Comments On: White Lights by Dominic Holden

Comments On: White Lights by Dominic Holden http://slog.thestranger.com/slog/archives/2009/06/16/white-lights Comments On: White Lights by Dominic Holden en-us Copyright 2009 The Stranger. All rights reserved. This RSS file is offered to individuals, The Stranger readers, and non-commercial organizations only. Any commercial websites wishing to use this RSS file, please contact The Stranger. webmaster@thestranger.com (The Stranger Webmaster) Wed, 25 Nov 2009 00:00:01 -0800 Wed, 25 Nov 2009 08:45:00 -0800 Foundation http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/tech/rss <![CDATA[Re: White Lights]]>
Now, if located next to a high vibration area, it might be shorter. But not much. It's not like incandescents which use a filament.
Posted by Will in Seattle]]> Wed, 17 Jun 2009 11:16:55 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: White Lights]]>
Too bad Greg showed up 5th in the 43rd endorsements last night, with similar results in other LDs in Seattle.
Posted by Will in Seattle]]> Wed, 17 Jun 2009 11:15:28 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: White Lights]]> Posted by Gomez]]> Wed, 17 Jun 2009 10:02:53 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: White Lights]]> do create visibility problems. They may be brighter, and they may have better color definition, but because the light coming from these LEDs is so highly directional, you end up with spots on your eyes and reduced night vision capabilities. What this means is that they're distracting when you're under them, and you see less well when you go somewhere else.
I think we can all agree that using less energy in the long run is a priority (and yes, sometimes it costs more money to save the world), but somebody needs to put some shades on them thangs.
Posted by Manos]]> Wed, 17 Jun 2009 10:02:02 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: White Lights]]> do create visibility problems. They may be brighter, and they may have better color definition, but because the light coming from these LEDs is so highly directional, you end up with spots on your eyes and reduced night vision capabilities. What this means is that they're distracting when you're under them, and you see less well when you go somewhere else.
I think we can all agree that using less energy in the long run is a priority (and yes, sometimes it costs more money to save the world), but somebody needs to put some shades on them thangs.
Posted by Manos]]> Wed, 17 Jun 2009 10:01:59 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: White Lights]]>
Reminds me of when my apartment building switched to flourescents in the hallways. Everybody complained how white and bright it was, a few weeks later nobody cared. And I guarantee if we were to switch back to the dim, orangy hue of old there would be real outrage.
Posted by tictoc]]> Wed, 17 Jun 2009 08:26:54 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: White Lights]]> doesn't maintain.
Posted by DOUG.]]> Wed, 17 Jun 2009 08:21:56 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: White Lights]]> here.

They use the "daylight" or "cool" white bulbs because everyone else does. I hate. At night, the human eye likes warmer light - it's more like fire light. That's why "cool white" fluorescent lights look so damn tacky in WallMart at night. Ever walk in to a grocery store late at night and your body starts to feel like it's waking up? It feels gross, but, at least for me, I don't get that feeling under incandescent lights, see @24. The daylight bulbs look a bit like moonlight, I suppose, but less cheery.

Warm white LEDs are on the way but remain less efficient than cool white LEDs, because that's where the research money is focused.

The LED streetlights stay cooler, are less susceptible to damage, less susceptible to darkening of the reflector, attract fewer bugs (less UV), last longer (big savings), and have a higher color rendering index (distinguish colors better). And they are politically in vogue and there is stimulus money available for them, so there isn't much we can do. So push for warm white!
Posted by rubus]]> Tue, 16 Jun 2009 23:25:42 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: White Lights]]> Posted by guestoflake49]]> Tue, 16 Jun 2009 22:54:18 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: White Lights]]> Posted by guestoflake49]]> Tue, 16 Jun 2009 22:52:25 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: White Lights]]> Posted by ROAG]]> Tue, 16 Jun 2009 22:30:27 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: White Lights]]>
Not so bad. Shielding your eyes? What? Do you ride around staring at streetlights? I experienced not one bit of discomfort. Once all the lights are LED we probably won't even notice, since so much of our perception is based on context.

For instance, are they really BLUE!? Or do they just LOOK blue next to the incredibly orange sodium lights?

That said, I feel like they shouldn't spend twenty million on streetlamps when they're laying off hundreds of teachers.

Posted by emor]]> Tue, 16 Jun 2009 21:54:52 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: White Lights]]>
I contacted City Light and spoke with Jeffrey Gilfoy who said to email complaints to him via jeffrey.gilfoy@seattle.gov and he would pass it along. Also, from the Capitol Hill Blog (3 months ago) a comment from Vicki Marsten read thusly:

Dear Mike,

Thank you for your comment. Please send notify me directly which lights are intrusive to you. This is a pilot and the use of LED's is just beginning to emerge in Seattle and we need all the feedback we can about how the whiteness of the light is perceived.

Thank you, Vicki Marsten
Seattle City Light
Comment by Vicki Marsten, Seattle City Light

*****************************************
Please send them your feedback before the whole city is awash in brilliant, harsh white light. Maybe it's not too late. :(

Posted by No Offense]]> Tue, 16 Jun 2009 21:20:22 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: White Lights]]> Posted by montex]]> Tue, 16 Jun 2009 21:18:47 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: White Lights]]> Posted by Catalina Vel-DuRay]]> Tue, 16 Jun 2009 21:10:15 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: White Lights]]>
And here's an interesting tidbit about the trial areas, all of which were on Capitol Hill: They switched out the streetlights in these areas, and there were few complaints (even though letters had been sent out alerting people of the switch). But in one of the trial areas, they switched them back, and people screamed bloody murder. So it just goes to show that this is 99% perception/Capitol Hill self-induced drama.

Streetlights are one of the most touchy issues at any utility - 85% the people think City Light hasn't put out enough, and the rest thinks there's way too many of them. In any event, the brightness and number of lights on streets is determined by both S-DOT and the Feds, not City Light. And LEDs are what every utility, big or small, is going to because it's cheaper to operate, so you might as well get used to it.

Posted by Catalina Vel-DuRay]]> Tue, 16 Jun 2009 21:08:51 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: White Lights]]> Posted by Zander]]> Tue, 16 Jun 2009 21:07:07 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: White Lights]]> Posted by ROAG]]> Tue, 16 Jun 2009 21:01:33 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: White Lights]]>
Certainly, be our guest if you'd like to quantify those additional costs you pointed out in your post that will be realized by NOT spending $21 mil on LED street lights.

However, lets take it a step farther. Wouldn't that $21 million be better spent supporting students and teachers in public schools, colleges and universities? Can you deny the cost-benefit ratio would far outstrip wasting $21 million of LED technology that will be utterly outdated in three to four years?
Posted by Cranky Old Man]]> Tue, 16 Jun 2009 20:39:40 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: White Lights]]>
http://www.njaa.org/light.html is one good resource to perhaps refine your ideas when spending the stimulus funds.

Posted by lkjh]]> Tue, 16 Jun 2009 20:18:55 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: White Lights]]> $20 million to save $408,000 per year? What is that...a 50 year payback for the money spent?

I'm sure that $408,000 will increase every year, and reduce citizens' energy costs due to decreased demand and, um... haven't you been paying attention to the actual costs of energy use (wars, climate change, habitat destruction)? Have we talked about anything ELSE the past 10 years?

The ones they've changed on the north end of Broadway (or is it the south end of 10th?) look HORRIBLE. [...] They make that whole block look like an aisle at Target.

I thought they already turned that block into an aisle at Target?

Posted by lizzie]]> Tue, 16 Jun 2009 20:18:52 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: White Lights]]> Posted by AliceInChains]]> Tue, 16 Jun 2009 20:07:12 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: White Lights]]>
I just don't understand why we need all new streetlamps just to use a different bulb, isn't there an LED bulb that will work in the old lamp poles.
Posted by Super Jesse]]> Tue, 16 Jun 2009 19:54:57 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: White Lights]]> Posted by seattlebikeguy]]> Tue, 16 Jun 2009 19:54:25 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: White Lights]]> And this is going to stimulate the economy how?
Posted by Rotten666]]> Tue, 16 Jun 2009 19:44:18 -0700 The Stranger