http://slog.thestranger.com/slog/archives/2009/01/05/sound_transit_fares_fair Comments On: Sound Transit Fares: Fair? by Erica C. Barnett en-us Copyright 2009 The Stranger. All rights reserved. This RSS file is offered to individuals, The Stranger readers, and non-commercial organizations only. Any commercial websites wishing to use this RSS file, please contact The Stranger. webmaster@thestranger.com (The Stranger Webmaster) Mon, 23 Nov 2009 00:00:01 -0800 Mon, 23 Nov 2009 05:00:00 -0800 Foundation http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/tech/rss
The RFA will make riding light rail hell. Among the problems: What if you are in the RFA, don’t scan in because you at first think you’re going to get off in the RFA, but enroute decide to change destinations and get off at a station that happens to be outside the RFA? You didn’t scan in, so now what?
Posted by jcdk]]> Wed, 07 Jan 2009 21:25:37 -0800 The Stranger
Andrew @17: "...everyone can just walk on and off and the buses can get through downtown in a reasonable amount of time" The problem with this logic is that currently, most current fare collections are happening outside the ride free area. That zippy trip you currently enjoy downtown wouldn't be so speedy but stops outside the ride free area would be much shorter.

DUMP THE RIDE FREE AREA!! It not only complicates when and how you pay, but makes boarding and un-boarding a nightmare. Nothing like waiting for some moron to dig for 3 minutes for change while 10+ people wait to board. Better yet - someone in the back decides they aren't going to even get up until the bus stops. Then everyone waiting to board has to watch as moron makes his/her way to the front THEN new passengers can get on. Boarding would be much smoother and faster if people paid as they got on through one door and other people could exit out the back door.
Posted by radix_point]]> Tue, 06 Jan 2009 16:22:24 -0800 The Stranger
Why does ST cost $3 from Tacoma to Seattle (30+ miles) or even Tacoma to Everett, but $2.50 from Bellevue to Seattle (6 miles), while Metro is $1.50 off-peak from Kirkland or Issaquah to Seattle. Makes no sense. Just have zones and charge the same for all the service between the zones.


Posted by Rider]]> Tue, 06 Jan 2009 12:12:00 -0800 The Stranger Posted by Joseph]]> Tue, 06 Jan 2009 09:08:13 -0800 The Stranger
Also, with smart card fares, they could probably program in an exception to the 2 zone fare for people going only 1 stop, if they want... though it doesn't seem necessary in this case.

Anyway, with 2 zones, all of SE Seattle is in the same zone as downtown, which seems fair. When the University Link opens, it should be in that zone as well.

The per-mile charge is ridiculous.
Posted by litlnemo]]> Mon, 05 Jan 2009 23:26:58 -0800 The Stranger
This is how they should do the light rail, for sure -- buses, though, are tougher because it's not possible to put ticket machines at all the stops. (Put them on the buses, maybe?)

Slowing down the loading of the buses within the tunnel is a problem, particularly when you realize that is going to slow down the trains down there as well while they wait for buses to get out of their way.
Posted by litlnemo]]> Mon, 05 Jan 2009 23:22:35 -0800 The Stranger Posted by Rainier Valley Guy]]> Mon, 05 Jan 2009 21:42:24 -0800 The Stranger Posted by Dougsf]]> Mon, 05 Jan 2009 18:06:33 -0800 The Stranger
Posted by Dougsf]]> Mon, 05 Jan 2009 18:04:16 -0800 The Stranger Posted by joykiller]]> Mon, 05 Jan 2009 17:54:56 -0800 The Stranger Posted by Eric L]]> Mon, 05 Jan 2009 17:29:29 -0800 The Stranger
Problem solved.

Then let the DSA pay for the vouchers if they care about them so much.

They can give them free with any purchase at a downtown business.
Posted by Will in Seattle]]> Mon, 05 Jan 2009 17:26:43 -0800 The Stranger Yeah because getting on the 38 or the 9 downtown in SF is a fucking dream, right?

What the fuck are you talking about? It's a god damned nightmare down there, and that's with BART and muni underground away from traffic.

That is further proof we need a ride-free zone.
Posted by andrew]]> Mon, 05 Jan 2009 17:25:06 -0800 The Stranger
It'd be faster than sitting there while the crack heads and their ho's stumble on board. Have you seen how long that takes? Jesus, an 80 year fumbling to pay in pennies is more productive then downtown Seattle's bums.
Posted by Free Bums on Free buses]]> Mon, 05 Jan 2009 16:57:53 -0800 The Stranger
I'd love to see the cash fare box eliminated. You should have to have a ticket or a pass to ride the bus. That would speed up boarding as individual riders will no longer be able to hold up the line as they pay with 15 dimes or 30 nickels or whatever the fuck they're doing that takes one person so long to board.
Posted by keshmeshi]]> Mon, 05 Jan 2009 16:50:45 -0800 The Stranger Posted by infrequent]]> Mon, 05 Jan 2009 16:40:56 -0800 The Stranger
Suburban riders are used to paying more (the two-zone system). But unless you're offering more mass-transit options than we have now cutting park-and-ride lots is simply going to put more cars on the road.
Posted by rjh]]> Mon, 05 Jan 2009 16:33:22 -0800 The Stranger
The U-Bahn is part of the MVV (Münchner Verkehrsverbund), the tariff union for the Munich region. All stations have information panels that show the zone you're in, although Munich city is basically identical with the inner zone (all U-Bahn stations apart from U6 Garching-Hochbrück).

1-day pass - 4.80 (9.60 for the whole MVV network)


Single ticket - 2.20 (short trip - 1.10)
Strip ticket (10 strips) - 10.50 (for the inner zone two strips have to be cancelled)

Season Tickets (IsarCards) can be bought as "rings", the Munich city area would be 4 ring zones:
Weekly pass 15.10


Like in other German cities, the Munich U-Bahn is an open system, there are no ticket barriers, you must cancel your ticket before entering the platform area and show it in case you're controlled. All tickets are valid on any means of transport (bus, tram, subway and local trains) with free transfer between them.

http://www.mvv-muenchen.de/web4archiv/ob…

Peace.
Posted by Reality Check]]> Mon, 05 Jan 2009 16:26:56 -0800 The Stranger
First a no brainer. The free ride zone is eliminated.

Second we need to handle pricing exactly the same as Munich Germany Handles the U-Bahn.

http://www.mvv-muenchen.de/en/home/fahrg…

Here is the link. Essentially they created zones (circles) that are spaced out further from the center of the city's Main Train Station. Fares increase approx $2 for each zone further out.

Single ticket fares (Einzelfahrkarte)
Number of zones & Price of single ticket
1 2.30
2 4.60
3 6.90
4+ 9.20

They also have a whole variety of monthly/daily packages. Note that you can travel the whole zone for a day with the same ticket. So if all of your travel was going to be within the center of town, it would cost you $2.30/day.

Lovely system. Fast, efficient, clean. I would park my car and take the U-Bahn if it existed here the same way it does there.

Imagine that.
Posted by Reality Check]]> Mon, 05 Jan 2009 16:10:34 -0800 The Stranger
I imagine if Metro instituted a zero tolerance policy for farejumping it might help curb the problem, but I also realize that this is a city in America, so I don't really have high hopes on that one.
Posted by j.lee]]> Mon, 05 Jan 2009 16:06:53 -0800 The Stranger
Encourage monthly pass use through discounts to riders and incentives for major employers, and eliminate as much confusion as possible (the whole city needs to be one zone), and overall, boarding will go better than it does currently.


Posted by Dougsf]]> Mon, 05 Jan 2009 16:06:39 -0800 The Stranger Posted by Greg]]> Mon, 05 Jan 2009 16:01:54 -0800 The Stranger Posted by Abby]]> Mon, 05 Jan 2009 16:01:11 -0800 The Stranger They can control park-and ride usage pretty simply by charging to park or charging more to park depending on the current set up. They probably should include that in the plan once the light-rail option is a live alternative.
A single card is definitely the way to go, and penalizing those who don't have one or don't use one is one way to get buy-in, and maybe that in itself would provide the impetus to improve it.
Posted by kinaidos]]> Mon, 05 Jan 2009 15:55:41 -0800 The Stranger
Does any other bus system reverse the order of getting on the front and off the back based on where the bus is and where it was? Somebody must be as dumb as us but I don't know who. Belgians perhaps? I've heard Belgians are awful.
Posted by elenchos]]> Mon, 05 Jan 2009 15:53:03 -0800 The Stranger