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Tuesday, December 2, 2008

Shut Up, Eh?

Posted by on Tue, Dec 2, 2008 at 9:14 AM

Funny, when I'm in Canada I meet plenty of Canadians with opinions—freely, if politely, shared—about our head of state down here. So Slog's Canadian readers will have to forgive me if I persist in having and sharing—freely, if not always politely—my opinions about your prime minister up there.

harperbush.jpegStephen Harper is a tool and a fool, and has never enjoyed majority support up there. Which is great. And, yes, while Harper wasn't able to do as much damage to Canada—which still has gay marriage and a budget surplus and great ski resorts—as George W. Bush did to the United States, it wasn't for lack of desire. I said Harper was a George Bush wannabe, not a George Bush actuallywas. Regardless, it'll be good to see him fall. And here's hoping that the New Dems and the Liberals unite, a la the Canadian Alliance and the Progressive Conservatives, and beat the crap out of Conservatives when your next election gets called.

And thanks for holding down the fort(s) in Afghanistan, Canada. But maybe you wouldn't be having to do most of the work over there if your PM was less interested in eating the PUSA's ass and more interested in sticking up for Canada's interests.

Oh, and let's not forget that Harper's government attempted to interfere with our Democratic primary down here in what looked like an effort to knock Obama out the race—reason enough to despise the douche.

 

Comments (54) RSS

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1
Didn't Harper win re-election, like, a month ago?
Posted by DOUG. on December 2, 2008 at 9:18 AM
2

So, do you want Canada to continue to mine the tar sands.

If yes, then Lib Dems are screwed on environment.

If no, then Mod Dems are screwed on energy indepedence.

Bzzzz...error, error, cannot logically resolve dilemma between Mod and Dem Libs...coalition fractionalizing...aarggghhh....
Posted by John Bailo on December 2, 2008 at 9:25 AM
3
wow another personal attack, what a surprise.

first Marlee... when the lawyers shut that one down it was time to move to safer targets... college newspaper columnists and Canadian politicians.
Posted by whatever on December 2, 2008 at 9:26 AM
4
Please note, Whatever: I changed those Marlee posts out of the goodness of my stone-cold heart. If you're a buddy of hers, you're not doing her any favors by insisting that KOMO's lawyers got to me somehow. I've never been sued because -- guess what? -- I actually know what I'm doing, and I'm aware the law.
Posted by Dan Savage on December 2, 2008 at 9:30 AM
5
Dan is totally on the money re: Harper.

Another good thing about Canada re: elections

THEY ONLY TAKE A MONTH! (Long long sigh)

And they could happen at any time given the right conditions. I hope the next election happens soon enough to allow Harper to get le boot.
Posted by mackro mackro on December 2, 2008 at 9:31 AM
6
LOL at "personal attacks" against fucking HARPER

Google "canada harper pm" and see the number of image photoshops. Not nearly as many as with "gwb united states", but you get the idea.
Posted by mackro mackro on December 2, 2008 at 9:33 AM
7
I can see Canada from John Bailo's house!
Posted by Colleen on December 2, 2008 at 9:39 AM
8
#7: Guess you must have just come from Insite then.
Posted by John Bailo on December 2, 2008 at 9:40 AM
9
I feel your pain Dan. During the 14 months or so pre-election whenever in Canada I had to force on a polite smile while well-meaning Canadians lectured me on how "america isn't ready for a black president" and how I should stop "wasting my time and money" trying to get Obama elected. Somehow growing up on American pop culture, TV, etc. makes some Canadians think they suddenly have PhDs in American Political Science.
Posted by Jason on December 2, 2008 at 9:41 AM
10
6, i was also having a laugh at 3 claiming "personal attacks." sounds like someone took a page from the palin campaign book, but forgot to check if slamming someone for his political machinations was the same as sniping at a teen daughter's pregnancy or choice of footwear. lame.
Posted by ellarosa on December 2, 2008 at 9:44 AM
11
Yeah, Harper sucks. I didn't vote for him, but I live in an area where the Conservative candidate gets in, no matter how big a tool he is. And trust me, the guy in my riding's a big tool, from lying about graduating from university to being insanely proud of raising the age of consent (which does nothing to actually prevent abuse of minors).

Harper made a huge mistake by trying to pass a very partisan budget, which provided enough for the other parties to get together. My problem is that for the "left" parties to have enough power, they'll have to join with the Bloc Quebecois. The Bloc only cares about Quebec, often at the expense of the rest of the country. Also, I kinda liked the minority government - prevented Harper from passing bad social policy, but still let him institute some good economic ones. The Liberals earned their time in the wilderness, I suppose now it's the Conservative's time.

I just wish all the parties would stick with economic policy and stop with the political maneuvering.
Posted by Karla Canadian on December 2, 2008 at 9:44 AM
12
Problem picks

"President-elect Barack Obama, like every candidate seeking to oust a ruling party, campaigned on a platform of change.
Then he went and hired half of the former Clinton administration. "
Posted by John Bailo on December 2, 2008 at 9:45 AM
13
Who's Marlee? Wasn't he the one who showed the light to Scrooge?
Seriously:
- we would love to have more discussion of Canadian politics, most of us down here are pretty ignorant and it would be educational. Keep it up!

--maybe we can have Canada join with/take up blue state USA? Please??

I'd sure like to trade in our connection to the swath of red state ignorance that is TX, WY, GA, etc. for the likes of BC, Alb., NB, NS, Quebec.

Yes we "Canamerica"!

Unity/l'unite, eh?
Posted by PC/l'un q'est-ce CP on December 2, 2008 at 9:45 AM
14
My favorite things about Canadian voters compared to us in the States are:

uno. they persistently believe they don't much need much help from the U.S. figuring out how to work their political system.

dos. when their best efforts to cast the right vote don't pan out as hoped, they tend to recognize it and take responsibility for fixing it, without wanting to blame or kill everybody else.

tres. poutine on election day.
Posted by tomasyalba on December 2, 2008 at 9:46 AM
15
So your point is Harper sucks? I think we can all here agree with that (apart from Bailo who seems desperately confused, yet desperately needing to get in on the Canadian action. The environment is a way bigger issue for the liberals than energy independence, last time I checked).

Uniting the NDP and the Liberal parties permanently is a terrible idea. Canada needs electoral reform more than it needs to migrate towards an American-style two party system. If they can just use this coalition to rebuild the liberal party's image, then that would be ideal.
Posted by ams on December 2, 2008 at 9:50 AM
16
#9 Jason I agree with you. I am a Canadian living in New York. Canadians are opinionated and misinformed and not afraid to show it. Having said that I am sick of explaining to New Yorkers where Ontario is. (right next door.)
Posted by Mike on December 2, 2008 at 9:50 AM
17
14: Don't forget

quatro: every Canadian has infinite knowledge about American Culture based on trips to Orlando, Vegas, and a drive over to Detroit from Windsor when they were 21.
Posted by Jason on December 2, 2008 at 9:51 AM
18
Next on Slog: Dan tells New Zealand how to vote. He went there once on vacation, and he knows best!
Posted by joykiller on December 2, 2008 at 9:51 AM
19
@17 - True, but you forgot TV :)

Still better than the average American's knowledge of Canada though.
Posted by Karla Canadian on December 2, 2008 at 9:53 AM
20
#16: True, so many Americans are just as uninformed (moreso actually) but they tend not to claim any expertise or special knowledge. They are just blissfully ignorant of other countries as a whole, and will usually admit it. When travelling in Canada I tend to get these (again, well-meaning I assume) lectures on American History or Politics with this attitude that somehow just being Canadian gives them this advanced knowledge.
Posted by Jason on December 2, 2008 at 9:55 AM
21
Mmmm poutine....
i never liked Harper or the Conservative Party, but I would rather see a conservative minority then a Coalition of 3 parties, one of which wants Quebec to seprate from the country. No matter what they say and how many agreements they sign full of good intentions, we know how political parties work and within 6 months the whole system will collapse again and we will be in an election.
Harper needs to swallow his pride and negotiate a new mandate with the other 3 parties so we can actually have a working government. it's been almost almost 6 months since any work has been done
Posted by chocolate canadian on December 2, 2008 at 9:56 AM
22
@13 - clearly you've never been to Alberta - they'd fit in a whole lot better with your texans than any blue-state-and-province fantasyland.

Posted by canuck on December 2, 2008 at 9:57 AM
23
I'm going to venture that, as Canadians, we do in fact know something about American culture, seeing as we are inundated with it every day of our lives. American culture leeches into so many areas of Canadian society. It's obviously not the same as being american or living in the US, but we do get pushed around by the US, and we are entitled to an opinion about the US. See: Germany/Austria, Australia/New Zealand.
Posted by ams on December 2, 2008 at 10:05 AM
24
#23: No one is saying you SHOULDN'T have an opinion, just that a Canadian tourist might not want to start lecturing an American lawyer on US law just because they grew up watching Frasier and Friends. I've seen that happen.
Posted by CanuckInPDX on December 2, 2008 at 10:13 AM
25
Some members of my family are the perfect baby boomers. Getting ready to retire enjoying some wealth and prosperity. With friends that like them voted for Harper because he supports there lifestyles, creating a climate where they can sit back and think everyone else that is poor is just plain lazy. Mean while the homeless which consist of many mentally ill people are just mostly ignored or given just enough token housing to make right wing politicians like Harper look good. All the time throwing billions at the Olympics in Vancouver all the while sitting on more billions that all could fix the homeless problem which most voters never actually see each day. it is just something they see on TV even though it is in their city.
The problem is these conservative voters do not make up enough votes in Canada to create a majority government so the parties on the left (which there are many) are joining with their votes from the last election to topple the government. If you can imagine 3 democrat parties splitting the votes on the left and fighting over half of the votes to win and election then you would realize our predicament. It can't be done. But if you take all your seats you won in the last election combine them with all the parties on the left in a coalition then you have the votes. Ya we will have to go back to the polls next year but over half of the people in this country did not vote for Harper. He is done just like George Bush is done. What is needed is a more progressive government to bring in a new era and change. Hmmm does that sound familiar.
Harper will slow down Canada's progression because he will not be able to keep pace with Obama and the US. His politics are based upon kissing George Bushes ass.
We are still stuck with a right wing government and soon you will get rid of yours. Ours should go at the same time. Harper is a lame duck, always was.

Thanks Dan for your post.
More...
Posted by -B- on December 2, 2008 at 10:16 AM
26
cinco. Many Canadian voters make an effort to gain expertise and special knowledge concerning the Baby Huey south of the border, mindful that America's military and economic might does not combine safely with our electorate's persistent belief that ignorance is a virtue.
Posted by tomasyalba on December 2, 2008 at 10:18 AM
27
Feed Harper to the circus.
Posted by Sirkowski on December 2, 2008 at 10:20 AM
28

Dan: This Canadian agrees with you on:

1) Your analysis of the current situation,
2) Your disdain for Harper,
3) The smug capacity of most Canadians to lecture the world (expecially americans) on shit we know nothing about, and

If you can be the spokesman for all gays everywhere I don't see why I can't be the spokesman for all Canadians everywhere. Well, except for Harper.
Posted by Ken on December 2, 2008 at 10:20 AM
29
Take that, Canada! Wait.. what?
Posted by Will Radik on December 2, 2008 at 10:23 AM
30
@19 You do realize that most of the people on American TV are Canadian, right? :)
Posted by Mike in Renton on December 2, 2008 at 10:29 AM
31
Normally Canadians would be impressed an American even knows they have a prime minister at all, so the fact that this is a discussion on an American Web site is beyond impressive.
Posted by Simac on December 2, 2008 at 10:32 AM
32
@30 - hmmm, you're right. I suppose that means Canadians are telling Americans about their culture - even making it! Wow, this seems like a conspiracy!
Posted by Karla Canadian on December 2, 2008 at 10:51 AM
33
As much as I dislike Harper he really hasn't done anything and compared to the Liberals (who are usually in power) he hasn't had any major scandals.

If anything I kinda like the gridlock - downloaning is still legal in Canada because it keeps getting tabled for elections & such

And to be perfectly honest I think I would trust a Canadian over an American (at least one that went to public school) when it comes to issues like civics, law & history - how soon we forget Sarah Palin 8^)
Posted by DavidC on December 2, 2008 at 11:25 AM
34
My Canadian boyfriend hasn't been able to stop smiling since news that the Liberals and NDP were forming a coalition came through. No more fucking Harper!!!

Do you know that ratbastards' party tried to singlehandedly cut Canada's arts funding? The one fucking thing that Canada is leading the pack in right now - the arts - and the bloody conservatives don't think that's worthy of taxpayers' money.
Posted by Jaya on December 2, 2008 at 11:28 AM
35
Really? A CA/PC-like joining for the Liberals and NDP, Dan?

Coalition, sure. Actual joining of the parties? You're even more ignorant about this than I thought.

The Liberals are the Establishment here, the party of the corporations, etc., and the NDP are the obnoxious kids who stand in the university public square and try to get you to sign petitions. (I was one of those obnoxious kids in university in the States and am still one here. :D) They don't like each other, they don't trust each other, and there's no reason to think they'd ever actually combine forces beyond a temporary coalition.
Posted by Cow on December 2, 2008 at 11:34 AM
36
@ 15 I agree completely. Canada needs electoral reform, not the unification of the left--but I don't think that either are realistic possibilities, certainly not in the near term. Electoral reform isn't going to happen on the federal level (maybe on the provincial level... it will be interesting to see what happens in BC!), and the the idea of merging the NDP and the Liberals is anathema to most NDPers (myself included).

Dan, the real problem in Canada isn't vote-splitting on the left. It's regional politics. Even if you merge the NDP and the Liberals, you only end up with 114 seats, far short of the 143 that the Conservatives currently hold. The Bloc has 49 seats. As long as the Bloc maintains its absolute dominance in Quebec, it will be difficult for any party (Liberal or Conservative) to gain the numbers that they need for a solid majority.
Posted by M. on December 2, 2008 at 11:43 AM
37
I'm a Canadian who sure as fuck didn't vote Conservative this last election. I supported Obama and spoke out, out, out about your election in hopes of educating those up here who clearly didn't understand the importance of the American election.

Obviously I should have spent my time reaching out to the Conservative crazies in Canada who would end up voting Harper back into office. Who saw that coming?

I also want to apologize for the Canadian douchebags who were putting down Obama. In my opinion, you finally have a leader who you can stand behind proudly. Now if only Canada could find one.
Posted by Canadian Fan of Dan on December 2, 2008 at 11:44 AM
38
@ 34 Did you see Margaret Atwood's column on the arts funding issue in the Globe?

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/s…

Read down to the end, where she describes Harper as a budding fascist. It's gold! Ha!
Posted by M. on December 2, 2008 at 11:51 AM
39
@36 You're right on the target with electoral reform not being a possibility in the near future. It would take a government in power that would benefit from proportional representation to bring it in, and we know the Liberals and the Conservatives will never do that.

The Conservative government doesn't bother me on a lot of fronts. They can't go wild with any social right-wing policies, which is great.

What really bothers me is twofold: One, the arts cuts, and two, them not giving a shit about post-secondary education. The fact that they're against the Kelowna Accord is only another strike against them in my books.
Posted by James B. on December 2, 2008 at 11:57 AM
40
Um, Dan.

Canadians have been making fun of Steven Harper for YEARS.

Just check out Air Farce or This Hour Has 22 Minutes on CBC if you don't believe me.

They even make money for their government by doing so ...

Posted by Will in Seattle on December 2, 2008 at 11:58 AM
41
A Liberal-NDP electoral alliance probably wouldn't be as successful as one might think. The Liberals are the centrist party and if they hooked up with the NDP and began to espouse a more left-wing platform I predict they would lose a sizable chunk of their moderate base to the Tories. Much of their left wing already went to the NDP in the last election. On the other front, I doubt the NDP base would be too peeved unless the alliance's policies were too Liberal, but the only other option on that wing is the Greens who are not yet a suitable alternative. The alliance could certainly win a minority government but I'm skeptical that they could win enough seats to not need unofficial Bloc support.
Posted by TMW on December 2, 2008 at 12:58 PM
42
effort to knoch Obama out of the race

Huh? Oh, you mean by telling the truth about his intentions on trade policy! Canada, save us from your honest politicians! We can't handle honesty down here.
Posted by David Wright on December 2, 2008 at 1:52 PM
43
Um wait. Did someone say Canada has billions? Can they save us? Please save us! Can we borrow Eight Trillion? We'll pay you back! We promise.
Posted by Vince on December 2, 2008 at 2:32 PM
Posted by Proud Canuck on December 2, 2008 at 5:10 PM
45
Does Canada really need to keep Quebec? If they got rid of them they could stop translating everything, especially political speeches, into French.

Quebecois are nothing but a bunch snooty French speaking Poutine eating Beaujolais sipping Frenchity French frogs. No offense.
Posted by elswinger on December 2, 2008 at 7:57 PM
46
I sure didn't expect to find this when I stopped by today...

1. Harper has to go. He's intelligent but has the common sense of the chicken wing I just ate and loves himself (and his power) way too much. Aurevoir.

2. The Liberals and the NDP should get together, even if they have to bank on the support of the Bloc Quebecois. Why? Because even though I generally like our current political system, I wouldn't mind seeing a little more voting and a little less appointing here and there... and I'm crossing my fingers that this situation might just give us the last little kick in the right direction that we need to get this started.

3. Canadians have opinions on American politics -- and they're perfectly entitled to. We live next door, we're flooded with American culture from TV to Wal-Mart and we get CNN. Welcome to the West where people say what they're thinking. Get over it. It's not like I've never heard an American say something about Canada that I disagreed with.

4. Whoever suggested that Canada should join any part of the USA (even the blue states)... no offense... but that won't happen until your government sends its tanks up here for our water and annexes us.

5. @45 Adding "no offense" on to the end of a patently-offensive post doesn't negate the offensiveness of it.

6. I like visiting the United States. I even have a NEXUS card and I usually get an I-68 for the summer. Why can't we all just get along?
Posted by Eric on December 2, 2008 at 9:29 PM
47
#46 My post was meant a joke. The "No offense" was supposed to be the punchline. And I thought Canadians had a sense of humor. I guess the days of SCTV, Kids In The Hall, and Monday Night Curling are over.
Posted by elswinger on December 2, 2008 at 10:58 PM
48
My partner who is pro Bloc Quebec and is French who grew up mostly in Montreal is married to me, American English speaking gal. 90 per cent of our conversations are in English and yet she is and prob always will be Bloc Quebecois because the Quebecer clan is solid and united in a way that anglophones will probably never be able to break.

She jokes that Quebecers would love to be able to saw off Quebec from the rest of Canada and float down to Florida. But since that ain't going to happen in the near future, seems like the bellyache about Quebec by anglophone Canadians is a lot of sheep bleatage.
Posted by sheiler on December 3, 2008 at 3:58 AM
49
I am an ex-Albertan living in Montreal, Quebec. That's like someone from the most blood red part of Texas moving to the Castro. Yesterday I got a call from my folks who still happily reside in Calgary, asking what Quebec thinks of this coalition nonsense. Since I speak for all of Quebec (really, they like me.) I said" Huh?" I've been busy and only glossed over the news and so was vaguely aware of what was going on in Ottawa (which is how most Quebecers are) but is subsequently found out that this is news is HUGE in Alberta. They are beyond livid, because like blood red Texas, they vote uniformly for the Conservatives. They are so angry that for the first time in about 30 years, the Alberta separatist party made the national news. Now Canada is made up of "have" and "have not" provinces, that is those who are net contributors to the federal tax base and those who are net receivers. Most provinces are "have not" provinces (including Quebec) and the others Ontario, BC go back and forth but mostly are "haves". Alberta is of course the most reliably "have" province and they are pissed off about having to share it. (This is because every Albertan is personally responsible for the fact that, during the Devonian era, billions of tons of marine life died and sank to the bottom of the ocean that is now the Alberta oil fields and Albertans don't want to share their wealth) . Forget those Quebec separatists. Alberta is about to become the new confederation killer!! Vive l'Alberta Libre!!!!
Posted by Loushka on December 3, 2008 at 11:14 AM
50
Dan, I stayed at a Holiday Inn once.
Posted by ho' know on December 3, 2008 at 11:43 AM
51
@47 -- Think about when someone calls you a faggot and ends with "no offense" as a punchline. It's one thing to tell a joke, it's another to be a bigoted asswipe and hide behind the old "I was joking" excuse later.
Posted by Eric on December 3, 2008 at 2:09 PM
52
@48 Did you see the recent CBC article about Quebec's french language police harassing restaurants for writing their specials in English last week? There are usually elements of truth to both sides of every story.
Posted by Eric on December 3, 2008 at 2:11 PM
53
#51 Why would someone call me a faggot? I am not gay nor am I uncomfortable of being thought gay.

I asked my friends in Vancouver if I should apologize to you and all Canadians. They told me to tell you to "Fuck off, eh?"
Posted by elswinger on December 3, 2008 at 8:40 PM
54
#52- nope, haven't seen it, but I'll check it out. We had a small gourmet sandwich shop in our hick mountain town for a few years and most of the signage and menus were up to me to make and my french was bad, so I added jokes to both the english and french sections of menus and other propaganda, to 'balance' out the bad french. We had a couple of customers come back with suggested corrections, and so we made changes. But no one gave us any hassles, and we got a lot of people laughing. Our town is a very small provincial, Quebecois, old timers, smoked meat haven. I think part of our charm was that I was an American trying to make it in Quebec, which everyone loved, even the immigration guy who helped me start my long journey over the border.
Posted by sheiler on December 4, 2008 at 6:11 AM

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