http://slog.thestranger.com/slog/archives/2009/01/10/all_protests_are_valuable_exce Comments On: All Protests Are Valuable Except for the Ones That Aren’t by Dominic Holden en-us Copyright 2009 The Stranger. All rights reserved. This RSS file is offered to individuals, The Stranger readers, and non-commercial organizations only. Any commercial websites wishing to use this RSS file, please contact The Stranger. webmaster@thestranger.com (The Stranger Webmaster) Tue, 24 Nov 2009 00:00:01 -0800 Tue, 24 Nov 2009 17:45:00 -0800 Foundation http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/tech/rss SDLesbianTimes.com, San Diego Democratic Club, St Paul's Cathedral, the Stonewall Young Democrats, San Diego Pride, SDSU Pride Resouce Office, Pride at Work, the ACLU, the Courage Campaign, San Diego Equality Campaign, and SD Alliance for Marriage Equality, were ALL THERE (and many, many more) to show their support for our cause. Nobody should be turned away from our team--that's not a way to grow the movement or show appreciation for our supporters. To those of you being negative about the 100-person turnout: stop the whining and say "thanks for the Love" to all of these supportive groups who took the time to march and show their suppot for our cause (none of them, is getting paid to be there).
Posted by Cecile (SD Alliance for Marriage Equality)]]> Mon, 19 Jan 2009 12:56:25 -0800 The Stranger Posted by Genesis Revelations]]> Wed, 14 Jan 2009 15:20:28 -0800 The Stranger Posted by Ms. Jones]]> Wed, 14 Jan 2009 14:27:48 -0800 The Stranger Posted by ByeSexuals]]> Tue, 13 Jan 2009 20:56:50 -0800 The Stranger
It seems that you are ready to spit fire over people that are "doing nothing", but donating money is not a whole lot different. I see a whole lot of these non-profits and NGOs not taking even remotely progressive stances simply because they're trying to make money. The word from them is, "don't rock the boat" and "don't scare the movable middle". That's not the kind of message that I want my money going towards! I don't think that we can change minds in our community unless enough people start making visible demands, and speaking their minds, not hiding behind politicians who will never give us rights without pressure, regardless of party affiliation.

Sure, I can donate money, but I'd rather actually participate in the process and put my voice forward. Activism can do that in a way that donations cannot, and I think that this is one of the fundamental differences between non-profit organizations and a grassroots organization like Queer Ally Coalition, which seeks to give people that voice, not just put people to work for the highest bidder.

Solidarity is not synonymous with charity!
Posted by Red Fox]]> Tue, 13 Jan 2009 17:22:34 -0800 The Stranger Posted by All tapped out]]> Tue, 13 Jan 2009 10:11:48 -0800 The Stranger Posted by fed up with the put downs]]> Tue, 13 Jan 2009 09:44:24 -0800 The Stranger Posted by Heather]]> Tue, 13 Jan 2009 06:38:18 -0800 The Stranger Posted by Heather]]> Tue, 13 Jan 2009 06:37:31 -0800 The Stranger Posted by wakethefuckup]]> Tue, 13 Jan 2009 01:18:40 -0800 The Stranger
The founding of the Mattachine Society in Los Angeles in 1951 marked the beginning of what would grow into a nationwide effort. The society’s leadership came from several male homosexuals who were either members of the Communist Party or traveled in left-wing circles. The slow, patient building of the organization offers an amazing lesson and source of inspiration. Not quite sure how to begin to develop their organization, Harry Hay and another member decided to try to find homosexuals who shared their political sympathies. In an attempt to locate other leftists, they obtained copies of a Communist party petition against the Korean war and took them to the gay male beaches in Los Angeles. During the next two months, the two men collected the signatures of several hundred homosexuals opposed to the war. But when they used the opportunity also to talk about current government investigations of homosexuals in federal employment and to suggest that something ought to be done, they encountered a terrified silence. No one was willing to risk exposure of his sexual identity by joining a homosexual rights organization.

The Mattachine Society’s definition of homosexuals as a minority “unaware” of its existence put the founders on more familiar ground and suggested to them an initial course of action. Their formulation resembled the Marxist distinction between a class “in itself” and a class “for itself.” The difference between these two was one of consciousness. In the former case, workers constituted an objective social category; in the latter, they recognized their common interests. According to Marxist theory, the transformation from one to the other made the working class a cohesive force able to fight on its own behalf. Homosexuals, too, were trapped by false consciousness, by a heterosexist ideology that labeled their sexual orientation an individual aberration. The first task of a homosexual emancipation movement, then, was to challenge the internalization of this view of homosexuals and to develop among the gay population an awareness of its status as an oppressed minority. Out of that awareness homosexuals could then evolve a “highly ethical homosexual culture” and “lead well-adjusted, wholesome, and socially productive lives.”

And socialists and other radicals impacted the explosion of queer organizing which took place after the Stonewall Riots. The lgbt movement has been a series of radical explosions of consciousness and activism followed by longer periods of conservatism. I think we've been in period of conservatism in the lgbt movement since the early 1980s.

Queers who'd worked in the civil rights movement, the women's movement, the antiwar movement, and other radical social movements of the 60s were the first to organize the struggle for gay liberation. The first gay liberation organization called itself the Gay Liberation Front in solidarity with the Vietnamese resistence fighters. Imagine if today's gay rights movement named itself after the Iraqi or Afghani or Gazan resisters of today. That should give us an idea of how CONSERVATIVE our movement had become. We've stopped reaching for our goals and have grown used to settling for whatever crumbs they happen to drop.

Even at the time of the Stonewall Riots, the more conservative gay organizations tried to hold the movement back from radicalizing. "A clash between the old guard organizers and newly rising militants was apparent from the Sunday of the riots, when Mattachine activists who’d met with the mayor’s office and police posted this sign on the front of the Stonewall: “We homosexuals plead with our people to please help maintain peaceful and quiet conduct on the streets of the Village—Mattachine.” Their pleas were ignored. Each night thereafter through Wednesday, more and more gays and straight leftists, from socialists and Black Panthers to the Yippies and Puerto Rican Young Lords, arrived on the scene to participate in the latest confrontation with police." (http://www.isreview.org/issues/63/feat-s…, Sherry Wolf, Stonewall: The rise of gay power)
Posted by Red Queer]]> Mon, 12 Jan 2009 17:14:14 -0800 The Stranger
@ 14 and other comments about the economy and discrimination in the workplace, you are right, marriage equality is only one of many struggles that need to be won and that idea was put forward brilliantly by the speakers that QuAC invited to speak at the event.

Below is an expert from a forthcoming Socialist Worker article by Ethan Boyles that highlights some of the topics that speakers covered from the front:

"This theme of unity was expressed by many speakers who argued that the fight for gay rights does not stand apart from other struggles. Mike Andrew, of Pride at Work, held that organizing for marriage equality is good, but not enough. The struggle needs to be taken into work places as well. “[LGBT workers] need union representation like any other worker,” he said."

"Chanan Suarezdiaz of QuAC called for the repeal of the “don’t ask, don’t tell” policies used in the military and pointed out the hypocrisy of the U.S. government, which claims to be spreading democracy around the world and yet treats members of the LGBT community as second-class citizens."

"A member of Students for a Hate Free Daily (a University of Washington group formed to protest against a homophobic article published in the school’s newspaper last month) connected the gay rights movement to the struggles of homeless youth in his speech, pointing out that 40% of homeless youth identify as queer."

Posted by Revolutionary Rachel]]> Mon, 12 Jan 2009 16:12:01 -0800 The Stranger
I'm not saying we should "shut up" but time spent in the street protesting might be more productively used somewhere else.
Posted by Jigae]]> Mon, 12 Jan 2009 15:02:55 -0800 The Stranger Posted by Red Fox]]> Mon, 12 Jan 2009 14:01:31 -0800 The Stranger As far as the role of the International Socialist Organization, there are two main issues--1) People can and have won reforms that lessen oppression even under capitalism. We actively support the fight for reforms under capitalism even if they don't get at the root of the problem. However, we don't believe full liberation can come until capitalism is overthrown. Therefore,as people who want to see the liberation of all oppressed groups, we have to work for the overthrow of capitalism. That takes organization. Building the socialist movement is a very important, concrete part of building support for LGBT liberation as well as the liberation of all oppressed groups. Having our banner, selling our newspaper etc. is a contribution to winning socialism and hence winning the only firm basis of LGBT liberation.
2) We believe that the fight for progressive reforms under capitalism and the fight to overthrow it are intimately connected. Every step forward in winning reforms builds the confidence , organization etc. that will be needed to finally overthrow capitalism. That is why socialists are the most consistent fighters for reforms. The I.S.O. does not just show up at rallies with our banner and newsppaper----which would be a contribution to the struggle for liberation in and of itself. We also build and are often in the forefront of organizing rallies, demonstrations and struggles in general. The list of the coalitions we've been involved in , struggles we've organized etc. would take up too many pages , but here are just a few in Seattle alone:
*In 1978, we organized with many other groups to defeat an anti-gay initiative that would have taken away employment and housing rights. We were instrumental in getting local 174 of the Teamsters Union to sign on to that fight.
*In the late 90's we organized with other groups to win same sex couples' rights at the UW---rights still in existence today.
* In the 90's,We organized a protest against lesbian-bashing outside the Wild Rose--initiating a protest that several other groups joined in .
* We were instrumental in organizing Marriage Equality Now ( MENOW) , a few years ago.
* We were involved in the formation of the Queer Allies group recently
* We organized the only public open discussion on the victory of Prop 8 ,and how we could win Gay Marriage during " Day without a Gay", Dec. 10
The list of our activity in opposition to racism, sexism, war and exploitation just here in Seattle, much less across the U.S. would take too much space----but anyone who wants more information is invited to contact us or attend our meetings on Wed. evenings at Seattle Central Community College. Contact us at 206-931-2922 or info@seattleiso.org
Far from being "parasites" , we BUILD movements against oppression and exploitation. The real parasites are the politicians who seek LGBT votes and money but give little in return.

Steve Leigh, proud supporter of LGBT liberation AND proud member of the International Socialist Organization
Posted by Steve Leigh]]> Mon, 12 Jan 2009 13:34:21 -0800 The Stranger
Domestic partnerships are a great advance, but what would we have if we actually had a vibrant, energetic, grassroots, democratically organized political movement involving the thousands of people who clearly were moved to action on 11/15? What if people came to rallies and weren't bored off their asses by talks of love and harmony and peace and reaching out? Who in the hell wants to make friends with people who are trying to kill us? Marriage equality bills have been introduced every year since 2005. Why doesn't Frank Chopp call a party line vote and pass marriage equality tomorrow? Why does the Democratic Party allow people in its ranks that don't support equal rights or even its own platform?

Last month, a gay Ecuadorian immigrant was murdered in New York by four men shouting anti-Latino and anti-gay slurs. Last summer, Duwanna Johnson was beaten on camera by cops in a police station. Last month, a 28 year old lesbian in Richmond, CA, was beaten and gangraped by four men for 45 minutes and then left naked outside an abandoned building. What response does ERW have to these violent attacks on our community? And what strategies do we have to make sure these things don't happen here? If we don't have a strategy, shouldn't we devise one? By the way, has anyone publicly pointed out the fact that ERW's strategy of winning rights through the judicial process FAILED.

Why is there so much internalized homophobia in some of these comments? Why do we follow the tone set by our leaders and insist that this is NOT a civil rights struggle, that we should NOT be angry at attack on us and our community, that we should NOT step up and create new forms of political expression and protest beyond simply writing a check or casting a ballot? I guess I am a radical. I believe equal rights are worth fighting for. Damn me.


Posted by queers CAN too think]]> Mon, 12 Jan 2009 12:35:02 -0800 The Stranger
For too many years, queers and lefties in general have had this really pessimistic definition of success based on numbers of phone calls made or door bells knocked or signatures gathered. Success in a political movement is not determined by the money you raise (No on 8 raised more money and failed) or on how many people you can get to come to your party, but on how many people you can raise to the level of self-conscious organizers.

As for Barney Frank... He's a fucking sell out. Just goes to show you that the Democratic Party loves to kill social movement by letting a few into their private clubs and screwing the rest of us. What has Barney Frank done in the last 25 years to help gay people? Why did he take George Bush's position and call SF mayor Gavin Newsom "divisive" when Newsom started marrying gay couples? A real equal rights supporter would have cheered him on and challenged other mayors (like Greg Nickles) The guy was forced out of the closet for having sex with a male prostitute and instrumental in getting Congress to hand over our tax dollars to Wall Street. That's your hero? Shit, there are plenty of great queers out there to look up to. Raise your standards.

And just to set the record straight: those thousands of people DID NOT come out on 11/15 because ERW or Kyler told them to. Thousands around the country who have never heard of ERW or Kyler came out. People came out because they were angry. We were attacked and people were pissed. A poodle could have called that demonstration and people would have showed up because that's what you do when you are outraged at an injustice.
Posted by pickle kisser]]> Mon, 12 Jan 2009 11:51:17 -0800 The Stranger
I think that there is room in this community for both types of groups. Fundraising organizations have their role to fill, but let's not forget that the Civil Rights, Womens' Rights, and Gay Rights movements of the 60s and 70s were successful because they built consciousness and solidarity with the community. I don't seem to remember them just collecting donations and then pleading to politicians for equal rights. They made DEMANDS, why shouldn't we follow suit?
Posted by Red Fox]]> Mon, 12 Jan 2009 11:19:46 -0800 The Stranger
By the way, in terms of being "out of touch with the community and reality", you were apparently the only person in the crowd of 10,000 on 11/15 who interpreted Ron Sims's comment that "everyone should be able to marry anyone they want" as an endorsement for NAMBLA and polygamy. In that sense, you sound like a right wing self-hating queer. I wonder if the UW Daily's John Fay sees you as his mentor.
Posted by i don't get paid to kill social movements]]> Mon, 12 Jan 2009 11:17:50 -0800 The Stranger
This is not going to happen in the first 100 days of the Obama administration, and you know it.

Now, gays in the military or non-discrimination for gays on housing, renting, hiring, etc might ...
Posted by Will in Seattle]]> Mon, 12 Jan 2009 01:22:03 -0800 The Stranger
Dominic (@70), you chimed in after 69 comments to defend yourself by repeating the same lame arguments people are taking you to task for. Being so dismissive of a single action - without providing any sort of context explaining it - is worse than ineffective. It discourages everyone, both those that are working hard and others that are considering doing something.

And re: the International Socialist Organization, get off it. Taking cheap shots at organizations you don't seem interested in understanding doesn't lend great credibility to the rest of your work.

There have been a lot of really great comments so far, talking about the need for a variety of voices, directions for GLBTQ rights movements to take, and more. I would hope you could engage with the readers on that level.
Posted by applekicker]]> Sun, 11 Jan 2009 23:57:19 -0800 The Stranger Posted by Heather]]> Sun, 11 Jan 2009 21:35:07 -0800 The Stranger
My point is that size queens are not always men.
Posted by MPetrelis]]> Sun, 11 Jan 2009 19:52:15 -0800 The Stranger 100?
"looks like the movement is dying"?

NEWS FLASH>>>

The 'movement' is DEAD

you read it on SLOG first
Posted by grim reaper]]> Sun, 11 Jan 2009 17:59:59 -0800 The Stranger
I didn't criticize the people who marched. But I do think the march was worse than ineffective--it looks like the movement is dying when only 100 people show up and the biggest presence is a parasitic group like the ISO.
Posted by Dominic Holden]]> Sun, 11 Jan 2009 17:53:40 -0800 The Stranger