As a man who was raised by a single mother, this report concerns me. I remember as a child my Mom coming home and talking about training men who ended up being promoted ahead of her in a few years time, ultimately being her boss. Said men then wouldn't offer a hand up for her. My feelings there is these men felt insecure about having someone with more knowledge and skills working UNDER them. If my mother had been given the same opportunities that men received, she'd have had an easier time providing for her family. MY quality of life would have improved, and my mother wouldn't have had to work so much overtime.
Single women raising families are still at a huge disadvantage in the workforce. If their children get sick and they need to take care of them, they end up not working. Thus, their wages get depressed. I'm hopeful that the improved sick leave law will improve this.
But for some to say women don't work as hard as men is blatantly unfair and even hurtful. Equal pay for women helps all of society.
Umm, maybe these guys should actually hire a labor economist with some expertise in assessing wage disparities with data? You can't simply compare unconditional mean wages and conclude the disparity is due entirely to gender. I call BS.
There is no mystery to this if you actually look at the data. Firefighters and police officers are some of the best-paid employees in the city and the overwhelming majority of firefighters and police officers are male. The only reasonable way to "solve" this "problem" is to convince women to go into those fields.
#6: You surely can conclude that there is a gender gap if the data shows a gender gap. It doesn't matter if the gap is due to dickhead bosses plotting against women, unconscious biases for giving men more raises or promotions, systemic biases that pay male-dominated professions more, maternity leave, or just some type of random data fluke. There's a gender gap that (as always) benefits men, and it needs to be fixed right now.
This should be a major issue in the mayoral election. McGinn needs to address this immediately.
@8 It seems then there are two major questions to answer;
1) Is it justified that the firefighters and police officers are some of the best-paid employees? E.g. are those increased wages necessary to attract the talented people needed for those positions, or is the high pay the result of gender bias?
2) Are there indeed fewer women willing/able to become/stay firefighters and police officers? If so, is that disparity the result of some sort of discrimination (e.g. female firefighters are harassed until they quit), societal forces (e.g. women are socialized to not idealize "manly" professions, women are more likely to be the sole caretaker for children and can't take the physical risk or uneven shifts required of firefighters/police officers), or some legitimate reason related to physical differences (e.g. firefighters have a genuine need to be X tall, Y heavy, or carry Z pounds and women are less likely to meet these requirements)?
@9: The sentence you quote is one of many intellectually dishonest claims made in the report. Most women working for Seattle PD have admin or dispatcher jobs that pay $25-$30/hr. Most men working for the Seattle PD are officers making $40+/hr. Notably, there is no meaningful difference between the wages of male and female officers.
Mike Bike McGinn will be right on that. Press release? Check. Pithy snarky quote from Pickus? Check. (Mis)Use of administrative machinery to make a polical point? Check. All we need is for his shill Goldy to do a follow up on some feelgood story about zoning . Oh, yeah, check. Because Nimbys aren't nimbys when they agree with his agenda.
At City Light the highest paid jobs tend to be in the electrical trades and engineering. While there are women electrical workers, they tend to gravitate towards divisions like metering, which have less opportunities for overtime. Engineering has quite a few women employees, given the industry, but it is still predominantly male.
I happen to speak to a lot of young people, and I always try to push the apprenticeship program, but it's a tough sell for both genders.
13: You realize that's the point, right? It's not coincidence that male-dominated jobs are almost always higher-paying than female-dominated jobs, especially when the people who decide these things are almost always male.
18: Are you saying because more manly jobs deserve more money? I'm sure you could come up with some better mental gymnastics to convince yourself why it's not sexist to value police officers much more than mental health workers, IT workers more than attorneys, laborers more than contract writers.
Well certainly more dangerous jobs deserve more money. And I don't think that being a good firefighter or cop or lineworker is necessarily "manly". Also, all of those departments have strong union representation. Why pit workers against other workers?
But in the bigger sense, mental health workers, IT workers et all all have private sector alternatives - with pay scales, incentives, and benefit packages municipalities can never hope to offer. The only thing the city can offer is a decent wage, somewhat secure employment, and a retirement. I think most city workers in those areas accept that trade off.
As for single mothers, one of the things that probably holds them back from making more money is childcare. It's expensive enough for a conventional 9-5 job, but what about a swing or overnight shift? Does anyone even offer such a service?
Is this the hired wage or current wage? Men often haggle the $ of raise/increase while many women just accept what they are given. This can also cause a difference. Women ASK FOR MORE!
In most classified (union) positions you start at a set rate, and after a one year probation, you receive a set raise. That continues annually through five steps, then you are through with raises, except for cost of living raises that are negotiated in the contract, or wholesale reclassifications of the job class. In both those instances, everybody gets the same increase.
#13: Most women working for Seattle PD have admin or dispatcher jobs that pay $25-$30/hr. Most men working for the Seattle PD are officers making $40+/hr.
#17: You realize that's the point, right? It's not coincidence that male-dominated jobs are almost always higher-paying than female-dominated jobs
It's probably also true that cops get a lot of overtime, pushing that $40/hr wage into a six figure salary (and they deserve every penny of it). An admin job, sitting in front of a computer is in no way the same, nor does it require "equal pay" to a position where you may not come home on any given night.
Single women raising families are still at a huge disadvantage in the workforce. If their children get sick and they need to take care of them, they end up not working. Thus, their wages get depressed. I'm hopeful that the improved sick leave law will improve this.
But for some to say women don't work as hard as men is blatantly unfair and even hurtful. Equal pay for women helps all of society.
Check your privilege.
Learn to wear a condom then or get married. Jeesh, life is NOT this difficult.
Given your stupidity about everything else you blather on about, that your understanding of sex is equally backward is, not at all surprising.
Looks like going into the police hasn't solved this problem for those women.
This should be a major issue in the mayoral election. McGinn needs to address this immediately.
1) Is it justified that the firefighters and police officers are some of the best-paid employees? E.g. are those increased wages necessary to attract the talented people needed for those positions, or is the high pay the result of gender bias?
2) Are there indeed fewer women willing/able to become/stay firefighters and police officers? If so, is that disparity the result of some sort of discrimination (e.g. female firefighters are harassed until they quit), societal forces (e.g. women are socialized to not idealize "manly" professions, women are more likely to be the sole caretaker for children and can't take the physical risk or uneven shifts required of firefighters/police officers), or some legitimate reason related to physical differences (e.g. firefighters have a genuine need to be X tall, Y heavy, or carry Z pounds and women are less likely to meet these requirements)?
I happen to speak to a lot of young people, and I always try to push the apprenticeship program, but it's a tough sell for both genders.
But in the bigger sense, mental health workers, IT workers et all all have private sector alternatives - with pay scales, incentives, and benefit packages municipalities can never hope to offer. The only thing the city can offer is a decent wage, somewhat secure employment, and a retirement. I think most city workers in those areas accept that trade off.
As for single mothers, one of the things that probably holds them back from making more money is childcare. It's expensive enough for a conventional 9-5 job, but what about a swing or overnight shift? Does anyone even offer such a service?
The salary schedule is published on the city website at http://www.seattle.gov/personnel/resourc… You can also get individual salary information at http://lbloom.net/xsea11.html
When transferring from one job to another, you may start at a higher step, but that is all formulated, not negotiated.
Strategic Advisor positions have more leeway, but I think that if you start at a higher starting wage, you have less room for future increases.
#17: You realize that's the point, right? It's not coincidence that male-dominated jobs are almost always higher-paying than female-dominated jobs
It's probably also true that cops get a lot of overtime, pushing that $40/hr wage into a six figure salary (and they deserve every penny of it). An admin job, sitting in front of a computer is in no way the same, nor does it require "equal pay" to a position where you may not come home on any given night.