Comments On: Maybe Along With That National Conversation About Gun Control We Should Have Some National Conversations About Masculinity, Insecurity, Overcompensation, Dick Size... by Dan Savage http://slog.thestranger.com/slog/archives/2012/12/17/maybe-along-with-that-national-conversation-about-gun-control-we-should-have-some-national-conversations-about-masculinity-insecurity-overco Comments On: Maybe Along With That National Conversation About Gun Control We Should Have Some National Conversations About Masculinity, Insecurity, Overcompensation, Dick Size... by Dan Savage en-us Copyright 2013 The Stranger. All rights reserved. This RSS file is offered to individuals, The Stranger readers, and non-commercial organizations only. Any commercial websites wishing to use this RSS file, please contact The Stranger. webmaster@thestranger.com (The Stranger Webmaster) Fri, 24 May 2013 00:00:01 -0700 Fri, 24 May 2013 14:45:00 -0700 Foundation http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/tech/rss <![CDATA[Re: Maybe Along With That National Conversation About Gun Control We Should Have Some National Conversations About Masculinity, Insecurity, Overcompensation, Dick Size...]]> Posted by watchout5]]> Thu, 20 Dec 2012 05:56:39 -0800 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: Maybe Along With That National Conversation About Gun Control We Should Have Some National Conversations About Masculinity, Insecurity, Overcompensation, Dick Size...]]>
Gun control via laws cannot work for a very practical reason. I do not need a manufacturer to build a weapon for me to purchase in order to own a firearm. I can build weapons far more damaging (and deadly) than ones that can legally be sold. It might take me a couple of days to get the parts but I could build a tank killer cannon if for some stupid reason I thought I needed one. The same cannon loaded with grapeshot would do wonders against people in body armor.
Modern weaponry may have more range (and definitely better accuracy to a point) than older types but no real difference in how deadly they are. Modernized weapons can be reloaded faster and a person can carry more ammo but that is about all.
Case in point: The Henry and Winchester repeating rifles in the 1870's allowed a cowboy to carry a lot of ammo if needed. A Native American with a bow was highly limited on the amount of arrows he could make and carry at a time. But that Native could easily outshoot the average cowboy. And that arrow will do a lot more damage to a person's body than the bullet will. Knapping an arrowhead takes some skill to do but it isn't that hard to learn. And you can find instructions on how to make a good bow in just a few seconds time if you know what you are doing on Google. Hard to conceal of course but so what? Decent bows can be used at ranges of over 100 yards while a pistol sucks at those ranges. Oh and Kevlar armor won't protect you very well from an arrow. A target arrow will punch right thru it and even a broadhead will go thru it.
Nuclear weapons are something that I can not in any way match at home but since I live in the US I don't have to worry as much about the Government dropping one on me. The fallout from doing so (both real and political) would be devastating to a lot more people than killing me that way would be worth.
Now am I a threat to anyone because I have that sort of knowledge? No. I have absolutely no intention of doing anything with that knowledge. If I were insane then I would be a threat but I am not insane. For the same reason I don't tell people of better ways to cause terror in the US besides flying aircraft into large buildings. Yes there were (and probably still are but I am not interested in finding out) more effective ways to terrorize a city than killing a large number of people in a couple of buildings.
And none of that requires me to be a gun-nut, which is something I am not. I just read a lot. And played a lot of war-games. You can learn a lot by reading anything that catches your eye. Some of it you might wish to unlearn but guess what? You can't unlearn something you have learned.
And now you have learned that there is a truck driver out there that could (but won't) plan an effective terrorist attack and can design weapons capable of standing off the Army (for a short time anyway) and you can not unlearn that fact. Have a nice day.
Posted by Romial]]> Wed, 19 Dec 2012 15:54:36 -0800 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: Maybe Along With That National Conversation About Gun Control We Should Have Some National Conversations About Masculinity, Insecurity, Overcompensation, Dick Size...]]> Posted by Haley]]> Tue, 18 Dec 2012 23:44:23 -0800 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: Maybe Along With That National Conversation About Gun Control We Should Have Some National Conversations About Masculinity, Insecurity, Overcompensation, Dick Size...]]> Posted by onion]]> Tue, 18 Dec 2012 12:28:58 -0800 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: Maybe Along With That National Conversation About Gun Control We Should Have Some National Conversations About Masculinity, Insecurity, Overcompensation, Dick Size...]]>
Shotshells are big, so you'd only get about 10 rounds in a magazine the size of a 30-round .223 magazine. But, in principle, you could festoon your body with a bunch of extra mags and practice quick reloads to the point that you could carry and fire 100 shots in a couple of minutes.

They're rare, compared to hunting shotguns or riot guns based on hunting guns with tubular magazines, so you are effectively correct.
Posted by ScrawnyKayaker]]> Tue, 18 Dec 2012 10:07:12 -0800 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: Maybe Along With That National Conversation About Gun Control We Should Have Some National Conversations About Masculinity, Insecurity, Overcompensation, Dick Size...]]>
@26 - The idea that we should forfeit some freedom in the realms of property rights and traffic laws IS a no brainer. As I acknowledged in my comment, some issues take thought. The point was that social issues, including free speech are nuanced and an all or nothing approach doesn't help the conversation. The rhetoric you refer to was my examples of gun control that worked? Rhetoric is not data. Rhetoric is waxing vaguely about A B and C without a single detail about what you are referring to.
Posted by smajor82]]> Tue, 18 Dec 2012 07:05:33 -0800 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: Maybe Along With That National Conversation About Gun Control We Should Have Some National Conversations About Masculinity, Insecurity, Overcompensation, Dick Size...]]> Posted by JrEM]]> Mon, 17 Dec 2012 20:28:52 -0800 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: Maybe Along With That National Conversation About Gun Control We Should Have Some National Conversations About Masculinity, Insecurity, Overcompensation, Dick Size...]]> Posted by Fred Casely]]> Mon, 17 Dec 2012 17:30:09 -0800 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: Maybe Along With That National Conversation About Gun Control We Should Have Some National Conversations About Masculinity, Insecurity, Overcompensation, Dick Size...]]> but i've also heard discussion of whether or not it's the semiautomatic function that is the problem, or the capacity of the magazine. shotguns can be semiautomatic. but they can't shoot 30 shells in rapid succession.(right? i'm a bit ignorant here)
also - yes to 51. The woman did buy the gun, but it took the dumbass dude to make it into a mass murder weapon.
Posted by onion]]> Mon, 17 Dec 2012 17:06:36 -0800 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: Maybe Along With That National Conversation About Gun Control We Should Have Some National Conversations About Masculinity, Insecurity, Overcompensation, Dick Size...]]> Posted by gnot]]> Mon, 17 Dec 2012 17:05:06 -0800 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: Maybe Along With That National Conversation About Gun Control We Should Have Some National Conversations About Masculinity, Insecurity, Overcompensation, Dick Size...]]> "... is arguably pornographic in itself; ..."

It's a picture of just an AR-15. Nothing else.
You can argue that it is pornography if you want.
I'm sure that there are people who would view it as such.
But pornography is still tangential to this discussion.
Posted by fairly.unbalanced]]> Mon, 17 Dec 2012 16:27:11 -0800 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: Maybe Along With That National Conversation About Gun Control We Should Have Some National Conversations About Masculinity, Insecurity, Overcompensation, Dick Size...]]>
Be well.
Posted by thelyamhound]]> Mon, 17 Dec 2012 16:12:28 -0800 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: Maybe Along With That National Conversation About Gun Control We Should Have Some National Conversations About Masculinity, Insecurity, Overcompensation, Dick Size...]]> You should look up "tangent".
Pornography is a tangent in this discussion.
Yet you felt compelled to comment upon it.

You still seem to be unable to get past your own prose.
Posted by fairly.unbalanced]]> Mon, 17 Dec 2012 15:52:18 -0800 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: Maybe Along With That National Conversation About Gun Control We Should Have Some National Conversations About Masculinity, Insecurity, Overcompensation, Dick Size...]]> Posted by thelyamhound]]> Mon, 17 Dec 2012 15:09:32 -0800 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: Maybe Along With That National Conversation About Gun Control We Should Have Some National Conversations About Masculinity, Insecurity, Overcompensation, Dick Size...]]> Posted by thelyamhound]]> Mon, 17 Dec 2012 15:07:48 -0800 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: Maybe Along With That National Conversation About Gun Control We Should Have Some National Conversations About Masculinity, Insecurity, Overcompensation, Dick Size...]]> http://bushmaster.com/mancard/
Posted by AndyM]]> Mon, 17 Dec 2012 15:02:16 -0800 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: Maybe Along With That National Conversation About Gun Control We Should Have Some National Conversations About Masculinity, Insecurity, Overcompensation, Dick Size...]]> "My tangents are the most interesting thing you'll read all day."

No. Not even close.

"What percentage of people who enjoyed Martyrs or Inglourious Basterds do you imagine have been involved in any gun violence?"

I'm guessing that all you have are tangents.
You have no understanding of the subject and you are too enamored with your own prose and your self-supposed expertise.
Posted by fairly.unbalanced]]> Mon, 17 Dec 2012 14:48:43 -0800 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: Maybe Along With That National Conversation About Gun Control We Should Have Some National Conversations About Masculinity, Insecurity, Overcompensation, Dick Size...]]>
But handguns are off the table. Americans oppose any kind of handgun ban three to one, and the Supreme Court will not allow one anyways.

There simply is no realistic way to reduce the rapid increase in handgun ownership (in the hands of a dwindling number of enthusiasts) until we can more or less expect to see guns going off at all hours and in all places. We are the land of the flying bullets.

Have some Jonathan Chait if you want to feel that sickening feeling:
The House Republican caucus is dominated by ultraconservatives whose members reside in safe districts, and whose only chance of defeat is at the hands of a potential conservative primary challenge.

http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/201…
Posted by Fnarf]]> Mon, 17 Dec 2012 14:32:46 -0800 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: Maybe Along With That National Conversation About Gun Control We Should Have Some National Conversations About Masculinity, Insecurity, Overcompensation, Dick Size...]]> You might want to read my previous posts on tangents.
My tangents are the most interesting thing you'll read all day. That said, those "tangents" were also examples of cultural products that could be lumped in with "culture of violence" by those inclined to draw lines in the sand.
That was your example.
Not mine.
I never suggested that they were your example. I was reflecting on the matter, and suggesting that maybe they weren't as good an example as my others--not because the same things may not apply, but because I'm considerably less knowledgeable regarding video games than I am regarding music or cinema.
I was pointing out the cognitive dissonance involved in claiming that first-person shooters are acceptable and that extremely violent movies are acceptable and then referencing "culturally entrenched pathologies" when the subject is guns or the advertising that Dan referenced.
I stand by what I wrote. If you care to respond to my points, rather than repeating your previous assertion, I may come to believe that I've been corrected via a cogent rebuttal. There's a first time for everything. ;)
99% of the guns owned and the gun owners will never be involved in any gun violence.
What percentage of people who enjoyed Martyrs or Inglourious Basterds do you imagine have been involved in any gun violence? I don't think we're as far apart as you think we are. To whatever degree you wish to act as an apologist for gun ownership, I'm happy to meet you as an apologist for the so-called "culture of violence," at least insofar as we're looking at individual works or products as opposed to tendencies in the framing.

Or, to put it another way, they can have my simulated dismemberment when they pry it from my cold, dead hands.

Posted by thelyamhound]]> Mon, 17 Dec 2012 14:22:03 -0800 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: Maybe Along With That National Conversation About Gun Control We Should Have Some National Conversations About Masculinity, Insecurity, Overcompensation, Dick Size...]]> "... cognitive dissonance ... Mission of Burma ... Mingus and Bartok ... Goju-Ryu ... NFL ... Jacobean revenge tragedies ... "

You might want to read my previous posts on tangents.

"First-person shooter games may or may not be a good example; I don't know because I don't play them, and don't care to."

That was your example.
Not mine.
I was pointing out the cognitive dissonance involved in claiming that first-person shooters are acceptable and that extremely violent movies are acceptable and then referencing "culturally entrenched pathologies" when the subject is guns or the advertising that Dan referenced.

"... material implements ... abstract notions ... courage of your convictions ... pornography ..."

Look at the statistics.
99% of the guns owned and the gun owners will never be involved in any gun violence.
And you want to talk about "responsible"?
Posted by fairly.unbalanced]]> Mon, 17 Dec 2012 13:40:41 -0800 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: Maybe Along With That National Conversation About Gun Control We Should Have Some National Conversations About Masculinity, Insecurity, Overcompensation, Dick Size...]]> Posted by blip]]> Mon, 17 Dec 2012 13:31:40 -0800 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: Maybe Along With That National Conversation About Gun Control We Should Have Some National Conversations About Masculinity, Insecurity, Overcompensation, Dick Size...]]>
one of the enduring mysteries of the gun kook is the compulsion to go into very detailed discussions of weapons and calibers after any kind of horrible incident like this. It never fails. Way to show empathy. That and your offhand "condolences to the dead" in the other thread -- you don't offer condolences to the dead, you offer them to the living -- tell us a great deal about your mental state. You take comfort in your 7.62 whatevers, now.
Posted by Fnarf]]> Mon, 17 Dec 2012 13:13:20 -0800 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: Maybe Along With That National Conversation About Gun Control We Should Have Some National Conversations About Masculinity, Insecurity, Overcompensation, Dick Size...]]>
The penis is the only part of the human body that it's socially acceptable to mock to a person's face. It's rightly considered unacceptable to tell a person they are ugly if their facial features aren't ideal according to the consensus. It's rightly considered unacceptable to mock a woman for having smaller than average breasts. It's rightly considered unacceptable to mock a person because their skin color isn't the same as the majority's. But the penis, because it's dirty or funny or something you can mock openly despite that it's a physical attribute that beyond a person's control.

If you want to change the culture of masculine insecurity, stop implying that men with average and smaller cocks can't be as manly as a man with an elephant trunk between his legs. The title of this post contributes to the insecurity it's attempting to confront.

The next time you say an SUV driver is compensating for a small cock, imagine roughly %25 of the men that are within earshot are smaller than average. You are being exactly as shitty as you would be if you proclaimed that women with small tits are bitches to compensate for their boob size in a room full of women with small breasts.

If our concept of masculinity contributes to gun violence, and I'm not sure it does, then we can start the healing by getting all the size queens at The Stranger and Slog shutting the fuck up about how great huge dicks are, and how gun owners and by extension perpetrators of gun violence are compensating for their inadequacy.

OK, feel free to start commenting on my small penis.
Posted by Scrum]]> Mon, 17 Dec 2012 12:58:07 -0800 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: Maybe Along With That National Conversation About Gun Control We Should Have Some National Conversations About Masculinity, Insecurity, Overcompensation, Dick Size...]]>
Which is why I build my own.

@49
Plenty of people hunt with semi automatic weapons, it is nice to have a quick follow up shot. Brownings BAR semi automatic hunting rifle has been selling great for around 50 years.

I would hunt with my AR however the State of Washington says that the 5.56x45 round used by the AR15 is not sufficiently powerful for harvesting deer, so I bought an AR10 in 7.62 NATO.
Posted by Cascadian Bacon]]> Mon, 17 Dec 2012 12:56:58 -0800 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: Maybe Along With That National Conversation About Gun Control We Should Have Some National Conversations About Masculinity, Insecurity, Overcompensation, Dick Size...]]>
First-person shooter games may or may not be a good example; I don't know because I don't play them, and don't care to. I can say, as a student of various martial arts over the last quarter century, that there are assumptions about those who practice this sort of thing that apply only to a certain subset of students. Likewise, I think that there are more and less self-aware consumers of certain strains of violent or transgressive cinema or music. Because I'm so often in the position of defending self-aware study or consumption of athletic pursuits or entertainments seen as "barbaric" by those without any basis for understanding, I extend the benefit of the doubt to gaming.

The point is, if you're going to move from the material implements used to commit atrocities (guns) to abstract notions like the "culture of violence" or spirituality, you should have the courage of your convictions and acknowledge that there are responsible and irresponsible ways of participating in (or at least interfacing with) that culture just as there are responsible and irresponsible ways of keeping firearms, smoking weed, consuming pornography, etc.
Posted by thelyamhound]]> Mon, 17 Dec 2012 12:53:38 -0800 The Stranger