Slog - Comments on California Proposition 8 Too Close to Call, Leading

Comment by Jaxxi Hax

Jaxxi Hax — Tue, 04 Nov 2008 22:44:04 -0800

Exit polls say otherwise...couples are racing to City Hall to get hitched just in case though. God, it breaks the heart.

Comment by The CHZA

The CHZA — Tue, 04 Nov 2008 22:44:10 -0800

You guys are going to have to wait another decade or two for all of the "god ordained marriage" morons to die off some more before any progress can really be made on gay rights.

Comment by Madashell

Madashell — Tue, 04 Nov 2008 22:47:34 -0800

I just don't get it - how could a blue state go this way? Is there any recourse, any viable challenge to Prop 8?

Comment by ashley

ashley — Tue, 04 Nov 2008 22:47:52 -0800

we're coming a long damn way tonight, but this is still so disappointing.

still holding out hope for CA after watching the others go dowwwwwn.

Comment by meloukhia

meloukhia — Tue, 04 Nov 2008 22:47:55 -0800

As a Californian who voted no on 8, let me say that I am really disgusted by 8's lead right now. I'm hoping that things will balance out when full counts come in from more liberal areas. I can't believe that 53.2% of us were really willing to take civil rights away from their fellow citizens while voting in such a historic election.

Comment by David

David — Tue, 04 Nov 2008 22:48:25 -0800

It is totally fucked. Is it too close or is it over? I've been texted by Cali friends and they say it passed...

Comment by Parsnip

Parsnip — Tue, 04 Nov 2008 22:48:37 -0800

I do not need to be crushed right now, not with my hopes so high. Half of California voters, eat shit.

Comment by tomasyalba

tomasyalba — Tue, 04 Nov 2008 22:50:10 -0800

The LA Times has a county-by-county rollover map thingy. Looks tight even where Prop 8 is going down. Los Angeles County is only at 16% reporting so far - but it's 54-45 yesward at the moment. Blargh.

Comment by chris

chris — Tue, 04 Nov 2008 22:54:03 -0800

I'm so embarrassed by this. I have to call my gay friends to apologize for the other half of this state.

Unbelievable.

Comment by Bruce

Bruce — Tue, 04 Nov 2008 22:54:18 -0800

@3 - California isn't a "blue" state -- they usually go Democratic for President/Senate, mixed for the House, and Republican for Governor. It's sad, but it doesn't surprise me.

@2 - (to paraphrase a guy interviewed on the Slog awhile back): Why can't they die FASTER?

Comment by You_Gotta_Be_Kidding_Me

You_Gotta_Be_Kidding_Me — Tue, 04 Nov 2008 22:56:45 -0800

According to the LA Times: "The proposition was trailing among white voters, but was ahead among black voters. Latino voters were closely divided."

"Every ethnic group supported marriage equality, except African-Americans, who voted overwhelmingly against extending to gay people the civil rights once denied them: a staggering 69 - 31 percent African-American margin against marriage equality. That's worse than even I expected. Whites, on the other hand, clearly rejected discrimination: 55 to 45 percent. Latinos were evenly split." -Andrew Sullivan

Thanks, Barack Obama, for everything so far!

Comment by lusk

lusk — Tue, 04 Nov 2008 22:59:41 -0800

Yes on 8 has been dropping from about 55% to about 52.5%...it's just a question of whether it will be enough to counteract before the night's over. It got an early lead from a lot of rural counties in california that got their results in early, and a lot of urban centers aren't voting no as strongly as they might...

Comment by Laura

Laura — Tue, 04 Nov 2008 23:01:50 -0800

Don't despair quite yet - you have to look at WHICH precincts are reporting. Rural areas have an easier time counting their votes and tend to report earlier, and they're usually more conservative.

Comment by seattleartist

seattleartist — Tue, 04 Nov 2008 23:04:24 -0800

Don't forget Florida has a similar initiative on their ticket... it's winning by a huge margin too :(

Comment by Kim

Kim — Tue, 04 Nov 2008 23:08:16 -0800

Arizona is also banning gay marriage. Arkansas is banning gay couples from being foster and adoptive parents. Florida is banning gay marriage.

Comment by scott

scott — Tue, 04 Nov 2008 23:15:00 -0800

This makes me want to move back to Washington - I am going to be too disgusted to live in California if this really does pass.

I suspect that this will get challenged in the US Supreme Court - it seems like it is illegal under the equal rights clause of the 14th Amendment.

Comment by DFD

DFD — Tue, 04 Nov 2008 23:18:41 -0800

California has early voting by mail, right? Does anyone know if the reported totals include the mail-in vote?

Comment by violet_dagrinder

violet_dagrinder — Tue, 04 Nov 2008 23:32:20 -0800

Unfortunately, the huge black turnout is bad for gays. Sigh.

Comment by emote_control

emote_control — Tue, 04 Nov 2008 23:33:08 -0800

From NBC's exit polls, if this thing doesn't turn around, it looks like the people to blame are uneducated hispanics and blacks over the age of 30. They seem to be predominantly Republican (for some reason I cannot fathom) and Republicans are overwhelmingly likely to vote yes on Prop 8.

Also notable is the extremely dramatic shift at age 29. Speculation: people who grew up with the internet are more tolerant.

Comment by Kim

Kim — Tue, 04 Nov 2008 23:36:40 -0800

Good thing we just elected a president who supports gay marriage... oh wait.

Comment by stealingzen

stealingzen — Tue, 04 Nov 2008 23:37:42 -0800

Well, I'm pretty sure a stupid Proposition doesn't have the clout that a State Supreme Court ruling can't trounce. It might have to go to the Federal Supreme Court, but even on the state level, this Proposition can't be Constitutional, and therefore un-enforceable.

Look up, folks. Have faith.

Comment by Rob

Rob — Tue, 04 Nov 2008 23:38:31 -0800

Hey guys, remember, you're always welcome in Canada. We had a nationwide referendum, and decided to support gay marriage, and then promptly forgot that it had ever been an issue.

Well, you might want to stay out of Alberta, but it's mostly good. Come enrich our cities with your mostly well-educated, liberal-leaning, wealth-generating domestic partnerships.

Comment by jrrrl

jrrrl — Wed, 05 Nov 2008 00:12:33 -0800

Oh COME ON. Obama was elected hours ago and you've already started blaming black people. Blacks make up 7% of California. The largest demographic group that overwhelmingly voted for proposition 8? Males, who make up 48% of the population. White women overwhelmingly rejected it, bringing down the "white" average. If proposition 8 passes, it will be because of the huge voting blocs of male voters and evangelicals, not the 4%/3% split amongst black voters.

Comment by charles

charles — Wed, 05 Nov 2008 00:16:29 -0800

I'm really upset about this.
I'm a WA native going to school in idyllic (or so I thought) central California. I'm offended that the majority of people around me are so self-righteous and mean. 'Why? How does it possibly benefit you to restrict others from marrying those they love? Why do you give a shit?! Is it because the divorce rate is so high and teen pregnancy is especially rampant among evangelicals? Are you grandstanding in the defense of marriage because you know that it as an institution has already been shattered and bloodied by ill-advised shotgun wedding and midlife crises?! WHY??!?!!' I scream into the night.

Obama... obama... the mantra alleviates

Can straight couples get domestic partnerships? solidarity!

Comment by Sarah

Sarah — Wed, 05 Nov 2008 00:17:53 -0800

this is just embarrassing, and sad, blame orange county...
and lots of religious minorities out to support Obama, this has been a worry for a while.

the last bit of hope (rapidly disappearing) is that this shows a conservative bias in mail in ballots.

but it don't look good

Comment by Sarah

Sarah — Wed, 05 Nov 2008 00:17:58 -0800

this is just embarrassing, and sad, blame orange county...
and lots of religious minorities out to support Obama, this has been a worry for a while.

the last bit of hope (rapidly disappearing) is that this shows a conservative bias in mail in ballots.

but it don't look good

Comment by gay in the CA

gay in the CA — Wed, 05 Nov 2008 00:50:35 -0800

Don't count us out just yet... it's still a bit of a long shot, but LA county precinct closure map (updated every 10 minutes) showed almost all of West LA still not closed at 12:35. They were finally closed by 12:45 and now are being driven to the counting stations with 1.7million votes to go for the county.

Comment by gay in the CA

gay in the CA — Wed, 05 Nov 2008 02:12:03 -0800

Just another illustration... at 2am, LA county shows 84% of precincts reporting for 2.1mil votes. Estimated turnout was over 3.5mil votes by 8pm (not including those still in line), thus less than 66% of population represented. Even the remaining Yes on 8 counties (San Bernadino, Riverside, San Diego) early results are skewing to the low population density areas rather than the more liberal and dense areas.

Plus, absentee ballots dropped off on election day are NOT counted until days later after signature verification. Given the problems with getting absentee ballots out due to high turnout (and requests for mail-in ballots), there may be a large chunk still to count if it ends up close enough in the morning.

Comment by Sven

Sven — Wed, 05 Nov 2008 02:12:56 -0800

51.8 for yes with 82% in. There's still an off chance but it isn't looking great.

Comment by zachd

zachd — Wed, 05 Nov 2008 03:13:59 -0800

I want this to fail so bad. The results from this have been killing me all night. Argh.

Comment by guy

guy — Wed, 05 Nov 2008 03:16:50 -0800

nooooo... ;_;

Comment by Steve

Steve — Wed, 05 Nov 2008 05:52:31 -0800

So what's the repeal process like? Surely this isnt the end of the fight. If it was the other way around, THEY wouldn't stop fighting. They would keep at it, submitting their signatures for another ballot initiative for another election..Gather your strength, kids, there's more work to be done. Let this just be a setback. Equality will come.

Comment by George

George — Wed, 05 Nov 2008 07:04:36 -0800

v
Voters in good old Calif. have rejected gay rights at the ballot, now, twice in ten years ...
more work, more time

And we must avoid the ballot box at all cost ... we loose there big time, year after year, everywhere

Next, more attacks on gay adoptions. Another good winner for the christian right wingers.

Comment by kwebb

kwebb — Wed, 05 Nov 2008 07:28:48 -0800

How can Californians vote for better treatment of animals, but not for us? It adds a bitter moment to an otherwise very sweet.

http://www.sfgate.com/election/races/2008/11/04/CA/c/i_proposition/i_0_2_treatment_of_farm_animals/g_ballot_issue/c/california.shtml

http://www.sfgate.com/election/races/2008/11/04/CA/c/i_proposition/i_1_8_same_sex_marriage_ban/g_ballot_issue/c/california.shtml

Comment by Jo Spot

Jo Spot — Wed, 05 Nov 2008 08:21:50 -0800

Christ guys, this sucks. I've been screaming and drinking and celebrating but it's been in the back of my whole time. My state... my giant, beautiful, diverse, 6th-largest-economy-in-the-world hippie-filled golden state... really? Breaks my fucking heart. So here's the thing: does anyone know what to do next? How to we begin to fight?

As cheesy as it sounds, I feel as though with obama in charge there is (*cough*) some hope, for... um... (*cough*) change... or a least an avenue through which we might begin to proceed. It's such a day of hope and celebration right now and I really do believe that we will come up on these bigoted, fearful bastards some day. That said, I'm 22 in california. It's me!! I feel like I'm the one that's gotta do something, and my generation, and my friends. So what the fuck do i do!???!! I feel like I can believe in change now, [insert cheesy obama cliche here] --how do we begin here?

The first money I've ever given to politics in my entire fucking life was $25 to no on 8 (thanks for the push dan!). Wasn't enough. I live in Santa Cruz, so protesting or educating around here isn't going to do a whole lot. How do we begin to fight this thing?

Comment by Peggy W

Peggy W — Wed, 05 Nov 2008 09:26:54 -0800

Is it true that once it's part of the State Constitution, the courts cannot ever touch it? I didn't join the rush to the altar because I had faith in my fellow Californians, faith which was obviously misplaced!!

How can such a happy day (Obama) be such a sad one?

I too want to know how we can proceed to fight this when it is obviously so WRONG!!!