I'm not worried that you guys will start reporting every gun death-I'm worried you guys will start reporting ONLY gun deaths. Seriously, the past few days it's been like 90% of slog. Don't you people ever watch any movies or see any shopping carts or go to any coal train protests anymore?

@31 because the nra and the gun owners' typical positions are in fact, nutty.

thei central argument is guns make us safe. obviously, the high rates of gun ownership in the usa the high rates of death by gun are causal -- they dismiss this.

they nuttily focus on minutiae, like "you non gun people aren't qualified to talk about the subject because you don't know the difference between a tactical sig glock 2820 and a bushmaster citizen defender 303030" or other drivel.

they say nutty things like arm teachers -- their hypothesis is somehow the good guys always win, when we know bad guys usually get the jump on the good guys.

they use a clackamas as an example of guns in the hands of good people WORKING to make us SAFE for god's sake. Clackamas is not an example of SAFETY; it's an example of HARM and DEATH.

they say the nra shouldn't be blamed, because [pick one state or city] has good gun control on paper, and aha! someone defeated it by crossing the political boundary. Seriously, they always point to chicago or DC or CT as "proving" gun controls don't work. This is nutty.

These nuttynesses are indicators of a deep seated imbalance that we, the non gun people, fairly and reasonably call nutty.

they refuse to see the social ill effects of lots of guns, legally, being in lots of homes, legally, stored, legally, under lock and key, when obviously this does enable lots of drunk people, nutty people, suicidal people, people with suicidal urges to murder lots of other people, and thieves, to simply (a) take the key and (b) steal the guns or (c) as iwth ms. lanza, you kill her first then take the guns. not seeing that the existen ce of 280 million guns is causally associated with the highest rates of gun death and massacre of any similar nations is in fact, nutty.

35

yes.

pre-judging all members of a group based on the actions of a few.....

the very definition of prejudiced bigotry.

a staple of the HypocriticalHomoLiberalLeft.

the killers in these crimes always seem to commit suicide.

and yet Goldy doesn't see it as a mental health issue.

funny how one's prejudice can block out the glaringly obvious...

@35 36 -- I said typical positions referring to vocal gun owners. but in fact, you're right, I do blame all gun owners, as they are the ones backing the nra for decades and pushing our politics to one side, resulting in us not having the system of canada and australia. if you're offended by that too fucking bad gun owners. until I read that there has been a 50% drop in nra membership and until you all stop blaming the likes of me for our problems, and take some responsibility, we won't let up.

the basic issue is this: the average person just shouldn't have guns. because if he or she does, this means you end up with 280 million guns all over, and you end up with our elevated rates of death by gun, gun massacre, suicide by gun, and huge swaths of the biggest cities plagued by daily violence. so it's you, you gun owners, you are a cause of our problems in those areas. not me. every one of you has a gun most of you have three or four and
-it's not that useful for home defense, as you have to keep it locked in a safe. right?
-you teenage kid or the neigborhood thief can find a way to steal the gun, or enough of them we have the social problem of guns.
--the very existence of the massive market in legal guns feeds the massive market in illegal guns.
--the political pressure by owners of 280 million guns is what blocks us, the non gun owners, from achieving laws like they have in canada or australia.

but hey, prove i am the asshole in this picture by all resigning from the nra and leading the political effort to get us canada style gun laws! that would surely . . . .

@35 and @36 -- you don't own bushmasters, do you?

tell us the firepower you own, and why you need it, how about that.

I continue to believe that that it's gun owners who're responsible for our politics on guns that prevents us from having the lowered death rates, or higher safety rates, whatever, of a canada or australia. I do lump you all together because i do not see some massive effort by gun owners to reject and denounce the NRA nor to influence elections and politics in a helpful way, following decades of gun owners helping the nra. the claim that we can't ban semis under the second amendment is false; we ban automatic weapons and can legally ban classes of weapons, that's why we CAN ban you from owning nukes. the claim a ban won't work is false, these bans on types of weapons are part of the controls in australia japan england == all the places that gun controls work pretty good, which the gun owners NEVER want to discuss. the claim confiscation is required is false, it'd be with compensation. "exclude the opinion of anyone who knows anything about firearms (don't forget to demonize them! that helps!" yes, I exclude you until you face up to the simple fact it's all these guns all over that CAUSE our problems with guns. (Yes politically and sociologically, of course the triggerman is morally to blame, etc.). ), the claim gun control only would work as well as bans on pot or heroin is false, again, look at england and japan and again, it's not usually a total ban folks, but highly limited licensing.
the problem is ""the average person just shouldn't have guns." Because it's the nations where gun ownership is far less than our rate is, that are safer, and the ez availability of 280 million guns legally obviously helps the folks misusing guns, keep and bear them. the threat that "I will vote with the NRA if you keep saying that!" only shows my view that gun owners are part of the problem is correct -- how stupid and childish is that?
"Talk like that is why so many gun owners oppose ANY new regulations regarding firearm ownership. " Well jack, there is talk like that and if your shame or guilt prevent you from tolerating it and that's why you like many gun owners will join the nra and support it, well that proves my point-- you guys are the problem. @45 you artfully leave open the possibility that you own a semi automatic ....handgun. but to return to the basic point"

if you believe gun ownership is a good idea for good guys
you will end up with 280 million guns around
then it's super ez for bad guys to get guns
and you get high rates of murder and suicide by gun, high rates of gun massacre and high rates of entire neighborhoods plagued by gun violence
if you don't have that kind of super high ownership of guns
if you have say only ten or twenty percent owning guns
and if they are super well regulated and tightly licensed so that it's just a pain in the ass to get a license and the average suburban mom like ms. lanza isn't going to get one
you don't get as many newtown massacres
so therefore, it's you gun owners collectively who are to blame. now if doceb is aware that there's some massive movement politically by responsible gun owners to reject the nra and push for bans on semis and tight licensing laws and a huge buy back problem, he can earn forgiveness but till then, no, you gun owners ARE the problem because you are why we don't have the gun ownership rates and gun death rates of japan or england or australia. and again note the threat of "don't insult me, or I will pay you back by voting to oppose things that otherwise I will support" -- meaning, "I will continue to back the nra even though on one level I agree with you we should ban semi automatic weapons !" -- this is known as being an asshole, and tends to prove my point. you don't overcome assholery by fearing and pandering to the assholes, you start by calling them assholes. now doceb tell me this, what DO you own? and why?
it's not non gun people who're the problem in the usa. it's the gun owners who directly or indirectly support and accept the gun culture. just owning a gun for home defense supports the nutty view that that's sensible. it's just not sensible. there is NO nation with the super high level of gun ownership we have that has LOW rates of death by gun. QED. the gun owners basic premise is just wrong. till they realize it they will defend it this defends and ensures all these guns all over this supports the nra loving politicians and things won't change and there will be more blood on gun owners hands every month forever into the future while forever into the future in japan there will be like ten murders a year and in england a small fraction of what we've got here. BECAUSE here people believe in guns, and that's NUTTY.

@46 am aware of the numbers of nra members. their influence is beyond their members. it's the widespread belief that it's good to have guns around that is the common core belief of gun owners that is the cause, politically, of us not having sensible controls on guns. there isn't one gun ownership group with a million members out there pushing like hell for a ban on assault weapons, closing the loophole, etc. when you go start one and go public, then come back and tell us about it, till then gun owners are the main cause of the problem here. politically, I am not saying they should collectively be executed for the gun deaths where others pull the trigger. it's more like sociological manslaughter blood on their hands -- it's clear you can't have safety from guns, when there's all these guns around in the hands of the average joe.