Friday, November 7, 2008
2008 About That "Unprovoked" Invasion of Georgia...
Posted by Annie Wagner on Fri, Nov 7, 2008 at 2:14 PM
If you recall, McCain got some fleeting traction this summer when Russia invaded Georgia. He was particularly fond of eviscerating Obama for a cautious early statement saying both sides should "show restraint."
Turns out cautious Obama might not have been so far off the mark. From today's NYT:
TBILISI, Georgia — Newly available accounts by independent military observers of the beginning of the war between Georgia and Russia this summer call into question the longstanding Georgian assertion that it was acting defensively against separatist and Russian aggression.Instead, the accounts suggest that Georgia’s inexperienced military attacked the isolated separatist capital of Tskhinvali on Aug. 7 with indiscriminate artillery and rocket fire, exposing civilians, Russian peacekeepers and unarmed monitors to harm.
The accounts are neither fully conclusive nor broad enough to settle the many lingering disputes over blame in a war that hardened relations between the Kremlin and the West. But they raise questions about the accuracy and honesty of Georgia’s insistence that its shelling of Tskhinvali, the capital of the breakaway region of South Ossetia, was a precise operation.
p.s.: Hello again! Law school's fun. But not as delightful as Slogging.
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4
A lot is going on over there the western media wont cover, like the 1000 Israeli advisors who were engaged in 'helping' Georgia's military..helping em do what? Ethnic cleansing operations in South Ossetia, prompting Russia's move to stop what has now been reported as war crimes...
btw, i believe Georgia is Israels second largest arms customer, behind Columbia...
5
Good to hear from you annie, but this is very old news. Probably the first to post about it on SLOG though. The people of Georgia had their suspicions from the moment it started, and their President and other executive members of the country's Federal level jumped in front of every camera they could to cry invasion. The BBC, Al-Jazeera English and even the CBC covered these suspicions and confirmed the presence of American advisors within days of the "invasion." The fact that the right-wing in this country was playing it as "..the rise of Putin" etc. was an instant clue to the fact that there was much more behind the story.
Georgians are now in the process of attempting to force the resignation of President Saakashvili and those in his cabinet involved.
Thanks though for the mention.
6
Good to hear from you annie, but this is very old news. Probably the first to post about it on SLOG though. The people of Georgia had their suspicions from the moment it started, and their President and other executive members of the country's Federal level jumped in front of every camera they could to cry invasion. The BBC, Al-Jazeera English and even the CBC covered these suspicions and confirmed the presence of American advisors within days of the "invasion." The fact that the right-wing in this country was playing it as "..the rise of Putin" etc. was an instant clue to the fact that there was much more behind the story.
Georgians are now in the process of attempting to force the resignation of President Saakashvili and those in his cabinet involved.
Thanks though for the mention.
7
Good to hear from you annie, but this is very old news. Probably the first to post about it on SLOG though. The people of Georgia had their suspicions from the moment it started, and their President and other executive members of the country's Federal level jumped in front of every camera they could to cry invasion. The BBC, Al-Jazeera English and even the CBC covered these suspicions and confirmed the presence of American advisors within days of the "invasion." The fact that the right-wing in this country was playing it as "..the rise of Putin" etc. was an instant clue to the fact that there was much more behind the story.
Georgians are now in the process of attempting to force the resignation of President Saakashvili and those in his cabinet involved.
Thanks though for the mention.
8
I guess YouTube "won" this one, too.
http://inthesenewtimes.com/2008/08/17/the-western-media-is-feeding-you-complete-horseshit/
Remember when organized media had only to compete with other organized media?
9
But they raise questions about the accuracy and honesty of Georgia’s insistence that its shelling of Tskhinvali, the capital of the breakaway region of South Ossetia, was a precise operation.
Why would that make it somehow acceptable?
Once upon a time, people believed that it was the right of the people to form governments among men to effect their safety and happiness; that when in the course of human events, a government became destructive of these ends, it became necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another.
What the fuck happened to all that?
Progressives should add Abkhazia and Ossetia (and plenty others) to the list which includes/d East Timor, Taiwan, Kurdistan, and Tibet.
10
Turns out cautious Obama might not have been so far off the mark
I hear this often. More & more often everyday. I think we will hear this even more often in the coming days, years, etc.
12
Keep pressing that "Post" button, Matt, it'll come unstuck.
This isn't really "old news"--both sides claimed from the beginning that the other side started it, but the reports of the OSCE observers on the ground, who are more or less neutral and who *were* there, haven't seen the light until now.
14
Toe tag, educate thyself. the portion regarding observers is so-called "news" however everything else is not. Generally by the time a story like this "breaks" in the NYT, its already been buzzing for a few weeks, if not months.
very in-depth:
http://www.phillyimc.org/en/node/75428
http://www.antiwar.com/justin/?articleid=13285
Please, educate thyself.
15
Add the Economist to the above links.
Seriously, if this is news to you you need better sources for international coverage.
16
@cynics above,
You guys really need to understand the difference between speculation and reporting. Yes, it was perfectly plausible long before this report that Georgia had acted in an aggressive fashion. Please try to find a Slog post where I say otherwise--I was reserving judgment long after Obama reversed himself. But there is news in this news, and it's these August and October briefings to diplomats in Tblisi:
The observations by the monitors, including a Finnish major, a Belarussian airborne captain and a Polish civilian, have been the subject of two confidential briefings to diplomats in Tbilisi, the Georgian capital, one in August and the other in October. Summaries were shared with The New York Times by people in attendance at both. Details were then confirmed by three Western diplomats and a Russian, and were not disputed by the O.S.C.E.’s mission in Tbilisi, which was provided with a written summary of the observations.The Economist was not privy to the information in these briefings before yesterday, and neither were various indymedia denizens.
17
"LAW SCHOOL IS FUN?" [emphasis and punctuation supplied]. WRONG. Law school is tragic. Law school is stultifying. It is merely a means to an end: a sheepskin, a bar exam and the right to practice law. Do not believe that law school is fun. It will make you into a lawyer. Practice law. Don't be a lawyer.
18
Annie, I think the above posters were upset that you initially did not say something to the effect "...as reported months ago" etc. The tone of your posting was sorta irresponsible as the evidence was there long before the official observers' statements made it into the NYT. Your reporting of this was correct, but if you had tuned in months ago it would have been relevant. The so-called indymedia denizens (which includes many blogs like this one) are now driving most major news stories so to discount their contribution--especially in an important story like this--would be a misjudgement.
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