http://slog.thestranger.com/slog/archives/2008/12/01/those_capitalists_have_been_ve Comments On: Those Capitalists Have Been Very, Very Bad... by Dan Savage en-us Copyright 2009 The Stranger. All rights reserved. This RSS file is offered to individuals, The Stranger readers, and non-commercial organizations only. Any commercial websites wishing to use this RSS file, please contact The Stranger. webmaster@thestranger.com (The Stranger Webmaster) Mon, 23 Nov 2009 00:00:01 -0800 Mon, 23 Nov 2009 09:15:00 -0800 Foundation http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/tech/rss You should stop by the discussion group for a chat. It would be good to move beyond name calling and talk about what to do about the mess we are all in.
Posted by doug]]> Wed, 03 Dec 2008 00:51:17 -0800 The Stranger http://www.socialism.com/activities/wash…, or call 206-722-2453.
Posted by Val]]> Wed, 03 Dec 2008 00:50:41 -0800 The Stranger Posted by Doreen]]> Tue, 02 Dec 2008 19:23:02 -0800 The Stranger Posted by jade]]> Tue, 02 Dec 2008 14:59:22 -0800 The Stranger
I'm using quotations to differentiate them from socialist who advocate nationalization and state control of all means of production, not to disparage them. I am a social democrat.
Posted by JMS]]> Tue, 02 Dec 2008 14:38:32 -0800 The Stranger
I'm not all that familiar with the FSP, but if they're authoritarian socialists, I don't know how they defend their system, but that's what us libertarian socialists have to say.
Posted by Laurel]]> Tue, 02 Dec 2008 10:47:18 -0800 The Stranger Posted by Laurel]]> Tue, 02 Dec 2008 10:38:48 -0800 The Stranger
Socialism is an economic theory, not a well-defined political system. Specifically, it is an economic system based around the redistribution of wealth according to people's needs and the needs of the community. The socialism that is commonly referred to as having failed is a specific kind of uthoritarian tyranny where all the economic decisions were super centralized (this never works because economies need to be determined by their participants in order to be flexible and functional).

I see people here using the term "pure socialism" to refer to this system, but that's inaccurate. "Pure socialism" would simply be any system where wealth is redistrubuted until all needs are met. This could just as easily occur democratically - indeed, I think it could only successfully happen that way.

And as for people who talk about "whether or not" we "should" have socialism in the US...WE ALREADY DO. Just not as much as western Europe. Also, whenever politicians talk about the importance of regulating capitalism...REGULATION OF CAPITALISM IS ALSO SOCIALISM.
Posted by Laurel]]> Tue, 02 Dec 2008 10:36:00 -0800 The Stranger
Dan, I love you, but you've got no class analysis. Your hypochondriac metaphor is bullshit. Human beings are not a singular body that, if one section is diseased, the rest feels the effect. The capitalist system of our country is fucking *built* on the poverty of other nations and has been for a very long time, even during the times when your family and mine have enjoyed comfort.

And YES to social democracy. I'm actually a communist, myself (libertarian communist, which is VERY different from the authoritarian Communism we all know and hate), but I think social democracy is the most viable next step in the direction of a just society.
Posted by Laurel]]> Tue, 02 Dec 2008 10:29:15 -0800 The Stranger Posted by JMS]]> Mon, 01 Dec 2008 20:01:14 -0800 The Stranger Posted by Brandon J.]]> Mon, 01 Dec 2008 19:38:26 -0800 The Stranger Weren't the people who said there were no WMD's in Iraq also like hypochondriacs?

Yeah . . . I just recently discovered that little gem. I was floored. Did Dan eventually retract that? I know he didn't vote for Bush in 2004...

On topic: Socialists are actual social liberals, unlike Libertarians. They will vote in favor of legalization of drugs, gay civil marriage, and gun control. They won't--like Libertarians--sell out the First Amendment in order to "save" the Second.

Yes, their fiscal/economic plank probably wouldn't not work in our country. But smugly mocking someone else's chosen economic system when, Jesus Christ, Dan, you fell for every single line of bullshit the Bush Adm. was trying to feed us . . .

I'm still fucking speechless...

And, no, I'm not a Socialist.
Posted by nonplussed]]> Mon, 01 Dec 2008 18:28:55 -0800 The Stranger http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flooz.com)
Posted by E]]> Mon, 01 Dec 2008 18:13:35 -0800 The Stranger
But they do have cool parties, mind you.

And if you've been to a Republican party, you know the Red Bushies don't have cool parties.
Posted by Will in Seattle]]> Mon, 01 Dec 2008 16:48:49 -0800 The Stranger Posted by Vince]]> Mon, 01 Dec 2008 16:09:46 -0800 The Stranger Posted by Cinnamon Society Blues]]> Mon, 01 Dec 2008 15:47:25 -0800 The Stranger
Socialists in America talk the old rhetoric of change and revolution, but the fact is the moment has proven them correct in giant parts of our lives.

Where is our National health care plan?
Why are millions of Americans losing theri homes to poverty.

What happened to good management?

The far right has run the country into war, unemployment, poverty for millions more and a depression. Is it time for a new left movement?

Ronald Reagan lied, and so did the Bush family. Feeding trillions into the upper classes does not work. War is not our national salvation.

I think I will go take a gander, the crises are far from over.


Posted by Larry]]> Mon, 01 Dec 2008 15:35:39 -0800 The Stranger very bad. But one answer is to introduce (more) 'complementary currencies'. They are working world wide, and they don't have interest or inflation. When the national currency (which also happens to accrete weath towards the wealthy) starts to fail, alternate currencies which benefit humans, not banks, are an answer.
Posted by treacle]]> Mon, 01 Dec 2008 15:25:16 -0800 The Stranger Posted by SCCC Student]]> Mon, 01 Dec 2008 15:19:16 -0800 The Stranger Go Project Venus!
Posted by ams]]> Mon, 01 Dec 2008 15:16:50 -0800 The Stranger Posted by elenchos]]> Mon, 01 Dec 2008 15:14:21 -0800 The Stranger Posted by tomasyalba]]> Mon, 01 Dec 2008 15:04:41 -0800 The Stranger If only there was a political system that somehow used people's innate selfishness to make things better for everyone else, we'd be fine.
Posted by Urgutha Forka]]> Mon, 01 Dec 2008 14:48:02 -0800 The Stranger