because that's the kind of devoted parent I am! My child will grow up to be your boss.
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