Russia must really really hate Science.

Which is ironic since they have one of the highest death rates due to HIV/AIDS ...

Can Bill Clinton tell us how insurgents with wrist rockets capable of going 4000 meters in the air took down a plane flying at a minimum cruising altitude of 35,000 feet?

It would be like shooting an arrow at the moon and expecting it to land on Tranquility Base.

@2: YOU NIMROD, WRIST ROCKETS ARE NOT USED BY ANY MILITARY, FOR OBVIOUS REASONS. RUSSIA HAS BEEN FUNDING AND ARMING UKRAINIAN SEPARATIST GROUPS, NOT TO MENTION SENDING RUSSIAN SPECIAL FORCES IN TO WORK WITH THEM.
JBITSMFOTP

The world reaction to this is frustratingly slow, but it's coming.

Gawker long ago edited their update to say "Or, it might just be 7, according to the conference itself."

Here's the WaPo source.

#3

You may now list the artillery and capabilities actually in the hands of pro-unification, Russian-backed rebels.

1. _________________
2. _________________
3. ....

@2, @6 shut the fuck up you insufferable piece of shit. Go read the news instead of making it up in your head.

@6: #1 would be Buk or SA-11 medium-range surface-to-air missiles that ride around on tracks and can be fired with a separate radar guidance system or with their own guidance by trained personnel. They have a range of 20 miles and can hit planes as high as 72,000 feet.

A number of these are in the hands of the rebels; they were crowing about capturing one from Ukraine just the other day, with video, in the exact same city where further video shows the rocket being fired. There are boatloads of trained personnel, as the rebels not only have lots of trained ex-military people but are also being supplied with active duty Russian troops as well.

And they've used them. This is the fourth plane they've shot down with a Buk in the past month. The other three were military supply planes. This one wasn't.

There is also a strong suspicion that further Buk systems have been given to the rebels directly by Russia.

Furthermore, fuck you, asshole. Go away.

http://m.washingtonpost.com/national/hea…

The 100 number is speculation. That is unconfirmed. Shame on you slog for not digging deep and doing the reporting I know you can do.

#8

How many, at what positions?

The only way to know for sure is to examine the wreckage and check for trace explosive residue to determine (maybe) the specific weapon (if any) possibly used.

that ride around on tracks

And those tracks were built in The Ukraine?!

Come on, Adlai Stevenson, show us the U-2 photos...

http://m.washingtonpost.com/national/hea…

The 100 number is conflated. Only 7 confirmed heading to the conference. Even one is sad but that number is click bait

Thank you for your life, Dr. Lange, as well as all of your companions. I shall light a candle tonight in recognition of all of you.

@9 The Stranger feels no shame, ever. They do the apology schtick at times, and print up a cute Regrets issue, but the fact remains. Their policy is We Have No Shame. It's sad when you think of integrity and dignity, but it makes it somewhat fun for me, they're such an easy target.

@11 President Obama said it was "apparently near 100" researchers and activists.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/t…

@10, you insufferable shithead: Torez and Snizhne. They were seen with the Buks, in launch mode; they were crowing about capturing them; they were seen firing them; they were seen moving them across the border (with an empty tube) shortly after the incident. The trail of the missile was seen in US radar surveillance. Seriously, can you not fucking read?

The Russians are now covering up the evidence at the site, shooting at the European investigators, and looting the victims, staggering around drunk in the investigation field, contaminating and destroying the evidence, and most importantly moving the Buks back across the Russian border.

The only question left, as I said above, is, whether the Buk that fired the fatal missile the one they stole, as is generally believed, or a different one supplied directly by Russia.

You really need to stop looking at rt.com. Several of their top reporters have quit in the last 24 hours over the ludicrously false propaganda they produce, garbage which you apparently cannot force down your gullet fast enough.

Oh, why am I arguing with you? You're as bad as a Truther. Go fuck yourself. Seriously, Bailo, this is gas oven time. Put your head in. End it. Put us all out of your misery.

When Bailo is not advocating forcing IUDs into twelve year old girls against their will, he is defending Putin's forces when they massacre civilians.

Truly the dumbest motherfucker on the planet.

Putin is the Tea Party's idol, and a mass murderer

The real T @ 9 & 11: the number of 100 or more was widely reported in numerous media outlets starting yesterday evening and mentioned by both Obama and Clinton earlier today based on those reports.

Those numbers came from people on the ground in Melbourne who were piecing together who they thought was on the plane and were in a state of fucking shock. I got text messages and emails last night from folks in Melbourne using those numbers. We won't know the total numbers until the passenger list is released.

This is devastating news for the HIV/AIDS community. The loss of Joep Lange alone is enormous and is on par with the death of Jonathan Mann in another crash 16 yrs ago.

A nice remembrance of Joep Lange by the great public health journalist Laurie Garrett:

http://lauriegarrett.com/blog/2014/7/18/…

@15 and @20 The WaPo article was posted mere minutes before the Obama interview was last updated...

But the WaPo article was posted HOURS before Frizzelle posted.

Responsible reporting and all that...

Well the flight manifest has been released, so hopefully we'll have some clarity soon.

@10: So you want us to believe that the Russian-backed rebels are using wrist rockets* because you say so. Excuse me, I didn't know their ranks included BOBA FUCKING FETT.
But when Fnarf mentions the Buk missiles in separatist hands and the surveillance footage indicating their use against the airplane, suddenly you want boots-on-the-ground forensics.
JBITSMFOTP

*There is an excellent reason that people don't launch missiles from their wrists in real life. Care to guess what it is?

There is no point in replying to Bailo. Especially you, Fnarf; he isn't able to digest any of your facts.

obama is really loosing it on foreign policy. he should launch a cruise missile onto those rebels bases.

You guys are so nice to play with Bailo.

This is a horrible tragedy all around.

I asked this on the last (now dead) thread about this: how do we square this with Iran Air Flight 655? Mistakes happen.

Putin is a POS and clearly responsible for this - directly or indirectly - but for those who are ready to escalate militarily, on what perch do we position our high moral dudgeon?

@31(troll) - no, we didn't actually apologize. Both the Captain of the ship and the Lt. Cmdr. were awarded the Navy's Legion of Merit medal by GHWB for their actions.

@38: Lenin wasn't a mass murderer. You're thinking of Stalin.

Bloody fucking hell. The Guardian reports that credit cards from people on the plane have been used and that the drunken fucking gorillas who call themselves separatists are basically looting the site (on top of walking all over remains holding cigarettes).

Fuck protocol and fuck Putin. NATO needs to land a dozen planes filled to the rafters with troops and vehicles.

#2,6 & 10 (supreme ruler of the universe)) is an example of a paid Russian shill. Look at his history if you don't believe me. This is his first comment thread, and he is spreading nothing but nonsense.

Kbatku, Dear Leader has been with us for ages. No one would pay him to sweep their front walk, let alone post anything. He lives in a garden apartment in Kent, which be never leaves, and wears nothing but muumuus all day. I think he's a trust fund baby.

@40 Tell that to the millions of Russians who died during the famines of the 20s.

Thank you for your life, Dr. Lange, as well as all of your companions. i will pary for them..sure...thanks

@49 sissoucat: Go back and read your history. It was the 30s and it was Stalin. Lenin wasnt alive long enough to affect any kind of Stalinesque slaughter.

People were certainly executed on Lenin's orders, but I don't believe there's enough to justify calling him a mass murderer. Pretty much any revolutionary leader is going to have some amount of blood on their hands just from the initial struggle of taking and retaining power (viz. Ernesto "Che" Guevara). The vast and overwhelming majority of the deaths under the Soviet regime in Russia were the doing, directly or indirectly, of Josef Stalin.